Ah... what is that noise.... Oh, it's those violins again!

Slavery? Pft. That's an insult to the actual slaves in times past!

Nobody hides the relative salaries for different occupations. If I wanted to be a boring accountant, get an MBA, CPA etc, I could earn a lot of money. But I choose not to. And I suspect many people make the same choice as I have for a more interesting occupation, and less time wasted being pseudo-educated in the crap universities these days.

Oh no, I'm a teacher and I only get 50k a year! Diddums! Everyone knows how much teachers get paid. Why did you become a teacher if you wanted more money than that? Do you enjoy those 12 weeks holiday a year? I bet you do!

Oh no I cant speak English and I can only get a minimum wage job! Does it beat the country you came from? I bet it does! Can you learn English? I bet you can if you put your mind to it!

Education is available to most, and nobody hides which occupations pay a good Salary. And then there is the option of... shock horror.... taking a risk and starting a business. You might even get a government grant to get started.

Nope, I really am seeing what all these right wingers I've hated for so long were on about.

If low income workers have to work excessive hours, by 'excessive' I mean beyond 45 hours per week, when do they get time to spend with their families, exercise, socialise with friends or even keep up with domestic chores? In fact, have any kind of life? This type of existence is the 21st century version of slavery.

Well, here is your answer. Nobody on a low wage can expect to work a 38hr week and live the way you expect them to. Boy, if they did we would all go broke cause no one could afford to buy anything.

In other words, rechtub, your "solutions" are a fantasy, the result of simplistic thinking and are, I suspect, a way of excusing yourself from offering fair reparation and conditions for your own employees.

Here we go again, My employees!

What makes you think my employees are under paid?

The fact of the matter remains that if you are in a low paid job you must work longer hours to expect a fat pay cheque at the end of the week. That's life!

Col: “Imho, I believe rechtub’s attitude is the reason he succeeds.”

Do you mean that you believe Rechtub has decided he is successful?
Surely if he is a success he is of a different class from the minimum wage peoples then that would be a definition based on income?

Rechtub:”Unfortunately, a recent inclusion has been to have several kids as the support on offer is huge, so much so that many are better off not working when in that situation, it's just a shame the way this support is handled as often it's the kids that miss out.”

Fill me in, I have heaps right now. The down side of course is having a husband earning too much but not enough if you get what I mean.

“… you must work longer hours to expect a fat pay cheque at the end of the week. That's life!”

Nah, the world doesn’t work like that at all. Cruise over to Mr Knox’s thread about the “haves and have nots”.

Fractelle:” As for earning above $90K because you have a degree - I wish - I certainly don't earn this kind of money. Also not everyone is in a position to devote the time, or have the money to study full-time - many are working long hours in low-paid work or busy caring for families.”

Or non-paid work. I don’t want to imply I'd prefer to work because really I wouldn’t but fostering, even though you get reimbursed, does leave you out of pocket in many ways. Hubby would have retired young if not indulging my passion for children.

And on the caring for family issue; I don’t think society has benefitted from both parents needing to work on minimum wages.

Studies keep saying stupid things recently like not breastfeeding is better for your baby and children in pre-school every day do better. I don’t think our society is reflecting this at all.

I think I do agree with Houel though, we are quite spoilt in attitude. Did agreeing to that just negate eveything else I said?

Fill me in, I have heaps right now. The down side of course is having a husband earning too much but not enough if you get what I mean.

The family assistance benefits sometimes outway the benefits of working hard when there are multiple children involved. And remember, the benefits come TAX FREE and don't involve the usual costs associated with going and comming from work.

Then there is the health care card. Every time I buy a script from the chemist they ask "do you have a health care card".

As I have said before, it's a wierd world when one can make a choice between working hard or staying home just because they have kids. THEIR KIDS, BY CHOICE!

So if you miss out due to hubbies wages, take a bow, you are what I consider a 'model couple'.

I would hate the tought of relying on someone else to provide the needs for my children, esspecially if I was capable, but not willing, to do it myself. But hey, some people make a living from it and it is then passed down through generations.

I would also point out that I have succeeded in what is considered a 'low paid industry', simply by working hard and taking risks.

You see we now have a world full of people who 'want the gain' but won't 'take the pain'.

Imagine our cost of living if one could work 38hr in a low paid industry, like retail and take home say $700+ a week.

It simply can't happen as wages is the single largest expense in running most businesses and a blow out in the min wage would have dire consequences for all concerned.

I say again. If you want higher wages, either work longer or work smarter. Of cause you can also take a lot of risks, but this is not for the faint hearted!

“The family assistance benefits sometimes out way the benefits of working hard when there are multiple children involved. And remember, the benefits come TAX FREE and don't involve the usual costs associated with going and coming from work.“

Foster kids are means tested on my husband’s income.

I got told today that some kids DoCS placed with me last week have been exposed to the swine flu and I can guarantee no one from that department is going to pay for anything or offer me a health card.

Top it off the carer didn’t send all the kids clothing and now their home is quarantined – yep I have to go buy clothes just as a cherry on top.

And today I learnt from a Queenslander that an NGO (LWB) up there pays its caregivers 800.00 more a fortnight than the government pays its carers.

So there ya go, I save DoCS and Centrelink money while hubby pays a stupid amount of tax so the government can send it off to other foster parents doing exactly what we do. There better be a special place in heaven for fools that awaits us model couples.

I don’t mind taxes going to a single parent at home with young kids or pensioners or sick and disabled people. I’ve probably forgotten a few.

So you reckon if the minimum wage went up it would kill a lot of businesses? Isn’t there some index or something that calculates that? I know it was mentioned a few pages ago. Doesn't this fix it?

Well The Pied Piper, the whole problem with raising the minimum wage is that you must also raise all wages in turn, otherwise, where are the incentives to become a doctor, lawyer etc etc.

We already suffer somewhat from this with people holding road signs on $24 per hour. Butchers, chefs, both with trades, get paid less, so why bother.

In a food business, we have whats called 'margins'. This is essensially the difference between what we pay for goods and what we then sell them for.

Now out of this margin comes your working expenses, rent, power, advertising etc and, wages, compo, super, holiday loading etc.

Now if you increase wages by say 5%, then that increase either comes off your bottom line, or it must be tacked on to the selling price otherwise you're out of pocket yourself.

Now to allow a 5% increase, actually becomes more like 6% with add ins. Super, compo, holiday loading etc.

Now to achieve 6% to the bottom line, prices have to be increased by around 8 to 10% because not every minute is spent taking money.

So the end result will be a further increase in food prices and ultimately inflation.

I think this may be the reason behind the recent decision not to increase the minimum wage. Essecially with regards to inflation.

You see, wages can't just be increased because life is tough. Someone, somewhere has to pay for it.

Now if small retailers are expected to fund the increases out of their pockets, where is the incentive. Remember, small business is the largest employer in the country. Loose them and we all suffer.

Furthermore, many small business operators are actually paid far less than the minimum wage when you take into account the hours spent either working and or planning for work.

Quoting is a classic example. The business owner is working for free when doing quotes, and while pricing the job. Often missing out by the way. Would you like to put in 10 to 15 hours per week not knowing if you will be paid?