I was inspired by Paul1405 and his emphasis on the cost of policy and thought it could promote interesting discussion to discuss Marxism in the same way.

CM with respect, we may just as well talk about the life and times of a road kill roo I passed on the way home
Both are dead, both smell ,and both are unlikely to worry us much these days
Donal Trump, what a man, he and those who follow him want to breath life back in to reds under the bed junk
We are better for being aware it is just another insane muttering from a man soon to be gone
This proudly progressive centrist refuses to fear shadows

Marxism, Socialism, Democracy etc are all simply sabotaged & inevitably brought down by greed !

How many people was it again that died as a result of Communism and Socialism. Many tens of millions from memory.

Venezuela is an amazing success story for socialism. Oh that's right that was 20 years ago when all the leftist academia were inviting the leaders here to teach and lecture. Now people are doing well to get a feed.

Socialism simply can't work as long as greed is all around us, particularly among socialists !

The cost of communism/socialism?

Incalculable. What is the cost of one life cut short? Multiple that by at least 100 million.

What is the cost of one nation being led to economic ruin by following these disastrous policies? Multiple that by 40 or so for all the nations who fell into the tender mercies of the socialists.

What is the cost to the non-communist world of being forced to combat the Comintern to ensure their societies weren't forced down this disastrous path?

Socialism was a 20th century tragedy that made the 14th century Black Death (which wiped out up to 50% of Europeans) seem like a gift from God.

In the end socialism was an error by the 20th century intellectual classes. And they continue to make the error.

Despite Belly's know -nothing claims that its all a figment of Trump's imagination, the fact is that those who (wrongly) consider themselves the intellectual elite, are indeed working to revive this religion which ought never be revived. They only way they manage that is through the moronic thinking of those like Belly who think that learning or thinking about communism is unnecessary. People have forgotten the disasters of the USSR or Mao. They need to relearn it - and quickly.

Has anyone considered we here are becoming a right of reality place
That haters flock here to damn any one whois not from the very right
Why ask you say, well you would be right, it is so certain the answer is yes that asking the question is time wasting
Look at the middle east, the mass murders by Muslims of other Muslims
Then America, see Trump's war on the international court of justice
Because they are investigating American Armed Forces actions there
Play your 1950,s reds under the bed games But just behind China America is a very real danger to world peace

I wonder if Belly would be willing to "pick up a gun for communism" like so many of his compatriots. Would Foxy or Paul1405 or SteeleRedux. You never think it's going to happen till it does.

It's somewhat amusing to think of Foxy on communist picket with an AK47 and fatigues on Bourke St Mall within sight of the location of the Melbourne muslim stabbing and defending against white British gaijin (outsiders), gwai-low (foreign ghosts), and infidels (non believers).

With Belly it's all about union membership. Nothing else matters. That unions have been contributors not only to financial gain for the selected but also a road to ruin for the nation's economy doesn't appear to bother him all that much, as long as ruinous policies & tactics are kept alive !
Makes me wonder how much he cares about those who don't pay union fees because they can't afford to ?

With China in front, America behind, Islam on the right, the unions on the left and the reds beneath, all that we have left is to look up and shout to our Father in Heaven.

Alas, the skies too are now full of drones, cameras and human-generated electromagnetic vibrations from gadgets designed to take away our independence and innocence.

Fortunately, one can still find God within one's heart.

Canem Malum,

For your information - Foxy's family fled
Communism during WWII. They lost
many family members. Some were horrendously
tortured by the red army, others died in Gulags.
Foxy comes from a family that has fought communism
at every turn. Foxy herself has taken
part in anti-communist demonstrations, written to
politicians, and taken part in the fight for the
liberation of the Baltic States.

You owe Foxy an apology for your repulsive slurs.

CM sorry old mate but you lost me
Yes I understand far right supporters are,seemingly a needed truth, of low IQ but you got down in the gutter with that lot
Foxy I will say sorry for him,he has neither the intellect or manners to do so
Posting here, right now, are children of migrants
Even migrants
They enable hate,against migrants
They talk of a long dead communism
But deny fearsly the truth
The radical right is a far bigger threat to our freedom than the other two eve was

The internet is good for fantasists like Foxy, who can say the wildest things, which might or might not be true, but which cannot be proved. A lot of those people 'fleeing communism' were often fleeing justice for being Nazi sympathisers. I used to know a sweet old Lithuanian man and 'refugee' who was exposed as a guard in a Nazi POW camp.

I obviously don't know anything at all about Foxy's people before they fled Europe; and that's the point - the stories could be true, or they could be false. Nothing said by any poster about themselves can be taken as gospel. CC doesn't have to apologise.

My family history has been
well documented on this forum from the day I first joined
decades ago. I've spoken about my family's experiences
many times. I've written anti-communism posts - explained
the horrors of what communism did not only in the Baltic States but
throughout the world. I've given references to books on the
subject. In other words all people have to do is check my
posing record.

many muslims come here escaping hell holes and then want to implement sharia law and it seems like some do the same with Marxism. Just a thought!

runner,

I've never had any Muslims knocking on my door
but there's been plenty of Jehovah's Witnesses,
Latter-Day Saints (Mormons), all sorts of other
Evangelists, and Christians in general. Also -
just a thought.

