So a 14 year old boy goes to Bali with his parents.

Whilst there he heads off to partake of a massage,..
on the way he is offered a small quantity of Marijuana,
which he foolishly accepts in exchange for a small fee.
He is arrested when he leaves the place of
"massage" and is now to be prosecuted with
"drug possession" which carries a sentence of up to six
years in Kerobokan Prison!

Let us examine the "alleged" facts:
1) He is a minor.
2) He is in Bali with his parents.
3) He was "offered" the deal by a local.
4) The police were waiting for him when he left the
Massage premises.
5) The amount of the "drug" was insignificant.
6) Drugs are available on virtually every street corner
in Bali, and tourists are seen as an easy mark.

It is accepted in our country that many people smoke
Marijuana for recreational purposes, and the penalties
for minor infringements are quite liberal, varying in
severity from State to State, but generally culminating
in a small monetary fine for apprehended offenders.

This boy has broken the law and deserves to be punished,
at worst by a suggested six whacks across the backside
with a rattan, but to even contemplate sending him to be
confined in Kerobokan Prison for ANY length of time is
inhumane!

It is time that our Government took steps to protect
it`s citizens, by issuing a few stern warnings to the
Indonesian judiciary, reminding them that they should
clean up around their own back door and stop the
commonplace peddling that permeates their society if
they really want to benefit from our tourism dollars,
as well as the windfall of foreign aid that we so
generously provide to them,....or has that been negated
by the fiasco of the Live Cattle Export Ban?

It seems that if you are a tourist in Bali, it is okay
to participate in drugs as long as you are not stupid or
naive enough to get caught!

NB: I do NOT smoke Marijuana or partake of any other illegal
substance

There are huge problems in Bali. For all the moral protests and anti-Western sentiment, the fact is you cannot walk down the streets without being offered 'drugs, women, boys or girls for sexual services (according to one male friend who went on a Conference in that country). He ended up being quite aggressively rude to make it clear to these hawkers he was not interested. It is time the Indonesian police and judiciary cleaned up their own backyard.

The only way out is not to frequent these places and if you do don't be silly enough to do anything illegal. The fact that these sorts of sting operations nabbed a boy may mean the whole affair will end with an exchange - the one westerner for a handful of Indonesian criminals being held in Australia.

It is about Indonesia not losing face, and if the diplomats and lawyers can work around that, there might be a chance the boy will not face time in a the prison system.

Crack up, well aware you do not like me posting in your threads.
But this one just has to be addressed.
I know nothing of this kid or his parents.
Except what we have read.
Seems he has a history of being on the edge, his age has something to do with that.
He used drugs here, he went to a country you should be well aware is harsh on drug users, not our country,we have no right to act other than as they wish.
Thousands of drug using Aussies go there, some stop using while there others do not.
I think his mum and dad have committed a crime, in some eyes.
They Love their son.
Maybe in an effort to straighten him out they took him there,and a Friend.
We owe him only what we would owe you, if you got in to trouble over seas.
His age is the only thing keeping him in the headlines.
Bali owes us nothing, more drugs are sold in a night in our inner city sin spots that ever there.

Problems for Ozzies in Bali will go on until people get enough sense to stop going there.

It is nothing like it used to be, & really not worth the effort today.

A few months of vastly reduced tourist arrivals would do wonders for the place itself, & the welcome mat for future visitors.

everyone does something silly sometimes but if the parents knew he was into drugs then why on earth did they take him to Bali ??

I love this incredibly bigoted notion by Australians that Bali, an Indonesian nation that in 20 years changed from a clean, laid-back, moral place into a rundown slum area where Australia's worst cheapskates go to exploit cheap prostitutes, get wasted, and put on their worst most disrespectful behaviour towards the locals- to a point where most of a Balinese have actually moved out of the cities (the workers there are East Javan);
-And we are not only expecting the Balinese (and Indonesians in general) to be thankful that we are contributing to this, but we are making it their fault when they successfully try to enforce the laws that WE are not respecting when we visit when they actually catch us doing a crime?
Of course, it's only an issue when a white Australian is caught and punished in Indonesia- rather than some brown person.

King Hazza,
That about sums up the true situation.

