No European imperial powers have managed to retain their
empires in perpetuity. Why would Russia be any different?

Putin extended his rule by another two six year terms in
2020. Russia has emerged as an unabashed dictatorship.
Putin is at the peak of his powers.

Can this change?

We saw in 1917-18 and in 1991 teutonic shifts can take place
in the blink of history's eye. Can there be a potential
fracture and destabilization in Russia?

Do future generations have a right to a better future?

Russia can see how Democracy doesn't work so, why should they bother ? Unless of course, the proponents of Democracy actually believe the moral & societal decay in democratic countries is something to aspire to. Are the current Olympics not enough for some to see ?
The economic imbalance in democratic countries really is not what Democracy is all about. Too many have no idea that Democracy is not achievable & is on par with Net Zero ! A handful of parasites doing exceptionally well does not translate into a successful society !
A real Democracy wouldn't have homeless & drug addicted people nor would it be possible for multi millionaire bureaucrats to thrive by being parasitic !

Damn. You've knocked it right out of the park Indy.
Nothing for me to add at this point, I'm kinda speechless.
Great Job, I'll leave it for now and come back later on. [smile]

Russia had two chances at democracy in the 20th century.

In 1917, in the months before the Bolshevik revolution
began. And again, in 1991, when the Soviet Union collapsed.

As long as Russians see themselves as subjects of their
ruler - Russia's democratization cannot take place.

Only the Russian people can decide if their next chance at
democracy will be more successful. The challenges that would
face a post-Putin Russia appear even more daunting than those
that the country faced with the collapse of the Soviet Union.

It is difficult to see what would move Russians to
take the first steps to
transform their country into a multi ethnic democracy.
They would have to examine their recent history and abandon
their imperial delusions.

Only a Russia that owns up to the crimes committed in the
name of empire can hope to begin to reconcile with its
neighbours and earn their trust. Imperial thinking implies
domination over others, competition with neighbours, and rule
by an emperor.

As long as Russians see themselves as subjects of their ruler
things are not going to change.

This argument reminds me of Noah and the flood, or of Sodom and Gomorrah. Hasn't it always been the case that autocratic rulers say that other nations and their people are degenerate, destined for oblivion, whilst all the suckers in the autocracy are steaming toward a golden age? Oh yeah, and all the limited freedoms, oppressive laws, large military, weapons and secret police are necessary to protect their riches and great way of life from envious outsiders.

What I wonder is whether it is easier to maintain an autocracy today than it was in the past. Unfortunately nations like Russia demonstrate that it is still possible.

Who cares! Whether or not Australia remains a democracy under increasingly Lefist politicians in both major parties, and 2.5 million unaccountable bureaucrats is what Australians should be worried about, not Russia.

Many Australians are already accepting creeping totalitarianism for money, too stupid to know that the more governments “help” them, and keep them “safe”, the more those governments control them. And, when the money runs out, they fools are still controlled, but much poorer.

Government is already moving to control what we can say, what we can view, and what we can read. They are determined to bring in digital ID so they can track us, and remove cash so that they can control what we spend and how we spend.

The ruling class is encouraging victimhood and helplessness.

They are dividing us with mass immigration and multiculturalism so that is no major group to fight back. Divided we will fall.

They want as many kids as possible in “early learning” so they can brainwash them. They want teachers to encourage children to keep secrets from their parents. Next step - inform on parents. The majority of teachers and teachers’ unions are Leftist zealots, themselves carefully brainwashed to pass Marxist values on.

The judiciary, business and union leaders, billionaires, celebrities and even the military are involved in propagating Marxism.

One of the biggest offenders in the march to totalitarianism is the media. Climate nonsense; the Voice; pro-Palestinianism; gender dysphoria, the lot.

As for our Judaeo-Christian values, they are also being forced out. It took, amazingly, two Muslims to speak out against the Olympic Games insult to Christianity: Iran’s Ayatollah Ali Khamenei proclaimed on X that “ respect for Jesus is ‘an indisputable, definite matter for Muslims’” : and Turkish President Tayyip Erdogan condemned the opening ceremony as a “disgusting’ affront to humanity’s sacred values and an insult to the Christian world”.

Not a peep from our bumbholes.

Nevertheless, there is always a useful idiot crank who wants to rabbit on about a country we are starting to look more like every day.

.

« Who cares! Whether or not Australia remains a democracy under increasingly Lefist politicians in both major parties … »

.

Ah, my dear anonymous poster, self-confidence is etched deep into our psyche. We drown out doubt with a flood of certainty instead of frankly acknowledging the complexity of a problem or the hesitation that should accompany what we claim to be the solution.

Certainty is an illusion. We live in an uncertain world.

“If you want to make God laugh – just tell Him your plans” (Yiddish joke).

Self-doubt is the hallmark of a great thinker. Doubt deflates the pressure to deliver “the right solution” with conviction. Instead, it provides room to experiment and play with tentative ideas.

Einstein began his article on how light is made up of photons with a hesitant “it seems to me.” Darwin introduced evolution with “I think.” Faraday spoke of the “hesitation” he experienced when he introduced magnetic fields.

Although the expression of self-doubt is a non-starter for most politicians, John F. Kennedy embraced it when he pledged to put a man on the Moon. He was unusually candid in admitting that he was asking his country to leap into the unknown: “This is in some measure an act of faith and vision,” he explained to the American public, “for we do not now know what benefits await us.”

Conviction breeds arrogance and hubris. It leads to complacency. The moment we think we have the right solution is the moment we start ignoring inconvenient facts and stop learning.

Self-doubt opens up the mind. If we doubt our answers, we’ll be receptive to revising them.

And maybe getting it right !

Self-confidence is like sand in an oyster : a little produces a pearl, too much kills the animal”.

.

Hi Foxy, a good topic.

You said; "Russia had two chances at democracy in the 20th century.In 1917, in the months before the Bolshevik revolution
began. And again, in 1991, when the Soviet Union collapsed."

I don't believe so, conditions did not exist at the time for the development of a liberal style democracy as we know it. Russia, like China and others has a history of political and economic instability, with no history of democratic processes. Liberal democracies develop over time, over a long period of time, when the conditions are right. Australia and other new democracies didn't develop their political and economic structure in unique isolation, we imported it from Europe, particularly Britain, where it had developed over a couple of hundred years.

Who is to say, that countries without a liberal democracy now, have a desire to develop such a thing. For example I don't believe China could be run on the same political and economic lines as Australia, that probably applies to Russia as well, and most of the world as it is now.

