The Rudd government inherited a $90 billion comfort zone via a $20 billion Federal budget surplus and the $60 billion Future Fund. In a single parliamentary term the Labour Party has managed to turn a $20 billion surplus into a $60 billion deficit. Net Federal liability has gone from zero to a projected $180 billion debt.
It took ten years to pay back a $96 billion debt inherited from the last Labour government, who took a decade to run it up. How long will it take to pay this one back? Labour party hacks look back quite rightly at the infrastructure deficits of the Howard years, but they do not consider that the windfall revenues of that period went to pay back Labour government debt.
In this climate you would think that even the most ardent grass roots Labour supporter would see what a pathetic spin orientated lot we have guiding our once prosperous country (it is still prosperous, just not for the citizenry of our nation). But as I go about my day to day business activities I find that the masses are not aware of the raw numbers involved and the debt trap that has been visited upon us. This is due to the media giving a free ride to the Labour party. They may report the waste and mismanagement when the issue arises from the voice of the people in the only forum we have left (talk back radio), but they report on the issue only once, and in a low key prominence, why have the media been shackled? Could it be the tax breaks that our treasurer has bestowed on the media segment? I am not a political animal but these talk fest no action clowns are a disgrace, it’s third world quality government that sees a very few prosper on the money of the majority. I am sick to the stomach when I hear the lies and spin that the elected government considers fit for our consumption. We are fools.

All politicians are wedded to short term fixes as most of the electorate are only interested in their own week-to-week vision. Politicians know this, although the present mob play it to the hilt. God help us (so to speak) if China falls over with its property bubble.

But
you know what
these people who vote for political parties dont care.

This is due to the fact that the only thing they care about is who's party is in power and they want it to be theirs.

We are just collatorel and its about party power and who has the most.

Stuart Ulrich
Independent

www.climatesceptics.org.au is reforming into an alternative political party.

Further to my disenchantment with Kevin Rudd. The ETS was a have to implement at any cost to save our future issue that has now lost its immediacy. My belief is that Kev does not give a hoot about the issue, other than it being a token that he could take to the U.N. when he moves towards his next vocation.....the United Nations. He certainly has the rhetoric for it and thus far a raft of failed schemes that had "good intent" at their base. I am serious when I state, most of our PM's had reached the zenith of their career path when they captained Australia, but Kevin is using us as a stepping stone to a career of non specific “specificity” with the U.N. He is no friend or leader to his fellow Aussies, he is all about himself. Many friends who reside in the corridors of power in Canberra told me during the Kevin 07 campaign that he was a prima donna to work with and totally self absorbed, sadly they are correct.

Correct Sonofgloin.The really big rub is that Kevin has borrowed from China to pay for inflation here.We get the interest bill and debt while the RBA sucks this surplus cash out via interest rates to the big end of town.I heard a comment today,"the Resreve Bank is doing the heavy lifting and the Govt needs to do more with stimulus."Hang on here.Wouldn't it had not been better just to lower interest rate 12mnth ago and have no stimulus or OS borrowing to create inflation?

The RBA should be sacked.They pannicked Kevin into this mess and it is not over.

The majority of selfish people I have met are vehement ALP supporters, especially in the Public Service. Only today one of the most tight-ar$ed characters I know told me that he didn't like the Liberals because they only think of themselves ? I don't vote Liberal or Labor but my vote goes to the conservative side of politics. I am so utterly disillusioned by Labor's smoke screen of being the workers' party. Biggest load of crap if ever there was one. It's nothing but an academic yuppy club that always blows our taxes on themselves. The Liberals aren't saints but they are more responsible. I have never lost employment during conservative rule but I have lost it twice now when Labor was in. I respect & admire the original Labor doctrine but unfortunately, under Gough Whitlam the pragmatists of politic were sacrificed to pave the way for academic hangers on experts. Rudd is not the worst but he isn't an improvement on Whitlam either. I honestly expected more pragmatism from someone who claims to come from a farming background.

The unfortunate reality, is that each and every successive PM will be the worst ever. Basically due to our hopeless biparty preferential voting system and compulsory voting.

We dont vote for who is the best, we vote for who is least worse. This way, we are garanteed to have mediocre political representation every time.

Wow, you guys have got this all to yourselves don't you!
The instigator of this thread conveniently neglects to mention the small matter of the GFC and the apparent need for stimulous spending, not to mention that the surplus was born of the mining boom and had nothing to with economic management. Nor is it mentioned that Howard pledged an even bigger spending binge than Labour's, before the election. Nor is it mentioned that essential (public) services were allowed to degenerate under the conservatives while the private sphere prospered and money piled up!
Get me a bucket!
Get ready for more pain, fellows, because Labour will win with a leg in the air!
But don't despise the pollies; they're your mirror image!

After my daughter "helped" with the stimulus, for my own sake I had to take away her new credit card.

I just wish we could do that with Rudd.

I do not see much insight or understanding in the thread.
Yes Rudd is down in the polls, yes he has dropped the ball.
Inferences that all Polly's are no good are thrown about.
Yet this worst ever will still win the election.
Clearly.
And some will still cry voters got it wrong, even that some should not be able to vote.
It is hard, harder for some, to understand it is them, not the world who fail to understand.

I haven’t posted for a bit. However I cannot continue to fail to express my disappointment with Kevin Rudd. He is a bit of a Promisin Jack. Or is that a Promisin Jackass. He promised to govern as a Constitutionalist, but is really a Labor Party Hack, unwilling to confront his lawless and unconstitutional State Mates, in a head to head brawl.

His core promise to end homelessness, for the 100,000 who must sleep rough again this winter, is a disgrace. His other core promise to govern under the Constitution is torn asunder, by his failure to know and understand that judges, uncapitalised and plural in S 79 Constitution, is not the same as Judge, capitalised and singular. His syntax chip in his CPU is flawed.