King Hazza all true, but normal Aussies go there,have fun, no sex no drugs.
Tourist feed by creating jobs, we must look at others views but not except them all.
In an existing thread,had crackup cared to look he could have found some FACTS.
The kid was a user before he went.
He bought it there at least twice.
And bragged about it.
GEE the BL&^DY PM and Rudd have helped him.
Do we declare war?
Please, let us all get our heads out of the sand.
Yes you can buy drugs, on every corner.
Yes police take bribes set people up, and protect the sellers.
How many of us? come tell me? do not understand the Gold coast and Kings Cross do it the same.
Drug use world wide is supported and sponsored by POLICE and those in power.

I've got a simple question, which should be simply answered, presumably:

what precisely is the harm that you presume cannabis causes?

As a 48-year-old man who has smoked cannabis [mostly]on and reluctantly off [when it was unavailable within my friendship circle] since I was 16, running my own business since 2005, I'm sincerely interested in your views on the damage thay I have suffered due to cannabis. Is there any? What is its precise nature?

Anyone?

Antiseptic:
If people wish to smoke Marijuana then it is a matter of individual choice, as long as each one is prepared to accept the penalty levied if apprehended.

At this time the laws of the land declare it illegal to grow, distribute or use Cannabis Sativa (a proscribed dangerous drug),so to use it is contrary to the laws of society! I personally can see nothing wrong with sensible use, however like all drugs overuse is self abuse and may create a problem depending again upon the individual.

I myself gave away cigarettes 20 odd years ago and my drug of choice now is Rum and Coke, which I have gradually reduced in amount of consumption due in part to the exhorbitant cost....but nobody NEEDS to drink, as nobody NEEDS to smoke, again an individual choice!

No doubt in time to come we will see the liberalisation of the laws and Cannabis will become legal in certain amounts, after all the Government will recognise the opportunity to tax it and make millions in the process!

Is there any? What is its precise nature?
Antseptic,
that's a bit like smoking. Some chaps have smoked since 14 & still going strong at 85. Another keels over at 40. Cannabis is probably not physically damaging but it does harm the thinking mechanism but again, there are exceptions. I know users who are off their trolley after a beer & a smoke whereas others just get a little happy. Grog sends some totally ape$hit & others just get jolly. What king Hazza said is just so true & many are simply looking for blame & excuses rather than attempt a little self-control & think only of how they affect others. Reminds me of the dad who got severely aggravated when I told his kid to stop tearing around between our BBQ tables. I made it clear to him that WE have to live with the consequences of his upbringing of his kid & not he. He simply couldn't see.

King Hazza
Nobody is arguing that Australians who put on their worst behaviour in Bali and who disrespect the laws of that country are blameless. In fact they show little courtesy to their host nation as the large number of hoony tourists to Bali continue to remind.

However, this case involves a 14 year old who while clearly breaking the law should be dealt with as a juvenile, not an adult. While not condoning the action of the boy there is little done via the judiciary to abate these aggressive street hawkers. Uphold the law but why are the pushers not punished in the same way as Western drug users. Is it because they are white people. From my experience of travels to various parts of the world, I have observed racism does not work in only one direction.

That is the double standard, but unless you have experienced it I imagine it is difficult to view racism as other than a Western phenomenon. It is not.

Antisceptic;
I actually think Marijuana should be legalized.
However, Indonesia disagrees and it thus becomes a matter of respecting their laws- and that includes what age they regard someone as legally responsible for their actions.

And no double standard Pelican- the kid allegedly flaunted his purchase in front of many onlookers and simply raised his chances of being caught with evidence enough to warrant arrest.
If that wasn't enough, this link demonstrates that Indonesia is actually very consistent in its drug arrests and the 'racism' claim is bunk;
In 2009, a total of 107 non-nationals were arrested for a drug offense, while 38,066 Indonesians were arrested.

http://www.apaic.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=58&Itemid=71&limitstart=2

pelican,
a 14 year old is not a child & therefore should not be treated as one. Today's youth have far more information at hand than when we were 14. As a matter of fact I started my apprenticeship at that age & haven't stopped working since. I knew at 10 that smoking dope was illegal & didn't do it. I did have a smoke at 22 simply to find out for myself what the proponents were on about. I didn't like the idea then & still feel that way now. Youngsters of today simply cannot plead ignorance anymore as far as drugs go. Same goes for stealing. If they didn't know it was wrong they wouldn't try & deny it would they ? A 14 year old in Bali more likely than not is half supporting his family.

