The Prime Minister of India, Manmohan Singh did not front to the recent CHOGM meeting in Perth.This was slap in the face for Britian.
http://www.telegraphindia.com/1111119/jsp/nation/story_14772215.jsp

So India is firming up trade and security relations with China and cleverly keeps friendly hand extended to the West.Note that the Gillard Govt were told to sell Uranium to India to get them onside,even though it is against Labor policy.

The West is in a tradgic mess of its own making.Isarel wants to attack Iran and even Zibigniew Brzezinski who wrote "The Grand Chessboard" says it is insane.

Russia and China have recently signed a gas deal worth $ trillion and have forged closer alliances.

In the West there is an enormous temptation to go for war,since the elites are under seige from their own populations,and they can save their wealth by just stealing others.War also gives them excuse to put the iron fist of oppression on dissent.We are seeing a similar climate that led up to WW2.

So what we are now seeing is an aligning of powers readying themselves for potential conflict.

If you want to stop war,become aware and get active.

Spewing, I was expecting a yap about cheese. Damn my blurry morning eyes.

I guess you're right in a way, but war is ALWAYS inevitable with humans, it's just what we do. For sure there's a massive strain on us at the moment and I reckon we're going to see resource wars at some stage. Maybe not while we're around, but it will definitely happen.

It's definitely tough of Greece and Italy and I don't know what the answer is. When hope is lost then things are hopeless. Without hope, humans go feral. Time will tell, I guess Arjay.

Oh, I don't understand by: "In the West there is an enormous temptation to go for war"

Who, specifically? No one can afford an invasion. Thats broken the yanks over the last ten years. They're in no hurry to do it again. Us? Who are we going to invade ... Gillard would need a poll to decide to swat a fly. Britain? Who would they invade? France? Nope.

Occupations cost money, and no one has got any. China is the only threat at the moment when it comes to invading someone but while they hold all the coin I can't see them doing ANYTHING like invasions.

Civil war after economical collapse would be my pick.

In his book 1998, Zibig as he is known said."Moreover as America becomes an increasingly multi-cultural society,it may find it more difficult to fashion a consensus on foreign policy issues,except in the circumstance of a truely massive and widely perceived direct external threat." ".....democracy is inimical to imperial mobilisation."

That threat which could mobilise imperial forces was terrorism.Bush had the signing orders for the Patriot Act ready before 911.Effectively it suspended Habeous Corpus.Obama has brought in Preventative Dentention,legalised assassination of suspected terrorists, and his latest attack on freedoms is that all those prisoners in Gitmo can be detained indefinetly even if proven innocent.Anyone can now be labelled a terrorist and thrown in jail,killed and you have no legal recourse.Hitler would be proud.

Susan Lindaur was a CIA asset turned whistle blower and the first person to be arrested under Bush's Patriot Act, http://extremeprejudiceusa.wordpress.com/

This all began in earnest in the 1980's when the environmentalists had the world convinced that C02 emitions had the world on the path to destruction.So too many people was the problem and the elites saw it as their noble cause to save humanity from itself via imperialism.It also gave them the opportunity of realising their New World Order.

We are seeing the final act being played out right now even though the world has not warmed since 1998.

China is already sourcing its energy and resources from Russia and elsewhere.We will be left with nothing in the event of war.Gillard has made us a nuke target by inviting US bases here.

You won't see this analysis in the popular media.I wonder why?

the india boycot of chogm,..was more a slap to juliar
you note it worked..over night the lefie got with the play
sure..uranium for india..[and heck why not]

but your right the media dont diss-cuss the real issues
just like those rats who rated b grade securities @..AAA+

they couldnt be seen to talk down the upcomming collapse..[so kicked the can down the road]...its that type of insanity that sees obama become a smiling assasin..

while flirting with her majesty the juliar
while she cracks down on her deluded war on smokers
and sips her red whine..while thinking of her next big new tax
[to please her masters]

the build up to woman[who serve the elite adgendas]
is typified in juliar and ager merckle...in the thatcher war monger mode

they know how to lie down and take it like a man
and by them doing it..the elites do it to us all

but heck mate..the sleepers sleep
till that one day the wake up
then we eat the rich

I can think of a reason, Arjay.