What about all the former Soviet states that are now democracies, the Czech Republic for example? What of the ability of migrants from autocracies to "fit into" the democracy they migrate to? And how many centuries before the descendants of these inherently undemocratic people become democratically inclined? What is fundamentally different about these human beings that makes them unsuitable for a democracy? To me, that sounds like the same guff that seeks to establish a "them and us" mentality, much like cult leader Albo tried with his referendum, and I note that he still has not given up his crusade for inequality. Perhaps it is more a matter of the system evolving than the people in it?

Yes, we are all going to Hell and the end is nigh. It has ever been thus.

"No European imperial powers have managed to retain their
empires in perpetuity. "

No imperial powers have managed to retain their empires in perpetuity.

There, fixed it for you.

I think we'd have a much greater chance of these autocratic nations becoming more democratic-like, if the west didn't use democracy as a tool of war.

That is, if it gave these nations space to evolve on their own.
But no, the West can't help itself to meddle in these countries.
They use civil society groups and NGO's to cause civil unrest, protests, overthrow elected leaders, install puppet rulers.
If the West acts this way, of course these nations will tighten their rules and reduce liberties to protect themselves from foreign threats.

What's happening in Venezuela is a perfect example of this.

The nation would be doing much better if it wasn't engaged in an endless battle trying to fend off attacks from the west specifically designed to undermine the country, and steal it's wealth.

I mean they're sitting on billions in oil.
But yet the west has them eating cats and dogs.

Imagine that, you have to go and find a stray cat to feed your kids.
All while your country sits on billions in wealth, but America won't let you use your nations resources to better the lives of your people.

I'm not saying autocrats are great people.
I'm just saying the West is no better and it's attitude and actions certainly help to foster these kinds of leaders and situations.

Until the world comes to this understanding I don't think things will change, and ultimately so long as this reality exists, then these autocratic leaders are probably doing the best they can for their people, whist remaining somewhat guarded when it comes to the Wests intentions.

Australians should be concentrating on their own country. Russia and Russians would have no interest in what some Australian thinks about them and their country.

Unfortunately, when the likes of Albanese and Dutton are the best our country can come up with, it has had the richard. Along with non-Anglo/Saxon/Celts enamoured with their 'roots' and multiculturalism, rabbiting on about foreigners and things they have no say in, Australia has been divided into tribes, working in their own interests, and not the good of Australia.

I'm seeing the beginning of the collapse of Australia; I'm very glad that I won't be here for the actual event.

While all this irrelevant claptrap about Russia is going on, a 9 year old child has been waiting 7 years for an adenoid operation in Queensland.

And that terrible woman the Leftists are always sneering at, Pauline Hanson has found out about it is going to pay for the operation.

But, never mind, you all continue to pontificate over Russia, as if your opinions on the world stage meant something.

Vlad is just waiting for your latest advice on how to run Russia.

Hi AC,

I like to think that people are equal, regardless of what they think or where they live. So when I look at Venezuela, I don't see a people unsuited to democracy being white-anted by malevolent foreigners. What I see are people like you and me being impoverished by an autocratic thug and his cronies. My concern is primarily for the hardships that these people endure.

Russia will not become a democracy in our lifetime or that of our grandkids. There is no democratic impulse in the Russia psyche - indeed the very opposite.

Nations or at least the people who make up nations have hereditary mores which have developed over centuries and millennia. The middle eastern peoples have been ruled by autocrats as far back as we can go, back to Sargon the Great or even Sargon I. Rulers change, regimes change but the form of government never changes - rule by the one or the few. The people are not only good with that but crave it. There's never been a democracy in the Middle East and there never will be unless it is imposed.

Russia is the same. From the time of the first Rus kingdom, Russian's have been ruled by autocrats and the desire for that is ingrained in their very being. They've never had a democracy and never developed institutions that might ushering in a regime which is devoted to individual liberty. They had a chance in 1917 and rejected it. They had a chance in the 1990s but as soon as things got even mildly tough, raced back to the roots by installing a new Tsar - Putin. They feel safe with a strongman in charge. Stalin killed tens of millions of them yet they wept when he died.

To be sure, it is possible to create a democracy in places where it has no tradition eg Japan. But that only happens if the old traditions are utterly rent asunder and the society can be reconstituted from the ground up.

The west has a tradition of individual freedom that goes back to Athens. The rest of the world doesn't. Russia won't develop nor import that tradition. Their tradition lays elsewhere.

The argument that democracy is incompatible with certain
cultures can be heard by defenders of autocracy around
the world.

After the Cold War ended, the process of democratization
began when the Kremlin began lifting restrictions on
Russians' ability to assemble, express themselves, and
travel abroad. But democracy did not take hold in Russia.

Yeltsin's successor Vladimir Putin was dillingently
dismantling the feeble democratic institutions that did
exist. In their place Putin patched together a facade
that displayed all the rituals and institutions of a
democracy but were nothing more than an empty shell.

We've seen how opponents were pushed off buildings. How
only government media was allowed. How journalists fled.
How demonstrators were arrested. How opponents were pushed
off buildings - how others died mysteriously, or were
poisoned. Putin poisoned and imprisoned his fiercest
domestic opponent Alexey Navalny. Putin extended his rule
in 2020. Russia became and now is -an unabashed dictatorship.
With Putin at the peak of his powers.

A democratic Russia would not
have taken issue with an alliance of democracies moving closer
to its borders. A democratic Russia would not be waging war on
another democracy, Ukraine, or threatening other European
democracies. And Russia's failure to become a democracy is
the root cause of its conflict with the West.

Putin has made it clear that his real objective in the
Ukraine is to re-conquer territories once controlled by Russia.

The potential path of a liberal democratic Russia won't
increase as time passes, not as long as Russians don't see
themselves as citizens of their own country but instead see
themselves as subjects of their ruler - a new way of thinking
in Russia is needed. This will be the country's biggest burden
in the era after Putin.

"What I see are people like you and me being impoverished by an autocratic thug and his cronies."
- That's probably what many less educated Venezuelans see too, because that's exactly what America wants them to see.

What I see are people like you and me being impoverished by a totalitarian US system.

I told you all before, it's a 'stick and a carrot' policy.

U.S. sanctions are the stick.
U.S. install their puppet rulers is the carrot.

Use the stick to bring the country to its knees.
Then use the carrot to blame everything on the existing government.
It's really simple, I don't know how you people just don't get it.

This is what 'democracy' has become, and this what I am objecting to.
Until people get a handle on this they will remain clueless about how the world really works.