I have said before he will be the 21st century Scullin. Sadly I was one of his most ardent supporters in 2007. He was more Christian than John Howard, but not enough of a Christian to understand that when Judges rule, there is famine and despair in the land. There is only one Judge, and that is Almighty God. While the State, any State appoints a Judge and Magistrate to be the Local God, without reference to the Holy Bible from the one profession Jesus Christ despised, the lawyers, then the people are oppressed and we do not have peace order or good government. Government by fear is not good government.

The only unforgivable sin, for a Christian is in Matthew 7 where it says Judge not that ye be not judged. Only a Pagan can be a Judge and Magistrate. If Abbott will accept that, he will win handsomely. He just may have enough Christianity to be a great leader. Watch the syntax. Punctuation and Capital letters matter

I find it amusing that anyone thought this second-tier bureaucrat would ever be anything else. He's made a career out of never sticking his neck out and making sure his bosses know he's doing as he's told, so that's all he knows. He's no doubt excellent at vetting minister's speeches for anything controversial and I'm sure he has great skill at running meetings, but it's become very clear that competence in managing or creating effective Government policies is not part of his skill set.

Squeers, the GFC is still with us. I am in a business which is a supplier to the building and landscaping industry and I know that activity in this sector around Brisbane at least is at a very low level indeed and has been falling steadily over the past 3-4 months. Some of my customers have not had a new project commencement in 6 months.

A further indicator is the number of would-be clients who cannot pay cash and the number of new account applicants. I don't have EFTPOS or credit card facilities and I have had people choose to leave and go to Bunnings, where they will pay at least 50% more, simply so they can put it on the credit card. That had neber happened until about 3-4 months ago, but it's become so common of late that my first comment to a new customer is "cash only" and I've had to put a sign up to that effect.

The "stimulus" simply gave Harvey Norman and JB HiFi and their like a windfall profit, a fact aclnowledged by Woolworths the other day when trying to justify their lower profit in the most recent quarter. As for the BER...

Instead of creating structural and regulatory change to ameliorate the impacts of global rorts, the Rudd government has chosen to try to buy popularity withour money.

Posted by Squeers,
[Quote]The instigator of this thread conveniently neglects to mention the small matter of the GFC and the apparent need for stimulous spending, not to mention that the surplus was born of the mining boom and had nothing to with economic management.[/Quote]

Not a cent was put into our banking system, just a funds guarantee from the gov, it was in good nick. Re the mining your correct. China did not feel the GFC so consequently we were protected.

[Quote]Nor is it mentioned that Howard pledged an even bigger spending binge than Labour's, before the election. Nor is it mentioned that essential (public) services were allowed to degenerate under the conservatives while the private sphere prospered and money piled up![/Quote]

Howards government just finished paying back $90 billion from the Hawke years and you expect me to contemplate that he would lift our debt to $180 billion in a single term, foolish statement. Re the public service, you want more? foolish statement.

[Quote]Get me a bucket![/Quote]

Can I suggest a labotomy to go with that bucket.

I don't like either of the major parties but you have to admit that Labor Govts have raised Govt incompetence to an artform.You could not get such a debacle even with the help of South Park writers.

I told Belly 2 yrs ago Labor would be a one term wonder.They are the "Bonobo Party".Bonobos are related to Chimps and resolve conflicts by by simulating sex with anything they can touch.It is quite hilarious to watch.

The difference being the Labor party are not simulating sex with our economy.Everything they touch,they f#*k. "Bonobo Party" has a good ring to it.

Well that's anecdotal, Antiseptic--though the fact that Australians and businesses live on credit is undeniable. But I think that's got more to do with manic consumerism than Labour's policies. No doubt too that the dual economy masks the hardship of many non-miners.
While I'm no fan of Rudd's, I don't hold him responsible either, or Honest John Howard, or any mainstream polies. Popular politics is devoted to illusion, the prestidigitation of the economy, euphemistically called 'fiscal management'.
No popular party or politician has the luxury to take policy beyond chicanery; contesting elections puts all contenders between the proverbial rock and hard place---all they have to do is deliver prosperity to all at no cost! Politics is thus the art of the 'plausible'; the winning party is the one that presents the most outrageous pledge in an attitude of deadly earnest. The electorate is thus perennially disillusioned in its delusional faith in such alchemy---the political black arts wherein the conjurer turns lower taxation into the cornucopia of elaborate social infrastructure and prosperity for all!
'Representative politics' is 'precisely' that! All the politicians' lies and political doublespeak are the verbalisation of popular sentiment, self-interest and speculation. The voters are the ventriloquists!

Rudd's mining tax is a stroke of genius btw, if you care to deconstruct its politics!

The Government had little option than to spend given the GFC. In th1930s, the US and other countries took a close the hatches and protectionist approach to a major economic trough, and we all know what happened then. The Rudd government had little choice in the matter and had to spend into sectors, where there is no lag time to achieve a benefit; e.g., Retailing. If the GFC had arrived under the old leadership, Howard and friends would have acted under the advice of Economists and also introduced some sort of stimulus.

Of course, from the stimulus package, there is an undesired legacy - debt. However, a smaller protracted pain can be spread over 5-6 years might prove a preferred evil over having allowed the economy go into a nose dive. When I receive a vaccination, I don’t complain to the doctor that, “Ouch! The needle hurt”, if the alternative is much worse.

Most of the problems which have arisen seem to have been “operational”, perhaps, arising from Ministers not kissing babies and giving speeches, when they should have been reading briefs and selected key correspondence. As for the “strategy” of keeping Oz out of recession, the stimulus package seemingly worked.
The Rudd government could have sold Telstra to create a multi-billion bucket, except that had already been done. Yet, selling key assets to pay debt is a desperate action, at any time.

The surplus from the previous Government would have been higher had Howard not had his own little bonus schemes, before elections.

As for Builders and Retailers being given unfair preference; this has always happened. Agribusiness has been treated as a “special case” by both sides of politics since Federation.

Above,

"Most of the problems which have arisen seem to have been “operational”, perhaps, arising from Ministers not kissing babies and giving speeches, when they should have been reading briefs and selected key correspondence. As for the “strategy” of keeping Oz out of recession, the stimulus package seemingly worked."

