Australia is unique in many ways, especially in its native animals.
It is also subject to drought and harsh conditions generally and these have helped to produce a unique animal, the kangaroo.

An animal which can fight predators, travel great distances to water, thrive on native vegetation and pasture and does not degrade its habitat.
Can carry its young when travelling or if there is any danger and can regulate its birth rate to suit prevailing nutritional conditions.

Its meat is very low in fat and tasty and its skin makes superb leather; both for shoes and garments.

Why is this resource not farmed for human consumption?
Why does Australia continue its love affair with mutton and beef and consequent harm to the enviorenment?
Why do we relegate this rich food resource to the specialty market and to dog food production?

Is Mise, farming is a problem in that the cost of Kangaroo proof fences would be large, as well as disruptive to wildlife. Roos are currently harvested, under culling quotas, for human consumption. you will find roo on many menus around the country but most of the meat is exported.
Animal rights groups have curtailed the expansion of roo meat to a certain extent by the "how can you eat your national emblem" arguement.

Probably the most important reason is that our meat animals like cattle, have been bred over thousands of years specifically for meat production and not for hopping at 60clicks.

Rojo
You are right Kangaroo meat is available here in AU and exported worldwide. There is not much meat for human consumption on a carcass so most of it ends up as pet food.

To put it in simple words Kangaroos are wild spirits and can not be farmed, herded and transported like domesticated animals.

Kangaroos are docile territorial animals but because of the ongoing culling and the drought they have to move on to survive.

Kangaroos are under a lot of pressure from culling, drought, loss of habitat, fires, floods and other elements.
Kangaroos raise one joey per year.

Kangaroos footprints make good seedbeds for our native plants.
They keep the grass other animals can not eat low and therefore lower the fire hazards.

They can suffer from diseases that can wipe out a whole mob- like blindness, Coccidiosis, Lumpy Jaw disease, Toxoplasmosis, Myopathy a Vitamin E defieciency and many other diseases.

If you keep on killing only the largest males and females you risk to wipe out a strong and healthy gene-pool. This is already happening and scientifically proven with fish.

The nature of the cruelty inflicted on kangaroos can not be ignored.
The fact is that thousands of kangaroos are shot every night.
Maimed animals do not receive a mercy shot when they get away and die a slow and agonizing cruel death.
Joeys depend on their mother for up to 24 months. When the joey loses its mother it loses its life line.
Let’s talk about what happens to the joeys, shall we?
The joeys still in pouch and fully dependent on their mother are being bashed to death with an iron bar, or bashed against the bull bar of the car etc. or just left to die an agonizing slow death, only to be eaten alive by predators, or ants.
Older joeys fully out of pouch and depending on their mother die of shock, depravation, starvation, exposure to the elements, or are being killed by predators incl. dogs etc. etc.

Its worth having a look at http://www.awpc.org.au/

Antje Struthmann

I buy Kangaroo meat all the time. The roasts are great and I use kangaroo mince isntead of beef mince.

If the cost of fencing is prohibitive, we need a different approach to farming them. Either larger farms so fencing costs less per unit area, or we need to manage them as we manage our fisheries.

Actually Kangaroos can have up to 3 joeys on the go at once - an embryo, one in the pouch and an older semi-independent joey. They can produce milk of differing qualities to suit them all.

The difficulties with farming roos is the problem with fencing, combined with general handling. Eg they must be shot - cant be herded onto trucks and taken to the abbatoirs. This effectively puts a cap on how many can be culled -I doubt you could replace beef and lamb. The more you shoot at a herd, the flightier they get (naturally) - professional shooters know this and manage their runs accordingly.

Also you face the disease problems - these cant be effectively controlled in a wild population and let me tell you that I dont fancy trying to get a mob into the yards to drench them!! Dogs are next to useless as a handling tool, as roos can kill them quite easily.

Perhaps going forward we can gradually domesticate the roo?? A job for the genetic engineers??

It does seem rather logical to go with what works best.. Roos for meat and leather products.

I suppose in some ways we are culturally set in our ways with beef and mutton. We tend to define ourselves in terms of the things we eat and its not easy changing direction mid life.

Speaking of animals and what comes naturally, I hope you will all have a look at this 'David and GOLIATH' vid and see where the dog 'bull terrier' gets its name from.
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=f1e4b_4607

One man owes his life to a doggy which deserves the Victoria Cross for bravery above and beyond the call of duty.
And Pericles has the nerve to suggest that the keeping of domestic pets is 'SLAVERY' ? sheesh.

paleif, sorry not much into the emotional arguement. I certainly don't condone the injuries that some roos suffer. The professional shooters I've had on the farm have been just that, professional. I've not come across any suffering casualties. I'm pleased that in the culling process the resource is not wasted and that someone benefits financially, even though it's not me. Apart from less crop being eaten.
Knocking the joey on the head is a humane response. I've had to do it with the odd roo we hit on the road. Don't usually keep a gun in the car to do otherwise.

Freediver, in a way we already do manage roos like our fisheries. A permit is required to take them and the roos are free to go where they wish.