How did Muslims become part of this thread
Can ANYONE tell me murdering people on their knees in their Church is not gutless murder
IT IS and just as bad as the moronic Islamists who cut the heads off unarmed people
However, Foxys history is known, right now there are posters here even first generation, with migrant background
Too in our country you will find Muslims who no longer follow that faith
Stop and think please
If a gunman went to a CATHOLIC CHURCH and murdered people because some of them may be pedaphiles what would you say?
Haters must hate but in the end resemble those they hate more each day

"My family history has been
well documented on this forum from the day I first joined
decades ago"

No.It has not. Your 'family history' is only what you say is. It is doubtful that anything about your family is 'documented' anywhere in the public arena. If it is, you would have to reveal your true identity to prove it. I repeat. You can say anything you like about yourself, and it cannot be proven or refuted. We 'keyboard warriors’ are just pseudonyms on a computer screen, no personalities, no substance - just opinions. Trying to project yourself as an interesting human being and talking about yourself just doesn't work on the internet. That's best left for real life - unless it's all a fabrication that doesn't pass muster in human interaction.

ttbn,

Thank You for your opinion.

As always it is appreciated from such an
understanding and caring human being such as
yourself.

However, I would like to point out that my
family's history- in context
on this forum and the reasons it was brought up at all
are evident on my postal record - speaking from
experiences shared at each time to make a point.
The history or the explanations have
not changed over the decades that I've been on the forum.

Anyway -

Whether you choose to not believe me is your prerogative.
I imagine if I was to walk on water - you would be the first
to exclaim - "See Foxy can't swim!"

cont'd ...

So you think that I'm trying to project myself as
an "interesting human being?"

I can assure you that I really don't need to do that.

Others, such as yourself do such a good job for me.

You really don't understand. Three separate posts to say nothing you haven't already said. You must be spitting mad. I'm gradually weaning myself off your preposterous ravings, and hope to be immune to them altogether soon. There's no hope for you, with your delusional self-importance, however. You even share your obsessions with hubby, I see. He has my commiserations, poor fellow.

Foxy clearly your husband had some one here in mind, he is a bright man

Dear Belly,

My husband is much smarter than me.

That's for sure.

The costs of Socialism & Communism are the dumbing-down of the masses and, thanks to modern education we're at about 10 minutes to twelve of reaching that goal !

Canem Malum,
Posted by Foxy, Sunday, 17 March 2019 9:44:57 AM

For your information - Foxy's family fled
Communism during WWII. They lost
many family members. Some were horrendously
tortured by the red army, others died in Gulags.
Foxy comes from a family that has fought communism
at every turn. Foxy herself has taken
part in anti-communist demonstrations, written to
politicians, and taken part in the fight for the
liberation of the Baltic States.

You owe Foxy an apology for your repulsive slurs.

Answer- Well in that case she must have some small appreciation of how offensive her opinions are to me and my family. If someones policies are communist then whether they realise it or not they are a communist. Marcuse (Frankfurt School) developed his ideas based on Trotskyism- he is considered the founder of the new left- Foxy seems from memory to quote policies of the new left- therefore in my view she is broadly a communist. Many Australian Communists upon returning from Russia in the sixties had become disillusioned with it's implementation in Russia- but even when they returned they couldn't believe that the underlying principles led to the Russian situation- but they arguably did- these people often remained communists- somehow they justified it to themselves- often by saying Russian Communism wasn't Marxist Communism. Democracy and Science means that sometimes you will be offended- as Kant believed- the "truth" is the best policy.

I often find comments by Foxy and others to be similarly repulsive- but I manage to pick myself up and continue- I don't ask Foxy for an apology for her offense nor others. I wouldn't accept an apology from Foxy even if she should provide one- as despite the pain the truth is more valuable- free speech is more valuable than political correctness.

Anyway...

Thank you for your feedback.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trotskyism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proletarian_internationalism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herbert_Marcuse

I consider Foxy's and others views (about Multiculturalism and Immigration amongst others) to be treasonous to the British Australian people and to the preservation of tradition and peoples in the world and believe they should be incarcerated as such- I'm sure she feels the same about me. They say law is not justice. So I'll try to work to improve the law. I believe every culture should have their own country. Maybe in time Foxy will come to see her error- as the young Candace Owens did- but I'm not going to hold my breath- and I wouldn't expect her to change her views on my demands.

CM please consider, you Sir are likely to bring a spotlight on yourself
You tell us YOU not Foxy, are an extreme radical
Just as surely as a cough and runny nose warns of a cold or flue
Talking about communism as if it actually exists now is telling
In reality the very right, Chins, wealthy powerful men buying influence, are the real dangers to the world
On first seeing you I did think you to be a bright poster well worth reading
What has taken place?
Please consider why you are hunting phantoms that no longer exist

Belly said 1- Talking about communism as if it actually exists now is telling.