>>You won't see this analysis in the popular media.I wonder why?<<

They are such vague, far-fetched, hysterical and sensationalist maunderings, that no editor in their right mind would risk the reputation of their organ by printing them.

This, on the other hand, is a place where opinions may be shared without too much qualification, which is a very good thing. Your posts on the new world order, that sneaky cabal of rapacious international banksters who are intent on ruining us all, their (somewhat pointless, I always feel) blowing up of New York buildings under the guise of a terrorist attack, and this, the imminence of WWIII being engineered by those mysterious folk with their inscrutable agenda, make a refreshing change from reading about the real world.

Keep up the good work. Just so long as you don't mind people disagreeing with you, of course.

This is a must see http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=kd6ix6swkXs Prof Chis Busby has found that the USA has been using enriched Uranium in Fallugia,Iraq.They have had massive/extensive birth defects there and it was not depleted Uranium as first thought.If you look at the attack on Bagdad ie "Shock & Awe" you will notice many mushroom like massive explosions.Some say the US were using some sort of mini-nuke.

Prof Chris Busby says that it seem the US has developed some new small nuke weapon from enriched Uranium.It could be a Neutron Bomb that gives off less radiation.So bearing this in mind the USA may well think that this will give them the edge over the soldier might of China in a conventional war.One scenario I read from an ex-CIA agent is that the USA will initiate WW3,hit hard and get China/Russia to sue for peace under their terms.It is quite possible if they feel they have a huge advantage.

Stg,just study the history of the last 2 world wars.JFK warned us about the Military Industrial Complex.He should have included the Banksters since they have all the power.They create all the money for the US ,European,British and our Govts to function.He who pays the piper calls the tune.

The discovery of enriched Uranium in Iraq by Prof Busby is very alarming since it means the USA have already initiated a Nuclear War.

Hee, hee, pericles...I was waiting for your reply to Arjay's question.

It is interesting though to note America is talking up its role in the Pacific as its economic potential continues to be seriously compromised.

Btw, a bit of a milestone recently. The U.S. clocked up 15 trillion in national debt (99.8 percent debt to GDP ratio).
http://www.usdebtclock.org/

I do think our arjay may be from the east, he for sure is anti west.
may I point out such compassions do not always work.
If we persist however, we must change the rules of the game.
In this game, one played for many past hundreds of years no two players control the game.
Each pawn wants to be knight every one wants only their best interests served.
Blind assertions the west wants a war are, well I see no evidence.

It is worth noting the Shanghai Co-operation Organisation started in 2001.Members include Russia ,China Pakistan and the other Stans in central Asia.India attended one of its meetings in 2005 but is not a full member.They have trade agreements and carry out joint Military exercises.If India joins,they will account for half of the World's population.India and China by 2050 will account for half the World's GDP.

You can see why the neo-cons in Europe,Britian and USA are getting a bit uppity.The banksters in the West have scuttled our economies but the game is not playing out as planned.They may lose all their power and give supremacy to Russia and China.

How does the West have a protracted war when we have no industrial base to support it,while being in enormous debt to the banks? For us it would have to be a short nuclear one.US soldiers are demoralised and via the internet are too aware of the skull duggery happening withing their own countries.If you don't have the high moral ground,there will be no passion in the fight.

The other side for us is that China now is securing other sources of energy and resources beyond Aust and our economy will be devestated by war on many fronts.

We have a long line of generational power brokers in Europe,USA and Britian who are more than a bit loopy.They will risk everything for their NWO.Even Zibigniew comes from a Royal bloodline in Poland.These people are not like us.They are born into fabulous wealth and have no connectivity with the real world of people and production.They think money creates wealth.When all is destroyed,their money will mean zilch.Inbred psychopaths is a fitting name.

