Last night I watched a doco on 1963-6 New Port Folk Music Festival. The songs, the artists were we ever that young? Joan Baez, Judy Collins, Mary Travers (Peter Paul and Mary) so lovely with such pure voices. Donovan (seemed hardly old enough to shave) even Johnny Cash would have stirred hearts then, Pete& Mike Seeger. Real Blues With artists names Like Sonny and Mississippi. Throw in some music/acts that well… perhaps best lost to time. Real ye ha Blue Grass and some Chicken Shucking and Corn Pluckin’ (?) music that sounded like it should have quarantined until it could be cured or died out. Good old fashion Black Gospel, Odetta now that’s a voice to camp out to hear. Bob Dylan, given the bucolic setting I wondered how anything living could have sounded in such pain without being put down, great songs though.

The Vox pops showed a naivety and genuine optimistic idealistic hope that they could/would change things for the better.
Sadly the youth of today have that hope replaced with cynicism/materialism and more and more diversions (chemical, electrical). They haven’t lost anything …they never had it to lose.

We failed to change anything that matters we traded our sense of contentment with our place in the universe, a sense of society/community its safety, security and sense of belonging for materialism and denial:
• We deny the damage we’re doing to the world and ultimately ourselves.
• We deny the importance of laws treating them as optional depending on our convenience despite being the glue that holds society together.
• We deny personal responsibility it’s always someone else’s fault. We take it out on those that remind us of our short coming.
We concocted elaborate arguments based around at best conditional rights to justify our wrongs and lack of responsibility to the whole. We show our children how to be selfish….
And they watch and learn.

Pity us in our old age we won’t have the community like our parents we won’t know how.
Like the Harry Chapin song says ‘the cat’s in the cradle’

Examinator I share your concerns, many do manners seem to be dead.
The young seem to live within another world, young girls serving in those well known take aways do not even try to hide a total lack of interest in being civil to anyone who is not date material.
But while I remember the 60,s, yes I was there, we must not forget our parents held the same fears, about us.
A lot of generations separate me from those days.
I want to say it is my view while my concerns remain parents in the range 20 to 35 years old do a far better job than my generation.
We got shunted into the yard seen but never heard.
I am impressed with the hugs and kisses and dads telling their sons and daughters they love them so often.
A million times I am unimpressed by children screaming in public or pre school kids disrupting doctors waiting rooms full of unhappy people while parents read books and look the other way.
Manners should be one of our best asset's, lack of them is no way to make Friends.

Why can't the kids of today be more like us - perfect in every way?

I'm a bit concerned about the use of the royal we and speaking for a whole generation.

For what it's worth (Not much, I know) I think you either should go for a walk in the park, or get a whip and lash yourself over the back with it.

Exactly what I was thinking, Spikey.

Kids!
I don't know what's wrong with these kids today!
Kids!
Who can understand anything they say?
Kids!
They're disobedient, disrespectful oafs!
Noisy, crazy, dirty, lazy, loafers!
While we're on the subject:
Kids!
You can talk and talk till your face is blue!
Kids!
But they still just do what they want to do!
Why can't they be like we were,
Perfect in every way?
What's the matter with kids today?
Kids!
I've tried to raise him the best I could
Kids! Kids!
Laughing, singing, dancing, grinning, morons!
And while we're on the subject!
Kids! They are just impossible to control!
Kids! With their awful clothes and their rock an' roll!
Why can't they dance like we did
What's wrong with Danny Kaye?
What's the matter with kids today!

BYE BYE BIRDIE (The Musical) 1963
Music by Charles Strouse Lyrics by Lee Adams

Here's a cute version

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VsQNy4wgMDM

Dear examinator,

I came across this quote that I rather like:

"What can I give this beautiful new generation?
The unwanted gift of my experience?
I don't think so.
Perhaps only the right to make the same mistakes.
And afterward not saying,
"I told you so!"

Spikey Pericles,
I'm not on about the children of today Socrates (the real one)said something like that 2500 year ago.
I'm more concerned about what we're teaching them with *our* behaviour.
One question must be why did so many of the "we can/will" generation sell out? What happened to the we want change...? Arguably we made it worse.
Take the ad about mum chastizing her daughter for saying "bloody indiot" then 30 second later calling another driver that, the emperor Nassi Goring ad.
Chapin's song says "I want to be like you dad" and he was

Houellebecq,

I observe your splendid understanding of irony.