Answer1- We had a thread not so long ago "Is Marxism or Communism still a threat" maybe it was even yours- the conclusion was that it is.

Belly said 2- In reality the very right, Chins, wealthy powerful men buying influence, are the real dangers to the world.

Answer 2- Yes there are some groups of wealthy power on the side of economic liberalism (free marketeers- what you would call right). But there are a growing number of the wealthy powerful on the side of cultural liberalism (what you would call left) including Jeff Bezos, Eric Schmidt, Tim Cook- even Bill Gates and Warren Buffet and George Soros appear to have moved to the left politically. There is a push for globalism that is common to communism and the two-stage communist theory. Correlation doesn't imply causation so you'll have to follow the bouncing ball to your own conclusions Belly. I find reading source materials and reviews of these illuminating. If you just read the news you will be subject to the same post modern revisionist Orwellian memory hole issue that Winston Smith faced. Some of the conclusions that you reach when reading challenging material are very confrontational- but well worth the effort- they won't always make you change you views but they will always help you see things in a new light.

Belly said 3 (Belly, Saturday, 16 March 2019 10:57:31 AM)- This proudly progressive centrist refuses to fear shadows

Answer 3- The problem with moderates is they are easily influenced by the communists- so effectively they become communist even if they don't name it so. As Einstein said in order to understand a phenomena it's necessary to go deeper than the phenomena itself

To Belly- I've just noticed in your posts you seem to have a "spacial visual" psychology- there's nothing wrong with that. For this type of personality it's perhaps necessary to translate the verbal or written into pictures to interpret them. When people with such a psychology read I suggest reading a text many times picking up textual cues to build up a picture by drawing an explosion diagram between the related concepts. There are many little tricks to digest written material- I'm not an expert

CM,

Both 'Left' and Right are very broad churches: I would regard both Foxy and myself as being on the Left-of-Centre, but certainly not Communist or Utopian: in our different ways, we've had too much negative experience of that ghastly disaster, plus enough common-sense to learn from history. Anti-Communist Left and pro-democratic, if you like.

And on the Right, I'm sure you would agree that not all right-wingers are as Fascist-Right as Tarrant or Islamists (yes, both are right-wing, both are fascist and perhaps mirror-images of each other, feeding off each other, in a grotesque way working together).

In this particular case, a Right-wing terrorist has murdered at least fifty innocent people. Can you say that without some sort of humming and ha-ing ? "A terrorist murdered at least fifty innocent people."

Yes, Islamist fascists have murdered vast numbers of fellow-Muslims, non-Muslims, Yazidis, Kurds, Copts, other Christians, innocent people by the thousands. But one crime does not justify the other, although fascist-extremists on both sides will happily now use this crime to justify further crimes of their own.

And for god's sake, can people please try to distinguish between immigrants and refugees ? Australia has an immigration policy, a rough quota of 180,000; and a refugee policy, with a quota of roughly twenty thousand. They are not identical. Then, of course, there are legal as well as illegal refugees.

Given the vast numbers of desperate people classed as refuges around the world, nearly seventy million, I'm fully in support of raising the LEGAL refugee quota, but totally opposed to ILLEGAL refugees taking their places, and pushing them down the queue., to wait for years more in some god-forsaken desert camp at the mercy of all manner of criminal gangs.

Joe

Dear Joe,

We're told by political commentators that there's
a white nationalist movement that is spreading
world wide pushing lone-wolf attacks. The live-
streamed massacre of now 50 in New Zealand mosques
underlines the reach of the movement that preaches
imagined "European ideal," rejects immigration,
and shares vicious threats and attacks over the
internet. We have people like Mr Anning that
are examples of this type of thinking as well as
so many on this forum.

It should come as no surprise to anyone considering
the history of this country. The following link
explains:

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/mar/17/australians-are-asking-how-did-we-get-here-well-islamophobia-is-practically-enshrined-as-public-policy

imagined "European ideal," rejects immigration,
Foxy,
Your attempts to misconstrue are becoming just a tad too sickening.
No others have taken in more migrants & refugees than the Europeans in Europe, America & Australia/NZ. They still do although because of some migrants' agenda this is gradually changing but not because of European ideal !
Even your own family is one of invaders to use your own implying when it comes to others. Tell us of one (1) just one single non-European country that has taken in refugees on compassionate grounds.
Just slow down with your hate of Caucasions, will you ?

cont'd ...

Dear Joe,

BTW - I forgot to add that it was me who raised the
topic for discussion on the forum of -

" Is Marxism still a powerful totem of evil in 2019?"

in late December 2018. It got more than 100 responses
and the results as shown from the posts was - yes.

Truth is the two mentioned causes do not truly exist in numbers big enough to win one seat in the lower house
The cost of right wing groups, to our harmony and very way of life is far bigger than both
After Trump falls, and he will, will the extreme right few here see they got it wrong
Not likely we can however hope

Individual,

You obviously are not familiar with debating techniques.
Putting up an argument from a given source -
to try to broaden any discussion is normal in debating.
If you disagree with what's being
presented you're required to provide evidence to
dispute what's being stated.