Arjay Take it easy. Obama put it on the line with China the other day. But that is for the good of a lot of asian countries. There's a good chance there is a lot of oil under the china sea, and China claims the lot. Obama says it belongs to all countries surrounding the south china sea. Sounds fair to me.

"Stg,just study the history of the last 2 world wars"

I'm too busy working, Arjay.

This defines your comprehension problem in a nutshell, Arjay.

>>Prof Chis Busby has found that the USA has been using enriched Uranium in Fallugia,Iraq<<

No he hasn't. Listen to it again.

He says that he is "not sure" where the radioactivity came from. But they have had "some suggestions". He also states categorically that the neutron bomb theory is "really a science fiction possibility".

By taking these random "theories" at face value, you risk looking a complete idiot. Not that you have ever been dissuaded by this in the past, of course. Whatever, it leads you into the realms of total fantasy, when you regurgitate titbits like this one:

>>One scenario I read from an ex-CIA agent is that the USA will initiate WW3,hit hard and get China/Russia to sue for peace under their terms.<<

There isn't a realistic grounding - political, military or Hollywood - where this idea has traction. But I notice you didn't provide a source - are you sure it didn't come to you in a dream?

But I guess everyone has to have a hobby.

>>We have a long line of generational power brokers in Europe,USA and Britian who are more than a bit loopy.They will risk everything for their NWO.Even Zibigniew comes from a Royal bloodline in Poland.<<

You accuse these shadowy, unnamed beings with having "no connectivity with the real world", Arjay, while you write nonsense like this.

You must be a hoot at dinner parties.

Arjay while ever you persist in saying others are close to insane, you will not be taken as a source worth while.
And finding some fault in the very nature of the leaders of the west, but ignoring the same symptoms exist nm the rest is unwise.
Why not tell us why Syria Murders its people after every Friday prays.
Why Iran holds its folk prisoners.
North Korea a nightmare, in humanity beyond belief.
If you targeted us, for letting China not let us act I would praise you.
Was UN help in the Balkans, now Lybia, a war like move?
Why did the Arab.Muslim states not do it, long ago.
What was the last action, of any of those to protect human life?

Pericles you are telling lies once again.This is why I don't bother with answering most of your piffle.Prof Busby said,this is not depleted Uranium,it is slighty enriched Uranium ie Uranium 235 and depleted Uranium is what's left over.He also said it was probaly used in some from of directed charge as per use against tanks but there wer no tanks in Fallugia.More likely it was used against buildings and people defending their own country.

You are an 'agent provocateur' who tries to spin he truth for your own advantage.

By the way somone is using your pseudonym on the Piers Ackerman blog or is that you?

Stg, see http://www.globalresearch.ca/ This site will give you an insight into what's happening.Also see http://corbettreport.com/
http://www.ae911truth.org/ http://patriotsquestion911.com/

It is worthwhile taking time out from work and educating yourself.

http://www.infowars.com/russian-warships-enter-syrian-waters-to-prevent-nato-attack So Russia has made the bold move to stop NATO invading Syria.A demoralised US Military will not do well against a power such as Russia.

Whether it not it stops mad dog Israel attacking Iran is another matter.An attack on Iran will see oil prices trebble and our depression deepen.Robert Baer Ex-CIA and Alistair Crooke ex MI6 do not approve of these NATO invasions.

Arjay, so you think some of us lie.
Some will not listen.
Some do not want to know.
And that your thoughts are balanced and informed.
OK
I disagree
But admit, some of us have a few of those symptoms.
Own a mirror by any chance?

Not quite, Arjay.

>>Pericles you are telling lies once again.This is why I don't bother with answering most of your piffle<<

You don't answer because I am right, and you know it.

Here are Professor Busby's statements, verbatim.

