Short Proposition

It is better to be pessimistic, that way you won’t be disappointed. While the collective polls at http://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/president-general/national/ currently tip Biden to win on a 9% basis, collective poll predictions proved wrong in 2016.

Within the collective polls Rusmussen Reports, a very accurate pollster in 2016 http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/elections/election_2016/how_we_did sharply disagreed with the collective on 28 October 2020, tipping Trump to win by 1%.

Long Proposition

See Rusmussen's 2020 prediction here http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/elections/election_2020/white_house_watch_oct28

“Trump 48%, Biden 47%, Wednesday, October 28, 2020

President Trump has seesawed back into a one-point lead over Democrat Joe Biden in Rasmussen Reports’ daily White House Watch survey.
The latest national telephone and online survey finds Trump edging Biden 48% to 47% among Likely U.S. Voters. Three percent (3%) prefer some other candidate, and two percent (2%) remain undecided... The margin of sampling error is +/- 2.5 percentage points...”

The US voting system is very complicated, due to:

The President is elected according to the Electoral College System http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Electoral_College not directly on the popular vote. In 2016 Trump won more Electoral College votes (304 to Hillary’s 227) while Hillary won more popular votes (65,853,514 compared to Trump’s 62,984,828).

Tied to Electoral College system, Swing/Battleground/Toss-up State results often determine who wins. See this Electoral Map http://www.270towin.com/maps/biden-trump-polling-map where Trump or Biden needs 270 Electoral College Votes to win. Swing States (Florida, Pennsylvania, Ohio, Michigan, North Carolina, Arizona, Wisconsin and Iowa) are identified and predicted here http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/oct/28/us-election-polls-tracker-swing-states-donald-trump-joe-biden .

In very close State counts disputes have been filed with State or Federal courts, perhaps ultimately for the US Supreme Court to decide. http://theconversation.com/the-case-of-biden-versus-trump-or-how-a-judge-could-decide-the-presidential-election-146367 .

This 2020 election is very unusual in that the President says he won’t accept a Biden win under the electoral system http://edition.cnn.com/2020/09/24/politics/trump-election-warnings-leaving-office/index.html .

Here's hoping Biden wins.

If Trump wins the Progressives will be uncontrollable in their spewing of hatred !

Indy, as a Progressive, I wont be greatly concerned as to who wins. A choice between the senile and the insane in some undemocratic election, in some undemocratic country is not a great choice to begin with. From a world prospective Biden appears to be the lesser of two evils, but only by a degree. To think, like other world nut cases these jerks have their hand on the button of ultimate destruction. That's far more concerning than any phony election result.

Yes indeedy indi

No matter who wins there'll be violence on US streets.

Trump has encouraged such violence for his own electoral benefit.

His base plead "Mr Trump please protect us from the rising, rioting black hordes!"

More here http://www.ny1.com/nyc/all-boroughs/politics/2020/10/27/americans-concerned-about-post-election-violence-as-police-prepare

I really think that the results will be very close.

But if Trumpf wins fair and square, as a 'Progressive', I'd concede that he is entitled to another four years.

End of, Individual.

Joe

"Trump has encouraged such violence for his own electoral benefit" plantagenet.

Really, when did he become the leader of the BLM ratbags, & how many times did he offer the military to stop the riots?

That is some pretty good rationalising there.

Plantagenet

Post PROOF of Trump supporting violence as you have claimed.

And post proof of your having criticised the Democratic party supporting looting, armed robbery, burning cities to the ground, murdering people in the streets because of their race, and the re-introduction of official segregation.

Post proof that you criticised the Democrats for actively promoting the spread of covid in the USA hoping to would make political advantage for them.

And why are you supporting perpetual war that has NOTHING TO DO with the defence of America, and channels BILLIONS of dollars into corrupt corporations and politicians? I find it hard to understand people who are as stupid and evil as to support that.

And you're saying it's okay to stab children in their head when they're halfway out their mother's birth canal, and call it a "right", because that's what the Democrats stand for. Yes?

Why do you support increased black unemployment and homelessness? Why?

If the police are defunded, you're SUPPORTING people's right to defend themselves from violent criminals, right? Or you're saying they should just get beaten, raped, robbed, and shot? Which? Because it's lunatic stuff either way. Explain yourself.

Why do you suppport war, violence, hate, racism, the re-introduction of racial segregation, thought police, mass political killings, bigotry, killing people in the street, burning cities to the ground, brainwashing little children, and totalitarian fascism?

You've obvioulsy been brainwashed.

Further to the Trump Will Win proposition is http://news.yahoo.com/shy-trump-voters-will-power-his-win-says-pollster-who-called-2016-race-203448623.html of 24 October 2020:

"‘Shy’ Trump voters will power his win, says pollster who called 2016 race"

"Thanks to the hidden support from voters who are embarrassed to admit they will vote for Donald Trump, the president will be narrowly reelected on Nov. 3, says one of the few pollsters who correctly predicted his 2016 victory.

Pollster Robert Cahaly, the head of the Georgia-based Trafalgar Group, saw interest in his company skyrocket in 2016 after he bucked the consensus of other pollsters and forecast that Trump would beat Democrat Hillary Clinton in Michigan and Pennsylvania, two states that were crucial to his victory.

[Cahaly] credits a proprietary model of calculating a polling sample that takes into account the social pressure that leads many people to hide their support of a controversial, polarizing candidate like Trump, even from anonymous pollsters.

It’s that same demographic that Trump often refers to as the “silent majority,” whom the president says will help him “win this election big.”

Unlike the rally goers in [Make America Great Again] MAGA hats who have memorized the lyrics and sing along to Lee Greenwood’s “God Bless the USA,” these “shy Trump voters,” Cahaly told Yahoo News in an interview Friday, will show that the methods of most polling outfits are outdated and unreliable"...MORE

Got this just now in one of those emails.

In their infinite wisdom, the United States' Founders created the
Electoral College to ensure the STATES were fairly represented. Why should one or two densely populated areas speak for the
whole of the nation?

The following list of statistics has been making the rounds on the Internet. It should finally put an end to the argument
as to why the Electoral College makes sense.

Do share this. It needs to be widely known and understood.

There are 3,141 counties in the United States.

Trump won 3,084 of them.

Clinton won 57.

There are 62 counties in New York State.

Trump won 46 of them.

Clinton won 16.

Clinton won the popular vote by approx. 1.5 million votes.

In the 5 counties that encompass NYC, (Bronx, Brooklyn, Manhattan, Richmond & Queens) Clinton received well over 2 million
more votes than Trump. (Clinton only won 4 of these counties; Trump won Richmond)

Therefore these 5 counties alone, more than accounted for Clinton winning the popular vote of the entire country.

These 5 counties comprise 319 square miles.

The United States is comprised of 3,797,000 square miles.

When you have a country that encompasses almost 4 million square miles of territory, it would be ludicrous to even suggest
that the vote of those who inhabit a mere 319 square miles should dictate the outcome of a national election.

Large, densely populated Democrat cities (NYC, Chicago, LA, etc.) DO NOT and SHOULD NOT speak for the rest of our country!

And...it's been verified and documented that those aforementioned 319 square miles are where the majority of our nation's
problems foment

Hi Individual,

" .... it's been verified and documented that those aforementioned 319 square miles are where the majority of our nation's problems foment ..... "

Well, perhaps not our country, mate.

You need to take more care when you cut and paste :)

Joe

The polls were hopelessly wrong in 2016.
The polls were hopelessly wrong about Brexit.
The polls were wrong about Australia's last election.

So let's all believe the polls!!

I don't think we can draw any conclusions based on the polls. They're all over the place and there's just too much temptation to believe those that say what we want to hear. So my view is we sit back and see what happens. The results should be known by 15 Nov or thereabouts - although much earlier if there's a landslide one way or t'other.

All I can say is that if somehow Trump pulls it off it'll be the most astonishing win in US history - or at least since Truman/Dewey.

Given the forces ranged against him and their willingness to sacrifice all principles in the desire to get Trump out, its amazing he's still in with a show.

Apart from the Democrats and never-Trump Republicans, Trump faces implacable opposition from the deep and not-so deep state (eg the FBI had evidence that the impeachment charges were unfounded, yet sat on it and hide it from the world), the legacy media(eg have been anti-Trump from the time he was elected and have co-ordinated efforts to hide the Hunter Biden scandal), and the social media barons (eg censoring the NY Post revelations).

Normally any one of those would be enough to sink a presidency. But he keeps fighting. We'll know how successfully soon enough.

Donald Trump needs 270 votes in the Electoral College
to win re-election. Trump's been president for 4 years
and who knows if voters will be judging him on his record
or blindly supporting him. Either way this will be a
Referendum on Trump. The election in the key electoral
states is likely to come down to how independent voters
perceive Trump's handling of COVID - 19. The pandemic
had hurt a lot of people and the question is are they
going to blame Trump?

Is the focus going to be on issues like the economy, jobs,
healthcare, COVID? We'll have to wait and see.
Will Trump go quietly if he loses?
We'll have to wait and see.
What will the next four years be like if Trump wins?
We'll have to wait and see.

Hi Foxy,

I suspect that the election will be very close, and just maybe Trumpf will swing the Electoral College vote. That doesn't meet until mid-January to finally decide who should be the next President, and it doesn't have to choose either official candidate. But ofd course, they will.

Biden will get the popular vote, maybe by a bigger margin than Henry Clifton did in 2016, but still may not win the Electoral College vote, which is more crucial. If he loses, then his supporters should cop it and move on, to fight Mike Pence in 2024.

Joe

Dear Joe,

Interesting times ahead.

Hi Foxy and Joe

Another complication with the US voting system that I didn't mention is that the US effectively has 50 politised Electoral Committees rather than the one non-partisan Electoral Commission that Australia enjoys.

For the US this is usually a minor problem if both candidates are honest. But in 2016 with Trump US intelligence detected considerable hacking of sensitive Democrat records by Russian intelligence.

Trump was only too happy to use the Russian info (directly from Russia or from Russia via Wikileaks).

The info was used to blacken Hillary's name overall.

But also to blackmail members of the Democrat dominated state Electoral Committees and state Democrat candidates. Everyone has an embarrassing past to downplay in some respects.

So this helped Trump win the unwinnable 2016 election.

In 2020 Russian intelligence has not been idle. Putin wants Trump to remain in office because off Trump's mutually beneficial relationship with Russia going back decades.

Trump is US$400 million in debt with much of it owed to Russian friends of Putin or to Putin himself (Putin is worth US$Billions).

See just some details of Trump's heavy indebtedness to Russia in my post below.

Trump is US$100 millions in debt to Russian creditors via Deutsche Bank. But, in association with Putin, the Russian creditors do not call in Trump's debts as long as Trump performs some services beneficial to Russian foreign policy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Trump_Organization#Financing records

Financing of the Trump Organisation

"During the property boom of the 1980s, Trump acquired numerous properties and by 1990 owed $4 billion to 72 banks.

When the market entered a slump in 1990 that placed the [Trump] Organization at risk of collapse...Trump's casinos later entered bankruptcies...

After these incidents, Trump had difficulty borrowing new money from most mainstream financial institutions. Deutsche Bank, which did not have a significant presence on Wall Street during the 1980s, expanded rapidly in the United States during the 1990s, and by the end of the decade had become Trump's primary bank lender.

In the process of [Deutsche Bank's] rapid expansion, [Deutsche Bank] engaged in numerous questionable practices, including manipulating currencies and interest rates, laundering billions of dollars for RUSSIAN oligarchs and misleading international bank regulators.

[Deutsche Bank] was fined $630 million in 2017 for facilitating a $10 billion RUSSIAN money laundering scheme. [Deutsche Bank] provided Trump with a variety of services including financial instruments designed to shield him from risks and outside scrutiny, and connected Trump to wealthy RUSSIANS who were interested in investing in Western real estate.

During the 2000s and 2010s, Trump borrowed $2 billion from [Deutsche Bank], owing [Deutsche Bank] about $360 million in 2016.

Trump's eldest son, Donald Jr., was quoted as saying at a 2008 New York real estate conference, "In terms of high-end product influx into the US, RUSSIANS make up a pretty disproportionate cross-section of a lot of our assets...We see a lot of money pouring in from RUSSIA."

James Dodson, a golf magazine writer, said that during a 2014 golf game, he asked Trump's son Eric how the [Trump] Organization was funding its golf resort acquisitions, to which Trump responded, "Well, we don’t rely on American banks. We have all the funding we need out of RUSSIA." Eric Trump later denied making the statement."

Thanks, Pete.

How on earth can anybody go broke owning a casino ? Isn't that little more than a licence to print [dirty] money ?

But if Pussy-Man has no more expertise in finance than in medical policy, it should come as no surprise.

Joe

Hi Pete,

Thanks for that.

According to news sources from America - there's so
much misinformation being spread currently and the
biggest misinformation spreader is - guess who?
The president himself!

Well, perhaps not our country, mate.
Loudmouth2,
I thought it was pretty clear that it meant the USA but since you query it, Melbourne, Sydney & Brisbane combined are a valid equivalent for here !

Foxy

You're just brainwashed, and you need to learn to think for yourself.

But just out of curiosity, why ARE you supporting bashing and killing people in the street for saying all lives matter, indoctrinating children with racial hatred, and the re-introduction of racial segregation?

Cumberland,

You don't know me and I don't know you.
So let us not judge anything about each other.
The things you accuse me of are incorrect and the
only person we can make judgements about is the
US President on his four year term in office, and based
on what America has become today.

If you like what you see - fair enough.
I don't. That does not make me brainwashed nor
wishing on America what you accuse me of.
O)n the contrary - My wish is for a United States of
America. Not a Divided States.

cont'd ...

Cumberland,

You believe what isn't true and refuse to
accept what is true.
And you call me brainwashed?

Answer: why are you supporting mass political killings, and forced indoctrination with racial hatred, and the re-introduction of offiial racial segregation, and forcing poverty and homelessness on blacks, and killing people in the street for saying all lives matter, and burning down cities, and hate speech, and looting and robbery, and corrupt vested interests stealing billions from the people, and censorship of freedom of speech, and exploitation of working people for big business, and voter fraud, and people being bullied, censored, doxed, attacked and killed for their political opinion and defunding the police, and stabbing children in the head when they're halfway out their mother's birth canals, and totalitarian fascism?

Why?

Yes it does make you brainwashed, because you're obviously unable to think for yourselself, but only obediently bleat what your manipulators have brainwashed into you, and then when challenged you try to evade my question and pretend you don't support what you do.

So you know you're doing wrong, but you choose to do it - because you're brainwashed.

Hi Foxy

Best to avoid responding to this latest US rightwing extremist, Cum land, the new Troll on the block.

Cum laps up replies.

Thanks Cumberland for you interesting comments. Kudos.

If all the racists, far right, bible bashing, happy clappers in America turn out to vote, all 100,000,000 of them, then Dangerous Donald wins again!

plantagenet

You need to understand that other people aren't as dumb and brainwashed as you.

So anyway, answer the question. Why are you supporting mass political killings, kleptocracy on a massive scale, and the re-introduction of racial segregation?

What is wrong with you? Why have unhinged hatred and anger over being deprived of political power so addled your brain that you actually support totalitarian fascism?

