Bloody yanks. DEMOS, I have a commerce degree, so can put theories around why big business likes a growing population. I just dont agree with the theory of continual growth (and mind you neither does the mechanics of the economy, which is why we have boom/bust cycles). Yes, I also agree that the LIBERAL government tends to pander to the needs of big business. Labor governments tend to also support immigration, but more from a humanitarian point of view. Same result but different theories.

I disagree that there is nothing the average Joe can do. We have an election coming up soon, and whilst it tends to be a pick of the one you think will do the least harm, there is potential for a decent change in policies. Howard would have been thrown out on his ear long ago if Labor had put up a viable alternative leader, which they now have. I guess I also live in an area that is populated by lots of independents. Mostly at state level (as our federal member is still the ex-deputy PM), but that may change as the current federal member is retiring and most people have had a gutful of the nationals - the only reason John Anderson has stayed as long as he has is that he has a strong connection to the local community and makes a pretty good effort locally (eg his kids attend local public schools).

More than ever at the next election, the candidates will be forced to listen to their constituents or risk being ousted in favour of an independent.

One final point, Australia cant cope with providing services to the population that we currently have - all the more reason for scaling back immigration until we get better equipped to handle it.

I think I should post a new discussion about "Multiculturalism"

Dresdener - you claim that multiculturalism is a form of oppression which has resulted in a destruction of our culture. It's easy to draw that view - many people from many countries with different values = a cultural morass.

I am a non-white Australian with migrant parents. I know many people such as myself. Notwithstanding the fact that we grew up with the rich cultural history of our parents, we are very much Australian, with Australian values. Australian culture - ie white, anglosaxon, christian values - are inculcated through our education systems and our peer groups. Some of our parents came here precisely because of the values and the culture - not to threaten them. In fact, I got so sick of people asking me where I was from (because I consider myself Australian), I told them I was adopted.

If we want to encourage and protect Australian values - let's start by reducing the amount of American content in our media; let's start by reducing the amount of imported goods; let's start by participating in our local communities; let's start by protecting our indigenous children

CJ... I have to 'whack' you again old son... isn't ur rear end getting a bit tender by now ? All these malicious rants of yours...

CRONULLA
"BOAZY was sitting there on the sidelines EGGING THEM ON for all he was worth"

woooo... now thats borderline defamation... but its cool, firstly lets analyze

Egging WHO...on...and for WHAT ?

Evidence please.

And 'you' say 'I' play fast and loose with the truth ? (frown)

Country Gal said:

Labor governments tend to also support immigration, but more from a humanitarian point of view.

CG.. it took me a good 5 minutes to recover from the choking attack that that 'humanitarian' bit gave me :) (Kidding) but hey..I'd re-think that if I was you... Labor..LIKE Liberal (and Greens, and..what's that other has been party ? Dem..ah..I forget).. deconstruct issues in terms of... VOTES.
1/ Labor KNOWS that if it appears 'supportive' of Immigration it will be seen to be the 'party for immigrants'
2/ Most immigrants end up in blue collar (laboring) jobs for the first generation
3/ = "Naturally" fit into the 'Labor' mould.

JAMES Purser... your feedback is welcome, and provides an opportunity for constructive dialogue.
My contention is definitely not that we clone people into wasps. I'm simply saying that once we DROP our ideas of racial/ethnic superiority, we will more freely intermarry with non 'us', and in the end, we will have a more blended, harmonious society.
Lets face it.. Kings and Emperors often married the princesses of their enemies to ensure peace. Intermariage IS a very effective way of reducing ethnic/cultural tension.
As to the 'religious' aspect.. that's something that each couple will have to work out at the family and individual level. For people to become Christians involves a process called repentance and faith, and is something people either do, or don't do when exposed to the Gospel of Grace. That will not alter the racial blending of intermarriage, but might tend to concentrate the intermarriages into religious subgroupings.

Blackstone, I appreciate the response. Let me just say that this isn't a 'white' or 'non-white' issue. What defines 'white' anyway? The Lebanese are 'white', so why haven't they been absorbed into mainstream Australian culture? Such imprecise terms have no meaning and merely confuse the issue. 'European' is more accurate, but even then Australian culture has evolved beyond its European settler origins.

I think you did manage to hit the nail on the head though. This is fundamentally a debate about culture. The UK managed to absorb a significant number of Indians and Africans from the 1950s onwards without any major cultural dislocation. This was pre-multiculturalism when such immigrants were encouraged to assimilate and become 'British'. Several decades later and the kids of those migrants are as British as bangers and mash, irrespective of their ethnic backgrounds.

Multiculturalism is divisive and unnecessary. To quote Canadian author Mark Steyn:

"We're told the old-school imperialists were racists, that they thought of the wogs as inferior. But, if so, they at least considered them capable of improvement. The multiculturalists are just as racist. The only difference is that they think the wogs can never reform: Good heavens, you can't expect a Muslim in Norway not to go about raping the womenfolk! Much better just to get used to it."

http://www.jewishworldreview.com/0902/steyn082302.asp

Blackstone, agree whole-heartedly with your final para, and can appreciate your experiences. I agree with Dresdener, to me its not about black or white (or any other shade), its mostly about culture, beliefs and values. Personally I dont put much stock in judging people simply by their background (except if they're americian - got a special dislike for people that want to impose themselves on the rest of the world), BUT that doesnt mean we should throw caution to the wind and let anyone in. If certain ethnic groups seem to have a high percentage of crime, or problems, then we need to seriously question why, and what is causing it - what remedial action should be taken (to help both "us" and "them").