Sonofgloin,
We do have a plan A, it was, and is, the deliberate demise of our manufacturing industries and the making of us reliant almost entirely on the import of manufactured goods. Your, ex army, uncle was right in what he said about the capabilities of our industry and still is so today. But it is not just about any war effort, disruptions to imported goods would have dire consequences for much of the population, whatever the cause.

The implementation of plan A, beginning about the 1970s and endorsed by both major parties, caused massive unemployment for many as industries shut or moved overseas. I would like to see Belly's opinion about that.

Yabby does not think we need a plan B because he maintains we simply purchasse from other sourses. To a limited degree he may be right, it seems to me it would be wise to have key elements of manufacture up our sleeve so we could easily build on that when needed.

Have yet to see any indication of this.

Yabby also says that some other countries are smart in training their own skilled workers, so where is the critisism of our governments and industry for neglecting this. Instead we poach essential workers from countries that likely need them more than us.

When things go pear shaped others will look after their own first and so must we.

Yabby it amazes me that you and Belly sit on ideological opposites and you both believe there is no way back, but neither of you see that the right government and a national will can see us right up there with the likes of Singapore.

You two remember Singapore that little island famous for the gin slings at Raffles. Forty years ago under the Colombo plan they dreamed of coming to Australia but they don't dream of that anymore, now we have Afghanis and Tamils, they can't get into Singapore you see.

Yabby:>> We were never self sufficient Sonofgloin and we never can be,
especially with increased manufacturing specialisation.<<

That’s right, we can’t be trained but the third world dirt farmer could. Can I remind you of what hopeless little Australia has produced?
Lord Howard Florey: Medical researcher
Sir Frank Macfarlane Burnet: immunology and virology
Professor Dorothy Hill: geology and palaeontology
Professor Robert Street: development and properties of magnetic materials
Professor David Craig: Theoretical chemistry
Professor Brian Anderson: control systems; signal processing; telecommunications
Professor Richard Stanton: metallic ore deposits; volcanic and metamorphic geochemistry
Dr Patricia Woolley: Zoology

and some inventions:
The Combine Harvester, Permaculture, orbital combustion engine,
Variable Ratio Rack & Pinion Steering, Hills Hoist, the Electric Drill,
differential gears for cars, Black Box Flight Recorder, Inflatable Aircraft Escape Slide,
The Two Stroke Lawn Mower, Latex Gloves, Shepherd's Castors, garage roller door,
salt water chlorination, Xerox Photocopying, Refrigeration, Wine Cask,
Electronic Heart Pacemaker, The Bionic Ear, Aspro,The Humidicrib,
Spray-on-skin, Thrust Bearing, Samba software,Uniloc Software Protection,
Internet WiFi or Wireless,Google Maps.

Not bad for starters, I could have gone on and on.


Yabby:>> Note countries like Germany, Switzerland etc. Still large exporters with large manufactuing facilities. They focus on training their youth, if not to university, in one trade or another. Virtually
nobody just leaves school, planning to flip burgers for a living.<<

"The unemployment rate for those under the age of 25 in the European Union reached 21.4 percent in December, according to statistics released by Eurostat, the EU's statistics office."...from Duetche Welle today http://www.dw-world.de/dw/article/01,,5194867,00.html

Germany has a youth unemployment rate of 20% that they are admitting to, I would add another 10% in real terms and Spain are admitting to 42% so the sky is the limit in real terms, perhaps none of their kids work. Yabby there is no positive story for the previous first world; we are all going down at the same rate that the East is raising, spectacularly.

Banjo:>> Yabby does not think we need a plan B because he maintains we simply purchasse from other sourses. To a limited degree he may be right,<<

Banjo a quick pole:
Is Yabby smart; yes
Is Yabby right to a limited degree; no
Is Banjo closer to reality than Yabby; yes

POLE CLOSED

Yabby not trying to look like a wise man from the east, in fact that saying comes from dumb men of the west.
But time and again we agree, in this thread you look brilliant/outstanding in relation to some.
Australian education is not ill,we produce,and have for 3 decades, fodder for hight tec industry's all over the world, our graduates.
Who says we are standing still?
Manufacturing , ok we are seeing job loss, it hurts us all, this trade unionist never likes that.

But without WORLD TRADE, this country starves be certain of that.
We gain more than the losses in WT.
Be fair dinkum, come with me to the big tin shed,see the empty corner shops hardware that served us well.
But do not lie would you buy at the tin shed or pay three times the price from a corner shop.
World trade is not interested in paying more to buy our made goods Australia is not either.
In my state government departments import Chinese rain wear rather than buying Australian.
Show me one developed country any one, that has not got the same concerns thrown around here AMERICANS FOR A START
Then show me a country you would rather live than here.
I am sickened by the outbreak of rubbish about this country, no country suits me more and its called AUSTRALIA not PARADISE.

*Germany has a youth unemployment rate of 20% that they are admitting to*

Err so what? Youth arn't much good in most jobs, until you bother
to train them. Youth might also have to learn that there won't
always be a job next door, move to where the work is.

Yes, Australia has produced some bright people and inventions.
It will continue to do that. Just last week Austal, an Australian
company, won a major tender to build US warships. They are busy
sending off another 100 million $ ferry to Scandinavia, built
right here in Fremantle. But a great deal of their workers are
457 workers, Aussies don't want the jobs.

To some degree Australia suffers from Saudi disease. Saudis own
the oil, but most of their skilled jobs or crappy jobs are done
by foreigners. Saudis get it too easy from the Saudi Govt, so
some of them think they don't need to do real work and make a living.

Some of our kids have been given everything and have grown up in
the lucky country. They can go surfing, do whatever, they are looked
after. They think that life owes them a living, not the other way
around. They don't want the welding jobs, or the meatworks jobs.
They want to be the managing director! Just like Saudis.

Singapore kids are taught quite different values and their island
thrives in a world of free trade.