What is the National Endowment for Democracy & Why it’s Wrong to Take their Money
http://www.youtube.com/live/omwCiF-Vt3Q

This is the stick:
U.S. Sanctions Have Devastated Venezuela. How Does That Help Democracy?
http://theintercept.com/2024/08/02/venezuela-election-maduro-us-sanctions-democracy/

And this is the carrot:
http://x.com/McFaul/status/1818312718698590332
"If there’s a peaceful transition to democracy in Venezuela, all sanctions will be lifted, and the suffering of the Venezuelan people will end."

In normal language:

"If you allow us to install our puppet ruler we will stop our collective punishment of your nation.
All we want is to rob your nations oil resources for the benefit of US companies.
If you let us install our leader, we will have them use deficit spending to fix the oil infrastructure in your country.
i.e. You Venezuelans will foot the bill, and we American companies will take all the profits.
If you do not accept, we are happy to have you eating cats and dogs.
It's your choice, kneel or starve."

You want people out on the streets to overthrow a non-vassal government?
- Nothing better than to starve them and deprive their children of a future, emotions will overcome ideology.
This is the democracy we so cherish.

It's the equivalent of robbing you at gunpoint, or holding your kids to ransom.

The belief that Western style democracy is impossible
in Russia. That Russians are incapable of adapting
democracy is shared not only by Putin supporters but also
by many other people including monarchists, nationalists,
communists, and many others.

People argue that Russia must follow its own culturally
determined path and that's because of Russia's
unwillingness to bend to the dictates of liberal democracies.
Russia therefore finds itself in conflict with the West.

Then we have South Korea. South Korea is an example of how a
country with no democratic traditions can transform itself into
a leading democracy within a couple of generations. Whereas
North Korea shows how the same nation can be trapped in a
dictatorship because of a drawn border.

Hi ttbn,
>>As for our Judaeo-Christian values, they are also being forced out. It took, amazingly, two Muslims to speak out against the Olympic Games insult to Christianity: Iran’s Ayatollah Ali Khamenei proclaimed on X that “ respect for Jesus is ‘an indisputable, definite matter for Muslims’” : and Turkish President Tayyip Erdogan condemned the opening ceremony as a “disgusting’ affront to humanity’s sacred values and an insult to the Christian world”.<<

I'm interested in why you find that amazing?
Did you maybe think it might come from Jewish people?
Or neutered western Christians who will be beaten over the head with 'You're bigots and anti-LGBT and oppose equality of all people' so they stay relatively silent.
Jews probably helped facilitate those opening ceremonies for all we know.

http://x.com/DrLoupis/status/1818891988055278070
“The founder of Christianity has been sentenced to boil in feces”
-Talmud

Jews have had it in for Christians since the Romans destroyed the Second Temple, and they still blame and hate them for it today.
It's not hard to find footage of Orthodox Jews spitting on Christians when they go on holiday in Israel.

They must laugh at how stupid and gullible the foolish Christians are.
They tricked you into thinking Muslims are the enemy, when they are the ones trying to remove Christmas and rule over the world.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jews_and_Christmas

Hi AC,

People always blame the outsider. Always have done. Goes by names like parochialism and it can get very nasty. I find that the idea of a conspiracy of outsiders is often false. Nothing wrong with a bit of suspicion and checking information to protect yourself, but you help no one when you take things too far. The Voice referendum is a good example of an attempt to foist such conspiratorial thinking upon Australians, and to our credit it was rejected.

Leave conspiracies to the entertainment industry. Cats and Dogs is not the way the world is, but it's a longstanding means of manipulation.

Pro-democratic, anti-imperial Russians do exist. Many
are living in exile. Those still inside Russia are
keeping quiet to avoid prison. They are not a majority,
but they do exist. They read news from independent
media outlets. Many operate from outside Russia.

They have their leaders. And, inside Russia they show up
in numbers on election day spoiling ballots.

We know that today Putin is firmly entrenched in power.
Over the last decades he has constructed a very effective
autocratic system operating on fear and terror. The day he
dies or is no longer in power political competition will
begin again in Russia.

The forces of Russian dictatorship is not pre-ordained.
We've seen with opponents like Navalny and others, who
have tried to show an alternate path, they do continue to exist.
And they will continue
fighting for an alternate path and will not give up hope.
To them it's important not only for their country, but
for future generations.

"The belief that Western style democracy is impossible in Russia. That Russians are incapable of adapting democracy is shared not only by Putin supporters but also by many other people including monarchists, nationalists,communists, and many others."

as well as realists.

I don't think that you could get much further from a democracy than Nazi Germany or Imperial Japan. People at the time said that the German and Japanese were unsuited to democracy, so why are they peaceful democracies today?

"Western style democracy"

You make it sound like a seasoning option for chicken Mcnuggets.

Tragically it will take years or even decades to unwind
the damage done to Russian society after Putin's rule.
Perhaps it won't happen at all.

But there are people who are pro-democratic, anti-imperialist
in Russia. These Russians, as stated earlier do exist.
Russians who are determined to prove that Russian dictatorship
and imperialism with its hold on power forever is not
pre-ordained.

People like Julia Navalnava who continues her husband's work
showing that there is an alternate path. Brave Russians like
her fighting for that different path today should give all of
us hope.

Sometimes the only realists are the dreamers. Especially
dreamers who do.

Russia needs dreamers who do.

As does the world.

"Pauline Hanson has found out about it is going to pay for the operation"

Talk about political grandstanding, The Lovely Pauline should also ditch her poison politics. BTW Hanson will "pay" for it with her taxpayer funded allowance. Far right extremists, like some here who support One Nation style politics, are rioting in Britain, their violence knows no bounds, attacking everyone in sight, disgusting! Be careful there are far right extremists who would unleash the same kind of hate violence here, given half a chance!

Hi Fester,
Maybe I went a little too far with some of the Jewish criticism, and I'm sorry if I caused any offense but I'm not wrong about the Wests MO of overthrowing countries, which by chance is mainly done by a group of Pro-Israel neoconservatives.

Hi Paul,
"Talk about political grandstanding, The Lovely Pauline should also ditch her poison politics. BTW Hanson will "pay" for it with her taxpayer funded allowance."

That's probably a little harsh, but maybe not altogether unfair.
Did I tell you that every now and again I watch pet rescue videos.
Even though I know some people do it for the money they make of youtube, I don't really care.
What matters is that the animals get the care they need.

Just because we have political biases doesn't mean we should kick them when they do something good.
We should recognise good, wherever it is and from whoever it comes from.
It doesn't have to mean Pauline's great, but it does mean that she did a good thing, regardless of her motives and I'm glad for the person involved that she did.

