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The Forum > General Discussion > Lax Gun Control Led To Deaths

Lax Gun Control Led To Deaths

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After the Port Arthur massacre in 1996 John Howard to his credit introduced much needed gun control measures to Australia. In 2017 due to lax control and procedures in New South Wales John Edwards was able to obtain a licence, and a gun, and then with training provided by the gun fraternity, Edwards in July 2018 shot dead his two children Jack and Jennifer before turning the gun on himself. Edwards through what the Coroner described as a ""wholly inadequate NSW Firearms Registry", was granted a gun licence when the facts clearly indicate such a person should have never ever been in possession of a lethal weapon.

Yesterday the NSW Coroner Teresa O'Sullivan made public her findings and recommendations into Jack and Jennifer Edwards deaths. Ms O'Sullivan said; "The evidence before this court plainly reveals that the deaths of Jack and Jennifer were preventable." She went on to say, the procedures and practices within the NSW Firearms Registry were totally inadequate in determining a persons suitability to hold a gun licence. The Coroner made no less than 24 recommendations in her 270 page report. Its time to review and revise gun licencing laws and procedures across Australia and weed out other potential John Edwards, and prevent massively unsuitable people from having access to guns.

Unfortunately five months after the murders of Jack and Jennifer, their mother Olga Edwards took her own life.
Posted by Paul1405, Thursday, 8 April 2021 5:33:59 AM
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Paul1405,
Why did John Edwards do what he did ? Can you please enlighten us on the lead-up.
Posted by individual, Thursday, 8 April 2021 8:09:15 AM
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Hi Paul,

Such a sad case from all perspectives.

I'm not sure what tests are currently being done
in NSW or elsewhere about the eligibility of who
can or cannot be given a licence to carry guns.
I would have thought that those with mental health
issues would not be given the right to bear arms.

I don't know much about the Edwards case. Hopefully
more will come to light. Perhaps something good
can come out of this tragedy as they probe into
what happened and why and ensure that in the future
incidents such as this can be preventable.
Posted by Foxy, Thursday, 8 April 2021 8:59:54 AM
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Well, I've found more details on the web about
the Edwards case - and here they are:

It seems that John Edwards " had a history of domestic
violence. He also had six prior families and had
fathered a total of 10 children. Five months after
the shootings Olga Edwards took her own life. The
children were scared of their father."

" At the time of the shootings, Edwards was the subject
of complaints of violence, intimidation, and stalking
by no fewer that five of his ex-partners and three of
his children. Apparently there's an inquest which will
examine how, despite these complaints being filed on
the police database, Edwards was able to obtain a gun
licence and legally purchase three refles and two
pistols before the shootings."

" One of Edwards former ex-wives was so terrified of him she
changed her name and moved to Queensland. The inquest
continues.
Posted by Foxy, Thursday, 8 April 2021 9:45:29 AM
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Paul,

You're right, lax control was the problem.
Had Firearms Registry and the Commissioner of Police done their jobs this tragedy would not have happened with a firearm.

It would still have happened as Edwards was apparently intent on killing, but had he done it a different way then I suspect that your interest would not manifest itself.
Posted by Is Mise, Thursday, 8 April 2021 11:11:20 AM
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your interest would not manifest itself.
is Mise,
Precisely ! Also, what drove him to do what he did ? Any female that marries a bloke that has has 5 divorces under his belt has a question mark hanging over her head !
Posted by individual, Thursday, 8 April 2021 11:45:23 AM
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Indy, it was a instance of family breakdown. Edwards had a long and well documented history of domestic violence, yet was given relatively easy access to legal firearms.

Issy, your deflection with a red herring is understanble, "It would still have happened", considering your gun mob the SSAA was up to its eyeballs training Edwards in the use of such lethal weapons, through the SSAA operated St Marys Pistol Club. Following his training by the club " Edwards spent 90 minutes improving his shooting accuracy under the supervision of a gun club official less than three months before murdering his children."

The problem in NSW has been the political arm of the gun lobby, the Shooters Party, has taken every opportunity to seek to have robust gun legislation watered down or abolished through political trade offs with the State government. The result has been a lax system causing the deaths of two innocent children. The State government needs to act and implement the 24 recommendations of the Coroner, before another tragedy of this kind can occur once more.
Posted by Paul1405, Thursday, 8 April 2021 12:25:04 PM
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Foxy,

Time to update yourself about Australia, you're not living in the USA now.