In answer to the question "where did the enriched uranium come from?", he answered:

"Well we're not entirely sure about that, but we have some ideas and there have been some suggestions... One suggestion is that people are covering their tracks [by using enriched vs. depleted uranium]... another possibility is that a new weapon altogether has been developed, that is a kind of neutron bomb... this is really a science fiction possibility"

I particularly enjoyed the first flight of fancy - that because they had found enriched uranium ("used in atom bombs and nuclear power stations", according to the professor) instead of depleted uranium, it is evidence of a cover-up!

There seems to be little doubt that some form of uranium-based contamination occurred in Fallujah, and that one of the possible causes was US weaponry. But as I pointed out in my previous post, you allow your predilection for global domination conspiracy theory to leap straight from that premise, into "the USA will initiate WW3,hit hard and get China/Russia to sue for peace under their terms."

You know perfectly well that I don't tell lies, Arjay. What I do, is point out where your stories leave the realms of reality and take off into the stratosphere of new world order conspiracy theories.

Incidentally, if you care to refute my direct quotes, or suggest they are taken out of context, by all means do so. It would be a welcome change to discuss facts with you.

You lie by omission.Busby also said that a new weapon other than this "Neutron Bomb" was possible.It is bad enough that they have used DU and now we find evidence of enriched Uranium.Busby was being very cautious and you are twisting this caution into your unlikely scenario.

Good to see Russia in Lybia eh.Perhaps those war mongering Zionists will get back in their cage.

Ok, so I didn't give the full transcript. Nor, for that matter, did you.

>>You lie by omission.Busby also said that a new weapon other than this "Neutron Bomb" was possible.<<

He said a whole lot of stuff. He didn't have any real evidence, so he used "suggestions" and "possibilities" to build pictures of different kinds of battleground nuclear weaponry. Naturally, when you don't have any direct evidence, you have to be "cautious", as you describe it. I call it woolgathering.

My main point was not Prof Busby's multiple-choice offering, though, but the way you translated his vague wafflings into your own dreams that "the USA will initiate WW3,hit hard and get China/Russia to sue for peace under their terms."

There will be an enquiry, where presumably we can look at the evidence, and understand that there are far more theories that fit the facts than only those drama-queen offerings made by the good professor. His history of being correct is not particularly great either - check out his dynamite Second Event Theory, and what happened to it.

He is quite addicted to publicity, it would appear. Mainly for that stalwart of factual reporting, Russia Today.

I guess we all have to make a living somehow.

Actually pericles, I think the champagne 'Arjay' moment was when he described the powerbrokers of Europe as 'inbred psychopaths'.

Arjay, the first step to having a rational conversation is seeing that the other side might have a point.

The second step is critically evaluating both arguments, rather than simply taking material that agrees with your point of view.

The moment you denounce them as 'inbred psychopaths' you free yourself of having to listen to any logic which contradicts your point. Fortunately, you also free us from having to extend you the benefit of the doubt or taking you seriously.

We recommend that you compose longer comments in a wordprocessing package in case your internet connection fails or the system times out and your comments are lost.

Incidentally, Arjay, I meant to ask you...

In your opening post, you state:

>>The Prime Minister of India, Manmohan Singh did not front to the recent CHOGM meeting in Perth.This was slap in the face for Britian<<

The article you referenced didn't mention Britain (or even Britian, come to that) at all, so I wondered where you got your information on the "slap in the face" from. Perhaps you meant this article from the same paper?

http://www.telegraphindia.com/1111109/jsp/opinion/story_14722738.jsp

Oh, can't be that one. It says that...

"In reality, the Commonwealth is the only organization to which India can claim a sense of belonging on the international stage..."

Some slap, that.

It is also worth noting that the Indian Head of State is of course their President, so the Prime Minister probably wasn't even invited.

If I appear rude I am sorry.
In my defense I offer only Ajay's posts,in this thread alone.
Rational Debate?
It is my view it is not possible here.
As both sides need to be rational.
Clearly one side is quite far from it.