*Think!*. You've got a brain. Use it!

plantagenet,

There is much wrong with your utterly bonkers conspiracy theory about Trump and Putin. Things like the level and nature of the Trump's debts. Things like this supposed blackmailing of Electoral Committees (whatever the hell you think they are). Things like the supposed Russian hacking of Hillary's emails - there is no evidence for that, just assertions from Crowdstrike, and Wikileaks have always said they didn't get the hack from the Russians. Oh and Seth Rich is still dead.

But I'll concentrate on one item. You say ..."as long as Trump performs some services beneficial to Russian foreign policy". The whole house of cards hangs on that, n'est pas?

Yet Trump hasn't done beneficial services for the Russians. In fact he's been Putin's worst nightmare. Just some of an extensive list of things Trump's done that disadvantage Putin:

* More andgrowing sanctions against Russia.
* Arming Ukraine. Remember, it was the Obamessiah who refused to provide them with arms. Trump reversed that policy.
* Strengthening NATO. Moving US troops into Poland. Giving support to the Baltic nations.
* Helping middle European nations avoid reliance on Russian energy by providing them with access to US gas and oil.
* Lessening Russian influence in the Balkans via the recent Kosovo talks.
* Confronting Russia's ally, Iran, everywhere and reducing its leverage.
* Remember the 800 Russian troops/mercenaries killed by the US in Syria?

But the real biggy is oil. The Russian economy is hurting bad. Why? Because they were heavily reliant on oil exports, but the price of oil is down. Why? Because of the monumental disruptive influence of US fracking.

If Trump truly was in Putin's pocket, the one thing he could do for Russia would be to kill or inhibit the US fracking industry. But Trump's done the exact opposite, hasn't he? (BTW, who does want to kill the US fracking industry? Burisma Biden).

So your entire conspiracy theory hangs on a charge that Trump does Putin's foreign policy work for him which is not only not proven, but where all the evidence points in the exact opposite direction.

paul1405

You need to understand that other people aren't as dumb as you.

What has Trump done specifically and exclusively to benefit whites? Answer.

It's THE DEMOCRATS who are re-introducting racial segregation. It's THE DEMOCRATS who are burning cities to the ground, bashing and killing people in the streets.

It's the Democrats promoting perpetual wars that have NOTHING TO DO with the defence of America, and everything to do with the corrupt enrichment of corporate vested interests.

And the left wing are SUPPROTING them while stupidly thinking they stand for the little guy. Trump is opposed to it! And you hate him for stopping wars!

You're so controted with hatred that you litereally don't understand what you're talking about.

With non-brainwashed people, they actually care that they've been manipulated into believing falsehoods and supporting violence and hatred.

But with you, and plantagenet, and foxy, you react by simply spasming with brainwashed evasion tactics and back-biting, instead of using your brains to *think* for yourselves.

There is a plague of corrupt vested interests, and a plague of useful idiots enabling them. You, plantagenet and foxy fall into the latter category, all the while thinking that you're some kind of anti-establishment resistance pffffffft!

Hi Joe, Foxy and Paul1405

Have a good weekend.

planta

Hi Pete,

I'll take your advice.
Thanks.

The news from America is getting more and more depressing.
Actually, frightening. And it looks like the crazies are
out in full force. Scary stuff! And what's just as scary
are some of the responses on this forum. Right on cue
they're coming out of the woodwork with their "Kudos"
for some hateful and vile comments.
So sad because it encourages the troll-like behaviour
even more.

Ah well, No point in adding fuel to the
fire. See you on another discussion where hopefully
sanity not nastiness will prevail.

Enjoy your week-end. Take care.

Foxy

You're supporting the ones who are burning cities to the ground, and killing people in the streets because of their race and political opinion, remember?

And you think you stand against "nastiness"?

What is wrong with you?

Why are you people so unhinged with hatred?

Dear mhaze,

You really are an utter distorter of the truth aren't you.

More sanctions on Russia?

Are you kidding me?

“Immediately upon entering the White House, Trump tried to lift Obama-era sanctions and return diplomatic compounds seized by the United States due to interference in the 2016 election. Months later, Congress drew up a bill to strengthen Russia sanctions and prevent Trump from lifting them. The administration lobbied hard against the legislation. When it passed with a veto-proof majority, Trump issued a statement expressing displeasure — and signaling that enforcement would be lax.”

“His administration has done exactly that. It delayed implementing the law and missed key deadlines, grudgingly conceding only after intervention by congressional leaders. Nervous tycoons scrambled to hire Washington lobbyists to keep themselves off a blacklist mandated by the law. But the Trump team made a mockery of the effort by merely copying and pasting from a Forbes list of Russian billionaires. That reassured the Kremlin that the sanctions would never be used as intended.”
http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2020/10/13/no-trump-has-not-been-tough-russia/

You sir are a joke.

Dear Cumberland,

Calm the farm mate. You really are talking unhinged crap.

Democrats certainly support the 96% of BLM protests which have been peaceful. No cities have burnt to the ground, Democrats are not murdering people in the streets and you have drunk far too much of the koolaid to be making any sense.

Steele Redux seems to be projecting again. I'm skeptical as to his authority with respect to judgements of the unhinged.

SR

"You really are an utter distorter of the truth aren't you."

I've pointed out before that you can always tell when SR knows he's on thin ice when he puts his ad homs at the beginning of the post in the hope that it'll mask the lack of substance in the actual post.

Yes Trump did seek to reverse the post-election Obama sanctions. They were put in place by Obama not for foreign policy purposes, but for purely domestic purposes to try to give substance to the Russia collusion meme. It is doubtful he's have imposed these sanctions had Hill won.

Getting rid of those gratuitous sanctions was an early indication that the adults were back in charge.

But later in the administration, new and tougher sanctions were imposed by the US against Russia. eg after the Skripal attacks. Sanctions were also imposed on specific Russia businessmen and military figures by Trump.

But this quintessential SR. I list a bunch of things that show my point. He picks out one only, then picks out a small subset of that one item and declares victory. I said there were "More and growing sanctions against Russia." and there are. That some erroneous sanctions were lifted is by-the-by.

But SR won't understand and/or acknowledge that.

Dear mhaze,

Rubbish mate. Trump only acted on the Skripal poisonings because of pressure from Congress. Even then it was a slight rap over the knuckles prohibiting American Banks from “participating in the primary market for non-rouble denominated bonds” issued by Russia.

What he should have targeted was the rouble dominated OFZ bonds which would have had a bit of bite. He didn't. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OFZ_(bond)

I picked the top of your list to dissect. I could do just as comprehensive a debunk on any of the others, you pick the next one and I will do so.

Dear Canem Malum,

Sure mate. Have you been reading any of his stuff?

“Post proof that the 7 billion people of humankind appointed YOU, of all people, to be their savious and redeemer BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. But it's too late! Because DE SKAH IS A-FAWLINl! DE SKAH IS A-FAWLINl! remember? All thos record cold events caused by global warming hahahahahaha!”

A few kangaroos loose in the top paddock me thinks but you might be a little more forgiving than I, or think this is normal discourse.

SR,

I said Trump has imposed more sanctions against Russia. Now as much as you want to muddy the water and try to ignore the point, it remains a fact (remember those?) that there are more US sanctions against Russia now than there were when Trump took over.

Now you might whine that he should have done more but that wasn't my point, or anyone's point really. If Plantagenet is right that Putin owns Trump, then there'd be less sanctions or no new sanctions. Is this get too complex for you?

Remember when SR used to complain that Obama should have been tougher on Putin? Me either.

SR

BLM is a self-avowed Marxist organisation, and hence opposed to the existence of private productive property, and in favour of the abolition of the family.

They also support critical race theory, which holds that people have rights based on their race, and they support compulsory indoctrination of children on that basis, as well as the re-introduction of official racial segregation, and racial differentials in taxation.

Your pretension to separate out BLM from its violent methods is entirely false, because they themselves don't agree with the distinction you are making, and neither do the Democrats, into whose treasury all BLM donations go. Kamala Harris has explicitly called for ongoing non-stop violence if Trump wins. And you support that, right?

BLM also don't agree that the Constitution is valid, because it's "racist" - what else? So you're against constitutional government, right?

Or you don't know what you're talking about?

Which?

So you are either
a) brainwashed into being a useful idiot but don't understand what you're talking about, OR
b)you support political violence, the attacking of political opponents on grounds of race and political opinion, racial discrimination and racial segregation, violent resistance to constitutional government, and arbitrary government power without limit or reason.

Which?

Hasbeen,

Well said. Only an idiot would say that Donald Trump encourages violence. BLM and others certainly do not need encouragement to violence; it's what they are all about.

Of course, nobody expects anything but idiocy from these Trumpophobes, who are all saying the same things they said before the 2016 election.

Dear Cumberland,

You wrote;

“BLM is a self-avowed Marxist organisation, and hence opposed to the existence of private productive property, and in favour of the abolition of the family.”

Bloody hell mate, you can't even tell the difference between a movement and an organisation so how on earth can you expect anyone to ever imagine they could have an intelligent conversation with you?

How old are you anyway? I suspect a teenager with the language you are using. Well there is a big world out there, perhaps you could go and broaden your perspective a little.

Dear mhaze,

Just for giggles I went and looked at a list of so called Russian Sanctions and it was mainly directed at individuals and companies but only 2 impacted Russia itself.

Is this what you mean by "more sanctions"? Keeping in mind the more substantial ones were Congress led not Trump instigated.

Dec 20, 2017 2 Russian individuals sanctioned.

Jan 26, 2018 5 Russian individuals and three Russian companies

May 15th 2018 5 Russian entities and 19 individuals were sanctioned for conducting a series of cyberattacks and interfering in the 2016 U.S. elections.

Apr 6 2018 7 Russian oligarchs and the companies they own or control, 17 senior Russian government officials, and a state-owned Russian weapons trading company (and a bank it owns) were sanctioned for their roles in advancing Russia’s malign activities – including the continued occupation of Crimea, engaging in cyberattacks, and supporting Assad’s regime.

Jun 11 2018 5 Russian entities and 3 individuals

Aug 8 2018 In response to Salisbury attack The U.S. administration announced it would restrict remaining sources of foreign assistance and arms sales to Russia, and deny U.S. credit to Russia, including through the Export-Import Bank. Restrictions would also prohibit the export of security-sensitive goods and technology.

Aug 21 2018 2 Russian individuals, and a Russian company

September 20 33 Russian individuals and entities were sanctioned for their role in U.S. election interference.

Dec 19 2018 18 Russian individuals were sanctioned for their involvement in a wide range of malign activities, including attempting to interfere in the 2016 U.S. Election.

March 11 2019 1 entity - Evrofinance Mosnarbank, a Moscow-based bank.

March 15 2019 6 Russian individuals and 8 entities

March 16 2019 A Chechen group and 5 Russian individuals

All this while Russia was revealed to have put bounties on the heads of US soldiers.

Oh and those sanctions for electoral interference, was the interference to get Trump elected or not?

SR

The Cold War ended 30 years ago. Russia has an economy about the size of Italy's or Spain's, and a much larger area to defend. The idea that it is a threat to the USA is not reality-based. You are being played for brainwashed useful idiot - AGAIN!

I must insist yuou grow a brain - NOW!

"All the while Russia was revealed to have put bounties on the heads of US soldiers."

Prove it.

BLM is a billion-dollar organisation. I suppose you're saying the donors just throw the money into the air at BLM riots and let their members grab what they want?

No? You admit that would be stupid?

BLM receives donations and they go direct to the Democratic party.

So I suppose you're going to say now that the Democrat Party isn't an organisation either?

Honestly, is that the best you can do? Talk about grasping at straws.

You're only making a fool of yourself with your brainwashed twaddle and facile attempts at evasion.

Settle it - answer my question without further evasion, and once you have honestly answered whether your stupid or evil, we'll agree that settles the question.

You need to stop squirming and OPENLY ACCEPT that either you support violent totalitarian fasicsm, or you are brainwashed.

"The truth will set you free."

Stop squirming, stop pathetically trying to dodge and duck and hide, and just answer my question, fascist.

Dear Cumberland,

Lol.

Cibwerland,

Fascist ? Pot - kettle.

We'll see how that fascism develops on the extreme-right next week, after Trumpf loses the election, refuses to go and calls out his 'proud boys' onto the streets.

Joe

SR asked..."Is this what you mean by "more sanctions"?"

Ahem, yes. There were sanctions and there are more of them. So more sanctions. Is that so hard to understand?

So I said there were more sanctions under Trump and you've proven it. Thanks for getting on board.

"All this while Russia was revealed to have put bounties on the heads of US soldiers."

Well no that wasn't 'revealed'. It was asserted. By the New York Times no less who of coarse have, this week, covered themselves in 'glory' over the 'anonymous' article from a senior white house official </sarc>.

The claims have been generally debunked. But you are well known for hang onto debunked claims if you like them, aren't you SR? Where is Pocahontas these days? And of coarse you still want to believe that nice Mr Mueller will find the goods on the nasty orange man.

"was the interference to get Trump elected or not?"

Not.

loudmouth

"Fascist ? Pot - kettle."

As proved by nothing? I'm a libertarian you fool.

"We'll see how that fascism develops on the extreme right next week..."

As proved by events that haven't happened yet?

You need to understand that other people aren't as dumb as you.

SR and loudmouth

Post PROOF that you have criticised BLM rioters for killing people for saying all lives matter, and just for being white.

Your failure to post such proof, or making any other reply whatsoever, constitutes your irrevocable admission that you support totalitarian fascism and official racial segregation, and that you are too brainwashed to understand what you're talking about.

Okay, go ahead. Post proof.

Cumberland = moron

loudmouth

We are amazed at the intellectual rigour of your ideology lol pfffffft!

You need to understand that other people aren't as dumb and brainwashed as you are, okay?

Got that proof that you condemned fascism there yet, feller?

White House Update on Pandemic Response. Trump got more Americans killed than 50 x 9/11s.

LANGUAGE WARNING

http://youtu.be/dpIkl2QnJeI

plantagenet

During the Portland riots, the Democrats denied that the President had constitutional authority to send federal agents to save a federal court house from being physically attacked.

So obviously, according to them, he has no constitutional responsibility for health.

READ THE CONSTITUTION. It's a state responsibility. That's why the feds channeled aid through the states.

So you're admitting that you don't understand what you're talking about.

When Trump was trying to stop the coronavirus from entering, the Democrats were busy with their malicious phony Ukraine impeachment - accusing him of the corruption & crimes that the FBI is currently investigating Joe Biden for.

Their agenda at that time was "the gun epidemic"; but they have armed security guards.

They declared that it's "racist" - (what else?) - and "hysterical xenophobia" for Trump to try to keep out infected persons coming in from China.

So they ACTIVELY SUPPORTED importing coronavirus FOR POLITICAL REASONS.

Then the Democrats made a big show of going down to Chinatowns all over the USA and hugging random Asians. So they ACTIVELY PROMOTED the spread of coronavirus - you can't make this sh!t up.

When there were only two cases in the whole of the USA, they were already saying, let's call it the Trump virus. They were hoping and praying for the largest possible number of deaths.

