Today i read a story that headlined 'Racism rife in Finance and IT Hiring'

A list of people from various backgrounds effected "It found that people from India, Sri Lanka, Bangladesh, Pakistan and China were more likely to be victims of racist hiring practices".

I suggest that employers are simply reacting to customers complaints, as I simply cannot understand these people because of their poor English skills.

I have to get my wife to call my service provider as I cannot comprehend what they say at all and often have to simply hang up on some phone calls.

They may think they have good english but if one fails to comprehend it has to be rated as poor.

Mind you there is/was a Scotish detective TV programme where I could only understand abot half the spoken words. Gave that away.

Some people are too quick to make charges of racism.

Banjo quite true
Racism is always wrong.
But so too is the manipulation of truth in the name of Political Correctness.
Such see,s us actually being told to ignore truth and slant our views in favor of pet projects.
Even in sexual matters and religion, we actually SOMETIMES act in the interests of minority's.
You can discriminate if you are a religion, in hiring.
English skills for those talking to us?
Racism?
Beware of and fight forever the PC monster .

I have had dealing with Testra, Citybank, and AUSTAR lately, and I can tell you I almost hung up on all as I found it hard to comprehend thier rep.

It has long been my view that Testra is one of the driving forces behind racisum in this country, with their pushy Indian cold callers annoying most of us at some stage no doubt.

I had a call late one day at my shop, an Indian man. I fobbed him off several times.

In the end, he was a customer complaining about a product, a product that ended up being purchased from another shop, not mine.

The fact is, it took him several calls just to speak to me.

It’s not racism Banjo. It is very important that the likes of Telstra employ people that can be easily understood by their clientele.

Crikey, when you need to call one of the various help lines, you are already feeling pretty damn frustrated. The last thing you need, after going through the service selection process and the inevitable loooong wait, is someone that you can barely comprehend!!

It is quite amazing that the likes of Telstra could have seen fit to employ such people in the first place!

Some of the Indian etc helpline employees are very good. Strong accent but easily understood. But surely they need to ALL be very good!

<< Some people are too quick to make charges of racism. >>

Absolutely. In all sorts of ways.

Agree completely.

I have changed my supplier of a number of products & services after finding myself connected to Indian or Filipino call centers, when I required service. It is an automatic reaction for me, the moment I hear that accent. I am not interested in finding if it is an Oz centre or an offshore centre, I am gone. If someone wants my business they had better make it attractive for me to use them.

If it's good enough for our governments to have foreign language call centre staff, I expect our companies to return the favor.

Yes I have some difficulty understanding some of them, & find some impossible, but a large complaint is jobs. If these companies wish to prosper from my business they had better have their call center in Oz. I am not about to give any business to a company who expects to charge me in Oz money, but not pay Ozzies to do that business.

I am also not too interested in having my details flitting around the world, for any smarty to pick up.

I was a member of the Shell racing team, [a little time ago], & had a pretty close relationship with them. After finding myself connected to an Indian call centre, when I wanted some information, I now use a different brand of fuel.

Call centers may not be the nicest places to work, but better than none, & if companies want to profit by exporting our jobs, they have made a big mistake with me.

no racism
must be systemetic
aimed at eliminating the race

like using depleted uranium...on bombs
to mutate kids[like in palestien]

or like planned
in the waters..near iran
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AF0l5I5ZxdE&feature=g-u-u&context=G2e5babcFUAAAAAAAKAA

its about making
subtil threats
http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2012/01/20/atlanta-jewish-newspaper-advocates-mossad-assassinating-obama-if-iran-gets-nukes/

setting up minds
http://poorrichards-blog.blogspot.com/2012/01/israel-to-give-obama-12-hours-notice-on.html
http://presstv.com/detail/222562.html

sometimes its not even about race
as much as age/type
http://www.uproxx.com/technology/2011/10/pop-didnt-eat-itself-why-piracy-didnt-destroy-the-music-industry/

or say smokers
or dopers

its about using the media..to instil systamised fear or hate
http://www.activistpost.com/2012/01/psychology-of-tyranny-for-philosophy-of.html

using govt
to do ya racist stuff
systamise it...[dont forget peers/press/propaganda]
http://original.antiwar.com/justin/2012/01/19/the-return-of-the-smear-bund/
http://www.goldcore.com/goldcore_blog/greece-iran-and-possibility-qe3-see-gold-and-silver-rise-again

complete disregard/disrespect[systemised]
on the base of race...

even if the same race
http://desertpeace.wordpress.com/2012/01/23/remembering-a-martyred-child/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3L4sk3XOHMA
http://www.presstv.ir/detail/222343.html

keeping the black mail going
on the black male
http://sherriequestioningall.blogspot.com/2012/01/obama-ordered-to-georgia-court-this.html

heck
often its not really race
just an excuse to hate

to make them feel better
by making others feel worthless

or knowing how to shut down complain/disscent/
or simply others speaking up...

race is the least skills based talent
that doggies lay down with other doggies
dont raise the c;evernmess of the dogs..just allows
the fleas..to network..with other fleas..and get new blood

