The current World Theme is, "Baning Greenhouse Gasses." I solidly agree with this sentiment. Excessive Greenhouse gasses are bad for the planet. There is, though, a need to have some of these gasses in the enviroment, in the right proportions, for the planet to work efficiently in order to sustain life in it's many forms.

CO2 has copped a really bad wrap of late, but it's not the worst GHG there is. Methane tops the list as the worst by a long shot. Yet, I have heard very little mention of Methane in the many discusions in this forum. Much research is being done on ways to expedite the removal of CO2 from the atmosphere, but very little to reduce Methane.

A little aside here. I have a 1999 Diahatsu Handivan, in the Owners Manual the is a section on Emission Control. I Quote, "The 3 way Catalyst. The 3 way Catalyst functions to convert CO, HC's & NOx into harmless Carbon Dioxide (CO2), Water (H2O) & Nitrogen (N2)." So 12 years ago CO2 was considered HARMLESS. How things change.

Most people in this forum associate CO2 with Heavy Industry, Such as Coal Fires Power Stations & Vechicle Emissions. However there is another industry that pours great amounts of CO2 into the atmosphere on purpose & most people, in the Western World, support this industry whole heartedly. In fact, I have never heard anyone complain about the size of this this industry huge contribution to CO2 pollution at all. Cont.

Cont.

The Carbonated Water Industry. I have done some crude estimations, or Best Guess. There is an estimated 9.6 billion people on this planet. If 1/2 of them have daily access to Carbonated Water then that's 4.8 billion people. If half of them drink one standard carbonated can per day that's 2.4 billion people drinking 2.4 billion cans. Carbonated water contains , according to the book, "Carbonated Soft Drink Formulation & Manufacture" Steern & Ashurst. Carbonated Water is produced using Carboloc Acid, it is not pulled out of the atmosphere at the bottleing plant.

There are 1.98 Grams of CO2 disolved in 1 Liter of Carbonated Water. That's .7425 grams/375 ml can. Using simple maths. 2.4 billion cans by .7425 grams gives 1782 Tons/day or 650875.5 Tons/year of CO2, in a crude estimate, being poured into the Atmosphere every year by the Carbonated Water industry. Will YOU stop buying Soft Drinks Or Beer in order to save the planet or is that too much to ask? Or, is this another, "I don't want to know about it." problem.

good points jayb

lets not forget that home compost produces methane
[tax them greenies with worm farms]

how about nitrogen..80 times as bad as c02
you know nitrogen..that makes that nice green salad

farmers use lots of it...in making soy
and worse is that 60%..of all nitrogen applied onto crops
turns into nitrous oxide..[120 times worse than a c02 'part per million]

then we come to that solar cell cleaner
hundreds of times worse than c02

and the list goes on
but so too the collective ignorances

i note the normal carbon tax cheer squad is mute with guilt
abbot if he really didnt want the tax would raise these questions in parlement

that he dont
reveals he is just a mr no..[too]
he wants the tax..but wants to be seen as opposing it more

so when he goes the double disolution
workers will once again resent,,the new tax and the new laws his election will raise..[but those running the 2 party scam..will say well done allround]

and still the party blindness
from the party lotalists refuse to face the ugly truth

this is about the next the cut for workers
that cuts their wage

recall gst..10% cut in wage
recall compulsory super to bailout the investers[running the 2 pary scam]
10%..cut in workers wage

ditto the carbon tax
dont befoooled that only 1000..[oops sorry only 500 will pay
and that 9/10 will get extra..the darn tax is indexed

meaning its going to grow at inflation rate FOREVER
based on spin and lies

look at the big number
the carbon tax is going to cost 70 BILLION..to get rid of

who is paying that LOSS of income

the mug workers
ie larratters/liberals greenies alike

next tax the other GREENhouse gasses
more tradeable commodies..[thin air]

silence is guilt?

Had to look up "baning" in the dictionary.

Found this:

"Verb

baning: Present participle of bane."

OK

Looking further:

"Noun

bane (plural banes)

A cause of misery or death; an affliction or curse

The bane of my existence"

Heh, heh, heh.

Kill CO2 NOW.

I get it!

Yes..., I know. I saw it as soon as I pressed send. :-( One of those thing. It's what I tell my wife, She is the boon of my bane. Old Scottish saying. The joy of my misery.

Came up with some others.
Humans breath out 9.6 million tons of CO2 per year. Not counting what all the animals contribute.
Oxy/Acet creates CO2 & burns up O2 lowering the amount of O2 in the atmosphere, thereby increasing the percentage of CO2.