"I'm not sure what tests are currently being done
in NSW or elsewhere about the eligibility of who
can or cannot be given a licence to carry guns.
I would have thought that those with mental health
issues would not be given the right to bear arms."

No one in Australia is given a liscence to carry a gun and no one has the right to bear arms; even a policeman cannot be armed when off duty.
In country areas when there is an emergency callout, often vital time is wasted whilst the Officer goes to the unmanned police station to get his pistol.
Posted by Is Mise, Thursday, 8 April 2021 1:14:35 PM
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From my understanding the way it works in
Australia regarding guns is:

1) You have to join a club first
2) The background check is very rigorous
3) Attend a firearms safety course
4) Pass a written and practical test
5) Show you have gun storage that meets regulations
6) Pass a rigorous background check that looks
at criminal history, domestic violence,
restraining order, and arrest history
7) You need a very specific permit
8) Then you wait weeks

As far as John Edwards is concerned the background
check on him failed badly.

BTW: For those interested - the last time I lived in the
US was more than 30 years ago. Do keep up!
Posted by Foxy, Thursday, 8 April 2021 1:59:58 PM
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Foxy,

"BTW: For those interested - the last time I lived in the
US was more than 30 years ago. Do keep up!"

That was my point, do keep up.
Posted by Is Mise, Thursday, 8 April 2021 3:43:23 PM
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yet was given relatively easy access to legal firearms.
Paul1405,
I think I'm within 95% of being right that the Public servants involved in the legal access to his firearms was a Labor supporter !
Posted by individual, Thursday, 8 April 2021 3:46:42 PM
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Is Mise,

No. Your point was to stir.

Nice try.

But -

So yesterday!
Posted by Foxy, Thursday, 8 April 2021 4:35:58 PM
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Foxy,

No, my point was that you were once again posting from a position of inadequate knowledge.

Nice to see that you have chosen the path of improvement.
Posted by Is Mise, Thursday, 8 April 2021 5:08:54 PM
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I would like to say nice try (again) Is Mise,

But it wasn't.

Now back to the topic.

Hi Paul,

John Edwards should not have passed a background check.
He did and someone needs to be held to account.
Posted by Foxy, Thursday, 8 April 2021 6:02:51 PM
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He did and someone needs to be held to account.
Foxy,
Yes, a Public Service bureaucrat !
Posted by individual, Thursday, 8 April 2021 6:06:56 PM
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This crime could have been preventable.

The inquest should come up with some answers
to ensure this does not happen again.
Posted by Foxy, Thursday, 8 April 2021 6:19:54 PM
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According to channel 9 News - as of yesterday (7th April 2021)
an inquest into all their deaths was handed down -
finding police, the firearms registry, and the family law
system failed to pick up on the warning signs regarding
John Edwards. Edwards had a long history of domestic
violence but was legally allowed to buy 5 guns.

24 recommendations have been made including better domestic
violence training for police and the decision makers at
the firearms registry.
Posted by Foxy, Thursday, 8 April 2021 6:42:21 PM
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to ensure this does not happen again.
Foxy,
How about asking your Public Service Union to pull their finger out ?
Posted by individual, Thursday, 8 April 2021 7:22:55 PM
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There you go again Indy, with your 95% nonsense again.

Issy, no comment on the part played by the gun lobby in NSW as they've white-anted robust gun control laws to the detriment of the law-abiding general public. In the Edwards case, the actions of Firearms Registry and the Commissioner of Police were the product of a system that has been allowed to be corrupted by vested gun lobby interests.

The 24 recommendations of the Coroner need to be considered and acted upon asap. A complete review of all licenced persons needs to be undertaken to determine their suitability, and weed out the undesirables.
Posted by Paul1405, Thursday, 8 April 2021 7:29:35 PM
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There you go again Indy, with your 95% nonsense again.
Paul1405,
Really ? Too close to the bone for you more likely !
Posted by individual, Thursday, 8 April 2021 9:02:53 PM
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Good to see Joe Biden is taking action against the gun lobby in the US following a number of mass shootings. Biden called the gun violence an “epidemic” and “international embarrassment”.