- Should read "kissing babies and giving speeches", of course.

Squeers << Rudd's mining tax is a stroke of genius btw, if you care to deconstruct its politics!>>

Since you have such a good grip on this could you deconstruct this for us? Thanks.

Well Spindoc,
while Rudd is a consummate performer and inveterate fabricator (that's the job description), at bottom I think there are a few things he actually believes in. Just as Howard was a frustrated conservative, so Rudd is a repressed (Labour) ideologue. However, as I outlined above, the art of politics is maximising appeal, and so whatever the ideology in play, it has to don the sober garb of 'everyman'. That's why all the pollies go on about (non-existent) 'Australian values'.
As I also said above, the politician's job is to pry tax dollars from a collectively tight fist. The proper way to do it would be via a steep progressive taxation system, but the hoarders have their own ideological defence against such an 'outrage' that the resy of the bourgeoisie buy into; getting rich is a 'human right' after all, just as poverty and getting screwed is for the disadvantaged.
So how does one squeeze vital tax dollars without compromising electoral viability? This is the perennial political problem.
Rudd has sussed that our dual economy is highly disparate in terms of votes (same with smokers; he could never treat drinkers like that). What's more, a lot of the share holders are overseas. The 30% slug will mean he'll have us back in surplus in no time, and be fated for his economic management, and he's only hitting a wealthy minority, --unless you buy into all the crap about jobs being lost--plumb targets of the left anyway! Australia's resources are precious assets that devolve a great deal of political and economic power. Indeed, there's plenty of room for another mining tax yet, something called the ets!
He's won my vote :-)

This is from the Australian showing the ineptitude of the clowns who govern us.

"And The Australian has revealed over recent months clear cases of wastage under the scheme largely linked to secret management fees being paid to big construction firms rolling out the work on behalf of state governments".

The building industry has a cost per square meter guide that is accepted and used in the building industry in the same fashion that the motor industry accepts the valuations in red book. It differentiates the build cost per square meter by the plumbing, electrical, levels, building material etc. A costing of the BER projects using this guide a few days ago found that a building that should cost $1200 per meter cost us over $3k, a building that should cost $3k per meter cost us $13000. The private schools were given the same funds with the caveat that they were free to spend it on infrastructure, and manage their own projects. The outcome for all to see is that they built three buildings and the public school could only build one, and a demountable at that (we might have to give them back).
COLA’s, that cost $120k three years ago now cost $800k.
This, again from the Australian is the response our queen of spin had to say on this matter.
"...Ms Gillard said the BER program was “the largest component of the Government's stimulus program - a package that has kept our nation out of recession and 200,000 Australians out of the dole queue...”

If we had got value from the $16 billion we could employ 500,000 Aussies. My issue is that if we are spending $16+ billion, and getting $7+ billion in value, why the other $9 billion is going into the pockets of six or seven major contractors. Why doesn't Kev just give every one of the working families $9k each, there are about 10 million taxpayers in Australia, it's better than the first measly $900.

I personally am twice cursed, not just with the Feds but also with the N.S.W. Labour govt...hahahahahahahahaha...govt, that’s a joke.

I think he was literally opening the wallet

Arjay truly sorry if it offends you, but I do not rely on your opinion on anything.
Henny Penny is active here in this thread and you my friend have that covered in your every post.
Not me mate, heard that?
I t is when we are wrong, or others think we are.
We dash out not me mate and hide our faults.
Here once again, my understanding of politics, others views, even the other side is tested.
Rudd will win another term.
He in my view will either get much stronger or be replaced before Labors third term.
See we do not have an opposition, like it or not LIBERALISM is the the hands of the children.
Voters, surely those of you who claim understating of politics?
Did not flock to rabbott.
They in the polls, RIGHTLY expressed unhappiness with gutless unfocused direction less policy's.
And did what I would have done, WILL do in my state elections polling, gave their smack to Rudd by going to the greens.
A Labor voters refuge, until second preferences.

It must be lonely for our good friend Belly. He must be the last man in Australia who believes Rudd will win a second term. Even though I am a Christian, I believe in the power of a quiet beer on a hot day, or a cold day, or any day really, and in my moments at the pub, I have never heard such open and loud criticism of a Prime Minister. Comparisons are being made with Whitlam, the last three year wonder, as most are too young to remember Scullin.

Rudd has a letter writer called Alex Anderson Assistant Secretary Legal Policy Branch who is doing his very best to ensure that Rudd is defeated at the next poll. This fellow has no logic chip at all. He must have grown up in a school that did not teach what Capital letters mean, so he does not know the difference between a court as defined and published in S 79 Constitution, and the word judges, again in S 79, and the Court and Judge in S 2 of the Judiciary Act 1903.

This superannuated spendthrift prime minister, has surrounded himself with yes men, who are so ignorant of basic syntax, that they cannot understand the difference between a court with judges, as required by s 79 and a Court and Judge, as inflicted upon us without exception by the State governments of Australia. Rudd is a republican, without a rudder. Like a motherless foal, he is wandering around, separated from the mother-lode of popularity, as more and more people wake up that he is a shallow remnant from the worst excesses of the Goss years in Queensland, where there is something in the water that makes a person a bit strange. Rudd was the engineer of the Heiner cover up.

Rudd was asked to sack the entire High Court bench, for insubordination, for removing the Queen from process issued out of the High Court since 2004. The sins of the Howard years continue. He still has time, but he must act now, or we will find someone else

Squeers meant to add, above, that the genius part of the mining tax was that Abbott would be obliged to contest it! That is defend a wealthy minority. The stroke of genius is that Rudd gets to play Robin Hood, while Abbott gets stuck with the role of Prince John!
I must say I'm impressed that I haven't copped any abuse; excellent restrain, fellows.
I'll also add that I had no intention of voting Labour before this, and I still don't like Rudd.
While I agree with Belly, that Rudd will win another term fairly easily, I shall bow humbly before wiser heads should that not eventuate.