Hi Banjo,

I agree - these foreigners have to learn the lingo:

"Fellow Australians, both old and new.
I'm glad to see yus all here for this important
ceremony. In welcomin' yus on behalf of
Council though, I would stress one point,
important to all of yus who are wanting to be
nationalized. I would urge yus all to learn to
speak English properly. I know that, in my own
particular line, which is plumbin', I often
have the greatest difficulty in understandin'
what some of yus are talking about when you
endeavour to describe what is wrong with your
sinks, baths or cisterns - as the case may be.
Now, this is only one instance of how important
it is for - er - new citizens - to learn to speak
English properly. I mean ter say, if you can say -
"comment tallez vous" in yur own tongue, isn't it
just as easy to say, "How are yus goin'" in English?
So listen to the old Aussies around yer, and in
next to no time yus'll be spoutin' English left,
right and centre just like the best of us."

(Taken from the book, "The Changing Australians:
A Social History").

As a full blown and proud of it Aussie Ocker, I would be in trouble understanding that if we still spoke like that Lexi.
I know how to try very hard to handle people with difficulty being understood, or under standing.
IF I was in Japan Germany, any place, at the end of their phone, would they be racist for not understanding me.
Herald sun today, the day before AUSTRALIA DAY! tells me I am racist!
For haveing the Australian flag on my car! male cow dung!
First some of us are racist, some of those complaining about us are, even if they do not know it racists.
Some just do not know they are.
POLITICAL CORRECTNESS is a tool for minority's to miss use, it is racist to ask that you learn English in an English speaking country.
But not racist for other country's to have the same rules for front line workers.
ok to not learn ,but racist for us to be concerned that some, who have lived here for decades never tried to learn.
Be FAIR DINKUM AUSSIE Some migrants are not saints.

to many are geting Government funding to prove that all white Aussies are racist. You can write the results of these 'research' projects before any research takes place. I am happy to be found guilty by every Government funded waste of money study. Some of the call centre people are the rudiest you will ever come across. Now we see if you have an Aussie flag you are a lot more likely to be racist (unless of course its the indigenous clour). I am sick of this cr- p.

Dear Belly,

As everyone knows, the world is divided into
two categories. Other people and us.

Other people are the problem.

Life can be defined as a long process of putting
up with Other People's irritating habits. Yet I
am constantly amazed at how tolerant even the
most intolerant people are of their own foibles.

The man who detests the way his neighbour sucks
air through his teeth will never be upset by his own
habit of cleaning his ear with the tip of his little
finger in public.

OK. I'll now take my tongue firmly out of my cheek
and get serious:

You say that you're an Aussie "Ocker," and proud of it.
That's great. Australia today is a society of
tremendous diversity and there are many Aussies here
who now call Australia home and are equally as proud
as you are. "We are One and We Are Many ."

We're a happier land than most others.
Perhaps that's due to the fact that no longer does the
world think of Australia as a place where kangaroos
hop down the streets and where the "down under" label is no
longer a label for backwardness. We've become more self-
conscious and self critical and this has forced both our
politicians and the public not only to revise our policies but
also many of our long-held and cherished notions about
ourselves and the rest of the world.

Things are looking up. Most of us no longer think that the
heritage of every Australian is the right to be exactly
the same as everybody else. Terms like "dago," "wog,"
and so on, are considered "outmoded" words that are no
longer acceptable to most people. And we no longer think
that life is only tolerable when we can look down on
someone else.

Migrants are no longer considered as "bloody riff-raff,"
and that's quite a big change.

Lexi,
I see the humour of you first post. Goodonya! But i think you miss the point.

Here we have claims of racism in hiring staff. I contend that other factors may have been considered, including that of the ability to converse clearly in english.

There are many in the nationalities mentioned that do not have good english and i suspect that,instead of blaming themselves for not getting the job, they simply claim racism. As you said, we find others to blame.

It is not racism or dislike of the Scotish that I do not watch that TV program, it is that I cannot understand half of what is said. I watch TV for entertainment not to be constantly trying to work out what is happening, that keeps me 5 minutes behind.

I think when someone starts claiming racism, we should look at other posibilities.

almost right Lexi.

The world is divided into two populations. The Scots and those who wish they were.

Banjo, if you cannae understaun Taggart, yer just a muckle dunderheid.

Then again, Aussies have 'Australian Ears' caused by decades of isolation. They find most non-Aussie accents difficult.

Dear Banjo,

Accents can be difficult for some.

I know from experience. Some Americans
are the worst tolerators of accents -
which is surprising for a country that's
supposed to be a "melting pot," of so many
different cultures. However, I found that
working in Los Angeles - I was forced to
develop an "American" accent pretty quickly
because the locals refused to understand
me. I got called a "limey," and other
endearing names.

I guess its all a question of what you're used to,
and of actually making the effort to listen. Or simply
ask them to speak more slowly - until you get used to
their speech. We do live in a diverse society - and I
guess in a few years time - accents won't be such a
serious problem as we get used to each other.

