Wrong (yet) again, Arjay.

>>Govts over borrowed.What a load of rubbish! These scamming banks we all know and they now admit to it, create money from thin air with the click of a computer mouse and express it as debt to Govts individuals and Corps.<<

What is the force that causes the banks to "create money from thin air", as you describe it?

It is (drum roll please) "Govts individuals and Corps" asking for a loan.

The money can only be "expressed as debt" if someone borrows it.

What would be the point of taking the trouble to "create money from thin air" if there was no-one around who wanted to borrow it? How would you enter it into your accounts? Elementary bookkeeping should tell you that for every debit there is a credit and vice versa.

This unfortunately demonstrates most clearly the illusions that you and one under god suffer under. You seem to have this impression that Banks merrily create currency on a whim. They don't. It is in response to demand, and the amount that they may lend is managed by the rules that govern prudential reserves.

The problems we are presently working through, globally, is that too many "Govts individuals and Corps" have borrowed beyond their capacity to repay. Should the Banks have refused them their loans? In some cases, yes, and the hiding of risk through the construction of tradeable instruments with fancy debt ratings did not help. The present restructuring of overblown borrowings is conducted by realigning risk, boosting capital underpinnings, and revaluing the loans themselves.

But back to the point: some "Govts individuals and Corps" have over-borrowed.

Fact.

And for you, one under god...

>>plenty to ridicule there ol pal<<

Too much, I'm afraid. Even if I could understand what you are waffling on about. But I will say once more that your idea that the problem is solved by using coins is, frankly, way beyond fantasy.

ridicules..""You seem to have this impression that Banks merrily create currency on a whim. They don't. It is in response to demand, and the amount that they may lend..is managed by the rules that govern prudential reserves.""

prudential reserves..a nice sounding solidity
be honest we are talking about fractions..in reserve
like 2..or 3 percent..that now they need to get up to 12%

reserves lol
held in govt bonds..[taking a 'haircut']

thing is the money wasnt there..[till someone begged for it]
then as arjay says it was made from as much as nuthin..[ie a book entry of a debt..payable at intrest..

based on a valuation..that has been greatly distorted..
by eaasy money/credit...[then..in the hard times
even the assets values will fall;..

for proof look at what usa housing prices have done]



""The problems we are presently working through, globally, is that too many "Govts individuals and Corps" have borrowed beyond their capacity to repay.""

or on the persumption govts can simply sell off assets
or increase chasrges for services indefinatly[well cant get blood out of a stone...;paying with intrsst bearing credit cards isnt sustainable..its danger

""Should the Banks have refused them their loans?"'

bankers deal;ing in local govt funds
shouldnt..have a right to refuse govt..acces to all its own funds..intrst free..!

think of it as community service
not bankers decree..govt controling finance
not bankers controling govt

""yes, and the hiding of risk
through the construction of tradeable instruments
with fancy debt ratings did not help.""

it gave a faulse impression of reality
deliberatly done to create a AAA+ product..to sell to super funds
[to steal away our compulsory super contributions..recieving less than bank intrest]

'"The present restructuring of overblown borrowings
is conducted by realigning risk,""

yes so those bankers
who defrauded us..get their bonus
and the tax payers cop the debt

""boosting capital underpinnings,""

to the crimanal bankers

""and revaluing
the loans themselves."'

not bad..they got monery for nuthing but a book entry
then the intrest on it..now get repaid the debt in full
and the peoples debt has doubled up..[trippled]

""some "Govts individuals and Corps" have over-borrowed.""

gee that's big of you
so why bail them fools out?
only to HAVE to bail them out again next year
only to bail them out again the year after..and after that

as the debt grows bigger and bigger
time the scam ended

show me how real money was lent?
it wasnt..govt is the best able to make ITS OWN MONEY FROM NOTHING
[and to hell with ursury]

Fact.
""your idea that the problem is solved by using coins is,
frankly,..way beyond fantasy.""

mate a sixpence contained 2.83 grams of sterling silver
[ie value..around 8 bucks][in 1965..!]

in 1966..a five cent piece
contains 2.83 grams of nickle
today worth 7 cents..

[no wonder they want to get rid of 5 cent pieces]
then 10..next 20..then 50 then in time even the one and two dollar

then all you got is cyber credit
[held by bankers..to at their whim..make it anything they damm well chose...at their whim your broke]..[at their whim your a billionair]

we cant trust them now..how much can we trust them tomorrow?
thats what your defending

as the bbc pointed out last night
the bankers are taking a haircut..[right]
but the non bankers are getting all the bond value...
bying it at a 60% discount][yet their getting their payment in full]

so bankers sell to their non bank mates
and the derivitivers traders
NOT ADDING ANY VALUE AT ALL
get a rich bonus

but why bother explaining to a know it all
who cant even see coin has the only real value

the conastitutioon says it must be
the ONLY legal tender for payment of debt

a bond is like a post dated check
[with checks..they require signing...[and by signing..
the obligation to repay the ammount..falls upon the last that signed it as having value]..so its buyer be ware..dont sign a legal contract

of truth bonds traders trade in nothing but a promise
that falls due on the last one who sold it

More detail please one under god.

>>as the bbc pointed out last night
the bankers are taking a haircut..[right]
but the non bankers are getting all the bond value...
bying it at a 60% discount][yet their getting their payment in full]<<

I think you may have grabbed onto the wrong end of the stick, but as you don't provide a link or a reference, it is difficult to be sure.

Who are buying the bonds?

as the 'bankers'..are 'taking the haircut
the bond traders...who funny enough control both ends of the bonds
are bying them up..at half price..[ie the haircut price]

knowing yet other bonds..underwrite their full value
i heard it on bbc..who has yet further intrsting reveal last night

but why bother trying to explain things to you
oh clever one

will you be one of the bond holders that cleans up big time
or will your bonds be the ones greece defaults on..next january

the problem isnt as much with the bankers
but those trading in bonds..especially bonds underwriting other bonds

[no one except tha rating agencies..knows which 'bonds' are really junk status..and which have been sold into your super]

mate i dont like talking about the money changers
id rather talk of rev 22.2..[the inspiration for the wikiseed
which led to the coinage revaluation fix]..[you laugh at]

till that one day you need to sell those junk asets
[and what better than a sound money base..based on a hemp seed]

but you dont want to help me explain..and im over trying to explain
to get to rev 22;3..we need to do rev 22;2

anyhow listen to bbc
last nights..world have your say..was intresting too

but im sick of loosing sleep over the whole issue

ps even the 'bank' haircut
ends in a bailout..for the full ammount
ie is really the next banker bailout..[bbc last night said the bank guarentes alone cost britons 100 billion a year]

best we do klike when russia went bust
disperse the assets..[each gets a fair share]
after all their super and taxes..paid for all of it

before the bwankers..tear it all down
for pennies on the pound..and kill any hope of a 'consumer led recovery'