One has to wonder were will rudds/ labors super tax stop.

It seems that rudd/labor are testing the waters as if this goes through we will then have the large chain supermarkets then the banks hit with this super tax.

Now belly would say no they wont, but belly should remember when even before the last state election that labor was still going to sell off electricity which he said no they would not, but still they try, and still they are trying to sell it.

So more tax higher costs, more debt that we the taxpayer has to pay back.

Stuart Ulrich
Independent

Posted by Squeers, Wednesday, 5 May 2010 5:00:42 PM
"while Rudd is a consummate performer and inveterate fabricator (that's the job description), at bottom I think there are a few things he actually believes in".

Posted by Andrew Bolt, Daily Telegraph, 5 May 2010

"Back when Rudd and I would still catch up for dinner or coffee, I knew him as a deeply insecure man who wanted nothing from politics but validation. Applause. Power.
Without revealing what he said in confidence, it struck me that there was no cause he cared about as deeply as his own success".

Now I concede that this journo is by nature to the right wing of Goebbels, but his evaluation of Rudd coincides with opinion of the friends I earlier mentioned (acolytes in Canberra) who virtually said the same thing. This guy is a major dudd. Ben Chifley started the Snowy Mountains Scheme, and this dudd cannot get insulation bats put in your roof correctly. Bob Hawke implemented Medibank and this dudd cannot even get a lap top and backup into the class rooms. James Scullin guided us through the Great Depression, and this dudd takes bouquets for saving us from absolutely nothing, our banks never failed, the lifestyles of everyone that I know stayed the same, basic items are expensive, like petrol, food, electricity, water, housing, but Kev is looking after my concerns with platitudes like Petrol Watch, Grocery Watch, Solar rebate, Batty pragramme, BER. But nothing is cheaper, nothing is fixed, nothing is finished.

Squeers as you intimate in your posts they are all bastards, but these bastards are incompetent.

PTB,

"It must be lonely for our good friend Belly. He must be the last man in Australia who believes Rudd will win a second term."

No,there are two of us.

The Liberals need fresh candidates. With Abbott, we would risk another Joh, Piggy Muldoon, or, even worse, a Winston Churchill.

p.s. Peter, I know Muldoon and were not Australians.

p.p.s. I have a friend who relates an experience at a Conference,where Robert Muldoon flipped-out, when he was asked to keep his speech short in consideration of other speakers.

The poster of this thread thinks he's riding on the populist wave of Rudd-knocking.

Channel 7's Sunrise did that this morning when it posed the question,"What is wrong with Kevin Rudd?". They then went on to vox pop 4 people. 2 of whom didn't vote for Rudd in the first place, one who said Rudd was destroying the country without identifying allegiances and one who said he thought we had had worse Prime Ministers in the past.

The recent opinion poll that has the Libs in raptures showed Rudd as having a 50% approval rating as preferred PM Abbott at 32%. Shouldn't we be asking, "whats wrong with Tony Abbott" on those figures.

Of course the problem with Abbott will be the policies that he will present, (none or little policy has been presented so far), but we do know that he wont allow an ETS or a Mining Tax or long overdue health changes etc, so on and so on.

We do know, "that he will not let an elected Govt govern". The responsibility (of the senate) is to review, consult, and examine the Govt's mandated legislation. Not just to knock, block, frustrate or sabotage the peoples representatives doing their job.

When we voted for the Rudd Govt, we voted for an ETS. Not even the Greens seem to understand this.

The Govt's mining tax, will once and for all prove ( if he sticks to it ),"that Kevin Rudd is indeed a conviction politician". And not the boogy man.

If Rudd wins the next election, we will have voted for the mining tax. What will the senate do?. Continue to obstruct the mandated agenda of our elected representatives?.

I hope not. But even that would be preferable to an Abbott led Govt ; "a genuine contender for worst PM and Govt we've ever had". One fixated anally on it's own small town ideological agenda a la Son of Howard.

As for the rhetoric of the Multinational Miners themselves, it's drivel for many reasons and I would like to make the subject of another post

A Mandate what a load of crock

Now rudd the dudd threatened a double dissolusion election and what did he do, he ran the other way.

A man of convictions i do not think so.

Sonofgloin quote:
"Back when Rudd and I would still catch up for dinner or coffee, I knew him as a deeply insecure man who wanted nothing from politics but validation. Applause. Power.
Without revealing what he said in confidence, it struck me that there was no cause he cared about as deeply as his own success".

Much as I (dis)respect journalistic nouse---it's not exactly the distillation of work conducted under laboratory conditions; ergo, your friend might be beset by demons that make Rudd's look relatively harmless. Surely we're all carrying baggage, and Rudd doesn't look to me like the high school football hero! But in the absence of more enlightened souls, in the current system we have to be grateful for what we get!
Your assertion that Rudd is incompetent suggests that competence is a possibility; which to me is like saying that the Chernobyl meltdown was mismanaged.
As Greece is currently testifying, the capitalist system is a house of cards. For me, anything that contradicts monetary doctrine is potentially good. Maybe we need a driven neurotic at the helm at the moment; surely we're witnessing an unprecedented shift of power from governments to corporations. We're approaching a time when national sovereignty will be looked back upon as quaint. Rudd is possibly setting an important precedent here; just look at the media attention the (fat) mining moguls command! How come?

Rudd and his seven Labor mates are like Mafia Dons carving up their gangland territories. How long must we model our government on the Mafia. The Council of Australian Governments is more about collective stealing of private property, imposing speeding fines which no one pays, and one holdout refused to join in the whitewash that is Health reform.

It is pretty open gangland government. Get rid of the independent courts, and install lawyer/gangsters as the Judges, and grand larceny is suddenly respectable. Screw any man silly enough to have children with a cranky woman, using arbitrary agencies like Child Support, that without any legal authority whatsoever, put their hand directly into men’s bank accounts, and then set up Trustees in Bankruptcy and company liquidators who get their thievery rubber stamped by the Federal Court and a High Court on $7000 a week each who refuse to hear anything unless the media first have a go at them about it.