Pelican I'm with individual, but would go further. It is about time we got rid of the kid gloves when treating delinquents, no matter how young. I hear stories of young hoods quiting the law to the cops, effectively telling them that they are powerless.

People are being beaten & injured by even preteens, with offenders virtually untouchable.

A bit more Indonesian justice, on our streets may be a damn good idea.

Well, it seems that nobody can tell me what harm I've likely suffered as a result of smoking cannabis for the past 30 years or so.

So why does the kid in Bali need to be locked up?

Anti in part to support you I admit I had, before my last two jobs smoked a lot of it.
Australian Truck drivers use far worse.
And have from about 1950.
But in another country, known for its harsh laws, the kid is a fool.
And he may well be, just that, an under achiever who fails to think.
He must know he is getting far more help than those we dropped on to death row over there,great job Federal police.
Sorry but there are users and users.
Some who over use are dead from the chin up.
Some are purely paranoid and will be forever.
For every it never hurt me story a human wreckage one can be found.
Well not it may be more like 20 good to one very bad.
I would not risk a 14 year old kid.

I heard on the news that they were moving the lad from deplorable conditions to another suitable place - translation " were moving the boy from cockroach infested conditions to a better place - rat infested conditions, at least his diet will be better cause rats are tastier"
Comment by tourist on barrier reef. “ I was thinking of going to Bali because it’s dirt cheap BUT… what price your safety, what piece of mind when most of the officials are corrupt, [ gee - sounds like Queensland ] you could be framed for anything because you are not delirious happy with everything. Because of human rights concerns, I won’t go near any near east, middle east, or far eastern country in a fit – I value my personal freedom more and don’t want to risk being bombed by people who get a slap on the wrist by authorities for killing a score of tourists. Stuff Bali and that region of the planet in general. If I had 2 lifetimes and a bucket load of money, I still wouldn’t be able to cover most of this big beautiful land and see all it’s wonders – why the hell do I won’t to go overseas and see something I can experience in an IMAX theatre and be certain I won’t get bombed, or shot, or mugged, or arrested for spitting on the footpath, then thrown in jail without representation, denied my rights, framed for a minor crime, convicted in absentia and sentenced to death ?.

Pepper I only got to the first sentence of your post.
Annoyingly uninformed.
And a WARNING.
Do not believe every thing you read.
The kid has been moved to A SHOW Place lock up.
2 years old I suspect its high class motel type rooms and services exist as a show case.
Far better than Australian refugee accommodation , it houses also about 35 illegal migrants on there way here,until stopped.
Indonesia, if it tried to interfere with Australian laws would rightly be condemned.
I condemn those who blame them for enforcing their laws in their country!

Talking of double standards...

"...if I were an Indonesian I would be shouting from the treetops about Australian double standards. The figures are elastic, but there are literally dozens of Indonesian teenagers imprisoned in Australian detention centres and jails, without charge, without trial, without hope."

http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/society-and-culture/hypocrisy-leaves-holes-in-the-kid-gloves-20111014-1lp30.html

"...a 15-year-old named Mukhtar was recruited from the even more remote island of Rote, a speck in the ocean near Timor. He was paid just $400. In late 2009 he was caught off Christmas Island, held for eight months in detention and then transferred to Hakea Prison, a maximum security adult jail in Perth. There he was kept in a section for ''protected prisoners'' who, almost certainly, included killers and child molesters. After a year and 11 months, a Perth court dismissed charges of people smuggling and he was sent home last Friday week. The $4 a day he'd been paid for prison work was taken from him to defray his airfare."

http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/politics/the-shame-we-keep-locked-away-20111021-1mc7p.html

But that's not the point here, is it. We're talking about an innocent young Australian lad, who through absolutely no fault of his own, found himself in Bali visiting a massage parlour and buying ganja, then completely accidentally boasting about it to anyone who'd listen

No comparison at all with uneducated Indonesian islanders maliciously crewing a boat so that their family might eat.

We can certainly hold our heads up high, can't we, with our feet set firmly on the moral high ground, and our judicial system the envy of all.

Well, perhaps not all.