Hi Foxy,
Why are you so concerned about Russia?

- Elephant in the room -

Israel is committing genocide and the U.S. provides the weapons.
What about guilt by association?

If someone goes and shoots up a group of people, then gets away and goes back to an ammunition supplier and the ammunition supplier knows full well what they've done, and then willfully provide more bullets so they can go back out and have another go, then isn't that ammunition supplier equally guilty of committing the terrorist acts?
Guilt by association?

Doesn't that mean the U.S. is equally guilty of genocide?

Hi Paul,
Looks like the breakout of civil war in England.

British patriots have lynched one black man and are attacking middle eastern businesses.
Muslim immigrants have been hunting British patriots with knives, hammers, acid and axes.
Police are overwhelmed.

There goes the great multicultural project.
Was it not inevitable?

.

« Can Russia Ever Become a Democracy ? »

.

Of course it can, but its current autocratic rulers will not cede power peacefully. They will fight to the end – and who will replace them ? Other autocratic rulers ?

Putin is doing everything he can to sow the seeds of autocracy in the minds of Russia’s children. Will he succeed ? Probably.

Why should Russia become a democracy anyway ? Is democracy better for Russian citizens than autocracy ? That is something for the Russian citizens to decide.

I wish them well - but I'm glad I'm not in their shoes.

The question I find more preoccupying is “Can the United States become an autocracy ?”

Again, I reply, “Of course it can”. The Economist demoted the US from a “full democracy” to a “flawed democracy” in 2016. It has been a “flawed democracy” for the past 8 years.

Most voters believe the government is led by people who do not act in their best interests. Just 40% of moderates say that there is a party in America that represents their opinions.

America’s score is weighed down by mistrust of elected officials and perceptions of corruption. The same survey by Pew Research found that more than 80% of respondents believed that most political figures “don’t care” about “what people like me think”.

I find Trump’s refusal to accept the democratic result of the presidential election of 2020 preoccupying, to say the least. He has already warned that he will install dictatorial rule immediately “for the first year of his term” if he is re-elected in 2024.

In any event, it seems More than likely, that the US will remain a “flawed democracy”, irrespective of who is elected.

No signs of the trend being reversed.

.

Hi Banjo Patterson,
I read or saw yesterday that Trump has openly stated he plans retribution against those who have been acting against him.
The lone-wolf assassination attempt also has some questions over it, like whether it was a Lee Harvey Oswald JFK type scenario.
- There may be more attempts on his life before November.

he will install dictatorial rule immediately
Banjo Paterson,
One rule for all no matter how flawed, is much more effective than everyone's rule for one ! Democracy has proven to be worse than malevolent Dictatorship in the long term.
Democracy is claimed to be peaceful. Which democratic Nation is peaceful or has peace right now ?

Democracy can't work according to its intentions because people aren't & never will be democratic. One just has to look at how "democratic" the Woke & Greens are.
The greediest and/or most selfish of people are the ones who spruik "Democracy" !
The non-contributors are pointing the finger at those who provide & call them greedy yet they have no qualms about sponging up the Tax Dollars !
Democracy could only work if people worked also !

Unlike Western democracies in thrall to the left and getting less democratic all the time, Russia still believes in the family, and has banned gender bending: surgical atrocities and hormone therapy; and they know what woman is.

Instead of asking people who don't even know much about Australia what they think about Russia, people asking such stupid questions should find out what Russians themselves think about their own country. They might be surprised.

Just because a country is considered by outsiders to not be what they call democratic, doesn't mean that Russians, Chinese, whatever, are gasping to be what outsiders think they should be.

People with so much time on their hands that they have to ask pointless questions of complete strangers - just made up names on a computer screen - seem to lack the ability, or the ‘thinkable, to put the question where it might have a chance of being answered by real people who might have the knowledge to answer it in an authoritative way.

An Ode to Russia.

Russia's a nation that's soulful and deep
With thinkers like Dostoevsky and Tolstoy
Who made people think
Rudolph Nureyev put all in a trance
Mikhail Baryshnikov and the Bolshoi
Boy, could they dance
It wasn't their vodka that made people sing
It was their heartfelt passionate songs
And balalaika strings

But, there's a dark side to this nation
Their frozen inferno is an aberration
Where millions of bodies lie side by side
Crimes the authorities try to hide
The prisons and psych wards need to go
In their place freedom should be allowed to grow
Autocrats like Putin must cease to exist
Leaders like Navalny must continue to persist
Russia needs to be free once again
Then all those deaths wouldn't be in vain.

Can we get our politicians to return Australia to a democracy after they forced multiculturalism on us without a vote. Same with mass immigration that a majority of Australians are against, and would vote against if true democracy existed in Australia. And let's not forget the Communist-Chinese methods used during Covid.

F…k Russia and the people trying to fool us that Australia is still a democracy . We have enough anti-democratic practices here in Australia. Just voting for a duopoly is not democracy.

In Ireland, Catholics and Protestants are united and marching against "asylum seekers". Australians sit back and take, so cowered by the political class they have let themselves become.

"I find Trump’s refusal to accept the democratic result of the presidential election of 2020 preoccupying, "

So I guess you must be mightily triggered by Hilary's ( and for that matter, most of the Democrats') refusal to accept the results of the 2016 election. Oh I forgot...its different when they do it.

"He [Trump] has already warned that he will install dictatorial rule immediately “for the first year of his term” if he is re-elected in 2024."

False... I'll leave you to look up why its false.

It'd take more than a year of dictatorial rule to clean out that filthy swamp mhaze.
If I was an U.S. citizen, I'd be wanting term limits for senators just for starters.

Before he died in prison, Aleksei Navalny, wrote a memoir.
It's coming out on 22nd October 2024. It's title is -
"The Patriot," and is published by Knopf. It can be bought
or pre-ordered from any good bookshop.

In this book, Navalny tells his story in his own words,
chronicling his life, and work as a pro-democracy activist,
and the attempts on his life. He rose to global prominence
as a fierce critic of Putin and resisted the Kremlin's
repeated attempts to silence him through physical harm,
poisoning, and imprisonment in a remote Arctic penal
colony, where he died in February at the age of 47.

This book is worth a read, and tells his story in his own words.
It comes as a final act of defiance. His widow Julia Navalnaya,
said in a statement, that it could have a galvanizing effect
on his followers and lovers of freedom in Russia.

It would make a great gift to anyone interested
in Russian politics.