The Judicial Power of the Commonwealth is the power of Almighty God to be the ultimate Judge. The Power of Almighty God can stamp out crime, and some English Kings actually did this. When King Henry VII killed Richard III and installed himself as King, people regarded it as a Christian miracle. He ended the War of the Roses, ands his first act was to pardon and forgive the warring parties. He did not pass judgment on them, and vested the power of Almighty God in accordance with the Holy Bible in a jury of twelve men, and not otherwise. That was during the time lawyers were banned from Parliament. Rudd promised to govern as a Constitutionalist, and even goes to Church, but has no idea what the Christian system adopted by Henry VII actually does. It ushered in an era of peace order and good ( God) government.

65% of Australians are Christian. We want the pagans who currently govern us to adopt Christian principles of government, vest the Judicial Power of the Commonwealth in juries, as S 79 Constitution mandates, and have the crims pay their way

Posted by thinker 2, Thursday, 6 May 2010 6:50:20 PM
"When we voted for the Rudd Govt, we voted for an ETS. Not even the Greens seem to understand this".

The electorate did get the ETS when Rudd received the mandate to govern, but the reason he received the mandate from the electorate was not the ETS.
I believe that the reason that we turfed the Libs out so overwhelmingly was first and foremost "Work Choices". Second was the promise by Rudd to sort out the duopoly of Woolies and Coles in regard to basic food prices, coupled with the horrific movements in fuel. The ETS was an issue for the few not the majority, more talked about in trendy Glebe than grass roots Blacktown.

Posted by Squeers, Thursday, 6 May 2010 8:46:54 PM
Rudd doesn't look to me like the high school football hero! But in the absence of more enlightened souls, in the current system we have to be grateful for what we get!

Squeers your acceptance of low standards regarding the govt we pay for finds me thinking you deserve Kevin Rudd, but the nation as a whole does not, I do not.

Posted by Squeers, Thursday, 6 May 2010 8:46:54 PM
surely we're witnessing an unprecedented shift of power from governments to corporations. We're approaching a time when national sovereignty will be looked back upon as quaint. Rudd is possibly setting an important precedent here;

In the seventies the U.N. Development Organization, the IMF, and the World Bank, got together with the "Money" and started shifting manufacturing resource to the second and third world. This was done under the cloak of a humanitarian sharing of the wealth with these poor nations. The outcome is that manufacturing in the expensive labored first world was decimated and the subsistence agricultural slave of the third world became a subsistence manufacturing slave. The only ones to profit was the "Money". Have a look at the Lima Agreement from the seventies that the stupid pollies of all first world nations signed off on.

sonofgloin:
<your acceptance of low standards regarding the govt we pay for finds me thinking you deserve Kevin Rudd, but the nation as a whole does not, I do not.>

My 'acceptance' is more like 'resignation'; that the nation as a whole 'does' deserve Kevin Rudd is 'precisely' my point.
Ever heard of 'enlightened self-interest'? Well what we have in the West generally is 'benighted' self-interest.

Your last paragraph amply illustrates my (healthy) cynicism.

Surely you realise that capitalism, an engine of perpetual growth in a closed system, must inevitably spread globally. Manufacturing must go offshore and cultivate new markets, driving population and consumption ever upwards until finally the human plague becomes unsustainable and a massive collapse (die-off) ensues.
Adam Smith, btw, never intended wealth to be concentrated in the hands of mega-corporations, specifically foreseeing that danger.
He also naively supposed that 'self-interest' would be modestly contented with 'sufficient'.
The reality is that the wealthy never have enough and this--combined with ever more mouths to feed--necessarily imposes poverty elsewhere.
Until Western electorates, blinded by ideology, accepts these hardcore realities, they'll go on getting the pollies they deserve. Even when Enlightened pollies come along, they're lame ducks, prevented by the electorate (and the global system that prevents countries from 'opting out') from making the kinds of radical reforms that might prevent the coming holocaust.

PTB,

"65% of Australians are Christian. We want the pagans who currently govern us to adopt Christian principles of government, vest the Judicial Power of the Commonwealth."

The Greeks who established proto-democracy were pagans. The Romans who establsishe legal systems, before Constantine (and some afterwards) were pagans.

Pagans were civil polytheists. Historically, it was the Christians, who were atheists, because they would not pray for the good health of the Emperor. As I think I have mentioned before, the Jews were respected for the long traditionas of their religion in Roman, but, over stepped the mark by invading a Roman garision in riot responding to the Greeks having animal sacrifices near their Temple, thus, starting a war with Rome.

As for the post-Hastings Monarchs, it is hard to justify divine intervention. The Normans turned the Anglo Saxon and Celt world upside down, with dire consequences for the aboriginal clans.

As for Rudd and Abbott, going to Church is like kissing babies and telling lies, its part of a politican's life. Albeit, perhaps Abbott is a true theist

Why do people expect any different. Howard was horrid in his first term. Ministers that were uncertain of themselves uneven policy and reelection with a minority of the popular vote. How close was that to a one term government. Time developed confidence and in its wake the deception that the government was doing such a good job. A useless opposition certainly aided this problem.
It would be very difficult to say that the previous government didn't waist some very important opportunities to develop infrastructure and fiscal policy that were more in the interests of the population rather than business. Fixing this has been the agenda of the current government. Minerals and mining are a finite resource and they belong to the nation not the mining companies. The ETS was ment to give business the incentive to move to new technologies faster buy making them cost competitive while giving some compensation to the population to ease the burden. The poor politics was pushing for it before copenhagen, this left them looking out of pace with the world and lacking leadership in their own country.
Having said that the current government have set new standards in poor administration born from promises. We can only imagine that P Garrett was promised a cabinet position and that will certainly not last to much longer. His disaster of a batts scheme was one of the worst implemented programs of all time and has done more damage to the government than any other issue.
Without question the senate obstruction stands responsible for all current policy vacuums. The punishment needs to be handed out on the senate and the opposition that believe good policy is to object and then offer no alternative. Have faith Australia, Rudd will learn and we don't need a fool like Abbott.
The big question will be in the budget. We all know the debt won't be as bad as first thought and we have cruised through the GFC, so let's see if they can make the really tough decisions and fix the debt fast. Tough decisions make the government.

