@algoerich
You may recall that originally you asked if it was possible to have a rational debate about multiculturalism.

I said that it was.

BIG MISTAKE

Words like multiculturalism seem to threaten the hell out of lots of people. But any subsequent posts were not directed at you.

I really am not sure if it is worthwhile trying to keep posting in this thread - maybe OLO could find a way of establishing what could loosely be called private threads - this would mean that those people who simply want to use this as a vehicle to vent their spleen can do so.

Your point about the workaround being clumsy is reasonable but it needs to be seen as a principle for guiding public policy.

Your comment about a crisis is spot on. I was reading a travel guide about Dafur written about 15 years ago. In the tiny village of Madu there are two mayors, two schools, two market squares and invisible boundry that runs through its centre - the reasons for this dualism that there are two tribes the Berti and the Meidob in times of plenty there are no problems but when there is a shortage you do gets strife as we have seen in recent years in Dafur.

This is why it is so important that we have a sensible population policy. Population pressure in the big cities is already leading to a situation where the vicious bile that has been evident in some of these posts is in danger of becoming a justification for the arbitrary denial of human rights to some members of the Australian community.

So maybe Andrew Jakubowicz was not drawing such a long bow after all. If we recognize that cultural diversity is normal then we will remove the justification for discriminating against people on cultural grounds.

@ALGOREisRICH,
I am writing in response to CJ Morgan.
You state:

"If so.. if 'immigrants' are aliented by a talk on 'population'... they have serious issues which need remedial therapy.
Or..it could mean they each have their own agenda which is to bring as many of 'them' to the country as possible. Otherwise..it makes no sense for them to feel alienated. They are here... perhaps they have plans to bring the extended family or the whole tribe down the track?"

There is more plausible reason why migrants feel alienated that has nothing to do with any underlying agenda.

Migrants tend to keep in touch with their countries of origin or where other members from their communities have migrated to. Many would therefore be acutely aware that the population debate in Europe is primarily about repatriating people (eg Sarkozy has just repatriated Gypsies back to Romania.)It also tends to be code for a racist agenda - this is why we need to take case how we present the population debate in this country.

With respect to multiculturalism there is one major frustration that I have with the debate and that relates to the assumption that it is possible to have a mono-cultural society. Apart from very small groups of people who may have just the one common/shared culture, in the main society, regardless of whether or not you have immigration programme, will be multicultural. You only have to look at the very large immigrant communities here to see this: Italian, Greek, Vietnamese, Chinese are all culturally diverse.

Even the only migration in to Australia had been from Britain we would have been a multicultural society - Queenslanders are different to people from Tasmania. Go to Cairns and you will find people being suspicious of all Southerners including their fellow Queenslanders.
Cultural diversity is part of the reality of any society.

Good to see you all fighting amongst yourselves.
I think I might drop Andrew Jakubowicz a line and ask him how HE would deal with opinions such as mine, then I could post my own rebuttals and save you all the embarrassment of looking so intellectually paralysed.
I'm not going to delve into Immigrant Crime or any of the other sordid topics raised in my absence, my issue is White Genocide, I'm yet to be convinced that there are Racist gangs of Non Whites roaming around specifically targeting us.
@CJ,Hero? This is the same Hitler who wanted to turn all of the Pacific over to the Japanese including Australia?
You've been taught by your professors that Hitler was a White supremacist, well that's not the truth, ask Hitler's friends MK Gandhi and Subhas Chandra Bose, it's all on the internet, just look for the articles marked CONTROVERSIAL!
@Suzeonline, Yes I do enjoy the odd "Multicultural" meal without contradicting myself, I can highly recommend Akkar bakery on Sydney Rd for their Halal Pizzas and there's a Chinese stall at the Preston market where you can stuff yourself silly for ten bucks.
I'd be a hypocrite if I patronised businesses owned by White people but EMPLOYING non Whites, there's a big difference.
My issue is with WHITE people, not migrants.
White people sign the visas, White people profit from running the detention centres, White people bring in 457 workers and White academics write walls of text justifying these actions.
But are they doing all this for the good of the White Race or for money?

@CJ Morgan
>Dereck, I haven't called Jay any names

You expressed a desire to see JofM hurt mentally and put a :) after it. Wishing pain, physical or mental, on another and taking pleasure in it, is a classic symptom of dehumanization.

