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The Forum > General Discussion > Do Governments always tell us every thing

Do Governments always tell us every thing

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Dear Belly,

We need to ask ourselves - to what extent do
ordinary voters get actively involved in the
political process? Most people I suspect
take little active part in politics.
Polls have shown that only a small percentage of
the population belong to a political organisation,
and even less have ever contacted a local, state
or national office on any political matter.

As we know political power is exercised by small elites
and the nature of the elites varies from one party to
another. They're influenced by their own self-interests
and those of powerful vested interests - therefore
of course the public is not always informed.
Posted by Foxy, Tuesday, 29 January 2019 8:27:17 AM
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Foxy you have hit it on the head
My lifelong view is apathy and the quite wrong, they are all the same kills better politicians
No need to aim at one side it clearly is all sides
Some do not even understand their vote goes not to the person they vote for but the next down the list [preferences]
In the end it suits politicians t know many just do not care enough, or know enough to get involved
We however, every now and again, get even those types involved and see such as Howard and Hawk, elected
Obama stands out
Sewing the seeds of miss trust, against the other side become a blood sport and blinds some to policy that is not worth having
Why would governments tell us every thing?
We seem uninterested until it is us who are the victims
Posted by Belly, Tuesday, 29 January 2019 8:47:30 AM
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"Do Governments always tell us every thing"

No. Never have, never will. Knowledge is power and government is all about protecting their power.

BUT the idea that they can keep the really big stuff a secret is fanciful.

One of the few (only?) benefits of the massive expansion of government over the past century is that there are ever greater numbers of people privy to the great secrets of government. The notion that something like proof of alien life would remain a secret is fairy-land.

Such knowledge would be available to multiple governments and therefore many many thousands of people. It would take just one of them to decided to write his name in history by releasing the proof of such a thing. It hasn't happened because there is no such information.

As to the Pearl Harbour conspiracy theories - they are just ahistoric rubbish. Whilst the US government might have missed vital clues, the notion that they knew of the attack and kept it quiet has no evidence and again relies on the nonsensical notion that 100s of people who would have known of such a thing all kept quiet their entire lives.
Its also mixed with a degree of racism. How could it be that mere Japanese could out-smart the US like this? They must have had some white help. Do you notice that there's no conspiracy theory about how the Germans out-smarted the Russians with Barbarossa? Why? Because no one doubts that German's were smart enough to do it. But not so the Japanese. Think about why.
Posted by mhaze, Tuesday, 29 January 2019 1:47:06 PM
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mhaze it will shock you but past questions about governments not informing us include
Did Whitlam know in advance Kerr was going to sack him
Was it a put up job to try to get Labor re elected
Did America, as it surely should have, know Japan was going to attack Peal Harbor
America needed some thing like that to drag its people in to a war they wanted nothing to do with
Yes governments lie, do not tell us every thing, we empower them, because we fail to demand an end to it
I would put more current questions but want the thread to not become a verbal warfare one
Posted by Belly, Tuesday, 29 January 2019 3:32:18 PM
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Did Whitlam know in advance Kerr was going to sack him...

No

Was it a put up job to try to get Labor re elected....

No

Did America, as it surely should have, know Japan was going to attack Peal Harbor....

No

Zero evidence for any of those claims
Posted by mhaze, Tuesday, 29 January 2019 4:46:02 PM
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Did America know about the possibility of a Japanese attack on Pearl Harbour?

Yes; see the papers written by General Billy Mitchel and this article (one of many),

"In 1924 General Pershing, perhaps to keep Mitchell out of harm’s way, sent him out on an inspection tour of the Pacific. In his notes of that tour, later reduced to a 323 page report, Mitchell took a look at the weakness of the US in the Pacific and the rising power of Japan. He predicted war between Japan and the US, and a Japanese strike on Pearl Harbor and Clark Field in the Philippines:

“Japan knows full well that the United States will probably enter the next war with the methods and weapons of the former war…It also knows full well that the defense of the Hawaiian group is based on the island of Oahu and not on the defense of the whole group.”

*

“The Japanese bombardment, (would be) 100 (air) ships organized into four squadrons of 25 (air) ships each. The objectives for attack are:

Ford Island, airdrome, hangers, storehouses and ammunition dumps;

Navy fuel oil tanks;

Water supply of Honolulu;

Water supply of Schofield;

Schofield Barracks airdrome and troop establishments;

Naval submarine station;

City and wharves of Honolulu.”

“Attack will be launched as follows: bombardment, attack to be made on Ford Island at 7:30 a.m."
http://www.the-american-catholic.com/2016/12/06/billy-mitchell-predicts-pearl-harbor-attack-in-1924/

General Mitchell was out on the timing by 18 minutes and there was no bombardment just an all-out attack, technology had moved on since Mitchell wrote his report.

"The attack commenced at 7:48 a.m. Hawaiian Time (18:18 GMT).[nb 3][16] The base was attacked by 353[17] Imperial Japanese aircraft (including fighters, level and dive bombers, and torpedo bombers) in two waves, launched from six aircraft carriers."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attack_on_Pearl_Harbor

Coincidentally the vital US Aircraft Carriers, which played an important part in the defeat of Japan, were at sea.
Posted by Is Mise, Tuesday, 29 January 2019 5:18:56 PM
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