Nairbe, let me remind you of your description of the Rudd govt track record.
"Having said that the current government has set new standards in poor administration born from promises".

This is more than poor admin....the track record (quoted)
"Grocery Watch, Fuel Watch, Housing Affordability, Defense Funding, Border Protection, “Building the Education Revolution”, Computers in Schools, Childcare Centers, GP Super-Clinics, Indigenous Housing, National Broadband Network, Internet Censorship, Home Insulation/Fires/Deaths, “Ending the Blame Game in Health”; and the ETS.
None completed. All tainted with excess and waste.
Now, to be absolutely fair, I can think of two election policies that have not been completely botched or abandoned by Rudd in Government. These are the Commonwealth’s Apology to the “Stolen Generations”, and the rolling-back of Work Choices.

The Rudd government will not be better tomorrow. Look at the decision of the day, tax the miners right now. Not later when the world’s economic climate is more favorable. But right now. Four billion off mining, first day’s trading, that’s off our superfunds, and they invest significantly in that segment, The point is what the Rudd govt is going to do with the money; it will pay off the foreign debt he has ineptly delivered to us.

Posted by nairbe, Friday, 7 May 2010 7:51:28 PM
Have faith Australia, Rudd will learn.

Give me proof, just one implimented policy or reasonable fix up of one of their cock ups.

There is a proverb: Gossip is delicious; how we love to swallow it. The gos that workchoices tipped out Howard is just gos. In truth, Howard was seen as a shallow non believing skin deep Christian, while Kevin campaigned from 12 December 2004, as a genuine Christian, as his article on OLO demonstrates. He realised we wont go for an Atheist leader in Australia.

However he is the hostage of Atheists, like Nicola Roxon and Greg Combet, and cannot govern as a Christian, because he is surrounded by atheist advisers. He has a flawed logic chip, and does not understand we do not want Chinese style government. We adopted gangland rule in 1970 in New South Wales when we granted the absolute rule of law to the legal profession, and followed it up by electing Whitlam. What part of society is most closely associated with criminals. The legal profession, of course, and like Rumpole, their livelihood is dependant on criminals being able to pay them.

Chinese style government is gang rule. Gang rule was the norm in England when the War of the Roses erupted. We must return to Christian Rule, and bury sectarianism totally in Australia. The politics of envy, which has led Rudd to single out the miners, for special taxes, should be buried forever. We are an immensely wealthy country, and Rudd made a commitment to end homelessness.

He walks the boulevard of broken dreams, and broken promises. When the Prince of Thieves who takes home 10 million a year in salary, as head of the Commonwealth Bank, only pays a maximum of 48% tax, while walking past the homeless on his way to work, this country is sick.

The Parliament of the Commonwealth is a truly democratic institution. Its problem is that it is a joke at grass roots level. Until our Leader, bites the bullet, and appoints every Magistrate as a delegate of the Governor General in every community, and separates them from State power, and pays them the same salary as the Federal Court Judges, we will continue to be governed by hardened criminals.

Peter the Believer,
you're dreaming!
Only about 7.5% of Australians attend services on a regular basis (the rest are merely sheep); hardly a mandate for Christianising government!
You might be pining for a return to the Dark Ages, cobber, but thankfully more enlightened thinking holds sway, at least constitutionally.
Why don't you and your ilk find a nice little offshore island and start your own radical Christian enclave? Think what fun you'd have drawing up your insular and exclusive little empire's rule of law.
And we'd be well rid of you.

Sonofgloin,
Grocery Watch - promised delivered not supported.
Housing Affordability - A difficult problem at the best of times, and yes i agree a failure. This is a problem that government will struggle to fix with the current policies on population growth and economics.
Border Protection - I will agree they failed to deliver a policy that was fair and humane. instead they just varied the hurtful and cruel system Howard had.
“Building the Education Revolution” - I can only speak from a NSW point of view but for us this has been a raging success and are yet to be shown otherwise. I sat on the organising committee of an multi million dollar school renovation. Yep i questioned cost many times as i thought the whole job could have been done for much less. After many arguments and having the whole process explained to me as to where the cost is and why, as well as the school building standards set by the NSW state government i now understand. It costs that much so we don't have problems like the batts, child safety problems , structural issues and matters arising in the future like bad paint jobs and carpet that is sub standard. There was also an employment program that ran through the building project that cost.
I would like to address all your points but i don't have enough words.
Yes they have failed to get policy executed but look at why, an opposition that blocks all in the senate but offers no vision and no policy. The government performance is weak but it has a vision, the opposition has nothing.
I don't propose to make excuses for Rudd, they have struggled and will pay at the election as they should. But there is no alternative at this time and past government record shows second terms are much more successful than firsts. (except Whitlam of course )
Try not to be so one eyed and a media sucker. The media are so bored with themselves they don't bother with truth.

Nairbe, a one eyed media sucker who is generally apolitical, but one who researched government data, both present and historical to make sure that I am despising the ineptitude of the right guy. Kevin Rudd is the right guy. The Libs do not fill my heart with joy either, it's the old truism that we don't vote them in, we vote the other crowd out.

This is the sort of media hype that attracts my attention, from the Financial Revue.
"Treasury's new projection for 2011-12 is $70 billion in the red - a $177,000,000,000 turnaround in nine months".

