If the Government dumped the whole Carbon Tax/ Emissions Trading Scheme and invested in my long term "solar revolution" plan, I believe Australia would be better served economically, ( By far less impact on industries and jobs. ), and the environment would benefit by the eventual shut down of the coal fired power generators that would no longer be necessary. You can check out the rough outline of my plan at www.voteforsanegovernment.com in the "Environment" page. I don't think the government would be very interested though. The plan is too long term to score them any votes in the short term and that seems to be more important to them than actually doing something to benefit Australia and the Australian people.

I had my panels installed yesterday.
More than, under the present rules, is viable.
And yes governments could *CONTRIBUTE* to c;leaner air by cutting tax, on supply and installation.
Some will never get the benefits, renters and pensioners are only some who will not get them.
It is wrong in my view for any one to profit , other than reduced bills.
They make their profits from those who can not get in to the system, power should cost every one the same rate.
However clean energy must not sponsor polluting industry,s.
Leaving the polluters to continue bad practice is no answer.
America, Europe, in part China, all are imposing a cost to pollute because not to, stops/changes, nothing.

Excellent stuff turtletimtam.

All you have to do now is convince the sun to shine at night.

It’s not easy living in an alternate universe but you could always sit very quietly and try to attract a worm hole to take you home.

Belly,

<< America, Europe, in part China, all are imposing a cost to pollute because not to, stops/changes, nothing >>.

I don’t think the USA is doing anything of the sort? The State of California is going statewide with its scheme this month but that’s it. Obama has failed twice to get his ETS up but the reps won’t pass it. In any event USA needs the EPA to legislate; they can’t do that until they face the Supreme Court Litigation Hold Notices pending over the EPA’s decision to declare CO2 a “pollutant”.

As for the EU their trading system has collapsed, their certificates are now declared “Junk Bond Status”, the USA’s trading system closed in December 2011 and there is no Kyoto replacement for global cap and trade. Neither the USA or China will ever sign any global cap and trade.

As for China, like some other developing countries, they are exporters to the developed world. The seven (manufacturing) state pilots in China at $1 per ton are to protect China’s exports and to counter any potential market lockout or disadvantage. For those who seek solace in China’s actions you need to understand that China has to drive growth, trading, industrialization, low labor and low energy cost bases and will not give up fossil fuel based energy, but you can always do what you always do, toss out reality, dream on and try to keep the great lies alive.

You over simplify everything so that you can offer your simplistic solutions. After that you need to research and actually think for yourself

spindoc,

The Reps won't pass it because they're head-stuck-in-the-sand climate deniers who are beholden to big business and big oil....and busily trying to dream up ways to shut up climate scientists.

China is going ahead with pilot schemes, so at least a mechanism is in place.

http://www.businessspectator.com.au/article/2013/6/18/policy-politics/chinas-ets-takes

What's this from Tony?

http://watchingthedeniers.wordpress.com/2013/04/25/how-tony-abbott-killed-the-australian-climate-sceptic-movement-and-schooled-them-in-realpolitik/

I don't believe charging/taxing industries for the pollution or carbon emissions they produce will reduce their emissions/pollution at all. The industries will simply pass the cost on to the consumer, (us), and continue as they are. If the Government tries to make them change their manufacturing processes to pollute less the business' will threaten to, or will, simply shut up shop and move to a country that has a more tolerant Government. Our Government will back down rather than lose an industry and Australian jobs. I believe my "solar revolution" idea has a better chance of reducing emissions/pollution. Check it out at www.voteforsanegovernment.com in the "Environment" page and tell others about it. Spread the idea.

turtletimtam,

Emissions have dropped since the introduction of the carbon tax.

http://www.smh.com.au/data-point/carbon-tax-contributes-to-emissions-drop-20121017-27rl6.html

http://www.theage.com.au/business/carbon-economy/power-use-down-since-carbon-tax-20130708-2pmcz.html

turtletimtam, any tax on emissions, charged to generators will never be anything other than a permit to pollute.

As for goimg solar, are you suggesting we stop burning coal, or are you suggesting we also stop digging it up.

Now if you say the latter, then where are the replacement jobs going to come from?

Furthermore, the likes of China and India will simply find another seller.

You should also remember that we as a nation only produce about 2% of world emmisioms, in other words, if we totally stops producing carbon, it would hardly be noticed.

All the hair brained schemes in the world may sound great, but there's more to consider than just emmisioms.

Poirot,

First, yes.
Second, yes.
Third, no, not from Tony. What made you think it was?

spindoc,

Oh sorry, Greg Hunt is not representing Tony...eh?

Well I kinda thought he was, according to articles like this:

http://joannenova.com.au/2013/04/australian-conservatives-going-labor-lite-pandering-to-the-green-vote-or-just-confused/

"Tony Abbott has a plan to try to convince China and the US to sign up for the “global climate change deal.”"

(Interesting to note that if one tries to access the original Business Spectator article, one gets a page not found.)

But I understand, if the LNP don't really know which way to go policy-wise.

As to stopping mining coal, eventually there will be none left so we'll lose those jobs anyway. If we invest heavily in my "solar revolution" idea we will need more workers in solar panel manufacturing and installation. We have to get overseas workers to fill our employment needs already, couldn't the miners who lose their jobs as we faze out coal mining fill some of those positions? Also, I know that world wide Australia is a small polluter, but if we set the example and show that solar power is a viable option by being the first country to "go solar" maybe the other countries will try it too. Someone has to bite the bullet and go first, why not us? If nobody is willing to set the standard we will all suffer in the long run.

As to stopping mining coal, eventually there will be none left
Turtletimtam,
Same goes for oil. Once that comes to a trickle they won't be able to manufacture your Solar equipment either, which might be a good thing because manufacturing that gear is extremely polluting.

carbontax=revenue raising..
but its for the money marketeers,..>>>the money environment.

true action is by REDUCE*..consumption..not the guilt laden buzzwurds

im reminded that the *ice age..was only 2 degree's cooler than now

so lets go for 3 degree cooler eh?:

does solar inputs go per kilowatt?
kill what for watt?

or goes it via money values?
i expect its the money values*