As for claims of "racism," I would have thought
that those claims would not be taken seriously -
unless there was substantial proof and a case to
answer to.

OK we are racist, ask the Indian students.
But not those Indians who burn foreign Christians to death.
Ask the youth who fly the Lebanese flag from their cars, but not those who burnt ours after tearing it from its RSL pole.
We are human, no more no less bad good ugly live side by side and in equal numbers no matter race or religion.
But tomorrow, we get a chance to? stand side to side with people who came from all over the world and who, for the most part are just as proud of this country as we are.

I've just been reminded of an incident that
happened to me in the library when I was
joining up for membership an elderly Chinese
gentleman.

He asked me to fill out the form
for him and I was happy to help. I began by
asking him for his name. He smiled at me and
said slowly - "NNNNNNG." I looked at him and again
asked, "Your surname please?" Again he replied -
"NNNNNNG." This went on for several minutes.
I thought perhaps he was hard of hearing , so I
raised my voice. He shouted back at me, "NNNNNNNNG."

My colleagues were cracking up behind me. And I
was getting a bit frustrated, thinking what's wrong
with this guy. Does he not understand what I'm
asking?

Finally, his young grandson came up and explained to me
that their surname was, "NG." The poor man had been
trying to pronounce the name for me by stretching it
out - "NNNNNNNNG." The problem wasn't the elderly
gentleman. It was me.

Austin,
You got it in one,Taggart was the name of the show. It should be on SBS with subtitles.

Sorry Lexi, but racism is the first call. For a bloke that opposes high immigration and the ideology of multiculturalism, I can tell you that racism is usually the first thing thrown at me.

Take the Indian students, that Belly mentioned, they were quite happy to brand us as racist when some of them were attacked, even though they knew who the attackers were and the motives for the attacks. Of course the Indian press took it up in a big way. Only later did we learn that it was Lebs in Sydney and Africans in Melbourne mainly and robbery the motive. What really disgusts me is that the police and polys knew the facts but were quite willing to let Aussies be branded as racist.

This and other incidents makes me very wary of the calls of racist.
Like this stupid article in the business section of a major paper.

Most likely they did not get the jobs because of poor english.

Now even more twaddle coming from academia.

Some fool West Australian female professor with an unpronounceable name, has declared her research has proved that people who fly the Oz flag from their car are racists.

Do we really pay these twits to spend time doing this cr4p?

Well, sorry love, you got it all wrong, as usual.

My navy son flew Oz flags from his car a couple of years back. The reason is something more like an Ozzie would do.

He saw the admiral driving around the base in a car with, you guessed it, flags fluttering from each front fender. Deciding he was worth any two admirals, he flew flags 4 flags from his fenders.

Of course he must be racist according to this fool professor, but of course, none of them would have any idea of what motivates a real Ozzie. They never will, while they believe real people have similar motivation to them.

Hasbeen I agree think that fool maybe be the reason the story started.
Be aware PC is driven by such folk often female.
Headlines this morning of the way women are treated even publicly flogged in some country's.
Remember it is from some who come from that back ground we are charged.
Find me ANY COUNTRY that could not be charged in the same way.
I too without reserve, think all party's betray me and my country by not truly considering the nature of refugee/migrants separating them selves in our country and charge many of those doing so with racism.
My home flys flags that is my concern, tomorrow if they want it,I would feed people from any nation on the earth.
But this idiot lady? she and those who think as she can starve.

as i write i see
*..the real adgenda*
[as im listening..to 'world have your say' on bbc]

see its not the world....'having their say'
but individuals..reacting
to the topic
limitation

the topic..is arminian being killed by turk...
and that france has made not recognising..*it a crime

in short its a state..declaring another state..a hate state
[but its real affect is the state...is percicuting individuals!]

for stuff the individual is thinking/saying..
and not that its them..that actually killed

see..there is an adgenda here
with the melting down of the euro
'france',..needs us..to think..[about other things]

but its not all of france..only the govt of france
but the state of turkey...didnt kill any arminians
individual people..[murdering racist blindness]..killed individual people

realise australian's..didnt kill the aborigonals
individual people..killed individual living beings
yet the state...set up the conditions..that led to murder

its not you hating me..or me hating you
that sees the many genocides done
its the fiction of state mate

this issue..is currently saturated in the media
wearing many guises

[like last night it was flags..[on cars..
indicating..lol/via statistical logic...lol[62%]..

indicating...lol..a leaning
towards racist bias..that leads to statism's absolutes
who's fruits end up in genocide...[occasionally]

why..is france just picking on turks
not rawandans...or not the natzies..or not israel

[ie someone has an adgenda..
and abusing the powers of state]

but it wasnt the lable..[zionists..[natzies/turks..]
it was individual weak minded patsies...
simply following orders

or propagandised
into hate...blaming individuals
for the collective acts...of the hate state

generic authorituive hate ACTS
thats..the real threat

not your racist thought
put into your mind..via the media

Gentlemen,

This is getting a little bit much for me.
I prefer to judge people as I find them
on a one to one basis. It's easy to accuse
groups for the behaviour of a few - be they men,
women, Australians, or any other nationality, religion,
or whatever. We expect people to fit into our culture -
yet when Australians go overseas - don 't they tend
to congregate in their own "ghettos" as well? London,
Los Angeles, wherever. Isn't it a ntural thing to do
to want to be with what is familiar to you. With time
that changes as you make friends with the locals.
It also helps if you're made to feel welcome - doesn't it?

