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Steve,

You disapoint me, you use an intelecutually dishonest arguement, the question the info arguement.

You are very childish.

The character of our elected politicians is a serious issue.

Mr Rudd and his thugs have intimidated threatened abused and blackmailed a journalist and newspaper editor.

I do not accept that behaviour. You may?

Mr Rudd and Brian Burke have been doing deals. The Corruption and Crime Commission will gie us an insight.

Mr Rudd should resign, he should not continue to drag down the reputation of the Great Australian Labor Party.

Nor should you in defending a morrally questionable Mr Rudd.

It demeans you.

.

Perth Guy

If you can provide me any information to back your argument I will stand corrected, but unfortunately you have not been able to quote any corroborating evidence to back your fanciful claims.

Childish? I am many years your senior. (I read from your yahoo rants you are 44) I maintained my rage when the Whitlam Govt. was sacked, I was on the steps of Parliament to hear “nothing will save the Govenor General” I marched against the Vietnam War. A time when you were just out of nappies.

“The character of our elected politicians is a serious issue.” I agree totally.
John Howard-serial liar, Peter Costello-serial liar and architect of work choices, Tony Abbott-serial liar and George Pells inside man, Phillip Ruddock-serial liar and immigration kick back guru, Kevin Andrews-serial liar and The Popes inside man, Ian Macfarlane-serial liar and bag man for the greenhouse mafia, Mark Vaille-I know the Greens get more votes but I am Deputy Dawg. Brendon Nelson-OK USA what crap do you have to sell us, Nick Minchin-tries to be honest, but has a case of foot in mouth (Howard would love to reshuffle him). Helen Coonan-OK Packer and Murdoch what do you want, Warren Truss-Vaille's patsy “Hey warren this trade portfolio is getting a bit hot, want to swap”, Julie Bishop-well WA needed someone, why not a Clayton Utz insider, WA's senior minister is a South Australian. Mal “tough” Brough-why were community services looking after one of his kids? Peter McGauran- OK I was elected a Nat but shucks I love the Liberals. Chris Ellison- Been back to Zimbabwe lately, also known as Chris who?
Almost forgot Malcolm Turnbull- The former General Counsel for Consolidated Press Holdings Limited, the Packer family's media group.

One last chance, some facts. Not I heard this from a mate, not some gossip, not some fanciful hope that the CCC will illegally release a non existant tape.

Perth Guy I have not attacked you personally, but I must admit the odd ad hominem attack is not beyond me, justify your claims with verifiable facts if you can.

perthguynic these pages have always been a forum to debate and to discuss the daily issues in our life.
A free space that is not allowed us in the letters to the editor in a press that no longer values free speech unless it is focused in the direction they want.
I have a habit some do not, I read every post in a thread that interests me often more than twice.
Some post just the opinion they have and while not truly taking the time to read others posts seem to hope others will read theirs.
I have read every thing you ever posted here.
And remain unconvinced you actually believe what you post.
Mate I question that phone tap, I do not believe it exists.
In just days new polls will again show Rudd has Howard under control.
And I too am near twenty years older than you and know first hand what it is like to remain in opposition for years .
Rudd is no old fashioned ALP leader because no old time leader could ever win power, he however is a winner.
I born a socialist am now different and so too is the electorate, we gain nothing by trying to sell ice to Eskimos.
Last weekend I saw Labor fail to win a seat it has always held by 27 votes.
While people have every right to vote as they wish I would hope a vote is not given based on lies or spite.
I do not care that your posts refuse to answer me but remain convinced your posts are not always true.
Are you from the H R Nicol's society? a chance exists that your stated extreme left home is another questionable statement.

Steve Madden, Mr. Rudds father died of Abdominal Sepsis.

This also happened to my Aunt who was in a road accident. The fact that she had a bad internal infection wasnt noticed by the nurses and she wasnt able to speak to tell them. Her relatives could actually smell the infection and had to firmly insist that the nurses check it out before it was picked up.

Its very hard to prove medical negligence in a court room because the medical system closes ranks to protect itself.

The workers themselves are to blame for these new industrial laws. They have failed to stand up for their right to strike when governments or bosses have sacked fellow workers who have been on strike fighting for better conditions.

When the Railway workers(tradesmen) went on strike to get a 38hour week Bjelke Peterson the then Premier of the state stood them down and threatened to sack them. Incidentally the PUBLIC SERVICE (office workers) in the Railway had had a 37hr week for years.

The whole nation should have walked off the job in order to protect the power of the unions when that happened. It was then that the unions lost their right to strike and the workers lost the protective umbrella of the unions. bUT THE WORKERS HAD DEVELOPED A STUFF YOU I'M ALRIGHT jACK attitude because their working conditions faught for by the unions in the past were so good.

I saw the whole nation stop work when I was a girl and workers stood together. The politicians backed down immediately the very next day
and the workers won. I forget what it was over now as I was just a girl but I remember being impressed by the power of the workers to hold sway over the government when they all stood together.

The workers dont understand that before they unionised there was a lot of exploitation by employers. Early last century Grandaddy Rockerfella (yes the same well know mega rich Rockerfella clan) wasnt paying his workers enough to feed and house thier families, so they banded together (unionised to get more wages and better conditions in the mines where they worked).

Rockerfella no doubt backed up by the police and government at the time (Money buys politicians), turned the guns on the workers and shot dead 11 of them. The schock that rippled through the American nation in the aftermath bought about change.

I dont trust either the Labour or the Liberal party these days and in the past have been a swinging voter at times but now I find it hard to vote for anyone.

I have trouble understanding it myself workers do not always want to even be in unions.
But once in trouble they rush to find us, I will try to give my ideas on why it is much as you say.
A union worth being in wins much without a war behind the scenes wages are increased and gains achieved.
That has become the way many unionist want it to continue, you can as an official be called to a new shop and welcomed with a membership card from every worker on site.
But fail to get one to put the hand up and become union delegate[ not legal under Workchoices, they must be worker Representatives].
This is not weakness but it can be fear driven, if you ever meet a boss who tells you quote * why would my blokes want a union? my door is always open I look after them * end quote.
Know deeply and honestly its a toss of the coin if it is true.
No not all bosses are bad most in fact are not but those words often point to a boss who is just about as popular as death!
It is no threat to unions that we must find different ways to service our members.
But it is to find so many who once knew our history back wards who do not think workchoices alone is enough reason to return Labor to office
In relation to union delegates is it not strange if I sat down today with an employer who wanted the union he is in at the table he could do so?
My company delegates could not be called union delegates?
Fair go John Howard!