.

Dear Indyvidual, ttbn, and mhaze,

.

It’s interesting to see that you all prefer Putin and/or Trump to Albanese and are highly critical of Australian democracy.

Yet, I see that according to The Economist Intelligence Unit’s 2024 world democracy index, Australia continues to qualify as a “full democracy”, ranking 14th out of a total of 167 countries.

There must be some good reason for each of you to prefer to live in Australia.

It's obviously neither our democracy nor our government.

May I ask what it is ?

.

Hi BP,

The three Usual Suspects you name prefer the radical far right to moderate liberal democracy. Mhaze, is a confirmed Trumpster, ttbn prefers the bigoted racists of One Nation. Indy thinks black people in Australia are "concrete jungle bunnies", said so himself. As long as they keep collecting their socialist aged welfare, they are happy, but they hate socialism.

Banjo Paterson,

I can't really speak for others as I don't know how they think. What I can do though is form opinions by how they present themselves & my perception. The term Democracy is being thrown around like a boomerang, bouncing off Leftist's heads on its flight path.
Of course Democracy is being hailed as a success by the parasitic non-contributors who do rather well due to the mentality & efforts of the conservative minded. Feel free to provide lists of Woke achievers in the fields of revenue creating which in turn provides employment which in turn provides the Taxes the Left lives off.
I don't think we on the "Right" don't necessarily prefer Trump or Putin, what we do prefer is what they stand for. I won't try to explain because you et al wouldn't understand anyway. It's all effort-creating related not just fruits of effort usage.
Why do we live in this "Democracy" ? Because that's where we are for various reasons & we don't want this Nation to go the way Europe has gone. All the signs are there that we are on the same path & the thinkers want to put a halt to the Woke's doings of dragging all of us down the path to destruction !

Here's an interesting link on Putin:

http://theconversation.com/putin-has-no-successor-no-living-rivals-and-no-retirement-plan-why-his-eventual-death-will-set-off-a-vicious-power-struggle-224485

.

Dear Indyvidual,

.

You wrote :

« Why do we live in this "Democracy" ? Because that's where we are for various reasons .. »
.

That’s a very enlightening reply, Indyvidual.

It’s the acknowledgement that you appreciate the importance of the question and have taken the time to give it some deep thought and reflection before answering to the best of your ability.

Many thanks, Indyvidual. I appreciate it.

It will be interesting to see what ttbn, and mhaze have to say. I’m not surprised that they are taking a little more time. It’s not something to be taken lightly and the reasons they prefer to live in Australia with our government and democracy could be quite complex – perhaps more so than yours.

As you say, you can't speak for them any more than you can speak for yourself.

.

.

Dear Foxy,

.

Since the death of her husband in the Russian penal colony north of the Arctic Circle, the Basmannyy District Court in Moscow accused Yulia Navalnaya of "participation in an extremist organization" and ordered her arrest “in absentia”.

She used to be known as the “First Lady’ of the Russian opposition. She is now its figurehead. She was last seen in Vilnius, the capital of Lithuania, where her husband’s activist organization was located.

On 1 July 2024, she was named chairperson of the Human Rights Foundation, succeeding Garry Kasparov.

She was born in 1976, the same year as her husband. He was 47 years old when he died. Her days are probably numbered too.

Here is an interesting article by Time Magazine on Yulia Navalnaya :

http://time.com/6967013/exclusive-yulia-navalnaya-speaks/

.

I think one much over-looked vital factor in these opinions is the life experience & subsequent mentality of a poster. Actual experience is nearly always dismissed as being out of touch by the younger & older folk have lost the patience to wait for the inexperienced to gain sufficient experience to lift the veil of idealism.. I remember remarking & hearing about topics 40 years ago only to be taken for granted yet now these views are deemed valid but only if an "educated" person utters them. Political Party allegiance is a clear example hence so many varied opinions on issues so many can't even relate to but comment they do anyway.
Idealism is the biggest hurdle to realistic social harmony particularly the idealists who lack the exposure to the requirement of merit to go through life !

Hi Banjo Patterson,

Recently on the 'Multicultralim' thread we spoke about the Olympic Games opening ceremony, and the discussion about what apeared to be a mockery of 'The Last Supper', and you spoke about pagan rituals.

I also noticed at one point somewhere you mentioned 'Yiddish', so I wondered if you might be Jewish (no judgement or animosity whatsoever)

Also earlier in this thread I stated 'Jews probably helped facilitate those opening ceremonies for all we know'.

I've been thinking about what I said, and my thoughts involve 'Kabbalah'.

Now I haven't watched the entire opening ceremony, but I wonder if the focus on all this paganistic stuff, relates to Kabbalah.

I remembered back to London 2012 Olympic Games, some people said that logo in fact spelled 'Zion'.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2011/feb/28/iran-london-olympics-logo-zion

Now like I said, I haven't watched the entire opening ceremony, but I wonder if I did, would I see and depictions of serpents 'Leviathon', or maybe any 'Eye of Providence' Ain Sof?

I came across a youtube video yesterday, showing an 'Eye of Providence' on the Eiffel Tower, (just like on the US dollar bill) but it may have been 'clickbait' as the videos thumbnail image, can't find the video now, but that got me thinking...
- I'm not actually sure if it really was on the Eiffel tower.

I also noticed that the Olympic medals have hexagons on them.
I also find the depiction of fire as the games symbol somewhat interesting too, as this is one of the 4 elements Fire, Air, Water, Earth. 'The flame of God is the soul of a human being'

I never looked too much into the Kabbalah, but I find all this paganistic symbolism, at least somewhat curious.

I also find Yuyutsu's belief in reincarnation interesting, as this also relates to Kabbalah, not just Hinduism.

Dear Banjo,

Thank you so much for the gift of information, and the
Time magazine article link, that you gave me about Alexi
Navalny's wife - Julia Navalnaya. I cried reading it.
I hope that she and her husband's organisation is safe
in Lithuania.
Putin's reach is long and strong.

Thank you deeply.

