You believe in the same God but not the prophet.christians believe Jesus is the one, Islam believe it was Mohammod and the Jewish believe he is yet to come.
Pick a god and you have a one in three chance of being right. Or you might be wrong and it could be one of over 50 000 religions in the world.
Question: Why are they all wrong and only one right, without reference to the bible, which is not enough evidence.
Question: When a religion hates another religion so intensely why is it forgivable in their gods eyes?
Question: Klu Klux Klan have christian beliefs. Believe they are the only children of God, that they are the one true race. Why are they not allowed to be free in their beliefs?
No URL"S please personal voices only I can google too.

Question: Why are they all wrong and only one right, without reference to the bible, which is not enough evidence.
Question: When a religion hates another religion so intensely why is it forgivable in their gods eyes?
Question: Klu Klux Klan have christian beliefs. Believe they are the only children of God, that they are the one true race. Why are they not allowed to be free in their beliefs?

Answer: Because For the gate is wide and the way is easy, that leads to destruction, and those who enter by it are many. For the gate is narrow and the way is hard, that leads to life, and those who find it are few.
Answer: Because God is Love.
Answer: I will allow them along with al-qaeda.

Dear Alpha
you would benefit greatly from some personal_enquiry into those matters.
The only difference between Religious Jews and Chrisians is the issue of Christ, Messiah or not. There are many Christian Jews.

What we (Christians) do, is proclaim Christ and the Gospel, for all to hear, accept or reject. Just as Jesus Himself did. We believe the Gospels are a true account of Christs teaching and life story. Please refer to them, and then if you have doubts, dig further into the sources.
Sorry, I have to give you a URL for that,
http://www.worldinvisible.com/library/ffbruce/ntdocrli/ntdocont.htm

Do we 'hate' non Christians ? Jews ? Muslims ?

Not at all. Unbelievers are described by Jesus as 'a lost sheep' for whom the good shepherd will leave the 99 safe and search out the one which is lost. He will continue searching until he finds it.
Please read the parables of Jesus concerning the kingdom of God.
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?book_id=48&chapter=4&version=31

I hate the idea of a supposed man of God telling small boys that his fondling of them is 'ok'.... Jesus taught that such people deserve a great millstone around their necks and 2b cast into the sea.

There is something I hate though.... 'falsehood'.I especially hate it when marketed to unsuspecting people as 'truth'. I most particularly hate the idea of a murderer/assassin/childmolester/Torturer/Mutilator_of_prisoners claiming to be "The final messenger of God". As far as I am concerned such an idea originates in the very pit of HELL.

Those happless enough to follow such ideas, are deserving of compassion yes, but most of all guidance. Would you not agree that if Ivan Milat started a religion, that his followers need to have his personal history pointed out ?

Regarding ANY group using or claiming 'Christian' affiliation or foundation, you MUST assess such claims in the light of the fundamental teachings of Christ. There is no other way around it.
Hitler used the bible to justify slautghtering millions of Jews. I've read his understanding. Only a person maliciously intent on mass murder could twist the sciptures that way.

"By their fruit you will know them". (Jesus)

I can pose questions as well; who says that all religions are wrong and who says that only one is right. As a catholic myself I thank you for your questions, and in response, I say that religion should not be based on who is right and who is wrong, but rather, religion, all religions, should be based on faith or, a common belief that there is something else in this world, a something that may never be comprehended. In religion there will always be extremists and there will always be religious segregation but it is important that everyone believes in something, even if this belief is that there is nothing at all. Maybe you should invest some time studying the topic rather than posing arguments through your stereotypical knowledge of what Christian, Islamic and Jewish people believe.

Gamble, AlphaFemale could spend the rest of her life studying what the various beliefs in the three large groupings she mentions and still not have all the variations within that group. I'm constantly astounded by the variety amongst the christians just on this forum.

A common theme for many of that group (but not all) is relentless muslim bashing. Our resident muslims (two few) generally take more care that their posts reflect the values they claim for their faith. I'm not aware of any regular posters promoting the jewish faith.

At a guess AlphaFemales post was a response to some of what she see's from those posters rather than a broadside at all people who use one of those titles to identify their faith.

