CJ Morgan wrote:

"Nice to see Steven taking a breather from whacking Mozzies."

I notice you don’t call this thread "whacking Christians."

So when I comment on the problem of Christian fundamentalism I'm the "good guy."

But when I comment on the far greater problems posed by contemporary Islam I'm an obsessed "Mozzie whacker" and a Jewish version of Boaz?

What does that tell me about you CJ Morgan?

I at least am consistent. I oppose all authoritarian ideologies whether they be those propagated by Aryans in brown shirts, Fidel / Chavez worshipping airheads or dark skinned people with beards or hijabs.

And, for the record, I do not "bash Mozzes." I bash the imperial authoritarian ideology that is CONTEMPORARY Islam. I also bash apologists for that loathsome ideology.

Runner,

I fully agree that, at least for now, Christian fundamentalism is a minor problem. Let's hope it does not develop into a major one.

stevenlmeyer: "I oppose all authoritarian ideologies whether they be those propagated by Aryans in brown shirts, Fidel / Chavez worshipping airheads or dark skinned people with beards or hijabs"

So do I.

"I bash the imperial authoritarian ideology that is CONTEMPORARY Islam"

No you don't. You conflate Islamism and fundamentalist versions of Islam with "CONTEMPORARY Islam". That is as intellectually dishonest as you would be if you conflated the fundy Christian nutters in yoiur link, or the Exclusive Brethren for that matter, with contemporary Christianity. That's why you mostly come across as an "obsessed 'Mozzie whacker' and a Jewish version of Boaz".

Which is why you cop some stick from me. And when did I intimate that you're a "good guy"?

CJ Morgan wrote:

"You conflate Islamism and fundamentalist versions of Islam with "CONTEMPORARY Islam."

Do I?

Over the years I have put a question to many Muslim Imams here and in South Africa. In its current form the question is as follows:

If (when?) Muslims become a majority in Australia or any other "Western" country would you seek to have the following made criminal offences.

-Adultery?

-Advocating atheism?

-Apostasy?

-Criticising Islam?

-Evangelising for a non-Muslim religion?

-Homosexual acts?

-"Insulting" Muhammed or Islam?

-Questioning the accuracy of the koran?

-Teaching an interpretation of Islam that differs from what is generally accepted (blasphemy)?

-Teaching evolution?

In every case the short answer, after many weasel words, has been "yes."

This sure sounds like an authoritarian imperial ideology to me.

My research leads me to one inescapable conclusion. What you call "Islamism" or "fundamentalist versions of Islam" is in fact mainstream contemporary Islam. It is the "liberal" versions of Islam that are the exceptions.

But don't take my word for it CJ Morgan. Do your own research. Get off your backside and interview a few Imams.

stevenlmeyer: "But don't take my word for it"

Don't worry Steven, I won't.

Further to the unlikely veracity of a Jew interviewing "many Muslim Imams", it strikes me that in the extremely unlikely event of Muslims becoming a majority in Australia (or any other Western country), then they would be quite entitled to seek to change the law to conform to their mediaeval religion. That's called democracy.

However, I'm more concerned about what happens now, where we have numerous Christian lobby groups and government ministers attempting to change our laws so that they are in accord with their mediaeval religion. That's called subverting democracy.

Runner, fundamentalist christians DO get involved in violence. How many in the US bible belt support the Iraq war? Its Bush's main source of power. Is it s serious concern? Well, yes but I agree the threat is not as bad as islamic fundy's (unless you're Iraqi or perhaps Iranian).

CJ, whether fundamentalist islam is representative of modern islam or not, the fact is the sub-group is much shriller than any other religous fundy group, and apparently much more dangerous, both to their own people and to the wider world. I think this is what has most people concerned. I agree that if muslims ever become the majority in this country, democracy would give them the right to instill their rules pretty much at will, but I would also suggest that we might not retain the democracy for very long.

Going back to the point of what modern islam is, the concern is also that whilst the modernly educated are generally well enough equipped to make rational judgements about their own faith, much of the sphere of islam operates in vastly uneducated, poor countries. Fundamentalists have their richest pickings amongst those not educated enough to argue back. That's my other concern, is that even if the fundamentalists are not a large proportion of the muslim population, there is great capacity for them to become so. Again, this is why this extremist group is more dangerous than other relgious extremes.