If Biden is willing to take on the powerful gun lobby for the good of the nation, why can't Australian politicians do likewise. Its time to remove all guns from the hands of those with no legitimate reason to hold a gun. Like John Edwards who pretended to be a sports or recreational shooter he was able to slip under the radar. With our lax gun laws there are possibly thousands of undesirables holding gun licences. Its time government acted to clean up the mess! A new no gun, no fun policy is what's needed!
Posted by Paul1405, Friday, 9 April 2021 6:30:08 AM
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Good Morning Paul,

The inquest has found the deaths of Sydney children
by their father were preventable if he hadn't been
able to access guns.

John Edwards shot his 15 year old son Jack and his
13 year old daughter Jennifer at their home in West
Pennant Hills in 2018. Later that day he killed
himself and six months after these happenings his
ex wife Olga Edwards committed suicide. An inquest
into these deaths followed.

Finally on the 7th April 2021 the inquest into all their
deaths handed down - finding police, the firearms
registry, and the family law system failed to pick
up on the warning signs.

Edwards had a long history of domestic violence but
was legally allowed to buy five guns.

24 recommendations have been made including as mentioned
earlier better domestic violence training for police and
the decision makers at the firearms registry.

We can only trust that these recommendations will be taken
on board to prevent incidents such as these from happening
again.
Posted by Foxy, Friday, 9 April 2021 8:07:26 AM
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Paul,

You are shewing signs of desperation again.

Foxy,

"The inquest has found the deaths of Sydney children
by their father were preventable if he hadn't been
able to access guns"

Utter nonsense.
The man obviously wanted to kill his children and there was no way to stop him short of arrest and there was no cause to arrest him.

What was to stop him using the kitchen carving knife or pieces of fishing line as garottes or poison?

Get with it, it's a rough world out there.
Posted by Is Mise, Friday, 9 April 2021 9:23:39 AM
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The facts are - John Edwards had a long history
of domestic violence but was legally allowed to
buy 5 guns.

Police admitted they failed to record or even read
Edwards case notes which allowed him to legally
purchase the firearms - including the Glock pistol
that would kill his son and daughter.

John Edwards applied for a firearms licence 18 months
before the shooting. He had it all planned. And guns were
his weapons of choice. The firearms registry admitted it
ignored Edwards's 15 domestic violence related entries
about John Edwards on the police database while deciding
whether he should have access to guns.

How Edwards came to access firearms despite a long history
of domestic violence was a CENTRAL issue at the inquest
into the deaths of his children.

And that is something that cannot and should not be
brushed aside, excused, or ignored.
Posted by Foxy, Friday, 9 April 2021 9:49:18 AM
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It is a rough world for some out there but putting
guns into some people's hands does not help the
situation.
Posted by Foxy, Friday, 9 April 2021 9:52:11 AM
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Foxy,

"How Edwards came to access firearms despite a long history
of domestic violence was a CENTRAL issue at the inquest
into the deaths of his children"

How right you are, and the failure was those in authority overriding the law and ignoring the advice of pistol club officials.

Paul,

Care to tell us just how the Firearms Laws have been watered down?

And which ones, so watered, are pertinent to the case under discussion.
Posted by Is Mise, Friday, 9 April 2021 10:06:30 AM
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Foxy,

"What was to stop him using the kitchen carving knife or pieces of fishing line as garottes or poison?"

Care to answer that before you cut and paste again?

Paul could shew us his wisdom by also submitting an answer.

There was/is a way, but that way is not PC and would never be countenanced by our social engineers.
Posted by Is Mise, Friday, 9 April 2021 12:21:00 PM
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Anyone convicted of a violent crime should not have access to guns.
Posted by shadowminister, Friday, 9 April 2021 12:58:33 PM
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Bad bus driving leads to death too.

I think we should ban all buses.
Posted by Hasbeen, Friday, 9 April 2021 3:04:44 PM
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Why not start looking what causes such violence in the first place ?
Society look into the mirror !
Posted by individual, Friday, 9 April 2021 6:49:56 PM
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"Anyone convicted of a violent crime should not have access to guns.

Or axes, hatchets, golf clubs, cricket bats, cutlery, chain saws, hammers, chisels. screwdrivers, fishing line etc., blunt instruments and cars and trucks, all of which have been used to murder.

First define violent crime.
Posted by Is Mise, Friday, 9 April 2021 6:55:47 PM
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I would add; what to do about people who have been trained, at Government expense, to kill?