Anyway - have fun. I'm out of here.

Lexi while I understand, and you should know I have always admired you, you are getting a bit predictable.
It was your post that fired me up to throw some burly, fish attractant, around my last post.
GEE lighten up!
The whole concept of AUSTRALIAN RACISM is a beat up, that woman, not Representative of ordinary folk.
Likely to be a Green, academic middle to high income, she has no idea about our daily lives.
Yes I would chase her and those like her under the veranda rather than feed them!
Are we to say, every ex pat living here who has his/her national flag on the car window or such as racist?
And have you even been even near little Italy in Sydney?
Italian to its boot straps our flag will fly with pride tomorrow, and 365 days a year we will be welcomed.
Try now Auburn, Granville if you dare here kids burn our flag post it on the net.
Wear their fathers national flag,as an act of war, on such as us.
Yet I do not care,did not bring them in to this other than to say what do you and others want.
Lexi I have not one racist bone in me, forget that junk it is said by racists.
I will always offer help and welcome TO ANY NON Australian.
Until they ,as is the case with every race, as individuals, prove I should not OUG next post for you.

OUG as you know I consider you a mate.
I hope you are well.
And am sorry to say we are drifting apart.
That last post,in a thread that sees me thought of as racist, disturbs me.
It warns me too.
My greatest fear is not education, it is however wrong information and wrong education.
Your post over looked GENOCIDE massive numbers Murdered just because of their Nationality by the Turkish nation.
An event that has been bought up time and again for near a century.
It too has been mirrored in the Balkans, twice at least in my lifetime.
Rwanda too saw it.
France, yes maybe to win some votes, has told the truth.
Turkey has,like Japan, not told GENERATIONS, of its own people what they did.
Japan/Turkey, even today hide MASS MURDER beggar all to do with GFC.
MATE EVERY HUMAN murdered BECAUSE OF RACE HAS A RIGHT FOR history TO BE WRITTEN TELLING THE TRUTH.
Back now to preparations for my racist rant tomorrow.
Flying Aussie/boxing Kangaroo, Southern cross.
Gee I am bad!

belly/quote..""sorry to say..we are drifting apart.""

we wernt ever together ol mate
[but if you really knew me..you would note
i dont talk to people..i dont like..[and heck mate..i like ya]

you allways give a
n opinion..this allows others..*a reply
and thats why were here for...[right>?}

""That last post,..that sees me
thought of..as racist,..disturbs me.""

mate forget negative thoughts
anyone who knows you KNOWS your not a racist
[well except for them greenies and liberals[and the hippies][and smokers]

but heck mate its all opinion

[mate you offerd me cash..
even though..*you hate my smoking
thats a thing hard to forget

""It warns me too.
My greatest fear is not education,
it is..wrong information and wrong education."'

mate we are s..'of one mind''..there
you are well read..[but..mate...simply reading..the official media/party line..

well mate
its not a 'core promise';..[if ya get my meaning]
even in writing...back pedeling..is the art of spin

""You..over-looked GENOCIDE
massive numbers Murdered just because of their Nationality""

no
see mate..thats where histry has lied

its vause they were the wrong people
in a place others didnt want them to be
or have the things...they got..

[genocide is killing any claim..by occupation

[recall abo's ned to show continuety
of traditional practices...and stay on their land..UNBROKEN

see law of posessionm is quite definite
no surviving heirs

terror nulious
empty land

free slaves..to pay off..with pennies
while looting..the land and the peoples assets

MATe..you know..there no no such thing...
as""the Turkish nation.""

[recall the war..[2]...
it was all cut to bits..divid up...
all them arabs/kurds/etc..[divided up that huge arab state]..into smaller divisive chunks..run by dictraiters..and mad men

[with the minority
oppressing the majority]

much like the 3 islands of javanese..lord it over
the hundreds of islands..[l;ol]
collectivly called indonesia

mate colonisation[divide the spoils]

you sen idi amin/pol pot matsatun...etc

""It too has been mirrored..in the Balkans,
twice at least..in my lifetime.
Rwanda too saw it.""

see mate
that is statist based hate
there is no israel palistein turkey iran etc
just lines of oppressors..oppressing the natives

""Flying Aussie/boxing Kangaroo,..Southern cross.""
the two abo flags...the queenslanmd flag ..the union flag
the footy flag/the cricket team/the volly ball team...[its the acceptable face of racism]

""Gee I am bad!"'

yea
lol

me too

at least we know it
we had to learn it..by sounding out the words
[one letter at a time]...

and without knowing
vowels/constants..capitals..?

and the basic rules of eng-lash
[our colonial tongue]...[but the foolish..shall confound the wise]