North Korea, maybe.

individual and Hasbeen

Fourteen is a kid. Everyone is entitled to make some mistakes when they are young and have the opportunity to mature and learn from them. Locking up teenagers of that age serves no purpose and there are better ways than breeding a whole new generation of hardened crims. This kid has a drug problem and that is what should be the primary concern here not to lock him up and throw away the key.

King Hazza
I am not blaming the Indonesians for upholding their own laws but I think the age factor is relevant and in this case the method of entrapment (if that was the case). The viability of entrapment often comes a cropper in Court. The case of the young model was dismissed on just as flimsy grounds as any other drug case as is my understanding including the fact that she was in the company of a high profile member's son. That is the double standard but to be fair Indonesia is not alone in privilege assisting in release.

I cannot comment on the statistics you quoted unless I also know the percentages compared to the population (of nationals) and the numbers of tourists each year compated to arrests. For anyone who has been to Bali the actions of police do not seem to deter street dealers pushing sex or drugs. Of course if there was no market there would be no hawkers.

What about a reverse sting operation to rid the streets of drug dealers and peddlers of young children for sex. I know which approach I would be barracking for.

Those last two posts! I feel warm and comfy just seeing them,the understanding and well put together posts.
This morning wander in to our print media had me down.
I am baffled by the comments there.
Running Bali in to the ground telling us not to go near the place.
Public debate and comment in this country has much to answer for.
Who knows enough about this kid to name him saint or victim.
Any of us know a 14year old boy or girl out of control.
How dare we!
Tell a NATION, we will tell them how to run the laws in THEIR country!
Some comment we must except,is not well thought out.
Last, we have, here in SYDNEY and other capitals, seen sex slavery drugs by the tonne and Police in prison, even the highest level!
And still defame others?

Not really Pelican- 14 is a dubious age to classify as a 'kid', and we are not 'entitled to make mistakes'- it is arguably that sense of entitlement to actually do the wrong thing that is perhaps a great problem in our society.
And the fact that many cops may be corrupt and easy to bribe in Indonesia cannot fault the authorities for doing the right thing, and the fact is, they are clearly arresting more Indonesians for possession than they are Australians- and considering the number of Aussies likely engaging in illicit activity and drugs over there, they are, if anything, looking the other way for our benefit more than the locals.

For the next part, which is also an answer to antisceptic; the reason why Indonesians might consider narcotics and prostitution so bad is because by Australians going there and demanding these services, we are establishing potential mafias, pimps and other groups that could be a detriment to the local communities;
The fact that Bali went from a very nice place indeed 20 years ago into a dangerous, rundown, backwater slum to pander to the more hedonistic likes of Australia's modern Bali tourist rather sets a good example that the authorities may have a good reason to come down hard on these trades.

King Hazza
I would have no objection if the boy was an adult but it is hardly dubious to perceive 14 as a child. Children of that age do not have the legal rights of an 18 year old for good reason; not possessing the maturity to make adult decisions. The same should apply when they do wrong. They cannot vote, go to war, drive a car or imbibe alcohol.

The boy was not dealing drugs or smuggling drugs into or out of the country (as far as we know).

The problem with the rights of an adult Pelican is that again falls apart when in a foreign country;
A 14 year old may well be allowed to drive a car, a foreign 14 year old would not be allowed to vote anyway. In some countries where people are expected to grow up fast and help their family work, a 14 year old may well be regarded as an adult (and Indonesia seems to feel that way).

And the majority of those who would be a 'regular' 14 year old has the exact same mental faculties as an adult- they simply lack experience (and no, people do NOT actually need experience doing the wrong thing to know not to do it).

Now we're getting silly, King Hazza...

>>The problem with the rights of an adult Pelican is...<<

The comma is down there on the right hand side - no, not there, further in... got it? Excellent.

Mind you, I am sure that there are a lot of grown-up pelicans out there right now, hanging on your every word...

pelican,
So, 14 is a kid. Tell that to my bank manager so he can adjust the $30,000 to kid's money. That's how much 14 year old kids stole in equipment from me. Belive me even though they were only kids as you say it still feels very much like 30 grand to me. 14 is not a kid anymore,
they know the difference between right & wrong & that's the card they play. If they didn't know that smoking dope is wrong then why do they hide it ?

Which part is silly Pericles?
You can't expect all countries to share our ideas of when 'adulthood' starts and when a person is expected to be held responsible for their actions any more than you can expect another country to agree on what should be a crime and what an appropriate punishment is.