Both loudly with guns and explosives and silently with their bare hands, knives, shovels and other silent instruments; there are many thousands of these trained killers in our communities.

BEWARE!!
Posted by Is Mise, Friday, 9 April 2021 7:04:25 PM
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Is Mise I was as a pilot trained to use unarmed combat, knives & other less obvious weapons, to kill silently to aid my escape if shot down behind enemy lines. I was also armed & trained in the use of all small arms, if necessary to use if a more noisy escape attempt was required.

I was likewise trained in shooting down aircraft, & the sinking of ships with the weapons issued to me. I would happily have done this in the event of hostilities.

You know, all that training has not made me ever want to kill anyone, shoot down a friendly aircraft, or sink a ship yet. If it has not roused such a desire in the last 60 years, I think it is highly unlikely to do so now. In fact I have not in those 60 years had the urge to even mildly hurt anyone, not even our lefties here.

I think it is unreasonable to think that, just because someone was trained in the defense of our country, & prepared to risk their lives in so doing, that they are any more likely to be aggressive to their fellow citizens.
Posted by Hasbeen, Friday, 9 April 2021 9:02:33 PM
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people who have been trained, at Government expense, to kill?
Is Mise,
You mean the ones you'll run to crying for help when the time comes ?
Posted by individual, Friday, 9 April 2021 9:20:31 PM
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Hasbeen,

"I think it is unreasonable to think that, just because someone was trained in the defense of our country, & prepared to risk their lives in so doing, that they are any more likely to be aggressive to their fellow citizens."

Precisely, and if their chosen sport is with firearms then there is no reason to stop them enjoying it, they aren't going to run amuck.

Individual,

"You mean the ones you'll run to crying for help when the time comes ?"
I won't do that at all, I'm one of the ones that the Government trained to kill and, like Hasbeen I've never felt the urge to use my skills against any fellow citizens.

Tomorrow I'll be on the pistol range doing a bit of practice and then some competition in my chosen sport.
Posted by Is Mise, Friday, 9 April 2021 10:26:50 PM
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Nothing to see here, deflection, the what if's, strawman arguments. Every time there is a tragedy involving guns, the gunnie ratbags can be relied upon to wheel out their usual array of nonsense with the objective of maintaining the proliferation of guns in the community. Some of these gun nutters even believe children as young as five should have the right to bear arms. They take their lead from the American constitution with the Australian chapter the SSAA under the influence of the powerful American organisation the NRA. Unfortunately Australia's band of gun nuts repeat the same perversion as what they have been indoctrinated with by the NRA from America.
Posted by Paul1405, Saturday, 10 April 2021 6:20:18 AM
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Paul,

Firstly, your heading "Lax Gun Control Led To Deaths" is pure BS as it is obvious that Edwards planned the children's deaths months before and the means that he used was immaterial.

How about telling us how the tragedy could have been avoided and why aren't the Greens et al calling for the Minister's and the Commissioner's scalps, after all this is not a mere allegation of misconduct but a proven one?

Once again you are pouncing on a tragedy to further push your favourite wheelbarrow.
Posted by Is Mise, Saturday, 10 April 2021 9:53:04 AM
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Edwards planned
Is Mise,
Do we know what his missus was like ?
Posted by individual, Saturday, 10 April 2021 12:36:12 PM
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"Do we know what his missus was like ?"

Which one?
Posted by Is Mise, Saturday, 10 April 2021 1:32:11 PM
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Paul,

Once again you go on with the blarney about the SSAA and the NRA.

You have been challenged to prove your allegations on numerous occasions and so far you have failed to do so.

The SSAA do not need money from any outside source, membership fees are about $20,000,000 a year from the over 200,000 members.

Then there are club fees from the over 440 member clubs (currently we pay $5 per shooter per day on the range), SSAA Insurance and their other commercial interests.

Unlike the secretive Gun Control Australia the SSAA is audited and the audit is on public record.
Posted by Is Mise, Saturday, 10 April 2021 2:05:57 PM
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Which one?
Is Mise,
The last one who committed suicide.
Posted by individual, Saturday, 10 April 2021 9:16:58 PM
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By all accounts a decent caring person; one wonders why the marriage was allowed to go ahead given his record.

