Well..Luddy.. perhaps "Christianity" as you so loosely describe it... or more accutately "The Christianity which you choose to identify by certain characteristics..chosen by you" does not embrace 'sustainability' is the same reason many folks don't embrace the Lord Jesus and His teaching?

Genesis 1 "Subdue" is clearly meaning "control for your benefit"..NOT "control it to the point of self destruction" that idea is a double 'duh'.

Let me put it differently:

Jesus said
-"Blessed are the meek"
-"Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness"
-"Blessed are the peacemakers"
-"Blessed are the pure in heart"

How are you going (all of us) compared to that checklist?

I can guarantee one thing..if we all went by that Checklist daily, we would be avoiding 'GREED' and embracing 'CARE'.. of our fellow humans and also our planet.

I think what you REALLLY mean is "Why arn't the select few manifestations of 'Christianity' that I've chosen for my biased article doing what I want to show they are not doing for the purposes of my biased article" :) so ner.

Still, having said all that, ultimately I speak for myself, and I'm sure that the 'Church' in general can benefit from a greater focus on how the Lords words should be applied to this important issue.

There you go Luddy... your calling.. offer yourself to the Churches as an "Itinerant Mr Fixit for the worlds ills" then you can rant and ramble at them about how selfish and irresponsible they are..and explain how wonderful you are :)

Religions don't embrace sustainability because at their heart they are essentially selfish and self-serving -

1. They believe Man is unquestionably at the centre of the Universe and everything has been provided for his exclusive use.

2. This existence in transitory. It's really the afterlife that matters so the only value in this life is to qualify for the next level. This life and everything in it is just a means to an end.

3. The cargo-cult mentality of an all-seeing, all-providing overseer who will fix everything (If it's His will - if not, it's part of a Divine Plan).

4. It's the survival of the religion itself that matters, plus what it offers the individual. Religions never take a backward step or surrender turf for the greater good of anyone.

5. Most have a concept of some sort of final rapture or Armageddon which will end up trashing the planet (along with the unsaved) anyway, so why bother.

It's always just around the corner, so party-on dudes!

You can ramble on about wickedness and greed all you like, but one of that factors that I think Ludwig is alluding to is that a great percentage of Christianity do not allow women control over their own reproductive biology. To be fair, some do but they aren't in the majority of the hierarchy of either the Catholic Church or any of the fundamentalist churches/sects/cults floating around. To be also fair Christianity is not the only religion that fails to acknowledge this majorly damaging policy.

In the end, it comes down to allowing humans to trash the planet by overwhelming reproductive success, just so that a few souls can be saved. While this seems an inherent contradiction, I would say "welcome to religion".

Christian Faith and sustainable living.

An unfortunate oxymoron given the basic tenants of the devout Christian:

"The sixty-six books of both the Old and New Testaments comprise the inspired Word of God and are without error in the original writings. The Bible is God's complete written revelation for the salvation of man and is the final authority regarding Christian life and faith.


There is one uncreated eternal God, eternally existent in three persons, the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.


Jesus Christ is God manifest in the flesh, was born of a virgin, led a sinless life, died on the cross and rose again bodily on the third day. Because He ever lives, He alone is our High Priest and advocate.


All mankind is sinful by nature. This condition makes it impossible to earn his exaltation through good works. Good works however, are a by-product of saving faith, not a pre-requisite to be saved.


Mankind is saved by grace through faith alone in Jesus Christ. Believers are justified by His shed blood and shall be saved from wrath through Him.


Christ's Church is made up of individuals who have recognized their lost state and placed their trust in the redeeming work of Christ for their salvation.


Jesus Christ will return again for His own. All true believers will reign with Him throughout eternity.


There will be a bodily resurrection of both the just and the unjust; the just to everlasting life, the unjust to everlasting damnation."

Nothing here about caring for the earth that sustains us. My question is, can the people who live in the real world get on with making our lives sustainable and ignore the self obsession of the fundamentalist religious?

"But I fear very much that Christians suffer much more from a lack of accountability by placing the duty of care in the hands of their god delusion… and hence feel that not only is there nothing they can do but that either god will take care of it…or the path to destruction is pre-ordained and simply has to happen."

Yes, Ludwig, I definitely think that's part of it. I fully agree with the points made by Wobbles and Fractelle too.

I also think Runner's statement that the 'environmental industry' might gain more support if it weren't 'so morally corrupt' is very telling.

Conservative Right wing Christians, in particular, wouldn't be seen dead lining up with the depraved, pot-smoking, dreadlock-wearing bunch of deadbeats that, in their eyes, constitute the environmental movement. They've railed against them so vehemently and for so long that they've painted themselves into a real corner. Now, as evidence validating the environmentalist movement's claims continues to mount, they find they've got nowhere to turn. Maybe the yankee evangelical, CJ referred to, might end up creating a respectable enough movement for Christians like Runner to put their names to.

The rest of us might have a worry though with those Parliamentary 'prayer meetings', and whether or not they were in fact being kept strictly to environmental matters.

Great work, wobbles.

Five succinct reasons why religion will never lead any environmental movement.

- religion is actually about the individual
- rewards are in heaven, not here
- it's all in the divine plan anyway
- religions fight for their own survival, not the planet's
- and then there's armageddon, anyway

Such style. Such economy.

Love it.