Steve Madden
I would like to answer that question posted 18.10.2206 please. The biggest problem with real farmers is they are very proud and wont except or ask for help. Even if they do as PF pointed out it is made so hard and complictaed that many just cant fill the papers out. The whole system is shameful.Because farmers are the backbone of this country and its the right thing to look after them. Also a long term view is ever heard of "santcions and boycotts'. Take a look around you it happens world wide. We have a high percentage of unemployed and few prodiving center link for many in this country. The National party are traitors to the farmers flooding the market with cheap imports.
The levies and tax dodges and the all mighty trade dollar deals and lerks and perks are not accessed by the real Australian farmer. No sir Re. The maketing support and props are not passed onto them either.Just try getting a accreditation done from a local plant to export standard if you are a smaller operator. Its made almost impossible for the litle man. There are people looking into the whole unfair system. It stinks.
Oh no thats strictly corp people with the clever accountants and the regional transport arrangments. Not so for people real farmer.

We dont want the Government to gobble up the poorer farmer. Poorer at times in bank balance but rich in knowledge and running free range farms disease free . We dont want all intensive farms and feedlots creating disease and inflicting mass cruelty.
We want real farmers who creek feed not intensive feed. Perhaps some do not know the difference.
this may help
.http://www.themeatrix.com/

Wayne Smith is on the right track regarding the water problem and yes sea water is the way to go. We are surounded by it and a profesor who is sort world wide regarding turning sea water into fresh lives right here in Australia. Here is another cluey bloke

http://www.themeatrix.com/

Why should farmers be treated differently than miners- because we all need to eat

Has been

Your right. Its not that simple. Have you noticed retired farmers are loosing so much per week off their pension if they own land. Its true some farms will have to look for another product to grow.

Laurie "exceptional circumstances' to small businesses crumbling'
You dont get it. Without the farmers and the meat plants you wont have a business. By helping the farmers the Government already helps you. Why should you double dip.

Pericles said he was surprised by the vehemence that turned up to post. I am saddened and angry. No wonder the old cockys talk about the city slickers. They really do live in fairy land. Oh well guess we can blame John Howard its easier that way.

Yabby is right on the money re back to back shifts of meat plants. I dont agree with the theory of why the reluctance to bring in the abattoir workers. I think you need to look a little closer to home.
Its interesting to note the GATS can be used everywhere else. If you get a copy of the act it clearly reads the GATS sytem can be used in every trade except prostitution. A good argument for any company looking to increae empoyment and run twenty four hour shifts at abattoirs.

Mark Vaile wrote a few years ago explaing why the GATS could never be used in abattoirs.

Farmers dont think like that. They speak in a language of a hanshake is worth more than any bit of paper. We cant afford to loose people like that. They are Australia.
Woolworth and coles for example need to get involved with free range Farmers. People want healthy products for their family and to know the animal has not been confined in an area it could not move in.
Move them on they say. Move them on where? Its their home their life and their land and we ow them big time. We wont move them on to be pushed out by the corperate bullys.
Steve Madden you are better than that

Steve,

Good admission of yours several posts back - "These are difficult issues". Too right they are. All I suggest is that it does few of us any good to encourage the self-righteous attitude of some who should know better when, faced with tightening water restrictions, an increased number of welfare recipients, or such like, they simply look around for that to which others have an existing entitlement to ease their own convenience.

Just to be sure we are talking about the same things, it has always been my understanding that mining, too, is a primary industry. I must admit that I don't have the figures to hand, but I think when mining is added to agriculture we are talking significantly more than 3% of GDP. Coal mining, too, is under attack in Australia from the same sort of control freaks who are responsible for the neglect of water supply infrastructure.

It must be thirty to forty years since death duties were abolished, but the utterly disastrous effects of this most destructive of taxes are with us yet. The forced sales and dismemberment of estates that this tax entailed, let alone the costly legal processes that were necessary to minimize its impact, are probably a quite significant contributing factor to the difficulties faced by farmers today. Sustainable farming is a very long-term business. The huge amount of money those death duties raised helped unsustainably expand the public sector, many of whose present day clients are squealing at having to share "their" welfare pool or career prospects with newly misfortunate people who have heretofore somehow carried their own load.

Payment of death duties, incidentally, provides a classic example of just how difficult it was to separate business from personal assets. Collection, in many cases, amounted to divesting the next generation farmer from what was not only his or her inheritance, but also the tools of trade.
Pericles characterises some of the critics of drought relief as raw-in-tooth-and-claw capitalists. More like scared former communists, I reckon, fleeing in disguise from a disaster of their own making!

Forrest

Mining is about 5% of Australia's GDP despite the hype about the resources boom it is still a very small part of our economy.

"Service Industries" are the biggest portion of GDP at about 58% and financial services make up a large proportion.

In other words the Australian economy is riding on the back of an industry that makes absolutely nothing. (except profits).

The accountants, brokers, merchant bankers are the ones who run and control our economy and they have no sympathy for the hard workers who strive to make a living for there families and future generations.

Until we find a way to let people who actually make something have a say we will become an economic rationalist battlefield of greed.

Try to buy clothes not made in China (from Australian cotton). Food will be next and water will be the excuse.

Free trade is a farce, we need to protect our farmers and manufacturers. What chance do we have when the "conventional wisdom" says otherwise.

The hard workers get zilch, screen jockeys get Mercedes.

Benny you misinterpret my feelings. I am not saying that things are correct just pointing out the way they are. :)

The way I see it Steve Madden everybody has a point. If you look at the overall problem its clear we need to get smarter. If they can build a city in the middle of the sand in other countries and find water so can Australia. The fellow talking about the sea water has a good point. Other counries are travelling to Australia to talk to this Dr who has the method. Every Government except Australia where the person lives. It does not add up. Some of the corp farmers snatch and grab every lerk perk tax cut but then again you cant call them real farmers. If you are in the know there are grants under the regional grants sytem that should be wiped. Tax lerks are a joke too.
What you end up with is the little honest farmer being sqeezed out. That is what is happening.
Lots of smaller free range farmers is what is required and the corp guys want to mussle the little man out and replace them with feed lots.
If you walk into a super market and buy a can of home brand baked beans, guess where they come from? UAE.
So tell me how that is smart.
What Australia cant grow some beans and put them in a tin?
God help us when its our turn to be sanctioned .
Give the land back to the free Range farmers and for god sake train some of these lazy people I see living off the dole walking the streets and beaches. A few in the army might be a darn good idea too.
You have got a nation of youth often walking around on drugs
A good long term plan if you are the enermy I would think.