When I was making arrangements to marry my wife in India over 25 years ago, there was much checking and a long interview, of both of us, at the Australian High Commission in Delhi.
Posted by Is Mise, Saturday, 10 April 2021 11:21:13 PM
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Issy, did you disclose your crazed pro gun fetish to the High Commissioner, that could have put the mockers on things?

Wow, a $20 million war chest available to the crazed pro gun lobby to finance their aim of the complete destruction of Australia's gun laws. Things are more diabolical than I thought.

Issy, when is the pro gun mob, as represented by the SSAA, going to apologise for the part they played (providing expert training and providing the guns used by John Edwards, were obtained from the SSAA St Mary's Pistol Club) in facilitating the murders of the children Jack and Jennifer Edwards. You would think feelings of guilt would prompt them to act, alas no indication of that overdue apology yet. But like the pro gun mob on the forum there has not been one word of condolence from Pro Gun for the tragic but preventable murders of Jack and Jennifer Edwards. Lets hope the State government acts on the 24 recommendations made by the Coroner, and lets hope that the pro gun lobby don't act in their usual way to undermine much needed gun reform.
Posted by Paul1405, Sunday, 11 April 2021 6:00:33 AM
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Paul,

Your desperation is becoming even more apparent as is your fixation against law abiding citizens; perhaps you should get psychiatric help?

The SSAA has nothing to apologize for, they acted according to law and if some of their members had been listened to Edwards would not have got a liscence.

It was not the SSAA that issued him with a Commissioner's Permit but the NSW Firearms Registry, which in it's entire history has never achieved anything.

Have you found the answers about the SSAA and the NRA yet?
We wait with bated breath for confirmation of your allegations.
Posted by Is Mise, Sunday, 11 April 2021 10:46:14 AM
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Okay, Issy the SSAA members who trained, and then sold the guns to John Edwards that he used to murder his two children Jack and Jennifer can smugly hide behind the law. The only crime they are guilty of is a moral crime, which is not punishable under any law. But they should remember the following;

"The inquest heard John emptied two rounds of bullets into his terrified children, leaving them with horrific and traumatic injuries."

"State Coroner Teresa O’Sullivan detailed the heartbreaking moment Jack crouched under his desk with his younger sister, attempting to use his body to shield hers, as John fired an entire round of bullets into his two children."

Yes, your SSAA members are guilty of no crime, I hope they all sleep soundly at night.
Posted by Paul1405, Sunday, 11 April 2021 1:26:38 PM
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Paul,

Are those actual quotes from the Coroner or did you make them up, because they are factually incorrect?

As for training, that's what Instructors do at firearm clubs; would you accuse motor car driving instructors of moral responsibility if one of their pupils uses a car to kill?

Training is available on the Internet,
http://prosafety101.com/how-to-shoot-a-glock-19/
would you have the 'net censored?

There is a mile of info on the net, from making your own submachine gun to making quite potent explosives and innumerable sources of 24 hour electrical timing devices (good luck with banning these!!) that allow you to be out of the country when the bang comes.

You are badly in need of help, I fear.
Posted by Is Mise, Sunday, 11 April 2021 3:29:03 PM
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Paul1405,
You're one unbalanced character that shouldn't be let near any weapon !
Posted by individual, Monday, 12 April 2021 8:59:34 AM
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Paul,

It seems that the NSW Police Commissioner disagrees with you.

"NSW Police accepts responsibility for John Edwards murdering his two teenage children"
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-04-12/nsw-mick-fuller-apologises-for-edwards-children-deaths/100062340
Posted by Is Mise, Monday, 12 April 2021 3:59:29 PM
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Issy, its good to see the coppers admitting responsibility for their part in the terrible murders of the Edwards children. The coppers are only a part of those who contributed, the incompetent public servants at the NSW Firearms Registry along with the SSAA members of the St Mary's Pistol Club who trained and armed John Edwards so he could carry out his vile deed also need to apologise.
Posted by Paul1405, Tuesday, 13 April 2021 6:19:18 AM
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Wasn't it only a week ago when a 21 year old black chap killed a white Police officer by deliberately running him over with a car ?
So far, I haven't heard any outrage from the anti car outfits or the BLM movement.
If a white PO is murdered by a black man without using a gun, is that ok by the supporters of BLM ?
Family violence is quite often brought on by the economic experts of the lucky Country & the bogans indulging in drug abuse.
In cases where the male ends up being the violator, no-one appears to check who the initiial instigator was. Could have been the woman for all we know !
Posted by individual, Tuesday, 13 April 2021 1:32:34 PM
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Paul,

"... SSAA members of the St Mary's Pistol Club who trained and armed John Edwards so he could carry out his vile deed also need to apologise."

