Belly,

<<One thing I can say for sure, I want no Church, no God, [who I do not believe ever existed], [put all Gods there] to tell me at any time what I can or can not do>>

One minute after your last breath you will meet Him and suffer His eternal consequences:

** 'And just as each person is destined to die once and after that comes judgment' (Hebrews 9:27).

** God does not believe in atheists / agnostics. God says they don't exist; some human beings want to hide from God under the guise of 'I do not believe God ever existed'. God states that ...

** 'They know the truth about God because he has made it obvious to them. For ever since the world was created, people have seen the earth and sky. Through everything God made, they can clearly see his invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature. So they have no excuse for not knowing God' (Romans 1:19-20).

You can deny God's existence, but He will have no bar of it. You will be without excuse when you meet him 1 minute after your last breath.

There are many in the world, including yourself, who want to deny God's existence. God tells why they can't or don't want to understand His existence:

** 'God shows his anger from heaven against all sinful, wicked people who suppress the truth by their wickedness' (Romans 1:18). This applies to all atheists / agnostics - the truth of the existence of God is suppressed because of the wickedness of their actions and thoughts. Their wickedness, prevents the truth of God's existence from being known.

So you don't want God to tell you what you can and cannot do. Does that mean you choose whatever ethical actions you want out of your own autonomous will?

Toni,

You must think I'm a dill with a comment like this: <<I think technically yo'll (sic) find that the title of this thread is 'Euthenasia', which according to my abridged Oxford is not actually a word>>

You and I know that 'Euthenasia' was a typo. The thread has dealt with the pros and cons of euthanasia.

I think we are spinning the wheels. I'm out of here. Bye!

//You must think I'm a dill with a comment like this//

Hmm, no thoughts on liberalism then? Funny, you seemed so against it before... glad to see you've conceded that point.

And nothing to say about how Territory rights might be pertinent to a discussion about the 'Restoring Territory Rights (Assisted Suicide Legislation) Bill 2015'?

It's not what you'd call a convincing rebuttal, is it?

Oz Spen - why does religion advocate a violent, punishing god - after claiming that god is love? Why is threat, shame and fear the foundation of religion? Why does it's adherents think they have a right to threaten others? How is that spiritual? Interested to read your response.

HereNow,

<<Oz Spen - why does religion advocate a violent, punishing god - after claiming that god is love? Why is threat, shame and fear the foundation of religion? Why does it's adherents think they have a right to threaten others? How is that spiritual? Interested to read your response.>>

Your ideology is coming through your straw man fallacy.

If you want a rational conversation, this comment is not the way to engage with me.

Dear HereNow,

I can only speak for myself.

However let me try to answer your questions.

Religion - certainly the Catholic religion in which
I grew up did preach hell and damnation. You're
absolutely right. Whenever I was naughty growing up
as a child, I used to think that "God'll get me for that."
I remember a very embarrassing moment. Fridays at my all
girls' school was when we went to Confession as a group.
There was one priest that we all dreaded to hear our
confessions because he was as deaf as a post. Well this
particular Friday - sure enough I had the misfortune
of being stuck with this man. I had him listening to
my confession. The girls waited for me outside - all
they could hear was this priest shouting - "You did WHAT?"
I came out of the confessional my face red as a beet,
and slinked into my pew - not looking at anyone while the
girls giggled at my demise.

I used to think that I was not religious. I'm probably
not a very good Catholic. I don't like what organised
religion has done to the world. However what I've learned
is that religion is internal, not external. The spirit
within us can't be blamed for the blasphemies carried out
in its name. What some have done in its name, projecting
their neuroses, even perpetrating evil on the world does
not make religion as a mystical phenomenon invalid.
I've had some difficult times in my life - and religion
has helped me to cope. Prayer especially gives me a
peace that I can't find elsewhere.

I'm not sure that I've explained enough for you. Suffice to
say that I have my personal beliefs - however I have no
intention or wish to convert anyone else.