Pericles,my comment about Singh was not influenced by the article referenced.This is a straw man argument.You distract readers by your nit picking innuendos.I stand by my assertions of USA use of Uranium enriched weapons in Fallugia and probably Libya.

Time and time again you have denied the science here http://www.ae911truth.org/ and the real patriots here http://patriotsquestion911.com/ You have no answers,only just deny the science.You have lied in the past protesting that the US Federal Reserve was owned by the US Govt when it fact it is the likes of the Rothschilds,JP Morgan,Rockefeller and Goldman Sachs etc.

You ignore the printing of money by these criminals that are destroying our economies just like the Great Depression.You ignore the criminal invasion of Iraq,Afghanistan,Libya,Somalia,Yeman,Pakistan etc.

You Pericles have all the attributes of being a Zionist symapthiser.Your old world order under the guise of "The New World Order" has come to an end.The people are rising up all around the planet.Many are not quite sure what is wrong,but they know that good ,honest hard working people are being shafted by the few who steal by counterfeiting our currencies.

You cannot be so stupid,if so,you are part of the problem.

Then why mention it at all, Arjay?

>>Pericles,my comment about Singh was not influenced by the article referenced<<

Especially as i) Mr Singh is not India's Head of State and ii) there is no evidence of anyone's face being slapped. Do you just invent these things on the spur of the moment?

You don't need to answer that, of course.

Now we have that out of the way, let's look at the rest.

>>So India is firming up trade and security relations with China and cleverly keeps friendly hand extended to the West<<

It's called international relations, Arjay. You have posted the equivalent of "dog bites man" - it is not necessary that in order to be someone's friend, you have to become someone else's enemy. It would be news if the sentence had read "India is firming up trade and security relations with China and cutting all ties with the West", but as it stands it is about as controversial as a bus timetable.

>>Russia and China have recently signed a gas deal worth $ trillion and have forged closer alliances.<<

How is this more dramatic than "Australia and China have recently signed gas and mineral deals worth $ trillions and have forged closer alliances."?

Oh. I forgot. It's all a global conspiracy to initiate WWIII.

>>We are seeing a similar climate that led up to WW2. So what we are now seeing is an aligning of powers readying themselves for potential conflict.<<

Ok. If we are to buy that, we need the equivalent of a Hitler (plus a Mussolini and perhaps a Stalin), the equivalent of Czechoslovakia, Poland and Austria, and a fired-up population that feels deeply wronged by a treaty signed late last century, and desperately wants to recover lost territory, in order to feel relevant.

Where are they?

You're so far out of touch with reality, Arjay, even your analogies fall flat on their face.

Money has been privatised by stealth
By: Ness
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/nov/15/money-privatised-stealth

Here's how it works. When you ask the bank for the money to buy a one-bedroom box in London, the money that appears in your account isn't borrowed from some prudent grandmother's life savings.

In fact, the bank simply types those numbers into your account, creating brand new money that you can now spend. As other banks do exactly the same, the amount of money in the economy grows and grows.

Every new mortgage creates new money, which pushes up house prices just a little more and forces the next buyer to borrow even more from the banks.

Through this process of creating money, banks have been able to inflate the money supply at a rate of 11.5% a year, pushing up the prices of houses and pricing out an entire generation.

Corporate America Is Using the Police Departments As Hired Thugs -
Ret Police Captain Ray Lewis
<http://www.youtube.com/v/oxk8OYiZ3vk&hl

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gim_pqUAKcc

http://whatreallyhappened.com/

Classic, one under god.

>>Money has been privatised by stealth By: Ness
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/nov/15/money-privatised-stealth<<

Let me guess. You chose not to read any of the the 511 comments that followed the "article", didn't you.

If you had, you would be a far more knowledgeable person. Many of them are along the lines of this one:

"Money as debt like this article is based upon just enough truth to look authentic but when closer scrutiny is taken, the direction it goes and the conclusions it comes to are miles from reality"

Don't get suckered in. The idea that "only government should issue new money" is asking for trouble. Do you really trust them that much? Also, you would need to define "new money". What is "new" about it? Who allows it to be created, and on what basis? Then you need to find a way to inject it into the economy without (presumably?) creating a debt.