Rojo.
No its ok its just that I thought it best to back off this a little the libbers hunt us down with their protests AGAINST pale
To be really honest we had meeting with head of Roo company.
.
Would like somebody start a roo ranch. Tap into some of the hundreds of dollars available for regional areas especially aboriginal people.

Some of those places go for thousands of hecters. Build some accomadation for Roo Rangers and eventually a value adding plant on a few.
The ranger and his family would be charged with keeping track on the mob and hand feed to quiten them

Then we would ask Mark CEO RSPCA to support silences being used when it comes to the cull.
That endures less tress and more for the profeshional shooter as they dont flee..
They just stand there - pop pop [ its kinder.

Also pay for some fencing and double up on the Roo Ranches with vegetables etc for the overseas people who would be interested to pay the family with a partnership into exports.

Had a good meeting with John kelly but time and 'others to help set it up" is the killer.

Joyes should be shot or given to carers.

I DONT approve of smashing their heads in on the side of the truck.
yes I have seen it.
Neither do I approve of the massive trade in USA to sell them as pets by the way.
We would like it made a law that roos are ONLY shot by profeshonal shooters.
The way to do that is to pay the farmer . That way it will stop a lot of the farmers shooting to maim only so the roo does not die on his proporty - but instead hops away and dies slowly of lead poison
.
If you know anybody in your area and you are far enough out it would be interesting to kick one off.

Although it would be easier to start the first few in QLD because of Mark it could be done elsewhere.

My problem is time.

Roo Ranches for Tourism

The possibilties of doubling up on the useage of Roo ranches are endless.
There is huge world wide interest in aboriginal art and paintings and kangaroos.
No reason why some training work shops could not be put into place for upholsters and there are a million other things that can be made from Roo hide.ie Shoes key rings etc.

Eventually accomadtion could be built and the Ranger could give tours which would serve to quiten the heard. Water placement is possible in many areas.
There is enormous interest in Roo from Russia. However if somebody wanted to take this on as a progect there really is enough funding in the regional kitty to start it.

Of course you would have to be invited by the people of the area and the Elders. It would be THEIR progect no ifs and buts.

It would be wonderful if anybody out there is interested to kick something off as a polite progect. Once you had one up and running I am sure others would follow.
It would be neccessary and a great advantage to work with the profeshional Roo people and shooters.

If the Roo Ranch Rangers could also make arrangments to see the other farms within the next five hundred miles then everybody could be paid.
Once the profeshional had most places covered and the farmers were happy being paid for a change we could Ban the cruel weekend so called SPORTSMEN and WOMEN who make me sick.

They do more damage and are far more cruel than the Roo profeshional shooter.
Anybody who thinks its fun to shoot an animal and leave it there just for the sake needs the old side of the truck treatment.
Personally I would lOVE to have another farm to take these so called members of the public just having a bit of fun! sport. There is not much sport in it for the an animal!

Listen to the gun lobbiests . I am away for a few days[ Think I will head for the hills myself.

Boaz, you will say absolutely anything to take a pot-shot, won't you?

>>One man owes his life to a doggy which deserves the Victoria Cross for bravery above and beyond the call of duty.
And Pericles has the nerve to suggest that the keeping of domestic pets is 'SLAVERY' ? sheesh.<<

Even for you, that is utterly pathetic.

For a start, the dog was patently not anyone's domestic pet, so that part goes straight out of the window.

But the main thing is that the dog was not actually fighting the bull in order to protect the man - take another look at the video and you will see that the dog was i) joining in a bit of fun and games with a bull, then ii) continuing the fun and games long after the guy had cut and run. Note that he went back for more after being shaken off the first time. He was actually enjoying himself.

No "bravery above and beyond the call of duty" - there was no duty involved.

But since you introduced the video (and I'm not sure of its relevance to the subject - it looks like you simply wanted to get in a cheap shot), what are your views on the actions of the guy who was saved by the "doggy"? Is bull-baiting a pastime of yours as well?

This has absolutely nothing to do with the practice of keeping animals as pets, and you know it.

Sheeesh, indeed.

Pericles

I couldnt resist just before I leg it out the door.

It is not uncommon for a dog to continue to attack the offender.

Despite the fact the man was free it would be normal for the dog to continue the attack until the bull withdrew.

Lets hope the guy went back and gave his hero a really good home and wormed him and fed him.

Perhaps a nice fire place to keep him warm in the winter and lots of daily runs in the park

I hope so anyway.

Does anybody know what happend to the bull?

I would like to think that some of the libbers gave him a nice home too.
After all the bull probably has seen the cruel rodoes and bull fighting world wide.

The poor bull.

Perhaps you could find out what happend to him

Hello freediver and Country gal.