I've re-written the poem I gave earlier:

Russia, a nation soulful and deep
Thinkers like Dostoevsky made people think
Tolstoy wrote about War and Peace
His Anna Karenina was hard to resist

Rudolph Nureyev's leaps were entrancing
Mikhail Barysnikov made a name dancing
Kirov and Bolshoi set ballet standards
Which Margot Fonteyn also demanded

It wasn't vodka that made Russians sing
But the plucking of strong balalaika strings
Cossack dancers led the way
Joyously demonstrating their hectic display

Volga Boatmen, was a popular choice
Kalinka, Katyuska, were given a voice
And who can forget - otschi tshorniye - dark eyes
With which Ivan Rebroff did melodicly surprise

However, the dark side of this nation
Is its Frozen Inferno, an aberration
Where millions of bodies lie side by side
Crimes the authorities try to hide

Alexei Navalny, whose widow weeps
She tries in his name justice to seek
The prisons and psych wards and abominable nooks
Solzhenitsyn exposed in his famous book

The Gulag Archipelago became well known
Showing to the world Russia's terror zone
Autocrats like Putin will someday depart
Hopefully his replacement will have a heart

And, like Gorbachev, he'll try to reform
But, a nation asleep is hard to transform
Russia's a nation that will need to dig deep
So that one day it may wake up from its sleep
Otherwise all the deaths and all the pain
Would have been suffered by its people in vain.

Tell me Foxy,
When will the United States become a real democracy?

Thomas Massie Tells Tucker Carlson That Every Republican Congressman ‘Has An AIPAC Person’
http://youtu.be/2ieJkvkPU9M

There's a criminal class in the United States, and it's call 'US Congress'

Dear Banjo,

You inspired me to re-write the "poem."

Thank you.

I'm asked :

"When will the US become a real democracy?

When Trump loses the election.

I have to say it's kind of amusing watching people talk out of both sides of their mouth.
Or it would be, if it wasn't such a serious issue.

So you're saying if the majority support Trump, then that's not democracy?

It's kind of like watching a caught fish flop around on a beach.

We love democracy!
- But only if the person we support wins.

It's kind of sad you know watching the western world become so polarised, divisive and slowly ripped apart.

Do you want to know who's to blame?
All of you, and none of you.

All of you because you all support your respective sides, all scream support for democracy - but all are completely intolerant of the other, and find an outcome that is not in our respective favour completely unacceptable.
(In remember you started a thread on tolerance)
And none of you, because all these problems and issues foistered upon us are little more than someone elses sick little game to have us all fighting amongst ourselves.

It's like the devil is just sitting back laughing singing and dancing in joy, if he exists.

Then you have Albo and Dutton on TV saying if anyone criticises government we must dob them in to the Federal Police and ASIO.
- Wake up you foolish leaders, everyones criticising.

What a bloody mess we've found ourselves in.
There's no way out either, we're all in it together for the ride.
Just as our kids and grandkids will inherit this mess.

Ordo Ab Chao.

Soon we'll all be the Palestinians.

The strength of Australia's democracy lies in our free
and fair elections. In our system.

We have secret ballots designed to stop the intimidation
of voters. We have compulsory voting ensuring everyone votes,
not just the partisan or the outraged. We have the
Australian Electoral Commission to draw and redraw electoral
boundaries so they are representative and fair and to recruit
100,000 Australians to run polling booths, where everyone's
ballot papers and voting methods are consistent across the
country.

The Australian Electoral Commission's vote counting is
scrutinised by parties and candidates to ensure the integrity
of the count is transparent and verifiable. No fraud here.

Contrast this to the US where free and fair elections are
polluted and diminished not only by outrageous
gerrymandering but by laws and regulations designed to
deliberately disenfranchise voters.

Where a former US president lied to the public about election
results and where a first past the post system means many votes are wasted.

There's much more at the following:

http://australiainstitute.org.au/post/australias-democracy-isnt-perfect-but-many-of-you-just-changed-the-country/

Sounds like your upset that politicians lie Foxy
- Wasn't there a time when that was just common knowledge?

Did I tell you all the story about how when I was little QLD Premier Peter Beattie promised there would only be tolls on Brisbane's Gateway Bridge for a couple of years until it was paid off?
That was in 1986, 39 years ago, and we're still paying tolls today and most likely will be forever.
That was when I first realised that politicians are liars.

When Trump loses the election.
Foxy,
Trump winning or losing that election, either way the vindictiveness & lack of soul of the Left will not allow good will to influence their indoctrinated supporters. Just look at yourself as an example !

.

Dear Indyvidual,

.

You wrote :

« Idealism is the biggest hurdle to realistic social harmony particularly the idealists who lack the exposure to the requirement of merit to go through life ! »
.

I don’t know about “the exposure to the requirement of merit”, Indyvidual, but I do know that we all live in a world of our own construct to varying degrees. That we are limited by the aptitude and quality of the physical sensors and intellect with which nature has endowed us.

While I am conscious of the fact that we do not have access to all reality, I do my best to avoid projecting my ideas, ideals and beliefs onto whatever fragment of reality I am capable of perceiving with the “tools” nature has equipped me.

.

Dear Armchair Critic,

.

You wrote :

1. « … you mentioned 'Yiddish', so I wondered if you might be Jewish … »

No, I’m not Jewish. I came across that Yiddish joke that amused me in an article I found on the internet.
.

2. « I came across a youtube video yesterday, showing an 'Eye of Providence' on the Eiffel Tower … »

The Eiffel Tower forms a triangle but, to the best of my knowledge, there was no Eye of Providence on it, nor any reason why there might have been.
.

3. « I also noticed that the Olympic medals have hexagons on them »

I haven’t examined the medals, but it’s not surprising that they have hexagons on them. The French often refer to France as “the hexagon” which is the country’s geographical shape.

.

(Continued ...)

.

.

(Continued ...)

.

4. « It's kind of sad you know watching the Western world become so polarised, divisive and slowly ripped apart »

Civil war seems to be an inherent defect of human civilisation, Armchair Critic.

There are about 30 ongoing civil wars at the moment. Historically, I think there have been more civil wars than there are countries in the world, several having had more than one civil war to date during their lifetime – with probably more to come !

Take a look :

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_non-international_armed_conflicts

.

Dear Foxy,

.

You might be interested in this TED talk by Rory Stewart on “Why democracy matters” :

http://www.ted.com/talks/rory_stewart_why_democracy_matters?user_email_address=3c480e8fee191cdeb6281576b2483b98&lctg=62d1a0db1c794c328ca4b1c8&geo=fr&subtitle=en

.

Dear Banjo,

Thank you for the link.

It's quite inspiring - re-affirming that by aspiring towards
democracy, we're on the right track provided we do it the
right way. Democracy does matter.

I am capable of perceiving with the “tools” nature has equipped me.
Banjo Paterson,
Almost everyone is capable of perceiving but only few perceive correctly !

Indyvidual,

"Can you climb trees, use your whiskers to navigate or
retract your claws. Can you see in the dark. Make over
40 different sounds. Do you have impeccable hearing?"
asked the Silver Fox.