As for your name calling of his opinions and the use of emotive words like "filth" and "hateful", you are in effect, saying she is irrelevant and should be overridden forcibly, or otherwise. This dehumanization technique is not new.

We have:
1 A desire to hurt JofM psychologically and I suspect physically.
2 Name calling to discredit and dehumanize him.
3 "Jokes" about the eradication of "her kind".

This paints a very disturbing picture CJ.

>You need to look up the term 'miscegenation'.

I am aware of the definition of miscegenation.

> If current trends continue, within a few centuries everybody will be coffee-cloured

So are you saying that creating the conditions for the eradication of a race or people, through miscegenation, is morally right and legal?

Are you saying it is morally right and legal, to forcibly or otherwise, oppose those who resist their eradication, even if the eradication uses peaceful means?

>why don't you tell us your position with respect to the blatant racism he expresses?

As for your question, I cannot answer you, until you answer question 1 below.

In case you have forgotten, these are the questions you have not answered yet:

1) Post specific quotes from JofM in this thread, so we can compare them to the definition of racism.

2) Which races/groups do you want to target for eradication by miscegenation? What action or policies will you support, in order to ensure this occurs?

Examples of possible targets:
Papua New Guineans, Japanese, Chinese, Samoans, Maori, Tongans, The Bushmen of Africa, Europeans, Icelanders, Inuit. Political Parties/Groups, Church Groups, etc.

Of course there are many other peoples and groups to choose from, so please add the ones you wish to target.

I would have added Tibetans, but the Chinese govt are already well progressed in the peaceful eradication of that ethnic group.

Thanks for the assist Derick but you've neglected one point.
Aboriginal Genocide.
It was Liberal,progressive, well meaning Whites and academics who came up with the "Half Caste" laws and the other tools of Genocide used on Indigenous people.
Forced removal of children and racial assimilation of Aborigines were seen as "Humane" solutions.
Now if, as we all know these policies were Genocidal, if moving millions of non Aborigines into Aboriginal homelands was a bad idea how is moving millions of non whites into White countries NOT Genocide.
Theres another unexpected windfall for White Nationalists from these "Progressive", "Humane" policies....and boy are these guys going to hate my next comment.
Just as an example,I am a blood relative to Mick Dodson and a good proportion of the other Aboriginals.
Mick's father was Irish, my family are Irish, when you look at genetic maps you see that Mick and I are genetically related to most Irish people.
So Mick is Aboriginal and I'm White, we're still distantly related but there it be, two different races.
Now Mick and I may be Cousins in a fairly loose way but are either of us related to the same degree with, say, Sudanese people, or Chinese?
This isn't as simple as CJ and Baygon and others make out.
If I'm now related to a good number of Aboriginals, but not of the same race as them, doesn't that mean race is probably a more significant factor in our society than they'd like to believe?
What Baygon and to an extent the author really wants is a discussion of Immigration that doesn't include RACE,especially my race the WHITE RACE only then would it be "Sensible".
This is why I come to this board to breathe fire on your discussions, otherwise they tend not to be real discussions at all, just pseudo dialectic musings.

@Jay Of Melbourne
>Thanks for the assist

No offense, I didn't intend to assist you as such. I just see this threatening behavior on political websites and think it is getting out of hand. The least I can do is a hold a mirror up to these people, to show them what they are doing and where it logically leads.

>So Mick is Aboriginal and I'm White, we're still distantly related but there it be, two different races.

I am the same. I have Aboriginals as close and more distant relatives, though am not Aboriginal myself.

>Forced removal of children and racial assimilation of Aborigines were seen as "Humane" solutions.

I like you view what was done and is still being done to the Aboriginal people as genocide. How can it be called anything else, when for the most part, their system of self governance, institutions, culture and way of life, has been replaced with alcohol, drugs and welfare payments? And all of this was done using policies of assimilation.

I also see the policies these eradicators espouse, as the final nail in the coffin of the Aboriginal people. If Australia's population becomes as large as they want and the majority are non-White, Australia's new masters will have no special regard for the Aboriginal people. They will see them as non Whites like themselves and give them no quarter.

So if the Aboriginal people want to continue to exist as a distinct people and culture, they must demand a homeland of their own, as well as self rule and it is the same for all distinct peoples of the world.

The people at the top and their followers may use flowery words to sell their Multiculturalism, Assimilation and Globalism, but destruction, division, and profits are their only motivations.