The central fallacy of all this (if you get that far through the comments) is illustrated by the story of the town that "creates" $270 from $100, and buys a racehorse. The telling observation by one poster goes as follows:

"No money has been permanently created in your example. Indeed it is quite a nice example of how lending and deposits tally"

As I have been trying to explain to you, for quite a while now.

Do some research, one under god, outside your favourite conspiracy theory sites and with an open mind.

Then... (you knew this was coming)... follow the money.

UOG this pseudonym Pericles does not deserve a reply.This Darwinian anker, is all about power for the few.He only bothers to utter BS, to be both a distraction and division in logical debate.More of his mass debate,rather than real intellectual analysis.

The elites work via deception and the old notions of divide and conquer.Left and right philosphies are the opium used to confuse the masses.We argue,while the banksters and the ilk of Pericles shaft us.

You couldn't script this stuff - pure gold!

sometimes its funny born mute
but lets see the joke of our honouerable member

per ridicules..quote..""Don't get suckered in.""

wise words

""The idea that "only government should issue new money"
is asking for trouble.""

yep much better bankers 'do it'...lol

UNELECTED big bonus bankers
yeah we can trust them...LOL

mate THEY WENT BUST
even when ITS them..controling the issue of new money

then WE bail them out
MATE ITS BETTER TO VOTE..for who gets that power..!

rather than letting the foxes run the hen house
for private gain..and great bonus..and stealing the value of your money too[inflation is theft bloke]

TIOO much power
in the total control of an unelected few

""Do you really trust them that much?""

do you really trust your banker mates that much?

""need to define "new money".
What is "new" about it? Who allows it to be created,""

mate you been to the link
DID YOU ASK HIM WHAT NEW MONEY IS?

new money..is having a new debitor..;on the books
[all money is debt..[all money has ursury on it..

maybe the ursury..we pay..is this 'new money'

that we are expected to create
by others defaulting

so the banker can get a bonus

""you need to find a way to inject it
into the economy without (presumably?) creating a debt.""

by lending on future assets
[ie the value of a building..that will be built on its future value]

or money...created by creativity
anyhow its better we can hold those powers to account
not bail them out..by our signing onto their debt books

the only wise words you say follow

YES its time SOMEONE..policed money
all they need do is...""follow the money""
by tracking back the debt bet

Tut tut, Arjay.

>>This Darwinian anker, is all about power for the few.He only bothers to utter BS, to be both a distraction and division in logical debate.More of his mass debate,rather than real intellectual analysis<<

That looks very much as though you are unable to discuss the - quite considerable - errors in your contributions, but have instead decided to throw a few insults around.

Fair enough. Whatever makes you happy. But perhaps the takeaway from this little exchange will be to encourage you to take greater care in future to check your facts when you post, and refrain from offering such concrete opinions on matters upon which you know so embarrassingly little.

Some hopes!

See you next time.

Errors from one who says the Fed Res is a Govt bank.Errors from one who thinks "quantitative easing' ie counterfeiting is good.Errors from one who thinks the derivative market is sound good practise.

The US Fed created from nothing $15 trillion of debt to bail out their mates + wars and then secretly created another $16 trillion for their derivative scams.When this all unravels,your super and most of the planet will be worth zilch unless you buy precious metals.This amount of money when released into the real economy will collapse the US $.It is a mathematical surety.

If Russia and China can keep the Zionists from creating WW3,then we have half a chance.

Remember the 5 dancing Israelis who were caught by the FBI photographing 911? They were released,then questioned and on national Israeli TV saying,"Our purpose there was to document the event."