NO?

Then you have no right to express an opinion when sensible
people are speaking.

Dear Banjo,

Just to jog some memories:

http://theguardian.com/world/2022/aug/31/gorbachev-and-reagan-the-capitalist-and-communist-who-helped-end-the-cold-war

Dear Banjo,

And then there's :

http://eng.lsm.lv/article/society/health/deaths-head-putin-gazes-into-the-inferno-and-the-russian-embassy.a446984/

.

Dear Indyvidual,

.

You wrote :

« Almost everyone is capable of perceiving but only few perceive correctly ! »
.

I guess almost everyone is capable of perceiving something, Indyvidual, but I don’t know what you qualify as “correct”.

Whatever it is, I see by her comments, that Foxy has “correctly” understood what I was referring to when I indicated in my last post :

“While I am conscious of the fact that we do not have access to all reality, I do my best to avoid projecting my ideas, ideals and beliefs onto whatever fragment of reality I am capable of perceiving with the “tools” nature has equipped me [with]”.

What I was referring to was the fact, for example, that some animals can detect forms of energy invisible to us, like magnetic and electrical fields. Others see light and hear sounds well outside the range of human perception, etc.

Bats can “see” without light. We can’t. Arctic reindeer can see ultraviolet light. We can’t. Elephants communicate over long distances with infrasonic sounds. We can’t. Many birds like the zebra finch can see extra colours that we can’t see. Birds can fly to great heights and see over the horizon. We can’t. A snailfish lives about 8.5 km at the bottom of the ocean. We can’t. Octopuses have 9 brains. We only have one. Only half of a whale’s brain sleeps at a time. Our whole brain sleeps each time. African elephants have a sense of smell five times that of humans and more than twice that of dogs, etc.

Our perception of reality is limited. There is much that escapes us.

Nature seems to have attributed us with a fairly wide range of sensors and receptors that are just powerful enough to keep us out of trouble.

.

Dear Banjo,

Thank you.

but I don’t know what you qualify as “correct”.
Banjo Paterson,
I mean correct as in factual & not as in idealism & bias distorted perception !

Indyvidual,

Recognizing the difference between an opinion and a fact
is crucial to maintaining intellectual honesty in
discussions and debates.

While opinions are valid in expressing personal perspectives,
they should not be presented as factual information without
proper evidence.

Cheers.

"I mean correct as in....those that agree with ME!", Indyvidual and those that think like ME! None of those, pussy footed, bleeding heart commie, lefty, greenie, picko liberals progressive etc etc types, did I say pussy footed, well I say pussy footed, them as well!

Foxy, Indy wants you to fess up to which or all of the above are you, he's given up on me, I'm just a little old commie who wants to take away his aged welfare, and set him to work in a Seniors National Service chain gang! Hummmm, not a bad idea.

.

Dear Indyvidual,

.

You wrote :

« Almost everyone is capable of perceiving but only few perceive correctly ! I mean correct as in factual & not as in idealism & bias distorted perception ! »
.

Thanks for the explanation, Indyvidual.

Unfortunately, I doubt that anyone is capable of performing that fantastic prowess.

Fact, in my mind, means something that corresponds to reality. And reality is that which exists independent of ideas concerning it.

Fact is an objective notion and, unfortunately, the perceptions of human observers are inevitably subjective.

In science, fact is an observation that has been repeatedly confirmed and for all practical purposes is accepted as “true.” Truth in science, however, is never final and what is accepted as a fact today may be modified or even discarded tomorrow.

I see truth as information that has not been voluntarily deformed at the time of emission. Or should I say it is whatever version of reality, thought, ideas, qualia, dreams, or imagination a particular individual is capable of perceiving or experiencing and subsequently transmitting without voluntarily deforming it.

In this definition, truth and the object of truth (reality, thought, ideas, qualia etc…) are totally different entities. Truth is simply the absence of intent to voluntarily deform information concerning the object of truth.

That, of course, does not exclude the involuntary deformation of information concerning the object of truth. To such an extent, that the information that is emitted may be totally erroneous but perfectly truthful.

It follows that there are as many truths as there are observers and each one may be completely different from all the others, though each observer is telling the truth from his or her particular perspective, the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. I see truth as a perfectly subjective notion.

.

(Continued …)

.

.

(Continued …)

.

Our initial perception may be false. We may incorrectly interpret what we perceive. Shock or prejudice may prevent us from correctly registering what we perceive. We may suffer a lapse of memory at the time of transmitting the information. We may not employ the correct expressions or be sufficiently precise in relaying the information. Our body language may be inconsistent with our oral expression, etc. All these and many other factors may possibly result in the involuntary deformation of information concerning the object of truth.

The star we claim to see may have disappeared from the heavens millions of years ago. That does not alter the fact that we are telling the truth in claiming to see it. Truth is not reality in this instance.

Truth is a horizon that keeps its distance no matter where we turn and what strategy we adopt in order to approach it.

For there to be truth, somebody must emit information. If there is nobody around to do that, there can be no truth. No human being, no truth.

.

Hi Banjo,

Is the truth of Ukraine crossing the Russian border subjective?

Another point.

Just say you had a consultation with a surgeon who lies to you about the risks and benefits of a procedure, persuading you to go ahead with it. Things go wrong and the matter ends up in court. Would you think that a court would tell you there was no case for the surgeon to answer because you agreed to the procedure? I ask this because you seem to think that Russia's autocracy is legitimate because it has popular support, yet that support is in large part due to state propaganda and outlawing opposing opinion, as was the case with other autocratic regimes like Nazi Germany.

I'm sure you don't believe in the legitimacy of public support of autocracies using propaganda and suppressing dissent, but that is the impression you give when you say that the Russian autocracy has popular support.

Hi Fester,

Autocrats like Putin will someday depart
Hopefully his replacement will have a heart
And, like Gorbachev, he shall try to reform
An authoritarian political system hard to transform

Russia's an enigma that will need to dig deep
To wake up from the slumber of its comatose sleep
It will need to shed chains embedded in fear
And admit state control is far too severe

Only then can Russia stand and proclaim
that centuries of abuse
Were not suffered in vain.

Poetry like that could get you jail time in Russia Foxy. Safe for you here fortunately. The Russian mafia is at most danger from former Soviet states undergoing democratic change. The Russian people were subjected to a propaganda campaign against Ukraine long before the invasion.

Hi Fester,

Just carrying on a family tradition.

And long may you be free to keep your family traditions Foxy.