The questions she asks are valid for all those who claim to have the final and absolute truth regarding the true faith. They forget the role geographic location, parental beliefs etc play in the choices people make about faith. They forget that people who believe entirely different things experience things in their lives which are not readily explained.

It's great to finally have a place for some of these discussions outside other more specific threads.

R0bert

I seem to need to put my belief forward on questions I ask for papers I write that are given to me to research not for my personal opinion. But I will give my personal belief because someone named Scout pointed out with validation that I am too blunt and cold. lol Sounds like a politician in the making if I can change the blunt to slippery.

I have studied hundreds unfortunately it will take me a life time to study everything I am fascinated about in this amazing world that we take for granted. Yes I have a fascination for the Ivan Milats of the world and please remember Mason,Vladimar,Ghengis,Stalin,Hitler. Strong, emotionally and maybe mentally impaired but the people believed in them to begin with. Why; Is what makes people the most interesting and diverse range of creatures on this earth.
I was raised Irish Catholic,(they created the religion you understand)...but I have seen to much to keep this one belief for myself. My children find peace within themselves and love a God that gives me contentment for their understanding, compassion and ability to live for their morals and principles in treatment of others. I teach them about other cultures because a faith above all is and should be judged on pureness and belief and internal peace that faith allows you.

If I told you there was a little man sitting under Sydney Harbour bridge who was invisible, knew the thoughts and desires of every person in the world, was omnipotent but left us all to get on with destroying the planet and each other while he totted up the points each of us were earning so when we died, those he preferred would go up into the clouds to sing, while everyone else went down somewhere else to burn forever…. You would surely ask for proof of my assertion. Yet you do not ask for proof of a similar story that is derived from 2500 year old legends of a Middle Eastern desert tribe. Why not?

A brave try, alphafemale, but you shouldn't expect too much enlightenment.

I have had some interesting conversations with some highly intelligent people who also happen to be religious. No amount of logic will convince them that they are delusional, and they invariably attempt at some point to tilt the discussion their way with the question "so what do you believe?"

I tell them that I believe that we humans have evolved to the point where there are far more questions than answers. Not perfect, but a good starting-place from which to discuss their fantasies.

One thing I have noticed is that they find it equally hard to understand why I don't "believe", as I find it that they do.

And another is that I invariably enjoy the discussions.

Childhood indoctrination, during which children are taught to switch off rational thinking when it comes to gods, has a permanent effect. It effectively lobotomises a portion of the brain so that even as adults they cannot see there is something strange in believing a superman in the sky is the primum mobile and personal saviour. Short of a partial brain transplant, these people can never recover, and no matter how intelligent they may appear in other respects, they are mental cripples when it comes to their religion. Pity is the only humane response. It’s a shame they don’t feel pity for those they oppress.

ybgirp, don't loose hope. It is possible to get healed, I've been there and so have some other posters in these forums.

R0bert

Question: Why are they all wrong and only one right, without reference to the bible, which is not enough evidence.

Question: When a religion hates another religion so intensely why is it forgiveable in their gods eyes?

Question: Klu Klux Klan have christian beliefs. Believe they are the only children of God, that they are the one true race. Why are they not allowed to be free in their beliefs?

Look up psychopathy, you'll see a perfect example of monotheism. Then equate that to the behaviour of unevolved infants, when found out in doing wrong, they pout and pass blame to anyone even their siblings, making up fantasy to cover their failings. There's no difference between any monotheist faction, they're all outdated, false, barbaric, infantile and delusionally despotic.

When confronted by truth, a psychopath will revert to fantasy, making up as they go along, what they want to be true in the hope they can convince people their delusions are real. Unlike in the past when people were un-knowledgeable about the world, they could bluff and suppress people with their fear imposing wrath, now people can search for themselves and what monotheistic believe is becomes clearer. You see this in their posts, unintelligible imaginings from an old mythical novel in attempts to make some sort of sense out of stupidity.

Until evolution leaves these unevolved behind, we'll have to put up with their delusional dishonest rantings. The truth is seen in Boaz,s "By their fruit you will know them". (Jesus)' and Michael4Love, “Because God is Love.”.