Don't go for a walk or self-flagellate. Instead, have a browse of http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Books_about_irony

Dear examinator,

I've been sitting here re-reading your opening post and
I've got to confess that I can't identify with the gloomy
picture that you're painting. I don't think that as parents we've 'sold out.'
That we've compromised our 'ideals,'
or created a world in which we're going to be
miserable in our old age.

Both my husband and I have worked hard all of our lifes.
We have two children of whom we're very proud.
While working full-time, raising a family, and with
my husband's support, I managed to complete my
post-graduate studies. We're a very close family unit
which includes grandparents, uncles, aunts, nieces and nephews.

My children know they are very loved. We've always been open and
honest with them.

So, I'm sorry, I don't understand why such an unusually gloomy
outlook on things from you this time. Life certainly has its
challenges but it's not as black as all that surely?
As parents we all try to do the best we can. But, my children
know that we're also human, and make mistakes. And when
we've goofed - I've always explained things to my children.
We've always talked about everything. And they've always
known the reasons behind our decisions. We've also tried
very hard not to impose our biases on our children. Be it
in politics, religion, their choice of friends...

Cheer up.

Foxy,
I'm not sad or gloomy. I'm sure that you, some others on OLO I can name are fine.
When I said "we" I was looking at the wider picture. I thoroughly enjoyed the show nostalgia and all that, even though I was still a babe in arms at the time of the show ;-)
A year or so later I was involved in my first march…to support the aboriginals’ right to vote (Me and umpteen others in Melb).

Recently I saw a number of vox pops after 'the big day out'(a pop concert a few months back) and I was struck by the differences in attitudes.

Sure youth will be what they have always been trying to find their voice the baby boomers had the Who and ‘My Generation’. This generation songs are far more aggressive and dark. Youth in general seem all that more jaded, more desperate to be seeking extreme diversions. The extreme nature of it rail surfing something our generation never did. Graffiti, gravestone vandalism, vandalism is far more aggressive, tagging (an identity issue). E’s, Ice etc are everywhere socially. There was always an *element* of rebellion (the archetypal Fonzie) later dope and LSD (in some environments). I wondered why the almost manic level of diversion (escape). Chapin’s warning gave me the idea.

The 29 yo across the road has a mouth at times like a sewerage pipe at times…his two children (6&4) were playing traffic and the boy mimicked road rage. The men down the road have abused me for doing bush regeneration because it interfered with their illegal activities.

The Grey nomads one wonders what this is doing for the extended family bit. Contact between grandparents and ensuing generations is important for any number of reasons. Forget the inheritance that is transitory consider the social and financial costs to society.

I’ve never believed in cocooning or blinkers, gloom is pointless, here I prefer realism then you can plan change. I will never give up on society and cocoon or binker my self.

Examinator
My parents used to worry about the same issues that I worry about with my kids - drugs, sexual promiscuity, manners etal. Each generation brings with it a revision of old problems based on changes in technology, availability of information and culture.

We cannot do much enmasse to change the things we might not like about some of the current social trends (manners is my bugbear), but we can try to be better role models ourselves - random acts of kindess and all that stuff.

The best thing we can do for our children is to remain positive and supportive and demonstrate by action rather than by words. (My kids go deaf to preaching and I still do occasionally fall into the old parent traps) :)

Dear Pelican,

I agree with you. I've also found that being supportive is important.
As I've said in many other threads - every parent I know lives
with the uneasy sense that their children are growing up too
fast.

Once I realised that collecting for the Spastic Society once a year,
and taking part in other 'fund-raising' activities, was not
going to add up to moral development, I started looking
seriously for way to help my children learn right from wrong, and
to know that sometimes there is a decision to be made in the
middle.

My children, growing up were facing tough choices and complicated
situations that could not be addressed with simple lectures on
the values of kindness or isolated chats about standing up for
one's beliefs. I wanted to surround my children with a sturdy
sensibility, a world view, and I wanted it to be different from the
'Me' mentality of modern culture.

But here I am getting carried away ...

Dear examinator,

I'm glad that you're not 'gloomy.' Your opening post just came
across that way to me on first reading and I became concerned.
Anyway, thanks for explaining - but as Pelly pointed out - parents
have always worried about similar sorts of issues over the years.
I guess they always will. Times may change, but the problems
remain. You do the best you can, and fingers-crossed, things
turn out OK.