{cause we dont know different]
not like those educated into serfdumb
too mund numb to care about others..thus caring for us ALL

one god mate
not 20,000 religeons...not
144.000 states
666 regons[nations]..[fiefdoms for the 1%..elites]
looting and plunderring while killing off true unionism..

and union co-ops
union discounts
union insurance

like north korea
china/usa france germany..et al

The Anti-Racists are the real racists !

thats so indiviually silly
it just might be true

i note reformed 'smokers'
and 're-formed'...drunks
are addicted the most..to reviling those..they formerly loved

if you call another strange
before they call you foreign
they just might not notice your foreigner too

there is a lot of mental imbalance
in this tribal loyalty...[i should note]

that kids dont notice these things
and are much more fore-giving

[maybe thats..because]

to their parents
they cant do anything wrong..
and if they do..are quickly forgiven
[thus quickly forgive others...as they have learned
they too were forgiven]

naturally haters breed haters
but loving hating..thats huge

striking..the first blow...
for an implied racist lable..avoidance
is much like any other point..once it is pointed out..anf fo-cussed on

"NNNNNNNNG." The problem wasn't the elderly
gentleman. It was me.
Lexi,
I only just read this. There was no problem in the first place, you made it one. I witness that frequently in remote communities. I won't try to explain why this is so because it is too difficult with only a few words.
Please do look at this as criticism on you personally, it's the furthest thing from my mind.
What I mean re the explanation is that it is just one of those situations where no party is wrong yet one party feels wrong, in your case you. It was the gentleman who should have had the nuance to explain & not leave you first get embarrassed & then feel guilty. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt that he wasn't at all worldly enough to realise he was in another country where names & pronunciation are different.

Belly, you say:

>> that woman, not Representative of ordinary folk. Likely to be a Green, academic middle to high income, she has no idea about our daily lives. <<

How do you know? Do you know anything about her, or the study's findings?
If Tony Abbott was to shoot from the hip (like you have) you would be the first to tell him to do his homework. You haven't.

I was listening to "that woman", that "fool", on the radio explain the research/study's findings while driving on Tuesday. Professor Farida Fozdar certainly did not come accross as anything you (or Hasbeen) have suggested - quite the opposite in fact.

Professor Fozdar said in summary;

"You had flag flyers who were expressing non-racist views, so I wouldn't like people to go away from hearing about this research thinking, 'oh well all people who have flags on their cars are racist'. That's certainly not the finding," she said.

Really Belly, one wonders why you (and others) protest so much, about this particular topic. Perhaps you should just do a Lexie and get 'out of here' too.

Besides, research has shown that those who complain the most (about topics such as this) are more likely to be rascist than not.
Note, that doesn't mean 'all' that complain, but most.

As you yourself has said, lighten up.

bonmot,
Many people have a dislike to others, there's nothing more natural. The anti racists in turn are people who simply can not accept natural facts & do everything in their power to cause destabilisation by trying to stabilise what are natural instincts. There are racists out there but they don't display that side of themselves because they know that it is a natural phenomenon hence not making a point of it because nothing can cure it.

Is racism a state of mind. The foreigners that claim racist taunts, don't understand the Australian lingo. What gets said between friends, calling each other bastards, would not be acceptable to a foreigner.
The Italians were referred to as wogs, that was not acceptable, now they call themselves wogs.

579,
that's called waking up to reality.

We're all thrown curve balls in the form of difficult
people and situations. Of course there are people
who mis-use the system. We all know that. And its
often convenient to blame others on the problems
we face - no matter where we come from.

It almost looks like at times entire cultures can
become hysterical blame sessions.

The point that I was trying to make - and often
it comes out not the way I
intended it to. However, I feel that regarding the issue of
what is racist or not - I guess you'd have to look more
closely at what actually went down, the intent, the context,
et cetera to be able to judge any given situation. Not
knowing all the facts - I can't do that in this case.
I remember working with a Serbian woman who would claim
discrimination at the drop of a hat at work. She was actually
a lazy creature - who misused the system to her advantage -
do not do her work, complained constantly, took heaps of
sick-leave, and was totally abnoxious - spouting the
advantages of communism daily to the rest of us. When we saw her
coming - we'd avoid her like the plague - not because she
was Serbian - but because she was a pain to be around.

Claims of racism need to be investigated thoroughly - before
making judgements - and Banjo could be right - it could be
a whole variety of reasons for why certain people are not
hired.

Back to the point - I prefer to take people on a one to one
basis - I either find them nice decent people - or if not -
and I don't enjoy interacting with them - I prefer to avoid
them. Nothing to do with their colour, race, religion, or whatever.

Dear Belly,

Me predictable? That's new. I've been called a lot of things -
but never predictable simply because I'm still on my own
road to discovery and I certainly don't have the answers to
the big questions in life.

Claims of racism need to be investigated thoroughly
Lexi,
whilst I don't dispute that, personally I'd prefer to ignore all cries of racism & instead I'd advocate investigating discrimination. People would be utterly surprised how many anti racists would be standing in the dock.

Indy:

"The Anti-Racists are the real racists !"