Yet the worldwide verifiable and viewable expression is, god is, vengeance, suppression, war, because its illusional power is unsustainable without the use of force.

You see it in their call to destroy other factions, their use of ethnic and cultural cleansing throughout history, the answers are all there to see.

Alphafemale

I don't recall ever describing you as blunt or cold. In fact I don't think that I have made any personal comments about you at all. Please enlighten me, as I find I frequently agree with your POV, and am mystified why you have attributed these comments to me.

You may have read this before. I just thought it might create a diversion easing the tension that must underly the vilification of Christians.

A University professor … challenged his students with this question. "Did God create everything that exists?"

A student bravely replied, "Yes he did!"

"God created everything?" The professor asked.

"Yes sir, he certainly did," the student replied.

The professor answered, "If God created everything; then God created evil.

And, since evil exists, and according to the principle that our works define who we are, then we can assume God is evil."

The student became quiet and did not respond to the professor's hypothetical definition…The professor, quite pleased with himself, boasted to the students that he had proven once more that the faith in God was a myth.

Another student raised his hand and said, "May I ask you a question, Professor?" "Of course", replied the professor.

The student stood up and asked, "Professor does cold exist?"

"What kind of question is this? Of course it exists. Have you never been cold?"

The other students snickered at the young man's question.

The young man replied, "In fact sir, cold does not exist. According to the laws of physics, what we consider cold is in reality the absence of heat.

Everybody or object is susceptible to study when it has or transmits energy, and heat’s what makes a body or matter have or transmit energy. Absolute zero (-460 F) is the total absence of heat; and all matter becomes inert and incapable of reaction at that temperature. Cold does not exist. We’ve created this word to describe how we feel if we have no heat." The student continued, "Professor, does darkness exist?"

The professor responded, "Of course it does."

The student replied, "Once again you’re wrong sir, darkness doesn’t exist either. Darkness is in reality the absence of light. Light we can study, but not darkness. In fact, we can use Newton's prism to break white light into many colors and study the various wavelengths of each color. You cannot measure darkness.

A simple ray of light can break into a world of darkness and illuminate it. How can you know how dark a certain space is? You measure the amount of light present. Isn't this correct? Darkness is a term used by man to describe what happens when there's no light present."

The young man asked the professor, "Sir, does evil exist?"

Professor: "Of course, as I have already said. We see it everyday. It's in the daily examples of man's inhumanity to man. It is in the multitude of crime and violence everywhere in the world. These manifestations are nothing else but evil.

Student: "Evil does not exist, sir, or at least it does not exist unto itself. Evil is simply the absence of God. It is just like darkness and cold, a word that man has created to describe the absence of God. God did not create evil. Evil is the result of what happens when man does not have God's love present in his heart. It's like the cold that comes when there is no heat, or the darkness that comes when there is no light."

The professor sat down.

The young man's name -- Albert Einstein

Ybgirp

Isn’t a combination of childhood indoctrination combined with a lack of rational thinking about the subject the surest way to guarantee a lack of adult faith? Such people are at the mercy of any emotional attack on their religion and irreversibly bitter about the indoctrination.

Re proof: Surely a man healing the sick and coming back to life could constitute proof. (cf. man under the bridge) If God performed miracles at the whim of atheists like a dog He wouldn’t be omnipotent would He?

Alchemist

In case you believe that hurtful remark, cf. attempting a cruel assault on feelings, let’s explore that further. The top 3 indicators of psychopathy, Juvenile Delinquency , Promiscuous Sexual Behaviour, and Early Behavioural problems, are hardly characteristic of Christians. Psychopaths have no concern for others.
Christians try to save people from eternal damnation and believe we should treat people as we want to be treated.

What is your point? Is it that gods are like darkness and cold... they cannot be studied because they don't exist?
Are you suggesting that what people think of as gods are in fact the absence of reason, and therefore not worth thinking about?
Sounds logical.

mjpb, from what I've read on the topic Albert Einstein struggled in his later years because the work that was developed out of his earlier breakthough work was showing things he was unwilling to believe. He worked to prove what followed his earlier work wrong and failed.

