paleif - nobody's criticising the poem - we're all agreed here that farmers are doing it tough.

I know plenty of people who would be offended by this arbitrary line you have drawn as to who the 'real' farmers are, and who aren't.

Apparently, the only 'real' ones are the ones who fit your idealised farming image. The real farmers I know are practical people who do what it takes to support their families.

I ask you - if a farmer is struggling to pay his debts, and to keep his family supported he establishes a feedlot, would you criticise him? Would you tell him he's not a real farmer? Would you insult him and tell him he should be ashamed?

I'm sorry, but you can't just dismiss arguments put forth and insult people, and try to hold some moral high ground by telling others to be ashamed. I'm looking at the practical issues and doing what I can in the country - no offence, but who are you to tell farmers they aren't 'real' farmers?

You only support them when they fit your agenda. Sure feedlots are unpleasant. But I'm not willing to pass such harsh judgment on farmers (and yes, they are farmers and it's not up to you to tell them otherwise) who are doing what they have to do to support their families in drought.

Reality tends to be a little less black and white than the arbitrary lines you have drawn.

Turnrightleft
Fair Enough OK
Your Question Answered.
No I would try to talk him into creek feeding instead.
If he didnt have the land I would try to get him some at NO cost to him.
If he then said "but that is more labour intensive" to creek feed instead of intensive- I would offer to supply staff for the first year.
We would also introduce him to people very interested in his Free Green Meats.
He would be offered a better price for his stock with a steady chain of supply. This would of course eventually make up for the extra wages - and some. The bottom Line for farmers is a good price at a steady rate.

Later when he was on his feet I would hope he might make a small donation towards helping else in the same way he had been helped.

He may then once happy with these contacts like to go further.
He might like to become a farmer supplier exporter.
If so arrangments could be made to either re-open or establish new abattoirs on his land or close by.

Accreditations infrastructure would be paid by others. He would be encouraged to ask other farmers to get involved.

There of course is a fair bit involved but thats your question answered in brief.

Um ... may I suggest the antagonists share contact details and work together in resolving the real issues - you might even find you have something in common.

This thread is dead for others - let's move on.

Davsav
Hi
Well its no more dead than many others. I agree with you about making contact and getting things going, absolutley.
So I am inviting everybody to email me at info@halakindmeats.com
Any more comments on the schools and contacting Australia All Over?
Any other ideas from others
How about Some old bush poems. I will post a few more in the next week.

http://www.halakindmeats.com/

http://www.freerangefarmers.com/freerange/pigs_vic.html