I'm sure you don't really mean that they trained and armed him so that he could commit murder, to do so they would have to have known that he intended murder.

It's like those made up Coroner quotes, poor understanding of the subject under discussion.

How're you doing on the SSAA, NRA links; found any evidence yet?
Posted by Is Mise, Tuesday, 13 April 2021 2:18:44 PM
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Dear Is Mise,

Edward's was knocked back at other clubs but welcomed at St Mary's. of course they should apologise. They put the gun owning rights of Edwards over the right to life of his children. The fact that you can't see there is anything to apologies for is indicative of the mindset of anyone assessing another's suitability to hold a gun licence.
Posted by SteeleRedux, Tuesday, 13 April 2021 2:43:16 PM
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Steele,

If you were a club official and the Commissioner of Police told you that a particular person was a fit and proper person to join a pistol club would you tell the Commissioner to go jump?

The Government has made it mandatory for a person that holds a pistol liscence to join a pistol club, it is not up to club officials to go against the law.

Edwards was not an aspiring shooter seeking to join a club, to train and be assessed for a liscence but a privileged person holding a Commissioner's Permit.

"They put the gun owning rights of Edwards over the right to life of his children."

Rubbish, they had no idea that he would harm anyone and if you can't see this then you are as thick as Paul.

Two bricks either side of a plank.
Posted by Is Mise, Tuesday, 13 April 2021 3:38:40 PM
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"They put the gun owning rights of Edwards over the right to life of his children."
Paul1405,
A brainless quote by a brainless wonder. If my gut feeling serves me right, I could almost guarantee that the Public servant signing off on that gun deal is a staunch Labor supporter !
Posted by individual, Wednesday, 14 April 2021 7:18:56 AM
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Already they're protesting of the latest killing of a black man by Police in Minneapolis.
But, still nothing following the white Police Officer's killing !
Posted by individual, Wednesday, 14 April 2021 3:23:01 PM
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Individual,

Keep up with the news, there was rioting in protest all over Washington,, the ABC reported it in depth...damn!! the alarm went off, time to get up in the real world.
Posted by Is Mise, Wednesday, 14 April 2021 6:00:02 PM
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is Mise,
I'm a bit ignorant on this, do only black criminals deserve sympathy ?
Posted by individual, Wednesday, 14 April 2021 7:06:11 PM
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Indy,

Who he votes for you wouldn't have a clue. At least like me, he's not some blow in who worked 5 minutes and has been bludging off the welfare system for the past 50 years.
Posted by Paul1405, Wednesday, 14 April 2021 9:01:42 PM
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is Mise,
"I'm a bit ignorant"
Posted by individual

Not wrong there Indy. Not my quote, but I fully agree with Steele.

In the US there is a systemic problem with white coppers murdering African American males, not the other way round. Maybe black Americans are sick of 500 years of murder, torture, exploitation and rape at the hands of white oppressors. Maybe you and Issy can put your heads together and come up with an answer. A familiar story that is also happening here in Australia.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QMiGa6wHY3U&ab_channel=AlJazeeraEnglish
Posted by Paul1405, Wednesday, 14 April 2021 10:07:03 PM
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some blow in who worked 5 minutes and has been bludging off the welfare system for the past 50 years.
Paul1405,
That's rather brave of you to admit your situation !

re Who he votes for you wouldn't have a clue.
I hit yet another nerve there haven't I judging by your desperate quip !
Posted by individual, Wednesday, 14 April 2021 10:13:23 PM
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Nah Indy,

Didn't you claim you came here as a blow in, dodged national service, had a short stint as a menial public servant, was sacked for incompetence when Gough got in. Been on the long term dole, graduated to aged welfare and have hated Labor and the pubic service ever since. That's what I've got from you over the years.
Posted by Paul1405, Thursday, 15 April 2021 7:13:10 AM
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That's what I've got from you over the years.
Paul1405,
You're not very observant are you. Only going by what you want to hear instead of hearing what's really happening. A classic sign of a useless to society hateful racist !
Posted by individual, Thursday, 15 April 2021 8:37:38 AM
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