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The Forum > General Discussion > State Land and Private Religous Purposes.

State Land and Private Religous Purposes.

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Dear Bronwyn,

I writhe at your feet in an agony of humble self-abasement for lecturing you.

Polycarp has generated a unity among those who are turned off by him. If we could only show that he is an extra-terrestrial we might unify the planet.
Posted by david f, Wednesday, 22 October 2008 7:49:31 AM
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Well.... much as I take a bit of a battering here :) from the usual suspects... I'm greatly encouraged.

Believe it or not, little snippits of information filter out which help me to understand the perspective of those writing against what I write.

David F.. your support for fairness is appreciated (moniker) -as to your comment

"The holocaust was a result of years of Christian bigotry"

Is quite close to the mark. Given the beautiful statements of the likes of Ms Shink.. surely you might like to add the word "misguided" just before 'bigotry'...because surely if you read the words of Jesus, you will see this to be a fact.

The statement "No man comes to the Father but by me" is without doubt one of those which divides humanity into 2 camps. "The Saved" and "The Lost"

Without further comment, it is easy to see why someone could be annoyed by such a verse.

Remember his words when arrested? (Matt 26:52ff)

"for all who draw the sword will die by the sword. 53Do you think I cannot call on my Father, and he will at once put at my disposal more than twelve legions of angels? 54But how then would the Scriptures be fulfilled that say it must happen in this way?"

Notice his emphasis? "that the scriptures be fulfilled"

Notice also in Matthew 8

16When evening came, many who were demon-possessed were brought to him, and he drove out the spirits with a word and healed all the sick. 17This was to fulfill what was spoken through the prophet Isaiah:
"He took up our infirmities
and carried our diseases." (Isaiah 53:4)

For those interested in textual matters..that section is ONLY found in Matthew..not Mark, Luke or John.

Nevertheless...Jesus is here being connected by the Jew (Matthew) to the Messianic Isaiah 53

TOPIC. Bronwyn, ur close when you say education is languishing due to lack of funding..so LETS STOP FUNDING PRIVATE RELIGIOUS structures on state land! for ANY group.
Posted by Polycarp, Wednesday, 22 October 2008 7:55:27 AM
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Dear TRTL

the Multi Faith centre at RMIT "resembles" a MOSQUE more than any Church as it was designed by a commissioned Muslim Architect.

I avoid mentioning "Islam/Muslims" because it is an issue of principle which would equally apply if they were Bahai's or Catholics. OR.. Brethren.

Bronwyn.. the issue of 'religious requirements' is irrelevant. The job of the STATE is SECULAR not religious. RMIT made a goose of itself by simply trying:
a) To be "politically correct"
b) To attact high fee paying Muslims from Oil rich countries.

They can reap what they have sown on those issues. I have little sympathy for them.

Regarding a similar request at the University of Western Sydney see this:

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,22364144-12332,00.html

Request: "Build us a mosque"
Outome: "denied"
Reason: "We are a SECULAR institute"

Bronwyn..I seem to notice a pattern in your thinking. i.e.. that the most important thing in all issues is 'what people want' rather than what the law or even the community says. I see this pattern also in regard to assylum seekers.

Dear Romany... you say you have studied the Quran and the Bible.

Please explain Surah 9.. in it's historic context.

Keep the following in mind:

1/ "Did Mohammad simply 'decide' to not honour existing treaties?" (verse 1)
2/ "Why"
3/ "Did he announce that he would KILL all mushriks who remained in the land after a certain period of time"? (verse5)
4/ "Was the only way of escaping death for a Mushrik(Polytheist/pagan) to embrace Islam"? (verse 5)

With the exception of point 2, they only require a 'Yes/no' answer.

if you say you know it.. how about proving it?
Posted by Polycarp, Wednesday, 22 October 2008 8:17:42 AM
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Dear Polycarp,

I am already breaking my word by posting to you.

You wrote:

“Nevertheless...Jesus is here being connected by the Jew (Matthew) to the Messianic Isaiah 53”

That should be amended to:

Nevertheless...the Jew Jesus is here being connected by the Jew (Matthew) to the Messianic Isaiah 53

Jesus was a Jew, and you reject his religion.

Obviously Matthew was wrong since the messianic prophesy was not fulfilled. The lion did not lie down with the lamb, and nations still study war.

I don’t think there is any such thing as a messiah, but Jesus was obviously one of the many false ones. Matthew might have later admitted he was wrong.

You also wrote: “LETS STOP FUNDING PRIVATE RELIGIOUS structures on state land! for ANY group.”

I agree with that. In addition let’s eliminate the school chaplaincy program and stop funding non-public schools. Pastoral care is the business of the churches. Chaplains should only be provided in the armed services, prisons and in similar places where people are away from their religious structures. School children live at home.

I also note Matthew 8:16 When evening came, many who were demon-possessed were brought to him, and he drove out the spirits with a word and healed all the sick.

That was part of the superstitious context of 2,000 years ago and of the superstitious part of our population at present.

Do you believe in demons?

The mentally ill used to be called ‘demon-possessed’. Some of us know better now. The New Testament as well as the Jewish Bible has much superstitious nonsense in it. Bishop Spong is trying to emphasise the ethical content of the Bible and get rid of superstitions. We can be aware of Matthew 8:16 and realize it is sheer superstition.

The original prophesy did not mention demons. That was added by the superstitious authors of the New Testament.
Posted by david f, Wednesday, 22 October 2008 8:39:55 AM
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david f

"I writhe at your feet in an agony of humble self-abasement for lecturing you."

You're forgiven!

Mind you, it wasn't the image of you writhing at my feet that softened my cold heart! It was this little gem in your last post that won me over -

.."let’s eliminate the school chaplaincy program and stop funding non-public schools."

How could I harbour even a hint of animosity towards a speaker of such wisdom!

You do realise though don't you that you have now placed me in a difficult position. Each time I go to address Polycarp, I now have to choose between showing my respect to you and showing my disrespect to his pomposity. I guess it will depend on how riled I am at the time as to which choice wins!

As long as you know that even while I ignore your advice I do respect you for the decent and fair-minded poster you are. You have to understand though I just don't have your same capacity to turn the other cheek!
Posted by Bronwyn, Wednesday, 22 October 2008 11:19:57 AM
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Bronwyn wrote:

"As long as you know that even while I ignore your advice I do respect you for the decent and fair-minded poster you are. You have to understand though I just don't have your same capacity to turn the other cheek!"

As the butt of your remarks I turn the other cheek.
Posted by david f, Wednesday, 22 October 2008 11:34:21 AM
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