According to Oxfam International - 23 million people have fled their homes - nearly 84% are hosted by poor countries. The six
wealthiest countries - with the most capacity - host less
than 9% of the world's refugees.

BTW: Which part of Jason Wilson's article that I gave in the
link that I cited do you disagree with - and what evidence
can you provide to disprove his claims?

Just truly read CM post baffling
What ever made me think you are smart
Why the mad rush to the very right you have had
The upcoming election results will underline my views are closer to reality than yours

Foxy,
It is my perception that your post are an insidious undermining.
I will no longer reply to anything you post as I have no intention to give you any more mileage in your attempts to cause division for some crackpot ideology !

Individual,

I would be grateful if you did that.

The feelings are mutual.

individual,

Good decision.

ttbn,
Going though these threads it appears (to me) that some posters are exploiting the innocent ignorance of well meaning people to undermine any good will for no other reason than seeding disharmony for some sinister agenda.
Some people can see through this smoke screen, others simply refuse to look. It goes without saying that there are extremists in each camp but when we face stupid extremists the show takes on a new plot.
Those disgusting & vile who exploit innocent ignorance have already exposed themselves in their eagerness to celebrate. Prematurely I hope but then again it'd be just as premature to hold my breath to see them fail !
Our future is at one of the most momentous pivoting points of all time, let's do whatever can be done humanely to stop the scales from dipping against decency ! Curb PC !
History has shown us what PC can do to humanity when the Nazis used it.

really interesting to read through Tarrant's manifesto. Multiple conclusions will be drawn from it but he blames the rape by a muslim immigrant of an 11 year old school girl in Sweden for tipping him over the edge. He also attributes Candace Owen (must admit I never heard of her) as being very influential. Believe it or not she supported Hilary in the last US election and now supports Trump. She is a black African. He liked the way Owen exposed the 'lying liberal establishment. He seemed to have mixed views on Trump.

runner any defense of the man be little you
Tell me can you ever see a Australia that is not multicultural
One that has no Muslims
How would that be achieved
Remember the names we, yes us, called ww2 refugees?
Is it not true the descendants of those people make up a huge percentage of our current population
Will, in time that not be true about today's migrants
A million plus AUSTRALIANS have made me proud, saying to one silly man we have had enough
Add runner to the great people silently crying because a mad evil man killed people in conversation with their God

Belly

runner any defense of the man be little you
Tell me can you ever see a Australia that is not multicultural
One that has no Muslims How would that be achieved

any defense of the man be little you - never would defend him just like won't defend muslims killing Chritians in Indonesia, Pakistan, Nigeria, Israel etc etc etc

you write
Tell me can you ever see a Australia that is not multicultural

I am very pleased we have people from throughout the world that has contributed to this great nation. This includes Asians, Europeans, Africans, Israelies, Syrians and the list goes on

you write
One that has no Muslims

This can't be achieved. Its to late. To minnimise future terrorist attack we should exclude those who refuse to denounce killing the infidel.

btw I did post my orginal remark on the wrong post.

Well runner moderation in all things, the center is the place voters live
Yes some Islamists are evil
Some in any race are
It will always be my view, faith, all of them, breeds disharmony
NO chance exists, not at all, those who think like this thread intends, that communism is a threat, will ever be mainstream
Far bigger threats exist and extreme right stands as one of the worst

and by the way Belly what has your beloved State Labour leader got against Asians? Its 2019 you know. Hanson got pillared for saying the same thing 25 years ago.

Dear Belly,

Here's a link that explains how some are spreading hatred in
this country and why we need to fight this heinous
influence that affects us all:

http://thecoversation.com/how-believers-in-white-genocide-are-spreading-their-hate-filled-message-in-australia-106605

Imagine just 19 people voted for Anning at the 2016
election. Nineteen. He got into parliament anyway
gaining a $200,000 taxpayer funded salary and a platform
from which to spew his dangerous bile.

Until this week, most of us saw Anning as a troubling but
ultimately inconsequential sideshow doomed to leave the
senate at May's election and fade back into irrelevance.

But his response to the New Zealand mosque massacre confrontation
with an egg-wielding teenager have earned him notoriety around
the world.

cont'd ...

Oops here's the link again:

http://theconversation.com/how-believers-in-white-genocide-are-spreading-their-hate-filled-message-in-australia-106605

Foxy, First, just some house keeping. Do you know that if you highlight and copy the URL at the top of browser page, you can paste it into the post (delete the 's' after 'http' so that Belly can keep up). I've noticed that you make lots of mistakes with your links when it should be so easy.

Now...

Anyone who needs to emphasis Anning's vote as 19 either misunderstands the electoral system or just wants to make apparent points that make no sense....or both. Does pointing out that Debbie O'Neil got 0.07% of the vote yet got elected mean that what she says is invalid?

The conversation article is by someone who is very badly educated about recent and not so recent history. Its by someone who imagines history the way they'd like it to be and then somehow convinces themselves that that is how it actually was. Little wonder that Foxy enjoyed it.

