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The Forum > General Discussion > West Papua and Bob Carr's deception

West Papua and Bob Carr's deception

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Should Australia do anything about West Papua?
Should we trust Bob Carr ?
Has the Indonesian occupation of West Papua been adversely affecting Australian health, and has it been adversely affecting the prosperity of our region for fifty years?

West Papua is a victim of the United Nations. The US in 1962 coerced Holland and Indonesia to sign an agreement for UN administration of West Papua, which can be done if the General Assembly approves an agreement under Chapter XII of the Charter of the United Nations to subject a colony to the Trusteeship System. Secretary General U Thant added the "New York Agreement" to the agenda of the General Assembly where Australia and 88 others approved the UN administration in resolution 1752 (XVII); _but_ he did not add resolution 1752 to the agenda of the Trusteeship Council.

So for 51 years the Trusteeship Council has not been "officially" told about resolution 1752 (XVII), and so the UN has not been monitoring conditions inside the UN colony as required by articles 87 and 88 of the UN Charter.

Australia at any time can add resolution 1752 (XVII) to the UN Trusteeship Council agenda; and likely the Council would ask the International Court of Justice (ICJ) to give advice on the legal status of West Papua, which would allow the UN to be neutral as it begins asking Indonesia questions about it's administration of the colony on behalf of the United Nations.

But Bob Carr says otherwise, at the Senate Estimates hearing on 5 June Bob Carr accused Australians who rise the Morning Star flag of West Papua of playing a "cruel deceit by self-indulgent people safe in their own beds, safe in a democracy". He said only he and not other Australians should rise questions about West Papua, and that he accepts "Indonesian sovereignty over the territories as a matter of international law." Whose telling the truth, Bob Carr or resolution 1752 (XVII)?
Posted by Daeron, Thursday, 20 June 2013 12:31:21 PM
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You need to remember Australia is a puppet to America for most things.
Posted by Philip S, Thursday, 20 June 2013 2:12:04 PM
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Bob Carr is a friend of Henry Kissenger who is a Globalist and supporter of Agenda 21.The Macquarie Bank made Bob an offer he could not refuse.

I think our Western De-mockracy is rotten to the core.
Posted by Arjay, Thursday, 20 June 2013 5:13:48 PM
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Has the Indonesian occupation of West Papua been adversely affecting Australian health
Daeron,
Has the British occupation of Australia been adversely affecting indigenous Australian health ?
Posted by individual, Thursday, 20 June 2013 6:29:16 PM
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Interesting question. I dug around before replying and listened to an interview with Bob Carr here: http://www.radioaustralia.net.au/international/radio/program/pacific-beat/west-papua-backers-raising-false-hopes-carr/1142390

I can't find where he indicates that he and only he should raise questions - did I miss it in the interview or is it elsewhere?

It smacks of the same sort of arrogance I see in Bob Carr that sickens me. Has he forgotten that he is unelected? We didn't choose him as our representative (yes, enough chose Labor on the Senate ticket for the Laborites to impose whatever sort of person they want on us), so I certainly don't accept any assertion that he has a right to speak on behalf of me.
Posted by Otokonoko, Thursday, 20 June 2013 10:11:44 PM
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'individual' asked "Has the British occupation of Australia been adversely affecting indigenous Australian health ?"

The British occupation in the 18th century probably killed 90% of the indigenous people with small-pox and other diseases; the Indonesian occupation of West Papua has afflicted the wild boar population with tapeworms and other parasites, Indonesia introduced HIV/AIDS via infected prostitutes, its health system has produced resistant forms of TB, and Indonesia has killed hundreds of thousands of people during its efforts to repress their calls for self-determination.

Flying foxes and other animals are transporting diseases across the border to PNG and to the Australian mainland.

So yes I would say Indonesian occupation has been and would continue to be bad news for Australia if it is allowed to continued instead of adding resolution 1752 (XVII) to the agenda of the Trusteeship Council so that the de-colonization process resumes.
Posted by Daeron, Thursday, 20 June 2013 10:31:58 PM
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Good question asked by Otokonoko who did not catch one of the self-righteous claims by Bob Carr. It is in his first response to Senator Natale when Carr warns Natale not to "arrogate" his position:

"That is our policy. It is the Australian government policy, so do not attempt to arrogate it. It is the Australian government policy to pursue human rights issues in Papua."
Posted by Daeron, Thursday, 20 June 2013 10:44:19 PM
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Carr has proved himself an incompetent arrogant fool in every thing he has ever touched, & his performance as foreign minister is yet another proof of his inability to ever get anything right.