They were already determined to try to politicise it, from mere spite and lust for power. That's why the overwhelming majority of deaths have been disproportionately IN DEMOCRAT JURISDICTIONS. Get the facts!

And that's why they've done everything to inflate the real and false figures, and maximise the destruction (while simultaneously burning cities to the ground, looting, bashinga and killing in the streets).

This means that their pretended concern is COMPLETELY PHONY AND FACILE.

They were obviously hoping to make political advantage of it, and trusting that gullible brainwashed morons would be too stupid to understand or care about their transparent dishonesty and anti-human ideology.

So, lucky they've got you, isn't it?

and...?

Thanks new writer for "Cumberland".

You appear to be a milder writer for Cumberland Baptist Association at Clarksville, Tennessee http://www.facebook.com/CBAClarksvilleTN/?ref=py_c than the shock-jock before.

Not that this Forum, Australia's On Line Opinion, contains few, if any, voters in the US Election.

Cheers

Just watched one of the most blatantly rigged interviews by 'our' ABC in the USA. They cherry-picked a Democrat white female married to an African American man, who commented on how she feared that Trump's speeches are putting her family in danger in the Republican neighbourhood she moved to !

I'm 2 from 2 picking Adern and Palaszczuk based on their hard COVID stances.
Not sure what that means.

http://forum.onlineopinion.com.au/thread.asp?discussion=9289&page=0#312535

Not sure how the US election will go.

I've generally thought the Democrats if they win, would do so with the help of electoral fraud.
Nancy Pelosi has been saying for at least a year that 'Trump will challenge the electoral results'.
To me that's them foolishly advertising their gameplan.
Should one optimistically 'expect' to beat the incumbent on their second term election?
Probably not.

But the fact that 'locking people out of states and nations' has been given a mandate by the silent majority has me wondering if Trump won't lose in his own right for his mishandling of COVID.

And part of me thinks that of this 'mishandling', he's been deliberately mislead by those around him to foul things up, whilst at the same time, his hands were tied by Democrats in many situations.

Finally I think Democrats use of inflaming racial issues (Black Lives Matters) and shutting down cities with the support of Democratic Mayors for months of ongoing protests is a telling sign that Democracy itself is wearing really thin, if it keeps up I don't know where it will end;

- Or maybe its all just as much a well organised stageshow, with pre-prepared performances following a script, for voter consumption and manipulation.

Trusting a Democrat to govern the nation is like asking a pedophile to babysit your kids.
You just know it's not going to go well, and you just can't take that risk.
- But truthfully the other side isn't really any better.

My conscience vote would be 'None of the above',
- Which in reality is probably like watching a game of footy and saying that you're going for the referee.

My lesser evil vote would probably be Trump.
- Although in saying that I think both parties are flawed in their policies.

And flawed for no other reason except they are always opposed to each other, always disagreeing and always fighting.
It doesn't really serve anyone's interests except the politicians themselves.

Trump needs to climb over a pile of a quarter of a million dead bodies if he's going to get back into the White House. Maybe his army of 100,000,000 rednecks will help him do it!

Interesting thing about the anti-Trump brigade, is that, without realising it, they have decided to support perpetual aggressive war, mass political killings, channelling billions stolen from the poor to corrupt corporate vested interests, extremist anti-constitutional Marxism, bigotry and hate speech, racial discrimination and segregation, forcing blacks into poverty and homelessness, the exploitation of refugees, and less sustainable development.

But they're so brainwashed they think they're supporting the opposite!

It's like they've been lobotomised by Trump derangement syndrome - obediently bleating the sound-bites brainwashed into them by their manipulators.

Real useful idiot stuff - Stalin would be proud of you.

It looks like Annastacia Palaszczuk won the Queensland election because she chose to fight the pandemic, putting the welfare of the people above her own political career.

Donald Trump chose not to fight the pandemic and instead put his political career above the welfare of the people.

If that is going to be the deciding factor then I reckon Biden will win in a landslide victory.

That said, I think I should put some more money on Biden with the bookmaker.

Annastacia Palaszczuk won the Queensland election because she chose to fight the pandemic,
Mr Opinion,
NO ! She won because she bought thousands of votes via Public Service positions which are now costing us so much that there won't be any money to fight the next COVID-19 Flu season after New Year !

Dear individual,

Queensland population increases at about 1.7% a year. The QPS increases have been slightly above that which have been understandable given what Newman did to the State.

But 45,000 people in a State with over 8,000,000 is not going to impact an election so stop being a clown and accept the loss.

pseudo-individual,

She won because people liked the way she handled the response to the pandemic.

I bet Soot and the boys are starting to rethink their approach to recalcitrant Premiers refusing to open borders and lift restrictions so that Soot can force the international border open to bring in millions of cashed up Chinese.

Mr Self-opinionated

If Trump chose not to fight the pandemic, then why did so many Democrat governors - who hate his guts - despite themselves, praise his response to their requests?

Why?

Cite the clause of the US Constitution that gives responsibility for health to the feds.

As soon as the WHO started contradicting itself, as soon as governments started permitting thousands of violent BLM demonstrates while banning church services, as soon as they started suppressing efficacious therapies, you should have noticed that the virus was being politicised.

But as usual, your deranged partisan hatred without reason simply eclipses your critical faculties.

Admit it. It wouldn't matter what Trump did, you would criticise it. So much is obvious.

One day you'll learn to think for yourself, and not be so easily and laughably manipulated by the mass media.

But you've got to want to do it.

By the way, stop trying to squirm out of being noticed for your humiliating failure to defend your irrational superstitious belief that we're all going to boil to death in the next few years, and answer my question proving that you don't know what you're talking about, or have the decency to admit it.

Cumberland,

Looks like you are going to be very disapponted when Biden wins.

What do they call you at home: 'Wrong Again' Cumberland?

CUMBERLAND BAPTIST ASSOCIATION of TENNESSEE anti BLACK hence anti BLM

Interesting "Cumberland" is of the Cumberland Baptist Association at Clarksville, in Tennessee.

see http://www.facebook.com/CBAClarksvilleTN/?ref=py_c

Tennessee was one of the Slave States in the Civil War and Tennessee was one of the "Jim Crow law" states that prevented African-Americans from voting.

see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Jim_Crow_law_examples_by_state#Tennessee

Hence it is predictable the Cumberland Baptist Association of Tennessee is Extremist about legitimate BLM concerns.

plantagenet,

A great deal of American history has been shaped by racism.

Yes indeed Mr Opinion

"A great deal of American history has been shaped by racism" in lynching African-Americans

by mob hanging, up to the 1960s, and police shooting and choking, to this very day.

Misop,

So profound ! So original ! Class/Year 8 can be so informational.

I remember what might have been one of the first editions of the 'Sun-Herald', the SMH's Sunday paper, in about 1953. It showed a photo of a Black man chained to the roof of his house as whites burned it down.

Hard to forget for a ten-year-old ......

And the murder of Emmett Till, about my age, beaten to death for smiling at a white girl in about 1956.

Hard to forget ......

And the murder of the three voter-registration workers in the South in 1964, Chaney, Goodman and Schwerner. Every bone in Chaney's body was broken, like an air-crash victim, said the coroner; Chaney was Black; Goodman and Schwerner were white, Jewish kids from NY.

Also hard to forget .....

Joe

AMERICAN STATES "HAVE NEVER HAD FINAL RESULTS ON ELECTION DAY"

The New York Times, November 1, 2020 reports http://www.nytimes.com/2020/11/01/us/politics/trump-ballot-counting-election.html :

"President Trump has been trying to pre-emptively delegitimize ballots counted after Nov. 3 [Wednesday 4th Nov Australian time]. But states have always counted past election night.

For weeks, President Trump and his allies have been laying groundwork to challenge the results of the election if he loses. Now, in the final days of the campaign, he has settled on a blatantly ahistorical closing argument: that the votes in a fair election should not be counted past election night.

“The Election should end on November 3rd., not weeks later!” he tweeted on Friday, two days after telling reporters in Nevada, “Hopefully, the few states remaining that want to take a lot of time after Nov. 3 to count ballots, that won’t be allowed by the various courts.”

“You would think you want to have the votes counted, tabulated, finished by the evening of Nov. 3,” he said at a campaign event a week earlier.

In reality, the scenario Mr. Trump is outlining — every vote in a modern election being “counted, tabulated, finished” by midnight — is not possible and never has been. No state ever reports final results on election night, and no state is legally expected to."

MORE SEE http://www.nytimes.com/2020/11/01/us/politics/trump-ballot-counting-election.html

Dear mhaze,

You are claiming that the significant Russian interference in the 2016 was not in support of Trump in any way? Well that flies in the face of what a bipartisan Senate Intelligence Committee found.

“After a thorough review, our staff concluded that the [Intelligence Community Assessment] conclusions were accurate and on point,” said Warner, the committee’s vice chairman. “The Russian effort was extensive, sophisticated, and ordered by President [Vladimir] Putin himself for the purpose of helping Donald Trump and hurting Hillary Clinton.”
Burr said in the statement: “We see no reason to dispute the conclusions. There is no doubt that Russia undertook an unprecedented effort to interfere with our 2016 elections.””
http://www.cnbc.com/2018/05/16/russian-meddling-intended-to-help-trump-hurt-clinton-senate-says.html

My god what a blinked apologist for the most corrupt and venal man to have held the office in 50 years you have become.

There are only two sanctions directed at Russia as a whole and they were done reluctantly by Trump who purposefully undermined them. And what an understandably poor, flaccid, attempt at sanctioning a country when its leader has Trump eating out of his hand.

'A great deal of American history has been shaped by racism.'

and like Australia billions of people want to move to places where 'racism is so rife'. And of course China, African Nations and others have boat loads of illegals trying to get there. But academia know best!

Psycho-runner,

They see Australia as a part of Asia.

As such it is their home as much as it is yours.

Oh so Trump's wall is to keep legals in Mr O?

Dear runner,

It should have been used to keep the infected in.

As I said many months ago the US would become the great infecting nation and it proved to be true. Our quarantine hotels are constantly having to house positive Corona cases of those who have come from the US back to Australia.

Thank you Trump.

He Man Say: Some totally neutral, unbiased reasons you should Vote for Joe http://youtu.be/gnca1VxL7eI

But 45,000 people in a State with over 8,000,000 is not going to impact an election so stop being a clown and accept the loss.
SteeleRedux,
What can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence

Dear individual,

Which is essential what I have done with your claim.

essential
Steeleredux,
Really ? You don't even know what word to use !

Dear individual,

ly

There you go.

'As I said many months ago the US would become the great infecting nation and it proved to be true. '

Of course Steelie your marxist mates in China had nothing to do with the spread of the virus. You surely love your own lies.

Runner,

Conspiracy theories can be so comforting, ay ? The world hates us, so they all plot and plan to destroy us - is that it ?

Viruses commonly spread from one species of animal to another, and to humans. Across the world, at that economic interface between hunters/gatherers and the modern economy, people exchange goods - captured wild animals, etc. for flashlight batteries, fish-hooks, etc. All manner of animals are transported around the world in this trade - someone found a capybara (i.e. from South America) in a S-E Asian 'pet shop'.

Southern China is ideal country for the natural production of viruses -plenty of jungle, high rainfall, warm and humid summers. So all around that foraging-modern exchange frontier, all manner of products would be introduced into the modern food chain. Viruses would go along with that.

As for the comparative performance of China and the US in relation to this dreadful virus, China has had - what ? - maybe a few tens of thousands of deaths, and is more or less in control of the pandemic there; the US has had at least 230,000 deaths, with another 700-1000 each day, and has completely lost control of the virus. By Inauguration Day, Biden may find himself with a massive problem, and a legacy of 400,000 deaths bequeathed to him by Trumpf.

But understandably, as children do, many Americans seek to blame someone, and it's easier to blame those who have total control of the problem rather than oneself. Yes, it may be that the evil Chinese plotted and planned and deliberately infected the world, but no doubt solid proof will show that one way or the other, sooner or later.

Joe

'Conspiracy theories can be so comforting, ay ? ' You tell me Joe. You seem to have embraced a number of them. Facts are that the virus left the shores of China. The other facts are that the Chinese don't want anyone to know where the virus originated as shown by their reaction to any investigation. Fact is also that Nancy invited people to Chinese festivals and help spread the virus while Cuomo sent covid infected patients into old people's homes. But then again you will have your own facts about Trump killing 230000 people eh Joe!. So Morrison killed 1000, Boris ??, the Italian PM etc etc. Nothing like a narrative to get your 'facts ' to fit it. That is consistent with the lying liberal left media eh Joe!

Runner,

I don't really have much time for any conspiracy theories. They usually pre-suppose brilliant planning on the part of conspirators, which is usually very far from the mark. As i wrote,

"Yes, it may be that the evil Chinese plotted and planned and deliberately infected the world, but no doubt solid proof will show that one way or the other, sooner or later."

"Solid proof". Still waiting for it.

Joe

Loudmouth said- "I don't really have much time for any conspiracy theories. They usually pre-suppose brilliant planning on the part of conspirators, which is usually very far from the mark. As i wrote,

"Yes, it may be that the evil Chinese plotted and planned and deliberately infected the world, but no doubt solid proof will show that one way or the other, sooner or later.""

Answer- Runner- It's not surprising that Loudmouth is supporting the Chinese Communists. Communists like Loudmouth are fine with conspiracy theories when it suits their agenda. Those spouting communist propaganda should be locked up in federal prison without visitation for treason against Australia. If you're upsetting them you're probably doing something right. Keep it up.

FBI MAINLY CONCERNED ABOUT ELECTION DAY RIGHTWING EXTREMISM [SNIPPETS]

@DFRLab, Nov2/3 2020, reports in part http://medium.com/dfrlab/electionwatch-what-to-expect-from-armed-extremist-groups-on-election-day-5461a961e543

“What to expect from armed extremist groups on election day.
Unlawful militia groups indicate they’re standing ready for election chaos

“...Trump and his associates have repeatedly telegraphed that they may preemptively declare victory on election night if it appears he is initially ahead.

Members of extremist online communities have repeatedly hyped the potential for turmoil during or immediately following election day, some going so far as to warn that a civil war may break out in the aftermath.

These assertions, often supported by misleading or hyper-partisan information, have encouraged coordination between groups and rank-and-file supporters....

Federal agencies have raised concerns that the election could be a flashpoint for a period of increased extremist violence in the United States.

The FBI sent a bulletin to law enforcement in August warning that as election day neared domestic extremists were increasingly likely to “plot against government and election-related targets.” The bulletin did not single out any partisan ideology, but subsequent reports from the

FBI and Department of Homeland Security have explicitly cautioned against right-wing extremist threats facing the nation....

...right-wing militias in the U.S. have “steadily ramped up their activities,” creating “significant concerns for the security of the election period, how seriously the election results will be taken, and the response to whichever winner is selected.”

...The Oath Keepers, one of the largest militia movement organizations in the United States, say they intend to engage on election day and the period of time that follows....

It’s not just the Oath Keepers: other

right-wing extremist factions have expressed they intend to involved themselves in election-related activity. Progressive media watchdog organization Media Matters reports that supporters of the QAnon conspiracy theory, which the

FBI considers a potential domestic terror threat, and members of a militia movement forum board have encouraged poll watching in both formal and informal capacities.

