Suze. You said:

"It is, unfortunately, notoriously difficult to get convictions if the victim is not also physically injured as well, providing corroborating evidence."

There's examples of false accusations. Such as the one recently. It shouldn't be easy to convict accused.

...and you said:

"I guess what I was trying to say was that even drunk people out there having fun should not be labelled as 'asking for it' if they are raped and bashed while drunk."

Short of predator attackers - which in my context are triggered by various other things and go hunting for victims, ie: the most drunk, or fit a certain profile and are attacked using drugs etc - there are generally a PLETHORA of warnings and actions by both people involved before it gets to the rape itself. Be aware of those warnings. Have friends watching out for you. Don't get too drunk. Don't OVER flirt. Don't be afraid to be stern and bail if you're getting bad vibes, etc etc.

"They asked for it" generally means to me that they didn't make good decisions. Such as excessive speeding. They are "asking" for an accident.

Suzie I made it quite clear in my post that I was refering to situations where someone was making their sexual interest clear.

There is no defense of the rape or the rapist, this is not about someone being grabbed off the street or being assualted by a taxi driver or attacked in some other situation where the risks were not clearly elevated. Being drunk in an isolated situation with someone else who is also drunk and who is clearly sexually interested is a dumb move if taht interest is not mutual regardless of how the rest of us would like the world to be. Risky on both sides because people don't make their best decisions when drunk.

It's about people who deliberately choose to put themselves in risky situations and sometimes seem to keep making the same choices even after they have gone wrong. Both sides of this are making silly choices if they don't like the risks.

R0bert

"Strays" isn't an offensive term. I think that people who would choose to get offended over that term have an unhealthy attitude towards sexuality.

Its the amount of malicious misinterpretation that goes into defending the 'never blame the victim' taboo that I find so annoying.
Kerri-Anne actually said "They put themselves in serious potential danger — they have to learn that". Karen Willis chose to turn this into "This idea that how a person dresses or behaves or whether or not they've had a drink and therefore that indicates that somehow they're asking for it or deserve to be sexually assaulted". I think that pointing out that people need to be aware of their safety in bars is quite different to saying that drunk women deserve to be raped.

Suze

No-one is disagreeing that having sex with someone who is saying no is utterly wrong. What concerns alot of blokes are these incidents where she has been happy to do alot of stuff that looked like foreplay, she hasn't made much of an effort to stop him when things went to far and he has been accused of rape. Consent can be tricky. For example, no-one can give a nice neat realistic answer to how drunk she needs to be before sex becomes rape.

Make some photocopies of, I concent to have sex with the holder of this certificate. signed by the recipient.

Hang on you lot, isn't australian law such that someone else is to be made responsible for your action ?

There should be an Australian law against speculative gossip. God knows how anyone can get away with the spin that is often put on the simple things said by people in the media spotlight.

Miranda Devine vocalised the sentiments of most people,

"Good on Kerri-Anne Kennerley for not backing down over her 'strays' comment on the Collingwood sex scandal. The linguistic police are always so eager to crush dissent that most celebrities buckle under the pressure.

Clearly the Nine host was not talking about rape victims; the last thing anyone wants is to heap injury on a young
woman who may already be traumatised.

But there have been too many instances of football fans who cry wolf the morning after for people not to want to point out the unfairness of it all."

http://blogs.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/mirandadevine/

I suspect that the politically correct roasting of Kerri-Anne Kennerley will rebound on feminism. Will the real feminism stand up?