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The Forum > General Discussion > Marriage in Israel

Marriage in Israel

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Liberal Democracy I guess is the "modern" form of democracy. Which has come to include separation of church and state.

Jordan Peterson says that all political systems create inequality.

Human's need values- values cause hierarchy- hierarchy creates inequality.

Who watches the watchers- how do you ensure that those that create the rules of virtue are virtuous. In traditional cultures there is a council of elders.

One measure of critical maturity is the ability to hold two opposing ideas in ones mind.

If there is a contradiction between Democracy and perceptions of good governance and Israel- is it Israel or the perceptions that are fallacious?

It's common to form a conclusion without doing analysis.

Some argue that democracy contains the seeds of it's own destruction- any stable system requires an ability to return to a stable state.

I believe that not having Self Determination will create great inequality.

Just because Israel says that they represent Hebrew culture (and you) doesn't mean that they do. Though they probably control many Hebrew historical treasures. You might argue that no government can represent the views of it's or any citizens. Or that it only should represent the views of it's own citizens. Maybe the US shouldn't be the world's police.

Do you think that judges are appropriate judges of the law? Should people agree with their decisions?

Governing is not deterministic but statistical.

I agree with Yuyutsu that marriage shouldn't be managed by the super-state- government should minimize it's interference in personal life.

Maybe the world has become to big too complex. This complexity creates it's own turbulence and poverty.

Confucius seems to model society on an army where families were analogous to self contained "identical" soldiers arranged hierarchically. It is possible to build flexibility into this system to balance freedom and stability.
Posted by Canem Malum, Sunday, 20 September 2020 10:28:55 PM
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Dear David,

Here's an opinion piece from The Jerusalem Post
by Moshe Dann, November 2019 on the general
question - "Is Israel a democracy":

http://www.jpost.com/opinion/is-israel-a-democracy-607359
Posted by Foxy, Sunday, 20 September 2020 10:37:30 PM
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Dear Foxy,

Recently, Likud, Netanyahu's party, and Blue and White, the main opposition reached a stalemate and considered what they called a government of National Unity. However, there was also another party, the Arab List, which contained mainly Arabs with a few Jewish voters. Neither Likud nor Blue and White invited members of the Arab List to join them. How can there be something that calls itself a government of national unity which shuts out a large percentage of the population? Israel can be a Jewish state or a democracy. It cannot be both. The Athenian democracy could shut out a large part of the population, woman, slaves and foreigners, and still be a democracy. A modern democracy cannot do that.
Posted by david f, Sunday, 20 September 2020 10:59:32 PM
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Dear David,

There will certainly be many more Jewish voters for the "United Arab List" next elections, which would make a good protest vote following the bitter betrayal of both "Blue and While" and "Labor" of their voters, joining Netanyahu for a slice of meat (under the pretext of COVID-19).

But beyond protesting, do you realise that half that "United Arab List" is communist and the other half would push for the imposition of Muslim Shariah law? Is this something you really want? With your views you would probably prefer to vote instead for "Meretz", a secular-leftist, pro-peace Jewish party that is not tainted with Islamic ideology.

"National Unity government" is of course a misnomer, an historical term that has nothing to do with unity or reality. Several Jewish parties were also left out. Most Israelis are left out, betrayed, which is also why they wouldn't cooperate with Netanyahu on fighting the Coronavirus.

---

Dear Mr. Opinion,

«But on a serious note it is basically a socially recognized contract acknowledging sexual relations and the rights and duties accruing from procreation.»

Surely we don't need to acknowledge sexual relations in the 21st century!

Procreation should be discouraged, not glorified. As for accruing rights and duties, they are, as should, the same anyway whether or not the parents are married.
Posted by Yuyutsu, Monday, 21 September 2020 12:15:41 AM
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Dear Yuyutsu,

As I told you in another discussion I prefer not to interact with you. However, I think your information is wrong, and you don’t know what I want. I don’t think the Arab List is half communist and half supporters of Shariah from the following.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joint_List

"The list is ideologically diverse, and includes communists, socialists, feminists, Islamists, and Arab nationalists.[25][26][19] After having united parties with various political agendas, Odeh met with Jewish Hadash activists and former Knesset speaker Avraham Burg (who had endorsed Hadash), in an attempt to allay concerns that the new alliance would dilute the party's principles, such as gender equality."

As I have previously said I prefer not to interact with you. However, I question your accuracy. Although the Arab list contains communists and Arab nationalists I don’t believe it is half and half communists and Shariah supporters. Having made an inaccurate statement you then ask me if that’s what I want. Of course I don’t want it, but that is irrelevant. If you are for free speech and I am for free speech you respect the right of people to advocate what you may not want. I think generally you are wrong, and I don’t want a world filled with people who believe in superstitious nonsense. However, you have a right to express your superstitious nonsense and I wouldn’t want you banned from online opinion. Similarly communists and supporters of Shariah have a right to express their views.
Posted by david f, Monday, 21 September 2020 6:09:22 AM
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Dear David,

You are correct about the communists and Islamists being less than half of the United Arab List, each. I apologise.

I agree that even communists and supporters of Shariah have a right to express their views. Nevertheless, Israel is still in a state of war and should the United Arab List take over, my family there would be slaughtered.

I actually favour them winning in protest against Netanyahu some 30% of the votes and being included in a coalition government, but not having enough to control Israel's security mechanisms.
Posted by Yuyutsu, Monday, 21 September 2020 9:51:34 AM
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