On Oct. 28, a man who claimed to be a Proud Boys member was arrested after threatening to bomb a North Dakota voting location..."

MORE AT http://medium.com/dfrlab/electionwatch-what-to-expect-from-armed-extremist-groups-on-election-day-5461a961e543

CM,

Loved your conspiracy theory ! Predictably off-the-mark :)

Joe

Hi Pete,

In some states, the counting of the vote doesn't start until voting has closed. So how on earth could a decisive verdict be possible for at least days ?

In any case, none of that matters since the Electoral College doesn't finally meet to make its decision until mid-January, about seventy days away. Surely Trumpf knows that ?

We'll soon see whether or not Trumpf knows he's lost and starts to bring out his 'Proud Boys' onto the streets to cause havoc.

I'm confident that the military will be ready for them. I have confidence in the American system.

Joe

funny over the last 4 years well over 90% of endless violence has come from the left and the haters of democracy. Now somehow they change the facts and are trying to pretend it comes from the right. Oh well same ol same ol lies.

Funny runner, dozens of far right extremists were arrested today, during violent riots in Melbourne.

Its kind of sad how easy it is for anyone on anyside who may have started with reasonable and genuine opinions on things;
- To slowly become subverted and lead into supporting or exhibiting radical or crazy beliefs and mentalities.

Think of it, millions of people willfully ruining their own minds;
- Like a one way ticket to mental problems, medication and the nuthouse.

It's as though some refined and perfected a path has finally allowed the social engineers to plug 'self-inflicted mental retardism' into an amplifier.

Vote counting continuing, heart in mouth CLOSE!

Meanwhile "2020 presidential election results" Electoral votes as of 8:07pm US ET Nov. 3, 2020

Now has Electoral College "votes" Biden 85 vs Trump 61.

See http://www.axios.com/election-results-2020-trump-biden-3a07f4c7-fb4d-4d62-b18b-392ff6f1eeb5.html

"We're getting the first results in the presidential election — but no clarity from the battleground states that will determine whether President Trump gets a second term or loses to former Vice President Joe Biden.

The latest: The Associated Press has declared Biden the winner in Illinois, Maryland, Massachusetts, Connecticut, New Jersey, Rhode Island, Virginia, Vermont and his home state of Delaware. It has called Tennessee, Oklahoma, Mississippi, Alabama, South Carolina, Kentucky and West Virginia for Trump.

But the most critical results will come from the battleground states. The polls closed at 7pm ET in the critical swing states of Florida and Georgia.

Ohio's polls closed at 7:30pm, while North Carolina's early and mail voting results are expected to be delayed until at least 8:15pm due to technical glitches.

Trump is watching the returns from the White House. Biden is watching at his home in Wilmington, Delaware.

Trump is likely to speak at some point tonight, but Biden hedged Tuesday afternoon on whether he'd do so, per Axios' Alexi McCammond: "If there's something to talk about tonight I'll talk about it. If not, I'll wait until the votes have been counted the next day.""

Also http://www.usatoday.com/elections/results/2020-11-03/ is good.

Go Joe!

Biden 203 vs Trump 102

according to http://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-11-04/us-election-live-updates-donald-trump-joe-biden-president/12845366

(270 Electoral College votes needed to win)

232 Electoral College votes still in doubt

plantagenet

You've been brainwashed and can't think straight.

According to you, police merely doing their duty to stop violent far-left extremist mobs from rioting, looting, and killing in the streets are "far-right extremeists".

Pfffff!

Anyone voting for Biden should be disqualified on grounds of stupidity

Arizona's potential to flip to Biden will be the decider in this election, methinks.

See Arizona's vote http://www.usatoday.com/elections/results/2020-11-03/state/arizona/
___________________

Interesting "Cumberland"

ie. Cumberland Baptist Association, Clarksville, Tennessee, USA, at http://www.facebook.com/CBAClarksvilleTN/?ref=py_c

is still singing from the Slave State Extremist hymn sheet to an Australian audience.

Why bother? It is America's FBI keeping an eye on teenage Extremists like Cumberland.

See http://medium.com/dfrlab/electionwatch-what-to-expect-from-armed-extremist-groups-on-election-day-5461a961e543

Uncertain results so far, but I suspect that if Trumpf wins this time around, it may be the last election in which anybody can 'Make White America Great Again !' or 'Put White America First !'

Not before time.

Joe

'Funny runner, dozens of far right extremists were arrested today, during violent riots in Melbourne.''

Oh you mean Chairman's Dan disgusting police force taking the knee while bashing those who oppose draconian idiotic laws. You really do show your colours Paul. Out there at the height of the pandemic with the marxist violent blm's crowd and you have the nerve to criticise those in favour of freedom.

Alas Joe(lm2)

Looks like "Making Trump Great Again" for the next 4 years.

Note that someone on "Thursday, 29 October 2020 5:13:02 PM" at http://forum.onlineopinion.com.au/thread.asp?discussion=9299&page=0

Didn't go on the "collective polls [tipping] Biden to win on a 9% basis"

But focussed on:

"Rusmussen's 2020 prediction here http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/elections/election_2020/white_house_watch_oct28

“Trump 48%, Biden 47%...The margin of sampling error is +/- 2.5 percentage points...”"

TRUMP GRACIOUSLY MAKES TYPICAL ALLEGATIONS ON ELECTION NIGHT

Here's Trump's Election Night Speech delivered an hour ago http://youtu.be/LFNGH2_1Kb4?t=22m22s

22:47 - "A very sad group of people is trying to disenfranchise [Republican voters] and we won't stand for it.

22:20 - And all of a sudden what happened to the Election. Its off!...[The Democrats] knew they couldn't win so they are going to court. And did I predict this...I said that that would happen...I've been saying this from the day I heard they wanted to send out 10s of millions of ballots. They said they were going to win and if they didn't win they'd take us to court.

29:35 - This is a fraud on the American public. This is an embarrassment to our country. We were getting ready to win this election. Frankly we did win this election....This is a major fraud on our nation.

30.05 - We want the law to be used in a proper manner. So we'll be going to the US Supreme Court. We want all voting to stop. We don't want them to find any ballots at 4 o'clock in the morning.

33.30 - Its a very sad moment. We will win this. And as far as I'm concerned we already have."

Trump calls Pence to the microphone, but Pence doesn't repeat or backup Trump's gracious allegations.

Hi Pete,

I don't know about other Australian states which haven't evolved to SA's level, but vote counting here usually stops around 11.00 pm on election night, skips Sunday, and starts again on Mondays. No problems.

With the US's fifty states plus other bits and pieces, one would expect something even more idiotically complicated. It is what it is. But the bottom line is that so many millions of people have voted as they are required or allowed to. So it's up to the electoral system to count those votes. No biggy.

No mad rush. We can all wait until all legal votes are properly counted. Nothing unusual about any of that. It's weeks away when the Electoral College has to meet to decide who has won this election, and 77 days before the Inauguration of the next President.

I think it's going to be very close. But as a progressive conservative, I hope that the Constitution and proper legal processes prevail.

Joe

Dear Pete and Joe,

I think we're all with you on this one.

The American people deserve to have their votes counted.
This election has to be fair and square. Saying that you've
won while closing down the vote count is absurd by any
standard of fair play and should not be allowed.

Trump can go to the Supreme Court, but any system of genuine
justice should prevail.

Foxy,

Justice?

Give me a break!

Judges and lawyers a some of the biggest low-life scumbags around.

Dear Foxy and Joe

Yes, for close and/or legally contested elections, a recount or two, State Court decisions, federal court(s) decisions then US Supreme Court deciding on some matter of US Constitutional Law may singly, some combo or all come into play.
__________________

NEVADA NOW CRITICAL TO ELECTION

Biden is now 264 - see http://www.usatoday.com/elections/results/2020-11-03/

So all Biden needs is Nevada's 6 College votes to get to the golden 270.

In Nevada Biden has 49.3% and Trump 48.7% with 75% of votes counted.

see http://www.usatoday.com/elections/results/2020-11-03/state/nevada/

___________________________

Trump is likely to launch serious court cases in 5 or 6 States.

Cheers

Pete

It is becoming clear, TRUMP can no longer win through the ballot box, his only chance seems to be to win a 6/3 vote with his stacked Supreme Court.

Joe, I don't believe anyone in South Aussie, would be still up and about at 11pm at night, particularly on a Saturday night, what time does the barn dance end, church tomorrow! Don't all three of you South Aussies, total population of SA as per last census, was three, go to bed when the chooks go to roost, like at 6 o'clock, you're not dirty stop outs are you? As for Sunday's, nothing's open, you're all in church anyway. I'm not saying South Australia is backward or anything like that, but just to let you know, we in the rest of Australia have electric light, and had so for over 120 years, unbelievable ah! You South Aussies will enjoy electric light the day you eventually get it, as you will enjoy the television when it finally comes your way. I'll explain later to you what television is, but its not another kind of barn dance, I know you guys love your barn dances down there in South Aussie, but TV will blow your mind. BTW; how are Burke and Wills going, anything on the overland telegraph?

Hi Paul,

Wow, you nailed it ! Yes, we're a bit behind down here. Even our email services - emails in SA don't get delivered on a Sunday. In fact, not after 5 pm on a Saturday, or before 9 am on a Monday; Tuesdays, on a long weekend.

But I've heard of a bloke in an eastern suburb who has bought one of those B & W television sets, he lets kids watch it through his lounge room window. I've heard that overseas, they're trying to develop colour but I can't see how that would work.

Oh well, time to get ready for the afternoon milking.

Joe

Hiya Paul, Joe and Foxy

Hope youse like dancin to duelin Banjos http://youtu.be/gsC4kf6x_Q0?t=2m55s

What with Biden at 264 he still needs the 6 votes from Nevada to reach Golden 270.

Problem is "There are no more results in Nevada to come today. We'll get more results at 4:00am AEDT Friday." http://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-11-05/us-election-live-updates-donald-trump-joe-biden-president/12849692

3.30am South Oz time - before mornin milkin Joe.

Pete

Its all over Red Rover! 'Sportsbet' have paid out $23 million on Sleepy Joe.

Nah! The Donald knows a bloke, who knows a bloke, who seen a fat old bloke with a big white beard in a red suit (obviously a Biden commo, red suit how obvious) with a big sack over his shoulder (again obviously stuffed full of Donald votes) getting into some sort of wheelless contraption being pulled by some strange looking nags with horns. When questioned all he'd say was "Ho! ho! Ho! off to the North Pole we go, see ya in December!" Now we know what's happened to all of Donald's votes, they're at the North Pole! Should win that one in the Supreme court 6 to 3.

Hi Paul

Methoughts you were telling porkies, or is that reindeers, until I saw Proof!

Here:

“Aussie bookmaker Sportsbet pays out early on Joe Biden win”

at http://www.9news.com.au/national/us-election-2020-sportsbet-pays-out-early-on-joe-biden-win/a722588b-85ec-4a87-a524-a1e592123691

dated 5 November 2020 11.20am

Trump has just declared open season on reindeers in US cities.

Cheers

Pete

Where have all the Forums TRUMPSTERS gone? Me thinks they are all in shock, or storming the polling places in Arizona or somewhere.

Paul1405

You obviously don't understand what's going on. Your confusion of a betting agency with questions of constitutional law means you're too dumb for anyone to waste time discussing any intelligent matter with you, because you obviously won't be able to understand it.

Hiya Paul

Very sad.

All the quality Trumpsters have skedaddled.
_________________

At 4am Aus Eastern time results for both Georgia (16 Votes) and Nevada (6) are due for release.

Recounts in around 5 very close count States (eg. Georgia and Wisconsin) are likely.

This is even before State Court appeals, let alone Federal Courts and the US Supreme Court.

Pete

some journos on Fox News are also demanding that the Trump camp prove their allegations of fake ballots

Dear Cumberland,

Again I ask how old are you?

You are acting like a petulant child. Grow up and put your case then you might get to slag off at others. Right now you are just delivering drivel.

Looks as if Trump is trying to usurp the presidency and make himself King Donald the First.

Thats our Donald, the reality TV despot, in character.

America tells Trump: "YOU'RE FIRED"

Trump offered an alternative to the ideology that started on college campuses and is now engulfing the country that defines individuals according to their race, that regards the democratic political process as a tool of oppression, and uses violence to shut down freedom of speech.

Inevitably what begins in Berkeley, California ends up in Ultimo, Sydney.

Hi ttbn

Why have you decided to specify "Ultimo"?

Biden takes lead in Georgia 50.5% to 47.8 30 minutes ago

see http://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-11-06/us-election-live-updates-donald-trump-joe-biden-president/12853740#live-blog-post-1194943606
____________________

Biden takes lead in Pennsylvania 49.5 to 49.4 16 minutes ago

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-11-06/us-election-live-updates-donald-trump-joe-biden-president/12853740#live-blog-post-1194933145
___________________

No wonder Trump wants to stop the popular vote threatenong Trump's "I'm a born winner genius" self image.

Best to use this link http://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-11-06/us-election-live-updates-donald-trump-joe-biden-president/12853740

which, right now reports:

"27 minutes ago BIDEN TAKES THE LEAD IN PENNSYLVANIA

...BIDEN PULLS AHEAD IN GEORGIA!"

Personally I think it's all gone too far.
What's needed is a new kind of voting system.

If all "men" are created equal then you would think a win of the national popular vote would be all that's required. The collage system allows for a vote in the state of Wyoming to carry four times the value of a vote in California.

runner, what are you on about, Trump is trying to act the tin pot dictator. Several of his closest supporters including his son are calling for the use of violence to get their way. In one speech a senator said something like; "When we see the whites of their eyes that's when the shooting starts."

Has another tin pot dictator, President Lukashenko sent President Trump a message of congratulations on his outstanding victory.

I liked the moderate Chinese guys observation, "if this is democracy, we stick with our system".

Pete,

Marxist headquarters, ABC.

Paul,

"collage system", now that would be a novelty in politics!!

"A collage may sometimes include magazine and newspaper clippings, ribbons, paint, bits of colored or handmade papers, portions of other artwork or texts, photographs and other found objects, glued to a piece of paper or canvas. The origins of collage can be traced back hundreds of years, but this technique made a dramatic reappearance in the early 20th century as an art form of novelty."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Collage

Hi Paul

A Wyomin may well say:

"How come Tasmania can send 12 Senators to Canberra while NSW (of vastly larger population) can only send 12 as well."

Cheers

Pete

Confusing as the US voting system is, it's no less fair than our preferential voting; and the Yanks can choose a non-politician who gets only eight years if enough people want him. We get no say in our leaders, who get a job for life. Who on earth would vote for a no-nothing, wet-left character like Scott Morrison! China is acting like the absolute pricks they are towards his country, and he doesn't say boo.

Just one current example of massive bias from the ABC: tweet by Marxist stooge, Sally Neighbour, "Trump. I feel physically sick". She's not all that well mentally, either

Still on our do-nothing PM - the person we should be concentrating on rather than
Trump:

Critics complain about Trump’s rhetoric on China but they never explain what they would do differently in the face of an authoritarian and imperialist power.

Well, like Morrison, they would do nothing, say nothing. Leave it to one of the lap dogs, Birmingham, to occasionally yap, but also say absolutely nothing useful, every time China lops off another of our imports.