The kangaroo can have a neonate waiting to be born when the mother animal loses her joey in pouch. and yes she can have an older joey at heal that depends on her for guidance teaching protection etc. for up to 24 months or more.
Because the joey occupies the pouch for up to 12 months before it emerges leaves the pouch temporary the female Kangaroo is only able to raise one joey at a time seldom twins.
The time the joey can spend in its mothers pouch depends on the mother animal. and on the macropod species.
The time the male offspring spends with his mother depends on the bond they have. Some males leave at the age of 18 months some stay with their mums much much longer.
The girls stay with their mums as they learn from her how to raise their own offspring(s).
Like the juvenile boys have their boys-club the females have their group and baby sit their closed relatives’ offspring. Some males are very gentle with the emerging or at heel joeys. They are more tolerant having these youngsters around then females are.
Kangaroos have a very unique, tied and complicated family structure and the mob members are keeping an eye on each other.
Kangaroos have a hierarchical structure and a pecking order. There is not enough space to get deeper into their lives.

The point is that the mob structure is being destroyed and the gene pool with it. Over the years the size of the animals has been reduced and the ones real big animals have been wiped out. Now smaller animals have to be culled to make up for the quota to export the meat overseas.

The kangaroo should not and can not compete with domesticated animals.
It takes far too long to mature.
As you perhaps can now understand the Kangaroo can not reproduce at the rate its being destroyed in some areas especially where the weekend shooter[public] are allowed. Especially where the big ones are the main target. It requuires a national approach.
Antje

Don't disagree with a word, People.

>>It is not uncommon for a dog to continue to attack the offender.
Despite the fact the man was free it would be normal for the dog to continue the attack until the bull withdrew.<<

Except that the dog was not defending the man.

He was attacking the bull.

Boaz sees the "doggy" in the light of a loyal household pet.

I see it as a homeless stray, with no allegiance to any family or individual, having a bit of playful fun with a bull.

Watch the video again, it is as plain as the nose on your face.

Have a gander at this news item from WA
http://www.thewest.com.au/default.aspx?MenuID=28&ContentID=22921
Keep up the good work folks but how did household pets get into it?
Wow! I thought that I was good at getting OT, but...

Here's an interesting page:

http://www.kangaroo-industry.asn.au/media/ki_med_kit_gen.html

I happen to know Professor Grigg of UQ, who supports responsible kangaroo harvesting and if that guy doesn't know about kangaroo ecology, noone does.

It also provides research dollars to go into conservation efforts, and there's precious little of those going around these days.

The Shooters Party has issued a platform for the NSW election, which includes a proposal to bring in legislation to allow recreational hunters to assist landowners with kangaroo control and use the skin and meat of culled kangaroos.

I believe this is pretty sensible, because at present there is really no control over the way kangaroos are culled. As someone who lived in far western NSW for some time, I know that a large number of farmers don't worry too much about getting tags. Particularly when the numbers are up, as I've seen them in good seasons,with roos thicker than fleas on a dog's back.

Roos shot this way are left to rot, and this is a dreadful waste of the excellent meat, rich in protein and low in fat. The numbers need to be reduced, because since man opened up western NSW and created waterholes and things, roos have the water they need to be able to travel further and breed more readily -- at least when there's no drought. In drought I've seen overblown roo populations starve to death. Letting hunters do the job (in line with a quota but with less bureaucratic nonsense) and then use the meat and skins would surely create a much better-managed and balanced control program, which would benefit the roo population itself?

Welbury80

Retailed as mjaso, kangaroo meat is being used in Russia to solve that country's domestic meat shortages. In fact, Russia is the biggest overseas market for kangaroo meat and now consumes over 45% of all kangaroo which is exported.

PALEIF, can you give me some references for that info on growth rates and size issues. There is a similar problem with fisheries management.

Also, are you aware of the damage done to our land by cattle etc? They are really not suited.

Free Driver
Are you aware of bush fires? Or the fact that what few fresh water creeks we have left are clogged up with vines that have overgrown.
Or how about the fact that the National Parks are now so fuled with old growth that we cant control our bush fires?
All these things were once controled by those cattle you claim do so much damage?
So what do you suggest. We ban cattle?
Ever occured to you we only share this earth with other creatures?

As for figures on Roo I will see what I can do. One thing for sure you cant trust the Government or industry to deliver figures.

Fish -we have allowed other to fish us out for the last sixty years and did nothing about it.

I recall the Fenton Island[ Maclay River] area and still remember hearing the small fishing boats going around and around 24hours a day non stop. They used to come off the bigger ships.

Myself and my cousin who was a third generation owner complained bitterly even way back then to authoritys about this illegal fishing. Nobody cared. Nobody did anything. The even eventually shot all the ducks and wild life but still nothing was done.
We are fished out. We are such a clever country!

We need many more fish farms because Australia is getting almost all its fish from overseas. Homebrand Baked beans are made in UAE.
When they block our ships from going in and out and it will happen people MIGHT realise that they can quickly become a third world country.,
Yes Roo meat is very big in Russia to the person who mentioned that.
Perciles.
Look whatever you like.
I just hope the dog was given a good home as I already mentioned to you earlier.
Maybe hey he was peed off because the bull was near his tree. You know the territory thing.
I am easy to get along with.
Thats Ok with me too.