I can't imagine you getting any interest from the current government in this, there can't be any votes to buy by taking it up as an issue.

The next government is most unlikely to be interested, they will want Indonesian cooperation on boat people as a first objective. Failing cooperation, they will be in too much conflict with them over the boats, to want another area of argument.
Posted by Hasbeen, Thursday, 20 June 2013 11:50:51 PM
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I have no idea how many West Papuans come into Australia every day & spread decease but there are many from Papua Niugini who visit on a just about daily basis on the northern islands. I have spoken with a West Papuan who said he comes down about 3 times a year bringing the odd illegal immigrant. The majority of illegals come via Papua Niugini. Normal traditional visitors only visit the islands but at times some of them continue on to Cairns unimpeded & unchecked. I have seen them go past the Customs vessel on their way to the airport & on to Cairns. There's no way of telling who is infected with what. The poor old flying fox hasn't got a chance to get past the sling shots & air rifles.
Posted by individual, Friday, 21 June 2013 7:42:16 AM
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I sign a lot of petitions calling for transparency, accountability and so on from our governments and statutory authorities. Do any of you know how to get a petition going that will tell Carr to do the decent thing and add resolution 1752 (XVII) to the UN Trusteeship Council agenda
Posted by ybgirp, Friday, 21 June 2013 3:51:57 PM
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ybgirp,
You can get your local member to sponsor you to table the petition & you can also address it to your Governor who by constitutional law has to present it to Government.
You only need three people to sign it, state their name & address & tel nr.
Most pollies have pulled the wool over peoples' eyes by telling them to get as many signatures as possible. Total Lie just to not have to act on it.
Posted by individual, Friday, 21 June 2013 6:24:12 PM
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ybgirp,
come to think of it yours is a federal matter so simply address it to the Governor General & he/she has to present it to Parliament
Posted by individual, Saturday, 22 June 2013 9:15:36 AM
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Thanks, Individual.
Posted by ybgirp, Saturday, 22 June 2013 11:33:31 AM
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ybgirp,
You might want to look into how to get the West Papuans off their Beetle Nuts to stop them from going bananas & shooting up Cop shops & Army Posts which inevitably results in retaliation & then the beetle nut brigade wants revenge for the retaliation & so the wheel keeps turning.
Meanwhile only the outsiders make money from the resources because only the outsiders have the means to dig just like here in Australia.
Posted by individual, Saturday, 22 June 2013 11:23:09 PM
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Why the hush about this thread ? Is it perhaps too close to home in every which way ?
Posted by individual, Monday, 24 June 2013 6:35:12 AM
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Thanks very much for the input about petitions, I've not been aware of what the official rules might be in Australia as I've mostly written letters to our politicians and directed petitions towards UN officials. If you can remember where you saw that I'd appreciate hearing, its good to know what the legal and protocol ruling are that are meant to be followed.

Regards the vectors to spread Indonesian disease and pests, human disease would normally spread from WP to PNG and then to the Torres or to the mainland. But other environmental pests can be readily carried by birds, bats. The poor flying fox just seemed the topical vector to mention by name after the recent 60-minutes program about the boy that got scratched by one. I have no idea that disease originated from the one million Indonesian settlers and their livestock, but there's no way to stop spread of Indonesian pests spreading to the rest of the continent if they are allowed to persist in the WP corner.
Posted by Daeron, Monday, 24 June 2013 7:36:42 AM
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Daeron,
No need to go to West Papua if you're looking for unsavoury deceases. Just go along the southern coast of New Guinea & if you get a chance have a couple of days on Daru. Visit the jail while you there if you want to see life at it's poorest. It will be a many years yet before a dent can be made into the health related issues up there. It's mentality that needs improving, money alone will not do anything. Work on superstition related causes first & you might, just might get the proverbial foot in the door. 1.25 million Dollars a day from Australia since 1975 hasn't made the situation any better at all. When the outsiders were in New Guinea things were on the up but since Goaf so generously left them to their superstitions with our money it all went wobbly.
No real difference in the West except a different language.
Posted by individual, Monday, 24 June 2013 7:38:37 PM
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