If Trump does go, we should get him over here, naturalize him, and get him working for us.

I've been thinking during the US election that the replacement of white people in the US will have enormous consequences for Australia, Britain and even Europe.

In Geo-politics it seems likely that China will be using trade to finance their military and power growth globally.

If this is the case- why is the West and Europe supporting China's industrialism- that will surely destroy the West and Europe in the medium and perhaps even in the short term.

Bribery is one traditional way to get people to betray their nations interests.

It seems that the Department of Foreign Affairs powers need to be vastly expanded in the West and Europe and adapted to cleanse itself of foreign interests.

The media and other industries (such as the courts and the legal profession) also play a role in a countries ability to protect itself- these also need to be looked at- if the West and Europe is to survive.

Sadly white people have done much to harm themselves and have become corrupted by authorities in universities that often aren't representative of white people that traditionally have made up the vast majority of the US Diaspora

Strangely despite what the interlopers ascribe- this problem hasn't arisen from Western and European racism in the 1900's but because they perhaps weren't "racist" enough to deal with racist elements in their midst.

It's a classic tactic to get your enemy to let down their guard.

Issy, how much did you do on TRUMP? College system seems rather strange to me, an odd ball democracy if ever there was one.

ttn, calling foul over the demise of your Dangerous Doctor Donald. A variation on what dear old granny would prescribe for what ales poor Donald; A hot cup of diso' and a strong light up the clacker. The worse President in living memory, and that includes Carter, Reagan and Bush Jr.

Repeating something over and over again doesn't make it true- but sadly it seems to be the only thing that works- hopefully the vast masses can develop their own principles and governments based on what they perceive is in their concentric interest. Pray that it's enough. Don't trust those in authority completely- they have their own self interest.

Dear ttbn, Canem and Wee Cum

I'm feeling a little sad.

What with Trump on his way out US (nay World!) politics will be so much more boring. Even the ABC's own "Planet America" will have to close up shop through lack of a good leftwing audience.

Maybe the now unemployed Trump can become POPE.

OR

Trump can open one of those SS Aryan breeding homes for unwed German mothers, with Trump as STUD.

Trump's daughter-wife can attest to Trump's manly virtues http://youtu.be/LPQYAT3wH_g

Dear All (even Wee Cum)

Joe Biden delivered this speech on the Election 2 hours ago http://youtu.be/KSMSiPgyDmw

Such a contrast in leadership style - and concern for all Americans.

Biden the conventional leader is so much better for Australia than Trump the Shock Jock, in Business for Trump's self.

According to some, Trump's mass rallies, have led to the deaths of about 700 supporters from Coronavirus, no social distancing, no masks, just ridicule from the arse hole himself. As America sets new daily records for infections, Trump has shown no concern what so ever for those infected or the dead, for Trump its all about me, and always has been.

True Paul

"Trump has shown no concern what so ever for those infected or the dead, for Trump its all about me, and always has been."

And so many really rightwing Trumpists and OLO Commenters VICARIOUSLY love Trump in a LIBERTARIAN way, for:

- his selfish irresponsibility
- his power
- his fame
- his wealth
- his manly menace
- and that he can service any woman he can buy, including his purchased wife.

Biden has defeated Trump in Pennsylvania, giving him a majority of college votes, with other states still counting in his favour. Biden is the American President elect. I may not agree with the American world view, but I am sickened by the disregard shown by Trump for American lives during the pandemic with 240,000 deaths, and many more to come. Biden's first priority, and he said it will be, is to fight the pandemic and save American lives. I hope for their sake Biden can turn things around. Biden should undo Trumpism whereever and whenever he can, and help create a better society for all of Americas poor and disadvantaged.

Many have such high hopes for an old man, but its not his task alone, the Vice President Kamala Harris, along with the chosen members of Biden's administration will have much work to do if the systemic racism and disadvantage of America is to be defeated.

A Biden win will be a Chinese Communist Party win. The majority idiot American voters will have what they deserve, and the idiot leftist posters of OLO will have nothing to rant and rave about - that being the one good thing we have to look forward to. It is pathetic the way the Three Stooges plus Plantagenet have worked themselves into a frenzy over something they have no actual say in. With our weak government sucking up to a hard Left America, which will be sucking up to China, the Australian left should be contented at last.

Ttbn,

So ..... a health system like ours is, what, communist ? An unemployment scheme like ours is communist ? An equitable education system like ours is communist ? Lunatic talk.

Get a grip. No, loosen that grip, Ttbn. You don't know what the hell you're writing about.

Joe

Joe,

What are you ranting about?

"Ttbn,

So ..... a health system like ours is, what, communist ? An unemployment scheme like ours is communist ? An equitable education system like ours is communist ? Lunatic talk."

What has this bilge got to do with my post - any post I've ever made. When have I said our health scheme and unemployment scheme is Communist?

I can understand why you fancy Biden; you are as senile as he is. The Three Stooges has been expanded to four, with you looking more like their leader with every daft post you make.

I don't think US will be kissing China's a.. under Biden, but we shall see.

I am more worried about what a Labor govt would do given some of the comments this week.

If you are concerned about China, which I am, I would strongly suggest that the Coalition is the best option.

Sanity prevails!
Much rejoicing!
No violent protests or burning or looting!
An overwhelming sense of relief and hope sweeps as an ameliorating and invigorating balm across the continent and across the world - Armageddon and indifference soundly rejected!

Never have so many owed so much to this one pair of splendid individuals and their wonderful enlightened supporters. (WWII heroics notwithstanding.) As history will ultimately reveal in due course.

Even disbelief and rejection are experiencing a gradual and inescapable sense of calm and acknowledgment that disruption and anger and protest are over and the Sun is determinedly rising on a New Day!

Howls muted by cheers; unity expunging division; one Nation, one people.
Democracy returns; the Republic is saved.

Chris Lewis,

I think Biden's first priority will be the suppression of the coronavirus in the US.

Image the ramifications for the rest of the world if the US goes into lockdown and is absent from the international scene for a couple of months.

I think the Chinese already see Australia as a vassal state of China, both in China and Australia.

In the last few weeks China has demonstrated to the world that it controls the major part of Australia's exports.

Local Chinese in Australia are a major political force in government even to the extent of having been able to get a former(?) affiliate of the CCP Gladys Liu into the national parliament where decisions are made on international policy.

For how long has Mr Opinion been warning you people about the Chinese threat?

Take a look at this short comment from Bronwyn Bishop:

http://www.msn.com/en-au/news/other/australia-is-in-enormous-danger-from-china/ar-BB1aIDHW?ocid=msedgdhp

If America locks down and withdraws for a couple of months then I think the time will be ripe for China to take control of Taiwan.

Now that Trump's chief of staff has caught the virus, maybe Trump himself might be infected - not just with a panic attack like before but a truly-ruly infection. That might have him being raced to the ICU at Johns Hopkins, and out of the White House.

Meanwhile:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k5zPMo6Nir0

Joe

Ttbn- I am as concerned as you are. Now is the time to look at our options. To continue with presenting the alternative view. Sometimes it's better to say nothing than to react to provocation. Some have said- what you say should be better than the silence- and the silence is golden.

The Communists and Locke Liberals are very well organised. Even if we lost this round we fought for what we believed and so we were true to ourselves in our hearts. There have been some great heroes in this battle- we can give respect to them quietly in our hearts- and celebrate them each year- they serve as examples to us- when and why and how- we fight.

One can lose a just cause.

It looks bleak- it looks like we are in for yet another round of cultural austerity policies- perhaps this is the end of the world. Maybe in one thousand years the British people of the world will get our home back- if we survive. The world will continue to overpopulate, over pollute, create ignobility- because they invest in universalism, globalism, liberalism, profligatism.

Take care mate

Ttbn- You'll like this...

From our friend Amicus.

Advance Australia Fair in its full expression: Original

Verse One
Australia's sons let us rejoice,
For we are young and free;
We've golden soil and wealth for toil,
Our home is girt by sea;
Our land abounds in Nature's gifts
Of beauty rich and rare;
In history's page, let every stage
Advance Australia fair!
In joyful strains then let us sing,
"Advance Australia fair!"

Verse Two
When gallant Cook from Albion sail'd,
To trace wide oceans o'er,
True British courage bore him on,
Till he landed on our shore.
Then here he raised Old England's flag,
The standard of the brave;
With all her faults we love her still,
"Brittannia rules the wave!"
In joyful strains then let us sing
"Advance Australia fair!"

Verse Three
While other nations of the globe
Behold us from afar,
We'll rise to high renown and shine
Like our glorious southern star;
From England, Scotia, Erin's Isle,
Who come our lot to share,
Let all combine with heart and hand
To advance Australia fair!
In joyful strains then let us sing
"Advance Australia fair!"

Verse Four
Shou'd foreign foe e'er sight our coast,
Or dare a foot to land,
We'll rouse to arms like sires of yore
To guard our native strand;
Brittannia then shall surely know,
Beyond wide ocean's roll,
Her sons in fair Australia's land
Still keep a British soul.
In joyful strains the let us sing
"Advance Australia fair!"

Some claim the following verse- and I've included it for completeness...

With Christ our head and cornerstone,
We'll build our nation's might,
Whose way and truth and light alone,
Can guide our path aright,
Our lives a sacrifice of love,
Reflect our Master's care,
With faces turned to heaven above,
Advance Australia fair,
In joyful strains then let us sing:
Advance, Australia Fair!

For those of us that want to thank President Trump for his service ...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvLF-Atq3NA&list=RDIvLF-Atq3NA&start_radio=1

What wonderful news.

Not only for America - but for the world.

PRESIDENT BIDEN!

Democracy has been saved. The people of America
have voted. And every vote counts. There's been
a massive relief from the traditional allies of
the United States. A feeling that perhaps things
may return to how they were 4 years ago in terms
of traditional alliances.

Trump's leadership was the worst period in relations
between Europe and the United States since the
world war.

And if Trump refuses to concede.

I'm sure that there are ways to escort the trespasser
out of the White House.

Foxy,

And the really good news is that Mr Opinion won money with his bets on Biden.

Its been a typical 2020 year for Donald J Trump. First he caught the virus, then he lost his job, now he's being evicted from his house.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m9SrXRNPRCA&ab_channel=DiaghoFett

Mr O,

Congratulations to you as well.

Well done.

Hi Paul,

It's lovely to see that character does count in
the US. That truth does matter after all. And
that fraudsters don't always come out on top.

Dear Everyone

Its heartening that the title of this thread, "Trump Tipped To Win Election", proved wrong.

Remaining Trumpsters are spreading disinformation on Biden's foreign policy, particularly on China.

http://www.bbc.com/news/election-us-2020-54472696 indicates 4 hours ago:

"...HOW WILL BIDEN CHANGE FOREIGN POLICY?"

"...DEALING WITH ALLIES

President Trump has praised autocrats and insulted allies. At the top of Joe Biden's to-do list is a full-court press to repair strained relationships, especially in Nato, and rejoin global alliances.

A Biden administration would also return to the World Health Organization and seek to lead an international coronavirus response.

CHINA

"In 2017, Mr Trump described how he and Xi Jinping bonded over chocolate cake. But since then MR Trump has traded his friendship with the Chinese president for accusations about spreading the coronavirus, for harsh measures and a new Cold War rhetoric.

In fact there is rare cross-party agreement on getting tough with China over trade and other issues. The question is about tactics.

Mr Biden would continue President Trump's policy of countering China's "abusive economic practices," but jointly with allies, as opposed to Trump's preference for unilateral trade deals."

PLANTA COMMENT

Biden's traditional alliance approach will be better for AUSTRALIA than Trump's "America First" approach.

Paul1405,

I think ex-President Trump will be alright because I saw him at the betting shop putting money on Biden to win.

BIDEN’S VICTORY SPEECH

Sunday November 8, Australian Time, on Youtube http://youtu.be/yX20JkK5L3s

TRANSCRIPT

begins http://www.latimes.com/politics/story/2020-11-07/joe-biden-victory-speech-2020-election-transcript

"My fellow Americans, the people of this nation have spoken.

They have delivered us a clear victory. A convincing victory.

A victory for “We the people.”

We have won with the most votes ever cast for a presidential ticket in the history of this nation — 74 million.

I am humbled by the trust and confidence you have placed in me.

I pledge to be a resident who seeks not to divide, but to unify.

Who doesn’t see red and blue states, but a United States.

And who will work with all my heart to win the confidence of the whole people.

For that is what America is about: the people.

And that is what our administration will be about.

I sought this office to restore the soul of America.

To rebuild the backbone of the nation — the middle class.

To make America respected around the world again and to unite us here at home.

It is the honor of my lifetime that so many millions of Americans have voted for this vision.

And now the work of making this vision real is the task of our time.

...And to all those who supported us: I am proud of the campaign we built and ran. I am proud of the coalition we put together, the broadest and most diverse in history.

Democrats, Republicans and Independents.

Progressives, moderates and conservatives.

Young and old.

Urban, suburban and rural.

Gay, straight, trangender

White. Latino. Asian. Native American.

... And to those who voted for President Trump, I understand your disappointment tonight.

... But now, let’s give each other a chance.

It’s time to put away the harsh rhetoric.

To lower the temperature.

...To listen to each other again.

To make progress, we must stop treating our opponents as our enemy.

...This is the time to heal in America.

...to the more than 230,000 families who have lost a loved one to this terrible virus this year. My heart goes out to...you."

See speech in full, at http://www.latimes.com/politics/story/2020-11-07/joe-biden-victory-speech-2020-election-transcript

Hi Pete,

Thanks for the transcript.

What a difference between Biden and Trump.
So glad that the United States has selected
a leader someone whose defining characteristics
are empathy and competence. This is a wonderful
development.

The fact that Trump wants to overturn the election only
shows the fatality of the bullet the American democracy
looks like it dodged. America has done well not to have
given in to a fraudster, liar and a bully's wish to
stay in power.

Great day for democracy.

Foxy,

Biden has a big task waiting for him come January.

I think he will focus his attention on suppressing the pandemic across America even if that means getting the states to lock down similar to what has been the approach in Australia (all to the chagrin of Soot Morrison who wants to force open the international border in order to bring in millions of cashed up Chinese migrants to maintain his tickle down economic programs.)

This will mean the US takes backstage in world politics and economy for a couple of months. What will be the ramifications of this?

I think for a lot of people including Australia things will get a lot worse and for China it might provide the opportunity it has been waiting for to annex Taiwan and consolidate its military strength in the South China Sea.

I don't think Biden will react to such actions by China, putting it on the Do List of things to worry about after America has won its battle against the pandemic.

MR O, u r funny.

Thankfully the real world is nothing like you say it is.

But, it is great u contribute.

Just watched the Biden/Harris speeches, their message of hope and unity for all Americans, with a promise of a brighter future for those who have been left behind. Promising to govern for all, both for those that voted for them, and those who didn't. Can't ask more than that.

ttbn and others should note, great coverage of the US election by our ABC.

Misopinionated,

You may be spot-on: it's very worrying that Biden can't exercise any presidential powers until he is sworn in, on January 20th.