You Pericles are clutching at straws in a cesspool of lies that will consume you.

its futile to try to teach the old dog new tricks
[dog used genericly not specificly]

im rereading..an old lengthy topic..at my old forum..
http://forum.worldfreemansociety.org/viewtopic.php?f=43&t=8225&start=40

cause things
seem to be..slowing down here

[even my dodo weblink..is acting funny
[no connection yet still on line..its too wierd to concern over]

''the Crown has made us all “citizens” of its government which means we've accepted, without protest,..more Crown benefits which have made us liable to many more conditions

-with one of those conditions being that we agree to forfeit to the Crown..our right to collect our natural share of the resources that we require to exist, our birth-right,..and administer it for ourselves.

Nanny will do that for her citizens.
it is a “system” - a system of cunningly contrived contracts of Byzantine complexity used to extricate..the wealth of our human energy.

However, they're contracts and, like all contracts, where there’s a way in there’s a way out. To get into a contract you accept a benefit, and to get out of the contract you stop accepting the benefit

or you protest the enforced use of a benefit if you must accept it under duress. The Crown has ways into the contracts and it also has ways out of the contracts which, of course, will actually be recognised by the Crown, using recognisable formulations..[i.e. forms]

although the Crown is hardly expected to clearly signpost the way and will try hard to discourage you from taking that path,..with hints of dire consequences..(that don’t eventuate and were never there) and 'guilt trips' about not accepting the Crown’s benefits,

always trying to hook you back in..any way it can
even if it means..taking/destroying it all..for our own good

just as you’d expect..from a cunning master.who doesn’t want to lose customers.[slaves]..And an unscrupulous master contractor..will tell you anything..you might believe..to try and get at your wealth for the least amount of benefit offered!

Incidentally,this business..of Crown contracts,
this business of the King..as commercial contractor
can all largely be traced back ..o the Byzantine Emperor Justinian the Great and subsequent Byzantine emperors...rome..etc ''

I refuse to believe that you are beyond reason, Arjay, so I'm here to help.

>>Errors from one who says the Fed Res is a Govt bank<<

Not sure I ever used that particular phrase, but let's take a look anyway:

"The seven members of the Board of Governors are nominated by the President of the United States and confirmed by the U.S. Senate."

Clearly, this is not a maverick private enterprise. It would in fact be reasonably accurate to describe it as a virtual co-operative, whose members work together to solve problems - inflation, currency exposure, sovereign risk, that sort of thing.

"As of March 2004, of the nation’s approximately 7,700 commercial banks approximately 2,900 were members of the Federal Reserve System — approximately 2,000 national banks and 900 state banks."

If you really want to know more, here's a book - it's a 2.7mb download, so don't click unless you are seriously interested.

http://www.federalreserve.gov/pf/pdf/pf_complete.pdf

>>Errors from one who thinks "quantitative easing' ie counterfeiting is good.<<

Actually, I think quantitative easing is neither counterfeiting, nor good. Sometimes however it is the best available weapon against massive economic collapse. It's unpalatable medicine at best, but sometimes you just have to hold your nose.

>>Errors from one who thinks the derivative market is sound good practise<<

The derivative market was designed to manage risk, and when performing properly, achieves this objective. Unfortunately there are some flaws in that design which turn out to have a magnification effect, instead of a mitigating one. We live and learn. Nobody's perfect.

>>The US Fed created from nothing $15 trillion of debt to bail out their mates + wars and then secretly created another $16 trillion for their derivative scams.<<

This is where we move into your fantasy world, Arjay, and unfortunately I cannot help you there. It is just something you are going to have to grow out of.

>>When this all unravels,your super and most of the planet will be worth zilch unless you buy precious metals.<<

Both parts of this sentence are wrong. Your homework for today is to figure out how.

If you find this episode description from the BBC world service program "Hardtalk" of interest, Arjay, you've got until Friday, 2 December to listen to it…

"'Another Great Depression is all but inevitable’ - that's the view of Steve Keen. No wonder he's been called the ‘Merchant of Gloom’.
But then Keen is one of the few economists to have predicted the global financial crisis.
And while he used to be a lone voice challenging the economic consensus, more and more people are now listening to him.
His way of avoiding depression? Write off the debt, bankrupt the banks, nationalize the financial system, and start all over again."