Ethnic violence and conflict is pretty common in other parts of the world- maybe some social libertarians believe we should bring it here to Australia so we can experience and experiment with machete politics.

I guess then Foxy will be happy- or maybe she will just blame someone else- and refuse to take responsibility.

Myself I prefer to live in a more cohesive society of my kin and kith. Where I can favour and preserve my ancient community- and not who I don't. Equal opportunity policy is anti-tradition probably intentionally. Diversity may be novel but not stable- I prefer stability. It may be boring but I don't need others to entertain me.

Every culture needs their own nation. There are too many people in the world.

If policies are implemented (such as diversity or multiculturalism) and bad things result (such as a move "to the right" by the population) is it the fault of the policies or the population.

mhaze,

I have problems with my eyesight.

I''m having an eye-operation in April.

Hopefully it will help.

But Thanks for your concern and advice.

cont'd ...

mhaze,

I wish you would not make assumptions on what I
enjoy. I chose the article because I thought
the subject matter was relevant to recent
events.

The article of the link I cited was part of a
series on race and racism in Australia. Apparently
the series examines this complex and incendiary topic
and the role it plays in contemporary Australia.

The author is a lecturer in Asian Studies at the
University of Tasmania.

Foxy will probably object to this article on a number of grounds. I found it interesting... need to verify some of the facts.

http://australiafirstparty.net/tasmanian-kaz-ross-abc-antifa-media-attack-on-alt-right-presents-an-opportunity/

Foxy hope it is ok have had both eyes done, great results see the alt right is at it again
How can something so wrong be called right?

Canem Malum,

No. Foxy does not object to the link you gave.

As a matter of fact -
You have just proven her point. That there is a
white nationalist movement and what it preaches is there
for all to see.

What you found so "interesting"- comes from a
Jim Saleam who's apparently a convicted criminal
and neo Nazi.

In 1975 photographs
were published of Saleam wearing a swastika armband and
associating with neo-Nazi skin-heads. He's a white
nationalist who has been a strong advocate of barring
further immigration to preserve "predominantly white
nation resistant to ...watering down of its culture.

Sound familiar?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Saleam

Dear Belly,

Good to hear that your eye operation went well.

I'm nervous about mine.

Still it has to be done - I don't have a choice.

Hoping for the best Foxy
Subject is drifting but we do that,bit surprised CM has too, to the very wrong very right

Foxy said-
Canem Malum, No. Foxy does not object to the link you gave. As a matter of fact - You have just proven her point. That there is a
white nationalist movement and what it preaches is there
for all to see. What you found so "interesting"- comes from a
Jim Saleam who's apparently a convicted criminal and neo Nazi. In 1975 photographs were published of Saleam wearing a swastika armband and associating with neo-Nazi skin-heads. He's a white nationalist who has been a strong advocate of barring further immigration to preserve "predominantly white nation resistant to ...watering down of its culture. Sound familiar?

Answer-

I know who Jim Salem is according to the Communists- but I don't know that much apart from that- I understand he has a PhD in politics. Apparently Nelson Mandela spent some time as a convicted criminal too for blowing up things with explosives. Personally I wouldn't go around with Nazi armbands but Prince Harry thought it was a good to go to a party in a Nazi uniform- to me it sort of detracts from what you're trying to achieve. It appears you don't believe that every culture should have their own nation- you'd probably prefer the Dalai Lama to keep quiet about China in Tibet. He says that "Europe should be for the Europeans". I guess you'd consider him a White Nationalist too. Myself I'm proud to stand on the same side as the Dalai Lama- but even if he didn't agree with me I still value the sacrifice that my ancestors made to forge a place for me and my family- do you? I guess you're entitled to your own perspective- as am I. The thing is the Communists and their friends believe that their perspective is the only one that is valid and seek to demonize those with other opinions.

In some ways I sort of agree with the Communists though- they believe I should be in prison- I believe they should be because they are traitors to their own. Hopefully there will come a time when these Communists and other Liberals are put in prison for their hateful violence to our community purely for their own power.

The universities who damage our nation with the education industry for their own profit- the companies that bring in foreign labour to artifically increase supply for their own profit- the unions who turn a blind eye to the damage to the labour force the only reason I can think of is in order to create a Communist Trotskyist Utopia- the media, the Labor Party- the Gay promoters who want to sexualize children and normalize minority views and take away sex education from the parents through initiatives such as Safe Schools- the feminists that want women to become men in effect damaging families and society- etc, etc.

These entities are traitors to Australia and should be treated as any traitor in warfare.

Confucius believed the family was the fundamental unit of society- the Communists perhaps believe that this is what stops individuals from conforming to hegemony.

I suppose Confucius was a Racist Nationalist too

Belly has suggested that I've gone a bit off track with respect to the topic. Fair call. I'll have a think and get back to you on that- hopefully overnight. I've been a little busy.

I'm not sure I agree with this comment but it's been said that "one person's terrorist is another's freedom fighter".