"People would be utterly surprised how many anti racists would be standing in the dock."

To clarify where you are coming from, what exactly do you mean by "anti-rascist"?

Thanks

Indy, is this what you mean?

>> In general, anti-racism is intended to promote an egalitarian society in which people do not face discrimination on the basis of their race, however defined.

By its nature, anti-racism tends to promote the view that racism in a particular society is both pernicious and socially pervasive, and that particular changes in political, economic, and/or social life are required to eliminate it. <<

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-racism

It's ok indy, I think I know what you mean now.

http://www.uws.edu.au/ssap/school_of_social_sciences_and_psychology/research/challenging_racism/introduction

So, if you had your way;

Professor Kevin Dunn,
Associate Professor Jim Forrest, and
Associate Professor Ian Burnley

and all those institutions associated with the project "would be standing in the dock".

A particular 'burn them at the stake fascist approach', but there you go.

@ Bonmot & Co

Far be it for me to talk on behalf of Individual, but I have in my travels detected a very exotic, but far from rare species who style themselves as "anti-racists".

Not sure whether they're from the same phylum as the ones Indy is alluding to ...

The ones I've studied are usually found at the forefront of town hall meetings decrying the evils of racism. And campaigning very loud & long that anything--anything, with even a smidgen of special race-based privilege should be scrapped out, shredded & stomped on.

But, blow me down, as soon they gain acceptance for their ideas -- & a little bit of power-- they go about introducing of a whole series new provisions, giving special rights to special groups, for special reasons--and calling anyone who questions it "RACIST"

binmot,
you're simply wasting time. Go out & live among people whom you help to support & cop resentment for it it. Nothing to technical about that & the nosing around by some academics does nothing. Racism is natural & can't be eliminated. Unless of course you favour genocide. What can be eliminated are the voices of those who are hellbent on dragging it constantly to the surface instead of leaving it alone. By constantly drawing attention to it you merely exacerbating an unfortunate natural attitude that can't be eliminated by legislation. Accept that racism has alway & always will be there & leave it at that. Just remember a cut will not heal if you keep tearing the scab.

Yeah, I've seen/met them too SPQR.

As I've often said, there are extremists on all sides. Sadly, they seem to gravitate to media shock-jock sites - and OLO of course :)

individual

You may not agree with Dunn (albeit he's an 'academic' walking the walk):

>> A careful balance must be sought between acknowledging racism and avoiding the perception that racism is normal and natural.

There are dangers in spreading the opprobrium of racism too widely - it should be characterised as a deviance and threat to public order, not as normative. <<

I agree.

Bonmot,

<< there are extremists on all sides. Sadly, they seem to gravitate to media shock-jock sites - and OLO of course :) >>

Thanks for the tip, I'll do a bit of David Attenboroughing around those sites.

The most idyllic environments for anti-racists I've found have been the ABC & SBS sites. And in those habits far from being an extreme fringe, they are very much mainstream...only stream, even. They seem gravitate to those sites like ruddy flying foxes to a favorite roosting tree.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1V1e20gdtd0&feature=related

Which makes me a bid dubious about your claim that shock-jocks are a good site to find "anti-racists"!

Since I seem to recall one of the most notorious shock jocks was recently shat on by the anti-racist flock --and I don't think we could put it down to him being a casualty of friendly fire.

Bonmot.
The accusation of Racism is always based on opinions not facts.

I personally know one Afro Carribbean/British HR manager who will simply bin any application or CV from an Indian or Asian, he won't hire them under any circumstances.In his particular field, which is highly technical and involves multi million dollar projects with a multi disciplinary team there is no room whatsoever for incompetence or lack of comprehension of English because the company loses money as a result, the idea of a company is to make money.
Today I went to do some follow up work on a project I started before christmas, the client was at the stage where he was getting quotes for floor sanding, he'd had six guys turn up, four of whom were Chinese, none of them could comprehend his requests, nor could they explain what services they offered or what process was involved to gain the particular stain and finish he needed.
How is it reasonable to ask people to lose money or accept sub standard or incorrectly finished work for the sake of feeding economic migrants?
Before you go off on a "Nation Of immigrants" tangent this is not the same as language difficulties between, say Greek and Italian workers and native English speaking clients, anyone will tell you that, if anything European tradesmen are often more skilled and more in step with the latest techniques from the continent than local White workers since all advanced processes are developed there and we still tend to lag behind.