Regarding your comments on the transparency you received when you sat on the board of a multimillion dollar school infrastructure project. Have a peek at these two web sites, the first gives a comparison of buildings erected pre BER and after BER, one cost $300k the other $900k. Then have a look at the second link to see what you can get built right here right now for $600k, and pocket the extra $300k.

http://www.2gb.com/index.php?option=com_homepage&id=15&Itemid=58

http://www.huxleyhomes.com.au/the-ponds-houselandpackages/

It is nothing short of disgusting, and you see no issues, you even suggest that they will get better at it. As I said I follow no party, but I know "what" I am saying about whomever I am saying it about. If Kev was like Hawke, I would accept that like all modern Labor govts they are not great fiscal managers but what Hawke implements gets implemented, Kev implements then fails, and that has nothing to do with the Senate knocking back his good ideas as you also alluded to. Why do you defend the indefensible, party indoctrination, stubborn character, defending the weak,....his government is banana republic thinking and banana republic bound, when we owe more than we have.

Aah, it's been another day on the sea of never ending temporary status paperwork here in Indonesia.

I'd been feeling thoroughly stressed and fit to smash on with some #$%! but instead opted to drop of paracetamol-codeine (we still have 50 mg per pill of codeine here in Indo) and a glass of sticky rice wine, 1 day fresh from the pasteurising bottle from atop the gas stove (from the 15kg clean weight gas bottle @ less than $AU10 per month for a family of 3 who mostly eat in) at about 0.40c per bottle @ current FOREX.

Things could be worse, I muse to myself.

..

And then, here, we have the return of P the B, and every one getting all fired up (a sign of good things to come I hope) and by far one of the more enjoyable threads I have read in a while.

Of course, just having come from the ABC Australia web, I note the allegations regarding Krudd and Garrett, the insulation disaster, subsequent cover up and refusal to adhere to the principals of transparency and accountability.

..

Potentially a series of hanging offences in my view and I note we still have pretty good trees out the front of the WA Supreme Court.

..

They appear to have cared more for themselves than the potential (and actual) extreme risks to our fellow Australians.

..

That's a drum to beat and even though the thought of Abbott at the helm disgusts me, Mr Wudd has to go if the allegations bear out.

..

Off with his head I say, and a "prayer" that *GreenBrowny et al* end up with the balance of power. .. AmenHotep.

Wow, we now have two died in the wool Ruddites. Everyone needs to understand the principles that governed England well, and caused the dark ages to blight most of Europe until Luther came along. It is a real pity that Rudd is only a skin deep Christian, and by association with a whole raft of lawyers, whose whole belief system is skewed away from truth and honesty, is unable to lead as a Christian should.

The lawyers have established nine separate republics, in what should be a United Nation, with a Council of Australian Governments, as representing nine separate Republics. These republics have de-facto Presidents, and Rudd is only one of these individuals. The Constitution is the Deed that establishes a United Nation, and is supposed to guarantee everyone’s freedom absolutely.

Rudd promised to be a constitutionalist. Unfortunately his henchmen have prevented him from governing by the Book. Poor old Squeers and Belly are as misled as the lawyers who make up a very significant part of the Labor Party these days. There are thirty LLB’s in the Labor Party in the House of Representatives, and not one of them has the gumption to get the Australian Style Manual, and learn what the punctuation of the Constitution really makes it mean.

The Style manual states that Capital Letters make a real difference. The word Judge and Court do not stand alone in Ch III Constitution. Yet the Parliament of the Commonwealth and of every State have created Courts. They have also created Judges. Both of these are Pagan inventions. Instead of having a Christian Commonwealth, we have a pagan Australian Government. I once told a good Roman Catholic Judge, that he represented Almighty God, under the Australian Constitution. He objected strongly, thought about it and promptly resigned.

The Bible says When Judges ruled, there was famine in the land. There is poverty and despair in all the Capital cities of Australia because Judges Rule. We do not have a democracy, when the people only get heard once every three years. The little j Constitution judges are you and me

Peter the believer - what unmitigated nonsense you've written. The bible says all sorts of things, including many that you'd probably prefer not to be quoted. Even most theologians today accept that it is a fairy story and not to be taken literally. Christianity has nothing to be proud about and is no model for anyone. Unfortunately I have to defend your right to drivel on but please - give up on the Christians are good, crap. It is blatantly untrue and serves no good end.

Peter the Believer,

The Dark Ages was the legacy of the fall of the West Roman Empire (476), wherein slavery morphed into fiefdom. The Norman Dynasteries (from 1066) lowered the standard of living of the Angles and the Celts. King John was forced to sign the Marna Carta (1215). Luther was significant, but the Great Divergence (c.1760) was more important. It was the breaking down od the power the old Mafia like nobel families that brought the modern era allowing for industrialisation and creation of wealth on scale undreamt of by our ancestors. Today, you and I, live better thahn Julius Caesar and Henry VIII. We don't wont to regress to Church and Monarchial states.

I can relate to your comments about the CBA Chief, I though the same about $20 million beig spend of unneed spires atop Sydney's St Mary's Cathral casting shadows towards King Cross's street kids.

Peter the Believer,

As I have tried to point out to you before: The Pagans (Pagani) were a group of Roman civilians or rustics. Herein, the Christians used the term to refer to people who believed in God but did not believe that God is revealed through human religions. It has nothing to do with non-Constitutionalists. The polytheists Romans called Christian "atheists" because of their religious exclusivity and because the Christians would not pray for the good health of Caesar. The term pangi was a Christian retort to being an atheist by the more religiously tolerant society.

Pagani was nothing to Kevin Rudd or being a non-Constitutionalist.

I think Rudd (Garret) have been is some respects disappointind and prefer Gillard, Swan and Wong. However, the any of these aforementioned five are preferable to Abbott's autocratic policy on the run with no details or Hockey's whining evasiveness (even more than most politicians).

The Labor party has become a liberal democratic party, easing its industrial roots. The Liberals have become a Tory cum Business cum Farmer party, with only secondary interest in middle Australian workers/professionals.