Canem Malum,
this sort of makes me think of people who claim to love freedom whilst they keep birds in a small cage !

CM yes I found you, at first a seemingly bright poster
And you probably are, but too you lurched to the very right sometimes
Consider,are you claiming the New Zealand mass murderer is maybe a freedom fighter?
See give some thought to the future of the webb, if was breaks out we, in all probability, will see it shut down
Right now, as never before, Governments are trying to control it, maybe as they search for radicals they will, in part,stop our freedom to say silly things
Nothing can change the truth, that murderer is a low form of life
Again but worth saying, naming every Muslim a threat is insane as saying every Catholic is a pedophil

Nothing can change the truth, that murderer is a low form of life
Belly,
As are those who caused him to become a murderer !

Jim Saleam's full history of violence, criminal
activities and convictions, being a neo-Nazi,
and his penchant for donning Nazi uniforms has been
covered on the web. It has nothing to do with
communism or finger-pointing at any one else for
his extremist, criminal behaviour. And comparing him to
Nelson Madela, or Prince Harry's actions is absurd.

Also suggesting that any one would find the Dalai
Lama to be a "white nationalist" is equally repugnant.

We've all heard the Australian "us" and "them" views.
That the Australian "us" was disappearing in a
"tidal wave of immigration" that was sweeping away our
national identity. We've heard the arguments that Australian
culture was white, English speaking and opposed to
multiculturalism and every conceivable migrant community.

We've heard these lurid tales of an implicitly white
Australia under demographic attack and also of the
blaming of " äctivists, academics, and politicians" for
impposing multiculturalism on an unwilling populace.

Nothing more needs to be said really - it's all the fault
of the communists, socialists, leftists, et al.

We must remain vigilant against these "evil" forces.
All of us that are white and British that is.

Bring on the election!

Should hunch my shoulders tuck my head in and keep walking
But not taking indy on, after such a post, is gutless
That murdering thing, like every terrorist, has a brain
He no one else, is responsible for his actions
Look at your post indy, it could be said just about anyone, including his victims, are to blame
The cost of right wing blind extremism should be talked about
Many will die because this act took place
Hate breeds hate

The cost of right wing blind extremism should be talked about
Belly,
That's your most hypocritical post to-date !

This forum is not full of hypocrites.
There's always room for more.
:-)

Foxy said- Also suggesting that any one would find the Dalai
Lama to be a "white nationalist" is equally repugnant.

Answer- I wonder how Foxy would interpret the Dalai Lamas comment "Europe is for the Europeans". To me it indicates that Europe- and the nations within Europe- the France, Germany, British, etc should be for the French, the German, the British stock that had been there for hundreds of years. These are all have white "phenotypes" or physical appearance. This surely means the Dalai Lama believes in the loose and broad concept of "White Nationalism" for Europe. I'm sure he would have a different view if these European stock started occupying Tibet.

Foxy said-

Foxy Comment 1-
We've all heard the Australian "us" and "them" views.
That the Australian "us" was disappearing in a
"tidal wave of immigration" that was sweeping away our
national identity. We've heard the arguments that Australian
culture was white, English speaking and opposed to
multiculturalism and every conceivable migrant community.

Answer 1-

1. Australia did have what is called anecdotally a "white Australia policy" (an explicitly White Australia policy) this was changed due to the views of certain influential people and organisations in the context of the Australian political landscape.

Foxy Comment 2-

We've heard these lurid tales of an implicitly white
Australia under demographic attack and also of the
blaming of " äctivists, academics, and politicians" for
impposing multiculturalism on an unwilling populace.

Answer 2-

Activists, academics, and politicians have advocated and used their political influence for imposing multiculturalism in Australia and more broadly. Both dominant major parties (who represent their own interest groups) advocate multiculturalism (the "Australian Labor Party" more than the Australian "Liberal Party") so this could create an environment where voters feel they can't vote against immigration even if they believe that immigration is not in their self interest. In addition to this those against immigration are labelled as racist and demonized in public forums including the workplace at universities, etc.

Anecdotally and Statistically the demographics of Australia have changed over time- personally I have seen significant changes in the demographics of Australia and the Western World over the last decades especially in certain contexts where dominance of certain groups have grown to greater than 90% over the Traditional population which has declined to under 10% in these segments. One could expect to see a high degree of alienation of Traditional components of these segments.

The Social Libertarian's could argue that this demographic change is not significant or there are counter balancing positive effects of this demographic change. It's well known that in politics you always upset someone- this brings us to political ethics- and the question of "what is responsible use of power"

Mostly the Social Libertarian's seem to shout down other views without even addressing the points raised.

Foxy Comment 3-

Nothing more needs to be said really - it's all the fault
of the communists, socialists, leftists, et al.

Answer 3- Professor Patrick Deneen from Notre Dame University in his historical and research into Classical Locke Liberalism (the father of our form of government in the western world) has compared Liberalism to Traditionalism and Social Liberalism/ Economic Liberalism.

It appears that the powerful have inherited/ colluded/ created a political environment that increases the Liberal nature of the community with every political cycle- and decreases the Traditional nature with every political cycle.