Trump will sulk until then and avoid doing anything, mostly out of spite, but also because he hasn't a clue what to do about the virus, OR about what China might do in relation to Taiwan and its illegal occupation of reefs and shoals in the South Seas.

Very dangerous times.

Joe

No worries Foxy

Here's hoping no extremist Trumpster nutter has a go at Biden, or causes other mayhem.

Trump can cause considerable damage until he is actually out of office at noon 20th January.

Hopefully Trump's minders will disregard and combat Trump's wildest excesses during the "lame-duck" period.

America indeed has a bright future at the end of the tunnel. That tunnel includes the end of Trump boosted COVID.

Other than declaring WWIII at 11.59am 2oth January 2021, Trump doesn't want to rock the boat at all. Where are the Proud Boys? Standing by and standing ready.

Paul1405,

I imagine Trump will do something unconventional and irrational prior to the inauguration of Biden.

Fortunately the American political system has all the safeties of checks and balances built into it to safeguard the people from a lunatic clown running amok and causing mayhem.

No one has said it so far so I might as well jump in an claim my place in the history books by being the first to say:

"TRUMP ........... YOU'RE FIRED"

Remember, you heard it here first.

This is interesting...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_spectrum

"A political spectrum is a system to characterize and classify different political positions in relation to one another. These positions sit upon one or more geometric axes that represent independent political dimensions.[1] The expressions political compass and political map are used to refer to the political spectrum as well, especially to popular two-dimensional models of it.[2][3][4][5]

Most long-standing spectra include the left–right dimension which originally referred to seating arrangements in the French parliament after the Revolution (1789–1799), with radicals on the left and aristocrats on the right.[1][6] While communism and socialism are usually regarded internationally as being on the left, conservatism and fascism are regarded internationally as being on the right.[1] Liberalism can mean different things in different contexts, being sometimes on the left (social liberalism) and other times on the right (conservative liberalism)."

Paul,

I did very nicely with the betting, if Trump had won I would have won and more than covered my bets that Biden would win and as Biden won then my small outlay on Trump was more than covered also.

The fluctuating odds were a gambler's paradise and the secret is to hedge one's bets and never let emotion get in the way of an 'honest' dollar.

Paul,

"ttbn and others should note, great coverage of the US election by our ABC"

and the changes in their faces as the count progressed.

The coverage in Aus has gone weird lately, with extremist vitriol from Alan Jones on Sky News alluding to potential devious means possibly or illusively launched by the Biden camp to unfairly 'steal' this election from Jones's super-capitalist 'idol' The Fantastic 'Trumpster'.
Jones even superciliously appears to decry the validity of so many 60+ voters supposedly getting out to support Biden. What? Can Jones possibly be suggesting the nursing homes were raided by Biden supporters for ballots in waste-paper baskets?
Super-biased Jones must be the most non-impartial commentator in Aus' news network history - yet some continue to hail him for his self-serving abrasive and nonsensical radio talk-back days. What a Joke.
Jones' idolizing of Trump and Trump's self-serving ideology is little short of religious zealotry. Just sickening!

Perhaps worse, if that's actually possible, is Jones' totally deplorable devious influence on Peta Credlin in her formerly reasonably worthy and credible 'Credlin' on Sky - seemingly osmotically deviating Peta towards Jones' skewed perceptions of reality. Just so sad.
Not that Peta has all of it correct - for she sides with compatriots Smith and Dean Jones in denying climate change. A shame.
Still, she has been unrelenting in pursuit of truth and accountability in respect of Daniel Andrews' government's hotel security debacle.
Unfortunately Peta has still allowed too much tripe from compatriots Smith and Dean Jones who continue to condemn any form of lock-downs as being in any way beneficial to containing Covid. Brainless.
Some of the Covid rubbish from Smith, Dean Jones and Alan Jones smacks of the biased rubbish coming out of Fox News - for example in trying to deny any benefit from wearing masks for Covid containment.
Of course, Fox News has clearly been in Trump's pocket for a long time now, but I hate to see indications of Sky, and Peta Credlin, appearing to 'follow' some of Fox News' bias and misinformation trajectory.

We need and deserve better, Peta.

Sorry, I mixed up some of the names in my above diatribe - Alan Jones I got right, and Peta Credlin, but the devious 'compatriots' were Rowan Dean and Chris Smith. (I'm fairly sure of the latter, but you know who I mean anyway).
Names have never been my forte.
Sorry about that.

CNN has been providing a reasonable and fair coverage, in my opinion, during the whole of this election marathon, and in the current aftermath. Hoping this will continue.

I'm not getting ABC or SBS at the moment, so have no comment on their most recent endeavours.
ABC was being rather biased in fairly recent times I thought, skewed somewhat 'Leftish' I assessed. Not good, and new stewardship seems to have been a failure. I would have hoped for better.

SBS has seemed to keep fair and reasonable. Good for them, and hoping this may continue.

Good on ya Joe and Kamala, and I hope you may get the 'cooperation' you and the Republic so sorely need, to get things back on-track post the Trumpster's deleterious and corrupting influence.

Yep Saltpetre

Kamala may be a major help to Biden like Vice President Cheney was to George W. Bush.

I understand Is Mise's need to crush what he see's as a cancer (Trump) out of existence. I am sure that my face did drop in just the way that Is Mise described. Winners are grinners.

Communism is a very determined and influential force. Maybe Is Mise will change sides if he realises the threat- as his ancestors and he himself is lost to history - maybe not.

If he doesn't mind if he is lost to history in favour of ideology maybe he won't care if we crush him to preserve our genetic line.

I think that would be sad but necessary

Yep Canem Malum

If its not your rightwing extreme, its Communism - there being nothing in between, in your wee book.

But there's still hope for Trump http://youtu.be/kxHd8JJ8hCU

Dear Canem Malum,

Now you too are banging on about communism. What the hell? Is there something in the water?

What about Biden is in any sense to the left of politics, especially in an Australian sense?

You really are chasing shadows and need to stop.

Overnight we have seen the true colours of the Trump - fomenting civil unrest with his continuing mouthing of lies questioning the validity of the election.

Trump, evil personified, scraping the very bottom of the cesspool barrel, intent on manipulating his loyal deluded brainwashed supporters towards a permanent social schism and possibly a civil war.

And, proposing contra-rallies to further stir-up disaffection and disobedience.
Such rallies should be banned! And, any further fundraising for this insect - banned!

It becomes clear that the Trump has actually brainwashed a large segment of the American populace, and remains doggedly intent on continuing the 'puppet show' and pushing his deluded followers towards some sort of 'showdown'.

Dangerous, and deranged. Trump the fraudster, the Black Witch, the would-be assassin of Democracy.
What a guy!

Is there no limit to this guy's egotistical self-service?

Ringmaster! Clown! Goofball! (And, Idol of Alan Jones.) Disgusting!

Indeed Saltpetre

To paraphrase your fine comment.

"It becomes clear that the Trump has actually brainwashed a large segment of the OLO populace."

In this, America's worst health crisis in living memory, Trump's main activities are:

- Second guessing the vote of most Americans

and

PLAYING GOLF!

CM,

"I understand Is Mise's need to crush what he see's as a cancer (Trump) out of existence."

Are you smoking it or having it in cookies (biscuits)?

I haven't been keep up with all the US election proceedings.

From what I understand Biden's not the winner yet.
- Only according to the media.

From what I understand a can of worms has been opened with legal battles, and things could get real messy if voter fraud is proven.

Again I want to say I told you all months back what would happen because Nansy Pelosi has been advertising for a year that Trump (incumbent running for second term) won't go.

Make no mistake, they had a plan.

And I'm starting to think that the pandemic was a bona-fide plan-demic, because COVID and the polarising race riots were the only thing that could shake Trumps popularity, and remove him from having a second term.

Also I wonder if China, who would obviously prefer Biden to Trumps trade wars weren't in on it, i.e. COVID.

Apparently Nevada are saying they want all mail-in votes recounted and double checked.

For me this is a good outcome.
If there is anything I want to see come out of this election, it's a focus on voter-fraud.

If American Presidents can now come to power like third-world tinpot dictators, then we're all in trouble.

To current Trumpists, contemplating a crossover to the "Light", fear not.

We the citizens of Biden's Brave New World [1]. Who are hereby called Bidets [2]. Are now divided into five castes. Study the Cast List well [3].

You, the Trumpist rightwingers (who can read) are Deltas.

You Trumpist rightwingers who can only repeat Trump slogans, are Epsilons, the lowest caste.

You can only ascend to the three Upper Castes (Alphas, Betas and Gammas) of Bidets, by renouncing your misguided, rightwing, Trumpist, lives.

STUDY NOTES

[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brave_New_World

[2] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bidet

[3] http://bnw07.weebly.com/our-caste-system.html

Yours in Majestic Guidance

Pete
(Alpha++ and Lord High Bidet)

You'd have to have your head in a real toilet to support Biden or Democrats.

In an abuse of public office, Trumps hit man attorney general William Barr has ordered a fishing expedition be launched by the Justice Department into electoral fraud. Despite having no prima facia evidence of wrong doing, other than the rantings of a deranged Donald Trump, Barr ordered his men into action. The man who would lead this "investigation" Richard Pilger was so outraged by this abuse of power he resigned immediately.

Hi Paul

1. Yes a Trump political scorched earth campaign, if Trump lost, was/is expected.

Trump's authoritarian leaninings are coming to the fore - against the will of most American voters and against the American Constitution.

2. There is another aspect. Trump's weakening of the American polity is to Russia's zero-sum politico-strategic advantage. The Russia that Trump personally owes a great deal of money to.

See references to Trump's debts to Russia here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Trump_Organization#Financing

INTERESTING:

BY James Palmer, Nov 11, 2020 http://foreignpolicy.com/2020/11/11/why-beijing-not-called-biden-election-transition-china-trump-xi-jinping/

"WHY BEIJING HASN’T CALLED BIDEN"

"That the Chinese leadership hasn’t congratulated the U.S. president-elect doesn’t mean it favors Trump.

Four days after the U.S. presidential election was called for challenger Joe Biden, China still hasn’t phoned to congratulate the president-elect. Its delay is matched by a few other autocratic states, such as Russia, but most democracies and some other key U.S. allies like Saudi Arabia have called Biden despite President Donald Trump’s continued denial that he lost.

Beijing’s response doesn’t indicate favoritism for Trump. If there is an ongoing power struggle between two factions, China doesn’t want to take a side. And with the ruling party denying the election result, the president attempting to declare a false victory, and the government conducting a purge of the Defense Department and the intelligence services, that’s not an unreasonable assumption on Beijing’s part.

If Trump’s refusal to concede were happening in another country, the United States might make the same assessment. It is only confidence in U.S. institutional democracy and the continued rule of law that suggests otherwise—something the Chinese leadership doesn’t share. This view is influenced by the experience of politics at home, where rubber-stamped votes mean nothing compared with behind-the-scenes contention. (State-run social media has more openly mocked Trump, however.)

Some analysts have worried that China will take aggressive moves thanks to the distraction in the United States, but I don’t think that’s likely. A crumbling United States, from Beijing’s point of view, is an unpredictable one. While Chinese diplomats are happy to shore up their relations with other countries as their U.S. counterparts face domestic chaos, radical moves are unlikely.

Just as some Americans are convinced that the collapse of the Chinese Communist Party is around the corner, Chinese leaders have believed for some time—and especially since the 2008 financial crisis—that history is on their side and that the U.S. system is doomed. If anything, the events of last week have confirmed that. And if you’re winning anyway, why risk changing the game?"

On a national basis the only demographic Trump went backwards on was white men; he made gains with African-Americans, Latinos, women and Hispanics.

The US election shows that the trajectory of Western democracies, including Australia, is towards the aspirations of multiracial, multiethnic, working and middle-class voters who reject divisive identity politics, celebrate their nation, along with its values and history and freedom, and believe all work — whether in a coalmine or as hairdresser — has dignity and meaning.

Yes ttbn

I fully agree, with your second para.

Hi Ttbn,

Wow ! I think you're becoming a - horrors ! - a centrist ! I'm inclined to go along with pretty much all of your last post.

Thank you.

Joe

I totally agree as well!

Well put!

Still. ttbn's conversion to the Light, may be too good to be true.

Time, and further comments, will tell.

Don't get carried away, folks. What is happening in America doesn't look good for the far-Left identify politics mob. And, I haven't changed in any way. I have never thought that it is immigrants or 'ethnics' who are the problem. Being anti-immigration doesn't mean I hold immigrants responsible for politicians' actions. The problem is the Leftists who are using them - the people who are exempt from their own ideology. The average immigrant is interested in quality of life and opportunities, not politics.

Re-read: "... working and middle-class voters who reject divisive identity politics, celebrate their nation, along with its values and history and freedom, and believe all work".

Now, does that sound like the sort of people I loathe? The ones who invented divisive politics; the Trump-haters and elites.

Once again, I have to wonder if some people here actually take in what they read. And, I'm certainly not looking for approbation from lefties.

And, what about white males backing off from Trump, while Afro-Americans, Latinos, women etc increased their support for Trump.

Did you miss that bit altogether? It's clear that immigrants to America appreciate what they have more than do rich, white elitists who want everyone else to do the socialist thing, without themselves suffering any losses to their wealth and privilege.

Funny how the people who Trump was supposed to have 'racist' and 'sexist' attitudes towards actually helped him in 2016, and increased that help in 2020.

As I was sayin "Time, and further comments, will tell."

So his last two comments have been rambling about Races, the Left and socialists.

Note as extreme as LEGO's Apartheid "scientific" Racism, but still a worry.

And as I said, Pete: some people here do not take in what they read. They have their own preconceived ideas, and they assume, rather than understand. They have a mental block against any opinions contrary to their own. Argument is futile. This is why I, generally, don't do discussions, why I don't bother to read most posts apart from those starting a discussion. It's a pity, because exchanges of opinion are said to produce the truth. Over many years, I have found that this does not occur on Online Opinion. You, I believe, are one of the posters most immune to ideas different from your own; the biggest giveaway being your liberal use of references, which you think are proof of what you say. They are not. Posters who use references that they think support their views have merely sort out information that confirms their pre-existing believes. They carefully avoid the equal number of references that oppose their views. I think that I have said this recently: "it is widely recognised that human reasoning is motivated by a desire to justify their biases rather than to achieve objective understanding of the world". But, I don't suppose anyone bothered to read that or took it in.

The fears that the Biden/Harris Whitehouse will be an extreme socialist affair have been confirmed with the appointment of Bernie Sanders as Biden's labour secretary. Unlike Australians, Americans can have any old unelected ratbag appointed by their President.

Hi Ttbn,

Thanks for your support for centrist policies.

I can't find any reference to Bernie Sanders' being offered a job with Biden, but I did find this:

http://www.marijuanamoment.net/bernie-sanders-and-elizabeth-warren-tout-marijuana-legalization-victories-as-they-push-biden-on-progressive-issues/

I'm not sure that support for the legalisation of marijuana is particularly 'Left', I'm certainly not interested in legalising it (although I'm a sort of left-centrist now). I'll keep looking for reference to Sanders as Labour Secretary though :)

Keep up the good work :)

Joe

Joe,

Don't talk rot, mate.