SPQR,
Anti Racist is a code word for anti White, they only see race problems in countries where the majority of people are White.
Anti Racism and merely fighting prejudice and injustice are two different things, Anti Racist activist groups are all anti White hate groups, without exception.
What's interesting is that they are almost always composed of middle class White and secular Jewish people, people of other Races while ostensibly the protected groups are largely excluded from their milieu, hence the double standard, the counter accusation by pro Whites of a hidden motive and coded language.
Non White people are overwhelmingly tolerant of White people, most of them like us and in the vast majority of cases Whites are kindly disposed to them in return.
Anti White hate and the schisms within our own diverse White populations a complex problem that runs deep into our history, it's not easily summed up in a few short paragraphs.
You might like to start delving a bit deeper into the issues and explore the historical context of "Anti Racism" by listening to this series of podcasts, Richard Spencer and Jonathon Bowden are very easy to listen to and understand, plus they have a sense of humour as well.
http://itunes.apple.com/ph/podcast/vanguard-ipod/id493212311

its interesting to note..the pm's media stunt
hasnt rated mention [so far]..under racism

of course mr abbots comments
could well be read..in that light

[as one..who was burned out of the embassy..3 times
by mr howard and his gg..iron bar turkey]..
its easier to see..what really happend

one need look not much further
than this mornings vision..from chanel 9
[that shows..pm and her advisers..plus opposition mini-star]
planning the evac

then..them leaving via the back door
police pushing away one..lone t shirted figure
plus 4 media...

no protester..was ever between pm.;.[and oppo]..
and the get away vehicle...[in fact all concerned and visable
in the vision..is all media pannicing the pm...[and a thug grabbing a bit of her yummie

her face..set into a state of fear..by her security...croper
and further stage managed by public relations

to ensure the oppop richard crainium
didnt get any media air play..out of this stage managed event

anyhow
more as a topic does..or dont form
and we follow the spin...lol..come in spinner

[noting the party hack bloggers
and call-in mob are on to..it

the best..you can do
is learn from it..[the issue of rights..etc is a different issue]

i have personally hosted 5 deligations
where the first people..sent envoys to lobby polititions
and stayed at the embassy...

[an embassy that has nought to do
with local first people]..cause that's not..what embassies do..

does aussie govt rule..over the us embassy
of course not..

the embassy dont belong to local first peoples

its not there..for locals

so when the local...family ripped my museum tent..to shreds
[to help iron bar..and get a nice new stone circle monument
and museum..instal;led..on a dead protest site..

the anti racists..racists first people...
tried to deliver a terra nullious tent..embassy

yes masta'...
stir sir?...yes of course boss/maam

lol

..'pm dragged ashen faced
through the angry mob'...

lol

angry mob
lol..of media throng

heck lok at the vision
not the tone of devision derision
heck the racists got meat...watch them turn up the heat

bah!

Don't you worry OUG, the little lady filling in on the ABC morning session, & their AM program this morning some how managed to blame it on Tony Abbott. With in a few minutes it was all his doing. I wonder what would happen to me, if I waved a spear at the PM, or anyone else.

It seams if someone is not crying for these thugs, & throwing them more money, it is perfectly legitimate for them to riot.

Did you notice how quick the cops were to announce there would be no charges laid. Talk about one law for them, & one for us. The new racist dictate, coloured can do no wrong.

@ Jay "The accusation of Racism is always based on opinions not facts."

The 'defence' of racism is based on opinions (not facts) as well, as you have opined.

There is a certain amount of fallacy in your defence, Jay - imho.

They should be charged Hasbeen.

Typical of your bias though (re ABC) - it's plastered all over the world, on all media, that Abbott's suggestion incited the 'mob'.

I guess indisciminate, disrespectful and insensitive 'sprays' from an Abbott PM is what we should expect, eh?

dear hasbeen there and dun nuthin
if you egsamin the footage...all the groping/pushing/throwing/shoving was done by the police[see we have our own footage]..but you just got the media

and point out to me in the media
where 'we' did anything

it was all security..[that manhandled your pm
and police that manhandled us[in fact pushed us to the pm
[away from the resterant]..towards the pm

[for that matter..whats with a press op..held lol at a resterant
why not these noble volenters recognised at parlement house..or the lodge...[like the real honoured guersts..[1%?]..who vistit her at home later..

not just for snacks
that alone indicates the mindset
of who really is important..and who gets a press oppertuinity[away from their adoring crouds....why not give them crowd recognition..not just a free snack in a rest/stop..rest=eraunt

actually turning tourist trade away
on the biggest day

did you notice..the self rightious
godess of frights...[pm]'s doorstop..reply this day

she has been conned
she is lucky..them that rough handled her
are TRAINED..to get ya on the gound..and shove your right arm over ya left shoulder..in a stress position

[at least the pm didnt get handcuffed...in pain..
by her 'secirity agency' brats[beating up fear..to show her..*how good..*they are]

but hasnuthin
look at those doing..the tripping throwing punching
not many dark fellas..or civil-liens..there..eh what

a sea of black and blue
and one blue swead'e shoe
[she threw at us]

recall bushes shoe thrower?

Bonmot,
Who's defending Racism? In your opinion I'm defending "Racism", you're only saying that because I'm White, anti Racist is a code word for anti White.
There's not one person of quality on this continent who stands "In defence of Racism", are you seriously saying you're frightened of the subaltern Whites, the voiceless, socially disadvantaged "Bogans" who are "too dumb to know any better"?
That's like saying you're frightened by yesterday's display involving the PM.

Words from a statesman or words from someone that doesn't think before he opens his mouth. Not a good example from a would be leader. Why wouldn't anyone be frightened by what happened yesterday, any one of these hooligans may have had a knife or something else.