Both Social Liberalists and Communists have certain views in common- it indicates a continuing probable influence of Communism on Social Liberalism- the father (Marcuse) of the New Left (Social Liberalism) developed his ideas based on communist principles.

High Immigration is a Socially Liberal policy. It's seemingly based on the idea that people should be able to live anywhere and in what ever nation they want- "freedom of movement of people". There are corollaries to these principles.

This seemingly contradicts the idea that culture and nation are linked.

So given that the free movement of people is a socially liberal policy and socialists and leftists are supportive of socially liberal policies it seems to follow that primarily the changes to demo

In conclusion- Traditional Conservatism is seen as the political stream- that opposes (Left and Right) Liberalism (blind freedom) that dominates the political landscape in the Western World.

Traditional Conservatives are "against Globalism" and "for Nationalism", against Marxist Communism, against extreme business, against extreme social policies, against progressivism for it's own sake.

Traditional Conservatives tend to believe that we can only protect "our own piece of the world" maybe through this we can set an example for others. We can't save the world. We wouldn't want to impose our will on it anyway. They have a right to create (or destroy) their own communities in their own nations just as we do

The Dalai Lama has made controversial comments
about refugees in the past. They need to be taken
in context. He's a refugee himself. He led thousands of
followers from Tibet to India in 1959 after the Tibetans
protested against Chinese limits on their autonomy. This
83+ year old continues to live in exile in northern India
today. His comments are understandable - concerning the
loss of his own country.

The Dalai Lama was speaking at a conference in Malmo, Sweden.
He also added "Receive them, help them, educate them ..."
He was speaking in the aftermath of a divisive election in
Sweden in which a far-right party, Swedish democrats, made electoral gains although they were beaten by the country's
centre-left coalition.

He also said that Europe was morally responsible for helping "a refugee really facing danger against their life."

Context is important.

The White Australia Policy - formerly - Immigration
Restriction Act of 1901 - was the government policy
that effectively stopped all non-European immigration
into the country and that contributed to the development of
a racially insulated white society. It remained a
fundamental government policy into the mid 20th century.

Abraham Lincoln stated on the subject of conservatism -

" Ïs it not adherence to the old and tried, against the
new and untried?"

Tradition is a cuddly word that has often been used to
soften concepts of prejudice and discrimination. Things
like the "traditional"view that white people are
naturally superior to black, et al. And there are many
other "traditions."

Just because in this country a few people still subscribe
to a certain view under the umbrella of "tradition" and
"conservatism" does not mean that these views are
acceptable to the vast majority in this country.

The soaring rates of hate crimes that we see around the
world and recently in New Zealand - things cannot continue
according to the outmoded "traditions" that are no longer
acceptable in the 21st century.

cont'd ...

Benjamin T. Jones argues in his article that the
dictation test was undoubtedly political spin to
justify a racist agenda. A century later, similar
charges have been levelled at the " stopping deaths
at sea" defence, which is used to justify the
current harsh treatment of pre-dominantly non-white
asylum seekers.

As a policy white Australia is gone. But as an
ideology it arguably lingers on.

There certainly is a minority who want to reclaim an
imagined idyllic Australia of yesteryear with its
white monoculture.

An overwhelming majority, however, agree with our
Prime Minster and most MPs - multiculturalism is
her to stay.

Get used to it.

Before I leave this discussion (for me it's now run its
course) I'd just like to add this small offering:

" We can discuss the Dalai Lama
And the flaws of Barack Obama
We can dissect the many sages
Locke, Marcuse, and Hobbes for ages

We can inspect the ammunition
By Hanson, Anning, and Bernardi's ambition
So many topics are ours to explore
From the past, the present, the future, and more

But one thing is clear from this paraphernalia
That's the love we all have
For this brown land
Australia!"

Foxy wrote a poem- thanks.

Everyone enjoys a good poem.

I found the thread to be a fantasy, knowing no current threat from any communist or socialist country exists
Too find it to be Trump like in its effort to manufacture a problem that no longer exists
Some of us fall for overstated or pure lies, hence the Trump Presidency
Ignoring the very real threat, far right extremism.
And Trumps supporters ability to turn common sense on its head, create non existent threats to support non existent saviors,is dangerous

Maybe we should stop with pie in the sky BS.

Q: Why do we have African gangs and Syrian refugees?
A: Because Israel initiated a civil war in Sudan to divide the country in 2011, and was part of the coalition of forces intent on removing Assad with the help of US trained IS proxies from 2012.

Here's a clip of our favourite screws-loose socialist.
- Alexandria Ocrazio Cortez -

http://youtu.be/a01LaYnPQwQ

It's the funniest thing I saw today so far...

Armchair Critic- Thanks for your posts. They're always interesting. Obama became US President in November 2012.

Hey Canem Malum,

"Obama became US President in November 2012."

- Correction -

Obama was re-elected as US President for a second term in November 2012.