You wouldn't look at the same sources I do, and apparently the MSM hasn't caught up with the announcement. It will eventually, and I'm not going to tell you where I saw it. I have given up on including my sources because certain posters immediately discount the information as being from horrible right wing sites or commentators. Apart from passing on what I think people might be interested in, I no longer care whether they believe it or not, care about it or not.

Ttbn,

Hmmmm ....... seems like we'll have to drag you kicking and screaming, towards the centre where you obviously, if unconsciously, would like to be :)

I've seen a reference that Bernie was interested in being the Secretary for Labor, but nothing yet about his being offered the job. Maybe your inside man got it wrong ?

Joe

Hi Ttbn,

You might enjoy this video of Sanders' reaction to Trump's decision to 'stand by':

http://edition.cnn.com/videos/politics/2020/11/11/bernie-sanders-trump-election-reaction-sot-tsr-vpx.cnn/video/playlists/this-week-in-politics/

Hmmmm ...... still no mention of being Biden's Labor Secretary .....

Joe

Achtung ttbn und fellow Trumpf-pets

Behold authoritarian President Xi of China suppressing Hong Kong's vote, on trumpfed up grounds

While:

Authoritarian President Trumpf suppresses America's Democrat vote, on trumpfed up grounds:

http://www.canberratimes.com.au/images/transform/v1/crop/frm/kDqE8LvSwvU8fyZkrZC97F/77dde521-7051-4c0a-b75f-af9b6277b75a.jpg/r10_0_1011_668_w1220_h814_fmax.jpg

Kudos ttbn.

While Trumpf describes Americans who fought and died for their country "suckers" and losers" including those who fought Trumpf's fellow Germans http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2020/09/trump-americans-who-died-at-war-are-losers-and-suckers/615997/

President Elect Joe Biden's son, Beau, died, due to war service in Iraq.

ttbn said; "apparently the MSM hasn't caught up with the announcement."

Hi Joe,

What brand of tea do you drink? You might not be consulting the same tea leafs as ttbn, he's a straight Trump tea man himself.

Donald used this sight to tell him he won the election. you can read it clearly for yourself that Donald won the election.

http://www.pinterest.com.au/pin/605312006142334470/

Joe, just visit the web site, its a sight to behold, its all in the tea leaves. Trump has called on his good buddy President Lukashenko from Belarus to come on over and recount the votes.

Reported November 13, 2020:

The US Department of Homeland Security's cybersecurity wing, the Cybersecurity and

Infrastructure Security Agency (CISA), describes the November 3, 2020 Election voting process as:

“the most secure in American history”

and

that there "is no evidence that any voting system deleted or lost votes" changed votes or was in

any way compromised”.

See INTELLIGENCE NEWS http://intelnews.org/2020/11/13/01-2903/

Ttbn,

So far, Trumpf has got around 71 million votes - more than any sitting president in US history - while Biden has got only another 5 million.

Close enough, some might say, so why can't Trumpf he declared the winner ? What's 5 million, compared to 71 million ?

Well, 76 million beats 71 million. Cathy Freeman beat whoever came second by a metre, out of 400, and won.

If all of the votes were recounted, and the Electoral College voting went Biden 270 to Trumpf 268, then Biden wins. End of. All over, red rover. 270 > 268. It's called democracy.

Democracy has to be preserved, exercised and strengthened. The right wing doesn't seem to think it matters a jot. But Ttbn and most of us centrists think it does. Good on you, Ttbn.

Joe

Looks like Planagenet's IntelNews is just two guys.

http://intelnews.org/about/contributors/

About Joseph and Ian

JOSEPH FITSANAKIS, BSocSc, MSc, PhD, is Associate Professor of Political Science in the Intelligence and National Security Studies program at Coastal Carolina University. Prior to joining Coastal, he built the Security and Intelligence Studies program at King University, where he also directed the King Institute for Security and Intelligence Studies. An award-winning professor, Dr. Fitsanakis has lectured, taught and written extensively on subjects such as international espionage, intelligence tradecraft, wiretapping, cyberespionage, and transnational crime. He is a syndicated columnist and frequent contributor to news media such as BBC television, CBC television, ABC radio, and NPR, and his work has been referenced in outlets including The Washington Post, Newsweek, Forbes, Foreign Policy, Politico, Vice News, and The Huffington Post. He can be contacted via email at joe [at] intelnews.org, or by calling 423-742-1627 in the United States.

IAN ALLEN, MEng, MSE, retired from the intelligence profession in the 2000s, after more than 25 years of service. He is currently active in private security consulting. His professional expertise is in the highly technical field of telecommunications security, communications interception countermeasures and related support services. Ian spent much of his professional career working in a variety of locations in North and South America, the Middle East and Southeast Asia. His post-retirement work has been referenced in specialized outlets including The Cipher Brief, Wired, Foreign Policy in Focus, The Military Review, and in news media such as Bloomberg, Al Jazeera, International Business Times, Metro News, Libération, La Razón and others. Ian edits intelNews‘ popular “News You May Have Missed” feature and writes the occasional opinion piece. He can be contacted via email at ian [at] intelnews.org.

The editors/ contributors articles have appeared in the left wing Huffington Post, Al Jazeera, and Libération ("popularly known as Libé, is a daily newspaper in France, founded in Paris by Jean-Paul Sartre and Serge July in 1973 in the wake of the protest movements of May 1968- Initially positioned on the extreme-left of France's political spectrum").

The website intelNews is interesting though.

"Israeli Mossad secretly secured COVID-19 vaccine from China, say sources"

http://intelnews.org/2020/10/28/01-2892/

Does this mean that Israel and China are allies?? What would that mean for the US and it's US Hebrew Diaspora? Could mean anything perhaps...

Dear Can Mal

The boss bwanas from IntelNews draw on better, more credible sources, than your constant Leftist, socialist, nay Communist, soothsayerisms.

I don't want to be a Commie, like you.

And of course "Israel and China are allies". Just ask David Singer.

Avagudweeken

Cheers

Come on Joe, everyone knows Lorraine Fenton of Jamaica WON the women's 400m final at the Sydney Olympics 2000, in a personal best time of 49.58 sec, beating Katharine Merry of Great Britain into third place, and five other competitors. Watch this YouTube and you will see Lorraine clearly beating the six others. Do you wan a re-run? Lorraine clearly beats Katharine, do you want to go to court over the result?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_U7Tra5Qm0Q&ab_channel=Olympic

Al Gore took 37 days to concede defeat. And, to date, only the media has declared Biden the winner. I don't think that Trump is going to pull a rabbit out of a hat; but, for heaven's sake, stop lambasting him for doing what anyone who doesn't want to lose does - like Climate Hysteric, Big Personal Polluter, Al Gore did.

There are two cases in the US Supreme Court reviewing a variety of lower-court decisions concerning the constitutionality of aspects of the counting of votes in the election. They won't be put off just so Biden can start playing Top Banana and giving his Commo mate, Bernie, a job (announced on Sky News, so Joe won't have conniptions).

Why should Australians care, anyway? Just enjoy the lunatic behaviour of the American Left in the streets. I have to say that Yanks are very, very different from us when it comes to politics. Even our loopy Left doesn't take to the streets over elections.

I wonder if Planagenet fears being "unloved"- as a Jungian "Lover".

Nah Canem Malum

I've got all the Babes I can handle.

They call me The____________________________________________________________TRIPOD :)

"Al Gore took 37 days to concede defeat", ttbn, in 2000 it came down to one state and about 500 votes, then brother Jeb called it for George. Your fool Trump is going on about, 4 or 5 states and tens of thousands of votes, chalk and cheese.

I’ll say again: Australians need to stop obsessing over foreign politicians, US or other, and concentrate on their own.

The SMH reported that Green lunatic, Adam Bandt, was invited to the South Korean embassy to address that country’s politicians via video link. God only knows why!

Sky News has reported part of what he said to the South Koreans:

“Not only do I ask that you work to get your government to stop buying our coal but also encourage you to agitate to renegotiate our free-trade agreement to included carbon tariffs against us.”

“We have no carbon price anymore, so we need a price signal on our dirt products”.

That such a treacherous maniac is allowed in our government is a disgrace.

Ttbn,

I'll get in first:

Adam Bandt is not part of any Australian government. And probably never will be.

Joe

ttbn is all for free speech, as long as it agrees with him. This droopy puppy followed Corny Banana and his Conservative Party around until the smarts milked him for what he was worth, then wiped him like a dirty A. The extremist ttbn supports, are out of touch with reality when it comes to coal.

Word about town is ttbn is in his dotage. But I, for one, believe any age group can be delusional.

Joe,

Bandt is a federal member of parliament, and as such has influence. Sorry my language allowed you to make a pointless comment.

Paul 1405 and plantagenet,

Instead of personal abuse against me, how about a response to content. I guess you approve of Bandt and his treacherous behaviour. What fine fellows you are.

plantagenet,

Paul 1405 is a moron, but I'm surprised by your comment. Could you explain to me how reporting, verbatim, the words of Adam Bandt makes me delusional?

Hi ttbn

Less to do with Bandt.

More to do with your misplaced "socialist" fixation in general.

eg. "The fears that the Biden/Harris Whitehouse will be an extreme socialist affair have been confirmed...
Posted by ttbn, Friday, 13 November 2020 8:01:55 AM"

Avagudone

Hi Josephus,

Well, I'm convinced !

I've just heard from a friend that he heard about a bloke who has a cousin in the US who has seen a 34-wheeler truck with "Biden-Harris Fraud Unit" in metre-high letters on the sides, pulling up in a car-park of a polling station. It seems that a team of masked people got out and unloaded pallet-loads of boxes of what turned out to be letters purporting to be postal ballots, which were ferried into the polling place by fork-lift. One letter fell at this bloke's cousin's feet and burst open, revealing a 'vote' for Biden.

So how many trucks like that would Biden need ? Clearly a major crime has been committed, maybe treason. Trumpf is the Rightful Ruler.

Well, it's so obvious ! I'm now a believer !

Joe

Josephus,

There's another thing that people don't know: Trumpf has always been interested in chemistry, and had a laboratory secretly built under the White House. So while a Trumpf double goes off, supposedly, to play golf, Trumpf himself has spent many sleepless nights working in his laboratory, trying to find a cure for this virus, and ultimately of course, for cancer. His findings are now being used by various pharma companies and will benefit the entire world. Not that Trumpf will admit to that, of course, being a sort of modern-day saint.

So despite his modesty, it can be revealed that Trumpf has found a cure for this Chinese virus, and it is now being mass-produced. He should be awarded the Nobel Prize for Chemistry for his contributions to humanity. And, of course, the Nobel Prize for Peace for pulling US troops out of Afghanistan, which will be announced shortly.

But will you ever see anything about this on communist networks like CNN, or the ABC ? Of course not.

Thanks, Josephus: I love your quirky sense of humour.

Joe

plantagenet,

So, you are playing the man instead of addressing the subject of my post. Pretty pathetic, mate. You should be commenting on Adam Bandt - one way or the other - not me. You might think he is the best thing since JC, which is your right, but trying to put me down is really weak and unproductive.

My "fixation", as you put it, on socialism, is not "misplaced". Socialism is a vicious creed, which has killed millions of people and ruined the lives of millions of others. I detest it, and make no bones about it.

You have obviously contracted the 'woke' disease and gone for the easy option - with the mob. You used to be a level headed and reasonable sort of bloke, with a sense of humour, worth reading even if I didn't agree with a lot you said. It's disappointing to find that you have gone over to the dark side.

I'm grateful that there is still a bit of sanity from the Left in the form of Chris Lewis. The rest of the non-conservatives here and generally are a bunch of nutters - if we are going to get personal.

"Socialism is a vicious creed..."

Indeed it is, and Australia is badly infected with it, Flood and Bushfire relief, Medicare, Veterans' and Aged pensions, thank the Lord that the pernicious and character destroying Free Milk for school children is a thing of the past.
Public education and Public Hospitals need to go as well as State subsidized Fire Brigades (both city and country) and all those Charities that help the poor and needy.

User pays should be the watchword, and if your house catches fire then it should burn to the ground if you don't belong to a Fire Insurance Group.

Down with Socialism in all its forms.

Socialism: "political and economic theory of social organization which advocates that the means of production, distribution, and exchange should be owned or regulated by the community as a whole."

That is not what we have here, Is Mise. But if will be unless you drones sharpen up and stop allowing yourselves to be led by the nose. History shows that Socialism was a failure. The people advocating it now will be exempt from their own ideology, but you and the other sheep will suffer.

ttbn,
Is there anything at all that Joe Biden's done which fits that archaic definition of socialism?
Indeed is there anything that Bernie Sanders has done that does?

You seem to be basing your opinions on labels rather than actual policies.

The only nutter here is ttbn, engrossed with his political model of the ninetieth. He cannot understand the concept of a mixed political state where the failings and excesses of capitalism are tempered by the injection of state run socialism.

On Adam Bandt, coal and the South Koreans. Like all our major trading partners South Korea is looking for a pathway to carbon neutral by 2050, China 2060, Japan 2050 and US under Biden 2050. Long term investment in the Australia coal industry, and coal fired power stations, is a non goer. Government uncertainty, and the world outlook has seen investors withdraw from the industry, and turn to investing in renewables. The problem in Australia is not that we will lose the coal industry, that is going to happen whether we like it or not. What we should be doing in 2020 is looking to how best to reposition ourselves to take advantage of the changing world environment. Some conservative politicians are simply taking a head in the sand approach to the coal industry, with nothing more than an eye to the next election.

ttbn would ban democratically elected members of parliament, who don't agree with his line of thinking, Hitler though the same as ttbn on that score, ban political opponents, What next ttbn "re-education".

Dear Paul1405,

Yes it is akin to calling a Canadian, who said to a bunch of Indian politicians that they should stop buying asbestos from Canada, a traitor.

Just an inane argument.

Ttbn,

So, on that definition ...... much of China's economy (and perhaps society) is not socialist ? After all, with so many billionaires, and so much of its economy in private hands, it's not much less capitalist - if at all - than the US.

Is there any country in the world which meets your definition ?

I don't think so: socialism, in that sense, has died and it won't ever be resurrected. Find another boogy-man.

Joe

Paul 1405 isn't the only moron.

Ttbn,

You didn't need to confess that, we already knew it, but thanks :)

Joe

Ttbn,

I think this sort of story is more likely to have a happy ending for Trumpf supporters:

http://www.betootaadvocate.com/sports/wallabies-fans-call-on-new-zealand-to-concede-bledisloe/

Yes, count every legal vote. Count the bloody things twice, three times, if it will entice Trumpf out of his bunker. What a sook.

Joe

Hi Ttbn,

This article:

http://www.aljazeera.com/opinions/2020/11/14/a-postmortem-of-a-colonial-election/

is another take on the Trump Incompetency. Perhaps he will never have his giant image carved out of the mountain, but once Kamala Harris takes on the job, especially because of her two successful four-year terms after Biden stands down in a couple of years, perhaps just after she retires in 2033, her image will be up there. But I don't think she would have the crude arrogance of your clay-footed idol to expect it.

Joe

Hi Joe,

Its a bit iffy as to whether Kamala Harris can do two terms, should Joe Biden step down during his first term. One thing about Trump doing one term in the modern era, he joins George H. W. Bush and Jimmy Carter as one term wonders. Bush and Carter were no great shakes, but with Trump joining them it will make both look positively statesmen like. .