His "god does not play dice" (or something to that effect) comment does not fit the realities of the observed universe, Einstein's own work laid the foundations for proving the role that chance does play in the universe.

Einstein may be one of the most prominent examples of a brilliant mind hampered by a wrong belief that he was unwilling or unable to put aside when reality intervened.

Evil is not the presence (or absence) of God, there is no god whose followers have been immune from doing evil, nor have those of us who do not follow god.

R0bert

Unfortunately, mjpb, a study reported in a recent issue of the Journal of Religion and Society, by evolutionary scientist Gregory S. Paul, looking at the correlation between levels of "popular religiosity" and various "quantifiable societal health" indicators in 18 prosperous democracies, including the United States, showed without doubt the the more 'religious' the country, the higher the levels of social dysfunction in all areas from murder to abortion, prostitution to sexual diseases, child and sexual abuse to divorce and theft... and the USA -- the country with the highest degree of religiosity, scores the worst on all counts. So much for the beneficial effects of religion.

Ybgirp

I aimed to make 3 points. The two going out to you related to childhood indoctrination and proof. I also let the Alchemist know that it is delusional to assume Christians are psychopaths. You appear to be referring to my diversion. Is that your diversion? Your joke is a joke so I presume you want laughter not analysis.

Robert

Re: example
Either that or most of us just aren’t smart enough to “get it”.

Ybgirp

I’m sure citing the study that will become the anthem of the atheists and it will be referred to many more times in mass media.

Christian, Muslim, Jew: Axis of Superstition

I did not accuse you Scout but agreed with an opinion on my writing style that I did not see. It was in another area concerning the dying I believe. I stated that you had validation in your opinion of my writing and I believe this was good to understand in allowing other people to read correctly my views and opinions.

Thank you for your opinions, I find the aethiest religion interesting. I see the grass is green therefore it is green. Not logical. When people argue to disprove I find it more interesting than when people argue to prove. It is of no consequence either way. I will not argue to do either with anyone. I will not force my opinions onto anyone who has their own choices and views on life and the meaning of it to them.
I will argue that to not allow children to believe in something stops them from thriving. Most children were taught and believed in god 20 years ago, it does not stop us from choosing new beliefs as we age, it enhances our choices because it gives us a palette to work with.

mjbp, I'm surprised nobody else has picked you up on this, but your fanciful tale about Albert Einstein is pure urban myth.

http://www.snopes.com/religion/einstein.asp

Interestingly, the legend is even bigger than you gave it credit for, with your extract being only a third of the total.

Enjoy it, you might learn something about yourself along the way.

Pericles,

Many of the other stories in the religion section were also quite amusing. Careful about the glass houses phenomenon though. The site you referred me to isn't exactly a well referenced academic work.

Thanks anyhow for the link.

Cheers

Alphafemale,

Here is a view of a simple Muslim:

I know that we all share the same God. I know that Jews and Christians have different views of what God is and isn't. I don't share their religious opinions but I don't judge them and treat them with respect like everyone else.

I know a number of people who are anti-religion who i happen to socialise with as long as we don't talk about religion.

I teach my two girls the same values. I pray and fast for peace and tolerance, work hard and pay my taxes and the almes.
I have no plans to invade another country or a neighbours house and I am groing Jasmin and roses in my backyard.

Religion is a personal / individual choice and people should chose what makes sense to them then never ever talk about it again.

Part 2.

Islam as I see it is a story board:

First there was the Jewish people who were chosen by God to deliver the message of unity and commandments. When they excluded others God send Jesus to correct the path and save them from literalism. When Jesus was rejected as a prophet(either totally or being worshipped as a God), God reset the definitions with the prophet Mohamed and the Quran. Thats the story I am happy to believe. The Quran talks about Christians and Jews as people of the Book and many of them are good believers, making it not my call to judge.

In terms of other religions, the Quran states that there are many other 'non-told prophets' which could mean that maybe even Buddha was a prophet.

The truth is I don't know and maybe I am satisfied with the "i don't know answer'.
What matters is how you live your life and treat others and be good to the your family, community, country and to mankind (& womankind my dear Scout :):)).