Armchair Critic- Of course. Sorry about my memory and incorrect fact checking. With respect I need to look into the history of Sudan a bit more. But I suspect there are pressures building in Africa with population growth and then a hair trigger will set a new round of violence induced refugees. When the UN Refugee Convention was created the refugees were from Europe and were after the First and Second World Wars- these refugees seem to have occurred for perhaps subtly difference reasons. Looking back and comparing with Africa's situation now perhaps the reasons for the World War's could have been partially related to the dynamics of population growth in Europe. You're probably a better person to comment on this than I.

Hey Canem Malum,
"Sorry about my memory and incorrect fact checking."
Don't worry about it, I'm guessing you probably knew Obama was elected in 2008 but you made your comment without thinking about it and messed it up.
- It was an honest mistake and I'm sure we all do it every now and again.
I hope it didn't seem like I was nitpicking correcting you.

It was too obvious an error not to point out.
I thought if someone doesn't point this one out we'll all look like dills...

The reason for my comment re Sudan is because of a video I watched here, you'll hear it mentioned about 50 seconds into the video.
I don't know the truth of it actually, as I haven't yet looked at it in-depth, but I will at some point.
http://youtu.be/LYvW2Em1uLs

Posted by Bazz, Monday, 25 March 2019 2:15:47 PM

Canem, try his parliamentary web site. It should still be there.
My impression of it was it very badly timed.
If he had said it as late as now it would not have had the same
reaction. It was not all that out of line with much that has been said
many times without causing such a reaction.

Answer- I think Fraser Anning believes that addressing the underlying cause of the issue now is the best way of preventing it in the future.

Mr Anning made his comments in the context of "lives
that have been lost" in a dark chapter in Australian
and New Zealand society.

Sorry for taking so long to reply here... I had written more... but this is what I've got...

Sorry Foxy I can't see the difference between the Dalai Lama and White Australia Policy based on your "argument".

I guess Communists and Socialists consider all wars to be based on racism. Most nations and organisations and cultures are aquisitive this isn't unique to the White British (includes the Communists and Socialists). But there are many racially insulated societies that have good relations with their neighbours.

Though most societies have issues- Socialism and Communism have some of the worst issues.

Socialism and Communism amongst others seem to use "massive passive aggression" as a form of power.

One view is that immigration is a form of invasion. The view of some is that law prevents immigration becoming invasion- I'm not so sure. I'm not sure that the Social Libertarian's would care if immigration was an invasion.

Gene's are like hardware- the mind is like software- both hardware and software are important for the development of a healthy person. The community is an extension of an individuals identity and is also important for the individuals health- if the community is alien and hostile the individual will become alienated and victimised.

Any warfare or invasion require boots on the ground to occupy territory.

As Sun Tzu says you confront your enemy with conventional tactics but win by deception. This seems to be the basis of ambush.

Our Prime Minister Scott Morrison is just trying to get through the election without rocking the boat- Economic Liberals which make up most of the Australian Liberal Party are generally ok with immigration as it increases the supply of workers effectively keeping wages low- as I've said previously- but it doesn't benefit the majority of Australian's especially the Traditional population. For the Indian Scab Workers on lower wages it does- that doesn't mean that I support the tactics of the unions either in many cases- they appear to have adopted Trotskyist Permanent Revolution tactics such as Rolling Strikes

The situation with Simon Crean was interesting how he changed the voting power of the unions within the Labor party but this seems to have perhaps opened the door to the Trotskyists- just proves there is no vacuum in politics. The unions though membership has been declining for many years appears but after the vote change became a shadow of their former selves.

Alexander of Macedon invaded Persia to create peace and perhaps bring intellectualism. Maybe he did, maybe he didn't.
I wonder what the Persian's thought about the idea of "getting used to it"- where are they today?

Joseph Nye talked of the difference between hard and soft power- and setting an example. I'm not sure that replacing White British with Indian's will achieve that.

Nate Silver on the other hand says that racism is inversely corelated with education and proximity to other races- this may or may not be true- I think that the statistical effect may be more complex than he is letting on- it could be the Facebook effect. I suspect that proximity to Nate Silver can be corelated with intelligence but not in the way in which he would prefer.

Personally I wouldn't care whether white people are naturally superior to black or not- the White British People are my people- that's what matters.

What is acceptable is fashionable and cyclical.

I'm not a big fan of Abraham Lincoln- but at least he supported the White South to get on with life after the civil war.

The boats issue is probably related to the issue of managing large numbers of mobile refugee populations. You must manage your borders but Communists want World Communism.

Politics seems often to proceed on the basis of FUD induced in a dosile population. As Liz Coleman says genuine Liberal Arts Education (the art of learning to be free) "no longer exists". People with Liberal Arts Education shouldn't finish with a belief in Liberalism but Conservative Traditionalism because learning to be free requires discipline and those that believe in blind freedom don't have it.

Thomas Jefferson Freedom "If a nation expects to be ignorant and free, in a state of civilization, it expects what never was and never will be."

Foxy said "He also said that Europe was morally responsible for helping "a refugee really facing danger against their life.""

Answer- That still leaves a wide scope for interpretation