When Hockey slammed 40% super profit tax, he didn't mention that on the other hand, companies like BHP receive favoured treated by Banks, with "shaded" exchange rates and lower interest rates, compared to you and me

In case any of you honking geese are capable of being objective, Rudd said he was absolutely passionate about dealing with climate change on the 7.30 Report. He is however a politician, and had to abandon it not because he's piss-weak, but because he is a 'representative' of a piss-weak country. It is the electorate that is piss-weak, here and in the US and elsewhere! What's a polly going to do? He/she is pegged to the self-seeking electorate that puts him/her in office.
Rudd plainly said that he was defeated by the politics, not by his own weakness.
So much for fu@#$%$# democracy!!

Here Here Squeers and touche.

All you dumb tax paying unbelievers, who refuse to do the hard yards and research, to back up your attacks on Christianity deserve to pay taxes all your life and put up with absolute mediocrity in government. If you did the hard yards, instead of believing in the infallibility of Parliament, you would understand what a truly magnificent document the New Testament is and that Commonwealth is a place and a word out of Ephesians 2:12. Authorised King James Version of course.

If you had a brain to share around instead of whingeing, you would know how to use this magnificent language we use to express the law in. Its English, and it must be written with style and grace. The Authorised King James Version is law, as Archbishop Jensen asserted to me by letter. It is the basis of the Constitution, and incorporates, in good old fashioned plain English, the fundamental laws on which the Constitution is built. Rock solid laws, not the sinking sand laws of contemporary lawyers.

If Rudd turns out to be a oncer, the 21st Century Scullin, it will be because he is a lazy arrogant and morally unsure person, who relies on idiots who cannot read and understand English either, for advice. The words in Chapter III Constitution, that ensure Christianity remains as the law, are court and judges in s 79, and S 116 which prohibits legislation establishing any other religion as the State Religion.

The Parliament of the Commonwealth starts every day, with the Lord’s prayer. If Kevin spent more time praying and studying the Holy Bible and less time doubting the wisdom of Almighty God, and the creation of more plant food, ( carbon dioxide) so the worlds people will not starve, he would be a whole lot better as Prime Minister. He was the beneficiary of a miracle, when he ousted the greater of two evils, in 2007. Thousands of Christians voted for him, and he has let us down big time.

Just watch the Lord take away what he has given. The big jury rarely gets it wrong

im amazed at how quickly we forget the reasons we ended up in this mess in the first place. it seems most voters would have prefered to be unemployed than have a defecit so i wonder would most people also live in the street than have a mortgage.i employ 13 guys at my small businnes and 60% of my work over the last 12 months has been government spending.its hard to critisise the government when i know dam well i would have had to let half my staff go. a decision that affects more than just one person but impacts on the families they support.It wasnt that so many years ago i was an employee and so i know what job security realy means to a man with a family.

Malcom Turnbull says Kevie is Orwellian but I think that is a term used to describe a human.

One thing for sure though I reckon *Missus*, if the Liberal party oppose outright the "Mining Super Profits Tax" without offering some kind of sacrifice to the people, they will lose for sure.

DreamOn

The miners even agree they should pay more so we should have taken some lol. However now no bottom to freefall as no reason to invest in Australia anymore so maybe no boom to profit from. Who would know, Rudd has plunged the nation into financial instability. Scares off even the most high risk investors.

If Rudd's tax puts a halter on economic growth, and slows down the rape of the planet, good.
It won't though; it'll be business as usual, and by spreading around the take, Rudd's on a sure electoral winner. The electorate's as deep and unfathomable as an open-cut mine.

*Posted by Squeers, Wednesday, 19 May 2010 7:01:20 PM*
" ... The electorate's as deep and unfathomable as an open-cut mine. ... "

Ah yes, well said, that one did make me chuckle.

..

& *Missus* yes my hip pocket is painfully aware of some of the current shock to the Ozzie Dollar having just lost out quite a bit on a not insignificant T.T. to Indonesia, though I do not know that it can all be attributed to a correction brought about by projections of profit short falls due to the proposed "super profits" tax.

There are many arguments of course which can be made and I know but a few of them. One is though if the proceeds are applied in a way that further stabilisers the economy as a whole, then that will make Australia a more attractive political environment to invest in as a whole. Sometimes its better to make less profit but to have a greater sense of security knowing that we are not going to do a Thailand or something similar.

Of course, there is more pure profit to be had in slaves but however ...

As my Nan used to say and as said before in this place:

"Look after the pennies and the dollars will look after themselves."

My view re the stimulus was not that it was a case of cash handouts, but rather a case of increasing the income of the depleted bottom end of town so that they could spend, though the apparent error in the ALP delivery was not to clip the top end thus generating the deficit that they have. And further, not to regulate the necessities is a mistake - doctors, lawyers, dentists etc - i.m.o.

Australia needs savings and more money for technology, innovation and development, with the people who get paid more being the ones that bring capital flows into the country,

AND

not a situation where the savings and beyond of the average people are destroyed by the ravenous, veracious appetites of the parasites that provide internal services.

TheMissus>> Rudd has plunged the nation into financial instability. Scares off even the most high risk investors.<<

A salient point to consider when discussing mining exploration and harvesting is the time frames involved from investment to return, and the ongoing stable environment of the host country. There are other countries as abundant as Australia in dig up wealth, but their governments are unstable or their governments are high taxing. Now we are being defined as high taxing and the out flow of capital has started.

The Labor party gives the tax imposed on the petroleum industry as example of "no negative effects", but the projects they use as benchmarks were exempt of the tax.
I do not believe the low standard we now accept from the clowns in Canberra, on both sides of the house.

Did you see Abbott get hammered by O’Brian in relation to truth.....his handlers should be ashamed to offer him up without a "get out" ramble for just such questions, and he must be a fool for uttering the rubbish he did.
God save Australia from Labor.
God save Australia from Abbott

Trouble is investors are reacting to the government, not to mining. So all sectors are getting hammered. If it is Australian, dump it.!! Even though markets would have been affected by the international fallout we have no floor.G oing down hard and fast. The cost to Australia maybe massive. Nobody knows what the cost will be, that is called sovereign risk and we didn't have that 2 weeks ago. Miners maybe greedy but Rudd is even greedier.