Dear Joe,

You think that people arriving by boat are not only
"queue jumpers,"but that they have acted unfairly
because they have "jumped the queue"of those wanting
to enter Australia as legal immigrants. Moreover you
have opined that they have used their "superior"
financial circumstances to gain an advantage over
their poorer and equally needy compatriots who are
unable to pay to escape from their poverty, despair,
oppression, and persecution.

Therefore the obvious conclusion we are invited to draw
is that such immoral, unjust behaviour should not only
be punished but also discouraged by ensuring that the
penalties for acting in this way are sufficiently
harsh.

Detention camps, surrounded by high fences topped by
razor wire and coupled with the prospect of indefinite
incarceration go some considerable way to fulfilling
both these criteria.

BTW: The "superior"financial status of some asylum
seekers over others is irrelevant in determining
how they ought to be treated.

Anyway, as I stated to you earlier - you have surprised
me with your opinion. And as you seem to be dealing with
opinions here and not facts - I shall stick with mine.

Dear Foxy,

You assert that, "Therefore the obvious conclusion we are invited to draw is that such immoral, unjust behaviour should not only be punished but also discouraged by ensuring that the penalties for acting in this way are sufficiently harsh."

Your interpretation :) I'm certainly not suggesting anything punitive, I would support the immediate repatriation of such illegal entrants to the country which they have just left, with complete compensation (well, up to ten thousand dollars) for their inconvenience, and advice to fill out the proper forms and wait like everybody else, with their record of trying to get into Australia illegally officially erased, no penalty applying.

I'm amazed at the heartlessness of people who can hear about people spending decades in desert camps, and feel no compassion for them. Very disappointing.

Love nonetheless,

Joe

Foxy and Belly,
You both are fond of quoting on 'facts' and 'truth'.

Surprizing that you quote this bloke Tickner.

Was it not him who was promoting the womens funny business episode in SA some years back. A scandal worth remembering for Labor. No facts and no truth! Joe may remember it well.

The official word from the Dept is that "Except for some New Zelanders, all non citizens require a valid visa to enter Australia". Looks like Tickner might still be promoting funny business.

HenryL.,

Yes, Tickner was appointed in 1990 as Minister for
Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Affairs under the
Keating Government. He was involved in the Hindmarsh
Island Bridge controversy which involved the clash of
Indigenous Australians religious beliefs and property
rights. He lost his seat in 1996 as a result of this
controversy and partly also due to the unpopularity of
the Keating Government at the time.

BTW - Asylum seekers are not required to have visas.
Google this information for yourself.

Dear Joe,

You sre suggesting punitive measures if you support
the immediate repatriation of "ïllegal" entrants
to the country thay have just left. They fled for very
good reasons. Choosing to take a chance on the high
seas in the remote hope that Australia may be prepared
to help them speaks volumes about the terrible conditions
in which they have been forced to live. Even if they
have not adhered to some imaginary queue, a compassionate
country would not promulgate even harsher laws to keep
them out.

The arguments against allowing asylum seekers who travel
to Australia by clandestine means the opportunity to take
up residence in Australia are weak. They are not illegal
immigrants and compassion obliges us to provide them
with assistance. The Western world has to accept a
large measure of responsibility for the conditions in which
refugees and asylum seekers find themselves. "Queue
jumping"(there is no queue) can be justified in cases of
need and is not immoral nor need it be considered illegal
if we are mindful of the spirit of the law to which
Australia has signed up.

BTW: No one has stated about feeling no compassion for
people spending decades in desert camps. Do not put words
into my mouth.

Dear Foxy,

I suppose I had Indonesia in mind, certainly not the dreadful regimes that they might have initially fled from. Like refugee camps elsewhere in the world, those in Indonesia may not be particularly comfortable but neither are they particularly dangerous for any refugees, except those from Papua.

People there can fill out the standard forms for legal entry into Australia, join the queue and take their turn. Whether they have ten thousand dollars, or can get it out of their friends and relations, shouldn't count: they take their turn, behind those who applied ten years ago, and fifteen years ago, and probably twenty years ago. And no, no penalties if they HAVE tried to get here by boat.

By the way, is it envisaged that - if, under Labour, illegal entrants are automatically approved - are they part of the annual refugee quota, or over and above it ? If they are part of the quota, I suppose those who have already applied, perhaps many years ago, can keep waiting.

Love,

Joe