Polycarp wrote: “...if the Almighty can create the universe and world and mankind.. it would be but a small thing for a snake to verbalize something if God so enabled it.”

Why would god endow a snake with speech in order to trick his beloved creations into doing something wrong that he already knew they were going to do? In fact, why would a god be doing any of this if he already knew the outcome?

Polycarp wrote: “...the idea that 'snakes can't talk' is a true to me as "broken bones cannot be healed in seconds" :) which as you know was my own experience.”

Had Polycarp’s arm been severed, would god still heal the wound and make his arm grow back?

Think about it...

David f wrote: “Since God is a human invention the only limits on what God can do are the limits of the human imagination.”

Quite so. But not even humans can come to a consensus as to what those limits are. Many Christians claim that god cannot do the impossible, and give an example by stating that god cannot make a square triangle. But that would mean that god's power is not unlimited, and thus he is not a god.

Such a paradox.

God cannot make a square triangle as it is impossible for a square to be a triangle.
But god’s power is unlimited; therefore, god can make a square triangle.
But a square triangle is a physical impossibility; therefore, god cannot make a square triangle.
But god’s power is unlimited; therefore, god can make a square triangle.
But a square triangle is a physical impossibility; therefore, god cannot make a square triangle.
But god’s power is unlimited; therefore, god can make a square triangle.

...Ad infinitum.

This never-ending loop, as well as the severed-limb-scenario, can only be broken by either stating that god works in mysterious ways, or conceding that he actually may not exist.

It’s unfortunate that the majority of the religious find it impossible to accept the logical latter, and go for the uncritical former.

Religious thought certainly is messy.

Hi there Adam D...welcome to the discussion.

You said:

"Why would god endow a snake with speech in order to trick his beloved creations into doing something wrong that he already knew they were going to do? In fact, why would a god be doing any of this if he already knew the outcome?"

Aahh...the old 'unfathomable question trick' :) There is an answer.. but it is one you may not like.

Human arrogance is one of those qualities we don't like the Almighty to mess with.. It's precious to us..right?

The answer is found in the Bible... and it is complete (the answer)

Romans chapter 9

That's it. Have a read and see if you can tweak to what I mean here.

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?book_id=52&chapter=9&version=31

Verse 19 might help.

It does not matter which religion one looks at..they all face the same question. "If God knew the end from the beginning....." and so it goes.

I urge you to consider one thing though. Paul, the author of Romans, (probably the most profound book ever written in all history).. spoke from a very special perspective.. that of an encounter with the risen Christ.

blessings.

Polycarp wrote:

Paul, the author of Romans, (probably the most profound book ever written in all history).. spoke from a very special perspective.. that of an encounter with the risen Christ.

Dear Polycarp,

On what basis do you make the statement that Romans is ‘probably the most profound book ever written in all history.’? I think that is merely another statement of belief. I doubt that you have knowledge of the many books that have been written in all history.

As far as the risen Christ I think Swinburne said it well:

That no life lives for ever;
That dead men rise up never;
That even the weariest river
Winds somewhere safe to sea.

The risen Christ is another fairy tale.

A long time ago, in the town where Peter Beattie grew up, history was accurately taught from Primary School through to Scholarship. It was a Labor Government then in Queensland. In 1957, a split between the Anglican Laborites, and the Roman Catholic Laborites, allowed a sectarian government to creep into power. The Labor Party did not get back into power for forty two years.

The history taught was that the Magna Carta and Bill of Rights, were achieved by the English, and that no Policeman, or other Public Servant could molest or shoot you, without having to answer to a jury. What was left out was the fact that these Statutes are sourced in Christianity, and it was the independent minded English, who rejected the Doctrine of Papal Infallibility, and required universal allegiance to the King, as God’s representative. The State and Church were merged, and have remained merged ever since. In Victoria, these principles are still in force, but a New Sectarian Government, driven by half educated lawyers and barristers, treats these principles as non core law.

Just teaching the Imperial Acts Application Act 1980 ( Vic) as history, would change the whole way Victoria is governed. S 8 of the Act may be found here.
http://www.community-law.info/?page_id=189

When Sectarianism became the State Religion, it had to have Priests and these priests are lawyers, solicitors and barristers, and they have taken over the State Church of Victoria, and made Victoria their own private resource, where they can steal just like Robert Mugabe, and Stalin did. They had to have Gods, and these Gods are Judges and Magistrates. History shows that this way of being governed never worked, and never will. The Great God Brumby, does not like competition.

It is time the people of Australia woke up to the fact that religion is central to government. You either have the Christian principles applied and all other Law is void, as is provided by the Imperial Acts Application Act 1980 ( Vic) or you have a dogs dinner of conflicting laws, making lawyers rich. History, just history, is enough

Hello Peter,

The Vatican quashed the Magna Carta. Please check your history book.

O.

Poly,

If God gave the power of speech to a snake to bring down Humanity, it follows, that God would have aided your Devil by providing said Devil the necessary conduit of communication.

All,

Bst wishes for the festive season. Off-line for a week.

O.