@ Jay

>> In your opinion I'm defending "Racism", you're only saying that because I'm White <<

Non-sequitur - I wouldn't have a clue whether your white, black or in between (nor you I) but "racism" isn't confined to one colour.

Which leads to another non-sequitur;

>> anti Racist is a code word for anti White. <<

Who says, you ... Jay of Melbourne? Don't bother answering because personally, I'm not into "code words" or trumped-up "conspiracy thingies" - I doubt many here are, except Arjay and a couple of other like minded OLO souls.

Aye, here's the rub:

>> There's not one person of quality on this continent who stands "In defence of Racism" <<

Depends on one's definition of 'quality' (or whether it is 'natural' as some other commenter commented). In any event, your definition is obviously different to mine because I, for one, haven't got a clue what you mean by;

>> the subaltern Whites, the voiceless, socially disadvantaged "Bogans" who are "too dumb to know any better" <<

As for being "frightened by yesterday's display involving the PM."

Let me put it this way;

Tony Abbott displayed yet again his diplomatic and political ineptitude of being a real leader by picking Australia Day (of all days) to stir the proverbial pot.

What Abbott said was just as offensive as someone making antiwar comments on ANZAC Day, or making anti-semetic comments in rememberance of the Holocaust - whatever one's personal beliefs.

Indeed, for a 'leader' who takes photo opportunities "helping" indigenous communities, one would imagine he would have enough nouse and sensitivity not to have made those comments on a day that many aboriginal people don't support as Australia Day, whether you like it or not.

Granted, the 'mob attack' was unacceptable and has done immense damage to their cause, but Abbott's churlish comments were ill-timed, insensitive and bordered on incitement.

Yes Jay, I'm frightened. Frightened of having a man like Tony Abbott lead our country. There's only one thing I'm more frightened of, Jay, of Melbourne - the measure of support he is getting.

Bonmot,
Basically then you're not anti Racist, correct?
I'm criticising anti Racism as a deviant stream of egalitarianism which is neither rational nor reasonable. Anti Racism exceeds the moral boundaries of the egalitarian Left and actually eschews political correctness, I merely point out the hypocrisy of a stream that promotes Genocide of those it identifies as "The White Race" while claiming to be part of a wider egalitarian milieu, they say they are anti Racist, what they are is anti White, anti Racism is a CODE WORD for anti White.

I don't understand why anyone from the Left would be frightened of Tony Abbot.
-He's anti Racist.
-He's pro globalisation.
-He's pro assimilation and pro multiculturalism.
-He supports action on climate change.
Liberalism in this day and age is a variant of Leftist thought, granted it's an obsolete tendency but there's no course of action action of any consequence which you could expect from Gillard or Brown that you wouldn't see from Tony Abbott if the need arose.
For the sake of being concise I'll pick one example, multiculturalism.
Multiculturalism has failed inasmuch as it's original inception was as a preparatory program to the goal of a genetically and culturally mixed monoculture, a concept which has been rejected by the vast majority of Australians who tend to a more cosmopolitan, tolerant mind set.
In this regard Abbot's alleged views on assimilation via Multiculturalism are out of step with the mainstream but in truth we don't really know which side of that fence he stands on,.
He's supposedly still clinging to the idea of racial assimilation but if he wants to be taken seriously by anyone besides his core supporter base (Wingnuts in most people's estimation)he'll have to modify his position.

Bonmot, tried to reply to your barb yesterday but dropped out.
I am as confused as you are ? just what are you on about.
The tent Embassy thing? junk comment!
Telling us they are well educated a bloke looking out of place in such a group used words not yet invented.
Launching in to Abbott for some thing he never said .
More damage done to true Aboriginals than any thing
JOM, I agree! at last! quoting from your last post
*I do not understand*
Thanks for the honesty.

Jay

Perhaps you should read my last comment again.

Belly, not confused at all but recent events have overtaken my response, to your reply, to Hasbeen:

http://forum.onlineopinion.com.au/thread.asp?discussion=4934#131992

Follow it through.

Secifically:

Professor Fozdar said;

"You had flag flyers who were expressing non-racist views, so I wouldn't like people to go away from hearing about this research thinking, 'oh well all people who have flags on their cars are racist'. That's certainly not the finding."

This is in complete contradiction to what Hasbeen 'wanted to see' or indeed, 'wanted to hear'. So, he makes stuff up:

>> some fool West Australian female professor with an unpronounceable name, has declared her research has proved that people who fly the Oz flag from their car are racists. <<

Your response:

>> Hasbeen I agree think that fool maybe be the reason the story started. <<

I hope that clears things up.

Belly,
There are people who immediately understand what I mean, I can't express myself any more precisely than I do and other people's cognitive dissonance is not my problem.

I have no problem with Indians on the 'phone, I simply tell them, in Hindi, that I can't understand what they are saying, bid them 'Good Evening' and, before they can recover, hang up.

Filipinas are a different matter, their squeaky voices upset my hearing aid but I must be careful as we have some friends from the Philippines, they know however and usually start by saying my name first up.