Mind you, he does emphasise the exponential growth of private debt and I'm not convinced that the program description accurately summarises his 'solutions '. What do you think?

win..he is right
if only people who rise early would listen to bbc..in the morning
they would be better informed..thing is if a capitalist fails
well thats what capitalism claims to do best..

[revalue debt..acces risk..]

govt should not be bailing out capitalists...
then putting the debt on the people..
then put the consumers[sorry people][..
under austerity measures that kills small business
and in time turn the capitalist dream into a nightmare

if banker invest wrong..and are too big to fail..govt seizes the assets
spends its peoples money on keeping workers working
no9t bailout bankers allowing the bankers to privatise the peoples assets for mates rates[then double the cost of govt services]

plus pay ursury on the govt bond
issued to the very bankers who lol..monetised the bailout

bankers create debt..they stopped asset creation long ago..now its only selling it all for salvage[pennies on the dollar]..plus speculating up the prices of goods..to try to retain the worth of their illgotten booty..[the bonus we paid for]

let govts seize assets
then govt bonds will be a true security

its absurd to price govt bonds out of balance
especially when the banker bailout..was lent from bankers

in fact its criminal[colluded treason]

but police police illegal campers
not white collar crims..with expensive cadre's of lawyers

the 1%..have abused their trust
to wit the people and the peoples assets and well being

thus the landless poor enterd the next lavels of austerity[became 3 rd world serfs..renting the 1 st world from the money changers ursuror]

who hold full and complete control over everything
by threat of force..and punitive perversions of state powers

One of the best quotes I've read recently was in an article on OLO where the author surmised that our (capitalist) system had done a sterling job of "privatising profit and socialising debt".....can't argue with that analysis.

*His way of avoiding depression? Write off the debt, bankrupt the banks, nationalize the financial system, and start all over again."*

Hang on WM Trevor. Allowing politicians to behave worse then any
mafia extorsion racket, is hardly a solution. German politicians
are right at the forefront of the present mess. They also have
the option of solutions to the mess that they created. Only the
German public might take it out on them, costing them their political
careers. That would be a small price to pay.

It is not the market that is failing, it is politicians. Putting
them in charge of banks, after their political failure caused banks
to fail, would hardly be logical or just or sensible.

The way forward wmtrevor is to create another National Govt owned bank,that can create increases in our productivity and inflation debt free for infrastructure.The other solution is to have private banks that are mutual societies thus if you are a depositor or borrower, it is your bank and you benefit from the fractional reserve system of money creation.

The creation of new money is a special activity since it represents the productivity of all individuals,and hence it should be shared equitably.We do not have a fair system.Those who currently create all the new money,have all the power.They are the private banks and their hangers on.

*Those who currently create all the new money,have all the power.They are the private banks and their hangers on*

After all this time Arjay, you still don't get it. Private banks
don't "create new money". They lend out money which they have
borrowed from depositors or other sources.

If you wanted to deny them the right to lend out money deposited,
they would have to charge you a forturne to guard your money etc
and pay you zilch interest on your deposits. Hardly clever when
you think through the implications.

If you want to profit from bank profits, then you are free to do
what super funds do, as well as some private individuals. Buy
bank shares and risk your money as bank equity, so that if the
bank has large losses, you lose your shirt before anyone else
loses theirs. Your choice really.

I'd be interested to hear more, Arjay, about this idea of yours:

>>The creation of new money is a special activity since it represents the productivity of all individuals,and hence it should be shared equitably.<<

How would this Bank of yours "create" money?

Given, as you should know by now, that there cannot be a credit without a debit, and vice versa, what in your view will sit across the other side of the ledger from your "new money"?

As a follow-up question, how do you imagine that this "new money", when it materializes, will be "shared equitably", and with whom?