I would like to see Biden step down after two years, giving Harris the time to establish herself. Then in 2024 go up against a creditable Republican candidate such as Mike Pence. Interesting how Pence has kept a low profile since election night. The Republican Party now has the opportunity to dump Trump, but would Trump go quietly? I'm inclined to believe Trump thinks the 71 million votes were from some new personal Trumpite group. Trump could believe that in 2024 he could succeed where Ross Perot failed, Trumps ego is big enough to think along those lines.

No serious discussion on the theme - what Adam Bandt said - so I'm out of here. A pox on the lot you. I will read only the handful of posters that I deem to be worth reading, and the rest of you can get further up the road. You will all know the short version of that, but I'm not willing to get banned for a bunch of morons.

Look fellas, ttbn is taking his bat and ball and going home, tut tut, what a smut! ttbn old cry baby, Adolf hasn't posted here since 1945, what ya going to read now?

Hiya ttbn

With ever increasing COVID death rates a gasping US population searches in vain for Trump's leadership.

Trump is therefore to be commended for selflessly leading his GOLF handicap.

See "Played Golf Since TRUMP Took Office? [Infographic]"
http://www.forbes.com/sites/niallmccarthy/2020/11/11/how-often-has-president-trump-played-golf-since-he-took-office-infographic/?sh=577099967b02

"Trump Declares Himself Victorious In Round Of Golf After Taking Lead On 4th Hole"

Reports CRYPTO-COMMUNIST POTUS Donald Trump's capitalist caddie ADAM BANDT.

at http://www.betootaadvocate.com/world-news/trump-declares-himself-victorious-in-round-of-golf-after-taking-lead-on-4th-hole/

Paul,

I would love to see a match-up in 2024 between Kamala Harris in the blue corner for the democrats, and Nikki Haley in the red corner for the Republicans, and either one Presiding until 2033. Ideally in a sort of Grand Coalition government. Or each one taking turns to finish their eight years. That would take it all up to 2040.

By that time, the US would be even more multi-ethnic, multicultural if you like, multi-everything and very little mono-anything, which would utterly piss off the Ttbns and Josephuses and Bad Dogs, who imagine that whites have the right to rule forever and, if possible, everywhere.

Heralding in a new world where people are judged on the content of their character ..... I hope I live long enough :)

Joe

ttbn,

Good on you for bringing Adam Bandt's idiotic viewpoint on Coal to our notice - and his associated traitorous lecturing in other quarters.
Any sane person would realise that Coal is a vital part of Aus future redevelopment from the ashes of Covid, and beyond.
Greening is Aus future to CO2 remission - by extending agriculture and forestry and environmental restoration and preservation. (Ref. Bradfield Scheme and its broad extension, East, West and Central, wherever humanly possible.)
Note: Not Adam Bandt's concept of 'Greening', which is essentially Renewables, with all that approach's limitations and costs.
In due course, nuclear will ultimately become essential, as will massive oil palm plantations, or similar, and oil-producing algae farming, and oceanic seaweed culturing.
Solar and wind, and even pumped-hydro, are useful, but fundamentally limited.

Paul is a 'Green', so essentially a disciple.
Some others have reasonably open minds, but may need convincing.
I, of course, am totally open-minded.

Trump is doing a great disservice to Democracy and Stability in America, by encouraging his 'followers' to revolt and cause civil unrest.
A total Plonker.
Heaven help the U.S. if Trump is ever allowed to hold any public office in the future, and particularly not the Presidency.
That's only my opinion of that Sociopath of course, so only to be taken with sufficient grains of salt.

America will have a real chance of major reform and development with Joe and Kamala, if the despotic GOP will only offer a reasonable level of Cooperation for the greater good.
Likelihood? One can only hope lessons can be learned and goodwill prevail.

If Donald Trump graciously concedes the US election to Joe Biden, he could set up a rematch in 2024

see http://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-11-16/us-election-result-if-handled-well-could-pave-the-way-for-trump/12876910

"Whether the President has identified it or not, the 2020 election result has offered him a significant opportunity.

Far from the widespread repudiation of Trumpism the Democrats had hoped for, the election results increasingly showed the President's ideology was growing, not shrinking in popularity.

While 63 million people had voted for Trump in 2016, his 2020 tally has reached almost 73 million, even as he continues to trail Joe Biden.

The Trump brand is also strong, as Republican tickets with his name at the top outperformed 2018 midterm races where his backers in the Senate and House of Representatives were left to run on their own merits.

The President's tweets in the last day indicate he may be approaching the realisation that he will not be in the White House beyond January 20th."

Trump Will Defect to Russia

Once he admits he's lost http://www.thewrap.com/jim-carreys-new-cartoon-imagines-trumps-defection-to-russia-after-election-loss/

Trump's Defection Cartoon http://pbs.twimg.com/media/EkykA_DVMAEmJLw?format=jpg&name=900x900

Trump is trying to incite rebellion and usurp the Presidency.

Isn't that an act of treason?

Mr O,

Good point: if a person holding a public office, uses that office to subvert the Constitution and incite rebellion, are they guilty of treason ? Or malfeasance ? And/or their estate is liable to financially compensate for any damage that they incite ?

Is capital punishment still the remedy for such treason ?

Joe

While Trump is POTUS treason against the US Government, of which Trump is the major office holder, sounds unconvincing.

But after Biden's Inauguration the floodgates of court cases against Trump may succeed eg. "As of October 2019, a case was pending in the federal courts regarding access to personal tax returns in a criminal case brought against Donald Trump by the New York County District Attorney alleging violations of New York state law.[110]" see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/President_of_the_United_States#Juridical_powers_and_privileges

Trump may need to escape to somewhere without an Extradition Agreement with the US or no easy CIA "Rendition" prospects.

Edward Snowden found refuge in Russia - so might Trump.

Pseudo-mouth,

You ask: "Is capital punishment still the remedy for such treason?"

In Trump's case, one can only hope so.

plantagenet,

Maybe Trump can hide out with Prince Andrew on one of Jeffrey Epstein's Caribbean islands.

AUSTRALIAN NUCLEAR DETERRENT BEST SUBMARINE BASED

While Australia’s Trump damaged alliance shifts to a Biden Administration Australia's own nuclear deterrent (mainly against China) must be considered.

If we cannot trust the US to go to nuclear war with China in defence of Australia we need our own deterrent. A submarine based deterrent is less likely than a land or aircraft based deterrent to be destroyed.

Fortunately Australia is buying the diesel version of the French nuclear propelled Barracuda submarine. Barracudas are relatively small and cheap compared to larger, more expensive, US observance of NPT blocked, US/UK SSNs.

The Australian public is Not Yet ready to OK Australia purchasing the French Barracuda submarine but will be by 2030, by which time:

(A) the Chinese threat will create sufficient fear.

(B) Australia will have started building 4 diesel Barracudas (known as Attack class http://www.navy.gov.au/fleet/ships-boats-craft/future/ssg ) from the early 2030s. There will be time to modify the first Attack class subs to the original Barracuda NUCLEAR propelled baseline and arm them with nuclear warhead cruise missiles (N-SLCMs?).

(C) If Australia sticks with the French Nuclear path the next 4 subs could be nuclear armed ballistic missile (SLBM) firing submarines, known as SSBNs. Fortunately France already has new SSBNs on the drawing board, known as SNLE 3G http://www.navyrecognition.com/index.php/news/defence-news/2018/october-2018-navy-naval-defense-news/6538-here-is-the-first-image-of-the-french-navy-next-generation-ssbn-snle-3g.html#:~:text=Navy%20Recognition%20saw%20for%20the,class%29%20in%20about%2015%20years , to be built in France from the 2030s.

Note that France has a track record of helping Israel build a nuclear weapons establishment http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shimon_Peres_Negev_Nuclear_Research_Center#Construction and Jericho MRBM/IRBMs http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jericho_%28missile%29 to carry them. France then conducted Joint Nuclear Tests with Israel in the Sahara and Pacific.

From the early 2020s until the mid 2030s the US will likely decide that Australia switching such vast $ sums and a nuclear future to a French alliance is disturbing for America's military industrial complex and the US Indo-Pacific alliance.

The USA will be far more attentive and forthcoming with nuclear weapons for us - its Australian ally.

(D) If you want to get a "new idea" read an "old book", like the following article on Australian Prime Minister John Gorton's AUSTRALIAN NUCLEAR DETERRENT at http://www.smh.com.au/national/when-australia-had-a-bombshell-for-us-20080705-32ai.html

plantagenet,

What a load of crap!

China could squash Australia like a bug under its foot.

Plus how many Chinese agents and operatives are already in Australia posing as permanent resident migrants waiting for the call from Beijing to move into action to destabilise the country from within prior to an attack?

And who are you sending into the battlefield? Surely not dementia-ridden Hasbeen in one of his imaginary jet fighters!

This is what we do: We send our leading politicians to Beijing to crawl on their hands and knees to President Xi and kiss his feet.

Hi Mr Op

The Australian nuclear sub thread is now at http://forum.onlineopinion.com.au/thread.asp?discussion=9315&page=0#google_vignette

US AUTHORITIES REJECT TRUMP'S ELECTION FRAUD BLEATING

http://www.wired.com/story/trump-fires-christopher-krebs-cisa/
reports:

Trump's 17 Nov 2020 firing of Chris Krebs for pushing back on Trump's Election fraud disinformation

"marks perhaps the most upsetting moment for democracy since the president’s refusal to

accept his election loss two weeks ago. Trump has since spread disinformation wildly

and has prevented the government bureaucracy from beginning a normal, peaceful transition.

[Trump's] increasingly quixotic legal battle has seen over a dozen courtroom losses across

multiple states.

Krebs did nothing more than tell the truths that Trump is trying to ignore..."

Cameron Stewart has an interesting article in today's Australian:

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/world/vaccines-are-the-only-hope-for-the-us-the-virus-horse-has-bolted/news-story/6c81b4f528c49241157acd8a3f7053e0

I was especially taken by his comparison with Australia, that the US

" ..... is ill-prepared for any pandemic because it is such a loose patchwork of States, each with their own rules and systems, making federal nationwide co-ordination a nightmare.

"On top of this came the bigger nightmare of Donald Trump who proved himself singularly unable to rise to his moment in history in dealing with the virus.

"Trump’s early denials, his refusal to warn the population, his advocacy of witch-doctor remedies, his abdication of federal leadership and his scorning of mask-wearing have contributed greatly to the number of American dead. As a result, he is a one-term president.

"But city mayors and governors, both Democrat and Republican, also bear their fair share of blame for their own short-sighted, uneven and piecemeal responses."

Dr Fauci warned very early on that, if competent measures weren't adhered to, there could be a couple of million deaths. The vaccine will take the best part of a year to distribute, even just in the US, so how right was he ?

Will the US ever elect a president as incompetent and callously uncaring as Trumpf again ? Frankly, I wouldn't be surprised.

Joe

Thanks Joe

For locating such an apt article. Trump is indeed the main reason Covid has been so severe in the US.

Re: "Will the US ever elect a president as incompetent and callously uncaring as Trumpf again ?"

Yes I agree the US will elect someone as bad after 8 years of Biden/Harris.

Americans, too often, see themselves as God-fearing, gun slinging, non-political patriots with mythical superiority on their side.

Such a bloated national spirit leads American's chosing Presidents with all these exceptional and mythical characterists.

In the end its as if America is full of ignorant locals who gather around the latest snake oil salesman in town, a salesman offering quick magical cures.

GOOD NEWS!

Reported 20 November 2020:

"Joe Biden wins GEORGIA ahead of Donald Trump after RECOUNT
flipping the state for Democrats at the US election"

"Joe Biden has won Georgia and its 16 electoral votes, an extraordinary victory for Democrats who pushed to expand their electoral map through the Sun Belt.

Key points:

- The Associated Press called the win for Biden in Georgia after a HAND-TALLIED AUDIT of ballots

- The AUDIT confirmed a winning margin of roughly 12,000 votes for Biden, having led by 14,000 before the hand tally

- The president-elect has called Donald Trump's refusal to concede an act of "incredible irresponsibility"

The win by Mr Biden pads his electoral college margin of victory over President Donald Trump.

Mr Biden was declared the winner of the presidential election on November 7 after flipping Pennsylvania, Michigan and Wisconsin to the Democrats’ column.

Mr Biden now has 306 electoral votes to Mr Trump’s 232.

...Mr Biden said on Thursday (local time) that Mr Trump's refusal to accept the election results has left Americans "witnessing incredible irresponsibility".

...WHAT HAPPENS after the RECOUNT?

The states have until December 8 to settle any disputes over the election result, including recounts and court contests.

Once that deadline has passed, each state's [ELECTORAL COLLEGE] electors have until December 14 to vote by paper ballot.

These are then counted and the electors sign six Certificates of the Vote.

Those certificates, along with other official papers, are sent by registered mail to various officials, including the president of the Senate by December 23.

The Lower House and the Senate will hold a joint session to count those electoral votes on January 6.

When a candidate receives 270 or more electoral votes, the President of the Senate will announce the results.

Inauguration day is on January 20, when the winning candidate will be officially sworn in as president."

via http://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-11-20/georgia-called-for-joe-biden-after-recount-us-election/12904184

I move a motion that the Good establish a sheltered workshop for EX Trumpsters. The poor sods are suffering so.

In our concern for their Post Trump's Golf Delusions (PTGD)

I hereby praraphrase that famous patriotic American poem about European refugees to America first seeing the Statue of Liberty. That is:

"The New Colossus" written in 1883 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_New_Colossus#Text_of_the_poemhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_New_Colossus#Text_of_the_poem

"Give me your tired, your poor,
Your Trumpest masses yearning to breathe free Biden air,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, Trumpet-tost to me,
I lift my lamp of Free Medical Care the golden door!"

I'll second that! Most of the Trumpsters seem to have skedaddled from the Forum since "Fearless Leader" got booted out! Where is mhaze and runner these days.

"Donny, come out now."

"No !"

"Please, Donny, I've got your favourite burger."

"No beetroot ? Plenty of pineapple ?"

"Yes, just as you like it."

" ........ No. I WON !"

"Donny, you took three swings, that's three strikes, and you didn't touch the ball. That's out."

"No ! it's my bat, so I'm still in. And anyway, I won."

"Come on, Donny. You need your nappy changed ?"

"Yeah. Then can I come back inside ?"

"Okay."

"And can I have all my Spiderman comics too ? They're my favourite."

"Yeah, sure. Now come on, Donny."

" ...... Okay ....... But I still WON ! "

"Yeah, you won. Now come on out."

Hi Paulo and Joe

Yes I miss runner so (not).

Speaking of Bub-no-Play-no-More's nappy needs, here's a documented case: http://youtu.be/LPQYAT3wH_g?t=2m55s

And the Whole interview. Donny's special woman http://youtu.be/LPQYAT3wH_g

Cheers

PARDON ME Joe!

Well if you don't want to PARDON ME, I'll get my mate Donny to PARDON ME! These must be some other Yanks that could do with a pardon, their jails are full. Donny could be in for a busy couple of months.