JayB

>> She is the boon of my bane. Old Scottish saying. The joy of my misery. <<

Love it.

What say you about this:

" From the mountainous Southwest deep into Texas, wildfires raced across parched landscapes this summer, burning millions more acres. In Colorado, at least 15 percent of that state’s spectacular aspen forests have gone into decline because of a lack of water.

The devastation extends worldwide. The great euphorbia trees of southern Africa are succumbing to heat and water stress. So are the Atlas cedars of northern Algeria. Fires fed by hot, dry weather are killing enormous stretches of Siberian forest. Eucalyptus trees are succumbing on a large scale to a heat blast in Australia, and the Amazon recently suffered two “once a century” droughts just five years apart, killing many large trees.

Experts are scrambling to understand the situation, and to predict how serious it may become.

Scientists say the future habitability of the Earth might well depend on the answer. For, while a majority of the world’s people now live in cities, they depend more than ever on forests, in a way that few of them understand. "

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/01/science/earth/01forest.html?tntemail0=y&_r=1&emc=tnt&pagewanted=all

Ammonite: Experts are scrambling to understand the situation, and to predict how serious it may become. The devastation extends worldwide. The future habitability of the Earth might well depend on the answer.

This has happened throughout the history of the Earth. The only difference now is that humans are here & modern humans don't like change.

Homo Sapien wouldn't be here but for a world wide drought that lasted 2 thousand years. Homo Sapiens split into 2 groups from the Horn of Africa & one group went went west to Western Africa. The other to Southern Africa. When the drought shifted West & South & the Centre became green again Homo Sapien came back together to begin what we have become today. Let's look at changing Earth. 12000 years ago the Sahara Desert was a swamp & Nigera was a Desert. The centre of Australia was an inland sea but you could walk to Papua New Guniea.

The Earth changes all the time. One area becomes Desert, another becomes filled with lush vegetation. All this happens over hundreds of years. Plants & animals, including Humans, shift & adapt. Such is our nature.

Now modern Man has become selfish & refuses to change. Demanding that Nature changes to suit man. Do you think that is going to happen? Yair right! Big Business has built down to the sea. It has cost them copious amounts of MONEY. Now they will lose that when it is flooded.

That's what driving this Carbon debate. Not the change itself.

Without going to all the trouble of researching the source, I think
you will find that the CO2 used in drinks is a byproduct of another process.
That which does not go to the bottlers would be releasd to atmosphere.

Anyway, it appears that there is no agreement internationally on co2
and China and India are simply not going to agree to any restriction.
Therefore it is pointless us doing anything so save our money.
We will need it for the transition to a new energy regime.
That is far more important.

Bazz: it is pointless us doing anything so save our money.
We will need it for the transition to a new energy regime.
That is far more important.

I agree Bazz. The sooner the transition to Alternate Power the better. Unfortunately it can't be done over night. The transition will take at least 50 years in the West. Maybe it can be done sooner in 3rd World countries. 3 world countries don't have a large Oil driven infrastructure. Alternate Energies could be put in place without upsetting the status quo of the Power Conglomerates , as would happen in the West. There the West could experiment with various Alternate Energies & perfect the ones that work well. The transition would be slower in the West as cleaner technology replaces older polluting technologies that have worn out & need replacing.

This will mean a change in Wall street as happened in the 1920 but, if managed correctly, without the crash, but somehow I don't think so. I can see the Energy Conglomerates resisting change to their power base & refusing to pass the batton to someone else.

Actually Carbon Dioxide is not the "worst" greenhouse gas. The "worst" is water vapour. See table from Wikipedia:

Water vapor H2O 36 – 72 %
Carbon dioxide CO2 9 – 26 %
Methane CH4 4 – 9 %
Ozone O3 3 – 7 %

To eliminate "Global Warming" you must reduce the amount of water vapour in the atmosphere. As oceans comprise about 70% of the earth's surface, the easiest way is to cover the oceans with a thin film of paraffin, thus stopping evaporation. Of course, you will also stop the oceans being aerated, killing all fish life. You also stop rain (dry atmosphere = no rain) but you can't win every time.

And methane is created by all rotting vegetation, so it is better to burn off the forests rather than let the leaves, twigs and trees rot.

Use CFC aerosols to destroy the ozone layer, and you reduce global warming from that source. Lets in harmful ultraviolet rays. Pity.

Perhaps it is best just to let the earth warm in the normal cycle to the same temperatures it had in the Middle Ages and Roman times.

Final thought - all the carbon in coal and carbon dioxide in chalk and limestone were once in the atmosphere before plants and animals took it out. No catastrophic warming then, hence we cannot create one now.