Hi Fester,

Thank you for your well wishes.

I shall keep up the family
traditions for as long as I live.

What Russian author - Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn taught the West
was the word "gulag," and its meaning. That communism was
not the path to freedom but the way of ideological lies, slaves,
and violence.

The following link confirms that meaning:

http://pbs.org/newshour/world/putin-begins-new-six-year-term-as-president-with-now-more-power-over-russia-than-ever

My apologies. Here's the link again:

http://pbs.org/newshour/world/putin-begins-new-six-year-term-as-president-with-more-power-over-russia-than-ever

"Freedom is never voluntarily given by the oppressors,
it must be demanded by the oppressed. "
(Martin Luther King Jr.).

Thanks everyone for your comments. For me this discussion
has now run its course.

I look forward to the next one.

Cheers.

That communism was not the path to freedom but the way of ideological lies, slaves,
and violence.
Foxy,
Coincidence or what ? Democracy has surpassed Democracy in an eerily similar way ! Violent protests, hangers-on in record numbers.
Economies relying on deceit & con & juvenile criminals don't even get detained. Yes, lovely society alright !
Thank goodness for a handful of sane mentality conservative thinkers still holding it all together despite the Woke tsunami battering our education system.

.

Dear Fester,

.

You wrote :

« Is the truth of Ukraine crossing the Russian border subjective? »
.

Yes, Fester, in my view, all truths are subjective. Facts based on reality are objective. The fact of Ukraine crossing the Russian border is objective.

And, as I indicated in my previous post, an observation that has been repeatedly confirmed is, for all practical purposes, accepted as “true.”
.

« Just say you had a consultation with a surgeon who lies to you about the risks and benefits of a procedure, persuading you to go ahead with it. Things go wrong and the matter ends up in court. Would you think that a court would tell you there was no case for the surgeon to answer because you agreed to the procedure? »
.

That brief outline is insufficient for me to make an appropriate judgement, Fester.

If the surgeon lied during the consultation about the risks and benefits of the procedure, the patient would have to be able to prove that beyond a reasonable doubt – which means that it would probably have to be in writing, addressed by the surgeon to the patient and signed by the surgeon in his handwriting.

Also, surgeons usually require their patients to sign a hold harmless clause prior to performing an operation. A lot would depend on how that hold harmless clause was formulated. It would be carefully scrutinised and debated in a court of law.

Here is a case in hand :

http://www.forpeopleforjustice.com/hold-harmless-agreements-may-spread-malpractice-cases/
.

« … you seem to think that Russia's autocracy is legitimate because it has popular support, yet that support is in large part due to state propaganda and outlawing opposing opinion, as was the case with other autocratic regimes like Nazi Germany.

I'm sure you don't believe in the legitimacy of public support of autocracies using propaganda and suppressing dissent, but that is the impression you give when you say that the Russian autocracy has popular support. »

.

(Continued …)

.

.

(Continued …)

.

The original meaning of the term “legitimate” in describing a political regime is defined as follows :

« A legitimate dynasty, a dynasty that reigns by virtue of traditional law, as opposed to princes who reign by coups d'état or by national will »

Today, legitimate simply means lawful – so far as political regimes are concerned.

This is what postdoctoral research scholar Seonhee Kim has to say on the legal dimension (legitimacy) of the Russian autocratic political regime :

« In authoritarian political systems, institutions such as parliament, judiciary, and law enforcement are typically viewed as mere instruments of autocratic rule, or at best, a democratic facade. In this conventional image, authoritarian institutions exist only for formal reasons and do not exert meaningful impact independently of the executive branch of government.

Recent scholarship has uncovered unexpected dynamics of the impact of law on Russian politics. Authoritarian influence over diverse legal institutions is not as overwhelming as conventional wisdom has presumed. Scholars are revealing how authoritarian legal and judicial institutions resemble their democratic counterparts. Not only are they responsive to bureaucratic incentives and public opinion, but also to the metrics of performance evaluation as opposed to central directives. »

Here is a video recording she made on the Russian autocratic political regime :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZCAn7Mg_12Y

Allow me to add that despite the current reign of severe political repression in Russia, there are no signs of major civil unrest. Boris Yeltsin’s brief democratic reign ended in disaster due to poor health and alcohol and Vladimir Putin succeeded him. Putin’s rise to power was meteoric. His popularity soared as he wiped out the rebels "even in the toilets".

The Russian Federation is a patchwork of 24 Republics, 9 Territories, 48 Regions, 2 federal cities, 1 Autonomous Region, and 4 Autonomous Areas.

Who knows what the people of that patchwork really think ?

Time will tell.

.

Democracy has surpassed Democracy
Dang ! I just realised I made a typo-should of course be surpassed Communism.

Thank you Banjo,

Always an incredible amount of thought in your answers. I can't help but think that the separation of truth and fact is more for the purpose of creating social harmony.

"Allow me to add that despite the current reign of severe political repression in Russia, there are no signs of major civil unrest."

Not as immersive as Nazism, which didn't have much civil unrest either, but there is a strong state narrative, and I remember Putin saying he would annihilate Russia's enemies and flush them down the toilet. I think he might have said that after getting the FSB to bomb a few blocks of flats in Moscow which he then blamed on Chechen terrorists. I was prompted to comment after watching a review of state sponsored pulp fiction in the Russian Federation. It's completely bonkers.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iCI6es9G0oo

Fester,
I just saw on the ABC News (yeah,yeah I know) that Ukrainians have occupied Russian territory as if that were a good or smart thing. Just wait ! That could be a very disappointing outcome yet ! That's what my gut tells me.

Indyvidual,

It will eventually - be up to the Russian people to decide
whether they want the war with Ukraine to continue.

Centuries of dreams, of hopes and tears
Have been hiding in Russia's soul for years
All tied and tangled in one layer
Of burning hope wrapped in a prayer
All the while that Russia's been burning
Its people for life have continued yearning

It's time to stand up and proclaim
That centuries of abuse were not suffered in vain.

Foxy,

You're implying that Russia should become a Democracy, why ? Look at all the pretend Democracies & even with your rose-coloured glasses what exactly do you see ? Overrun by Dark Age religious zealots who are not allowed to think for themselves & women being commodities used as breeding machines to defeat the "democratic" system with its own game for its eventual downfall. None of that in Russia as far as I know but feel free to correct me. Russia will remain Russia, will Europe & it's UN buddies ?

Indyvidual,

The dark side of this nation
Is its penal colony aberration
An arctic inferno frozen and brutal
With thoughts of escape being totally futile

Where millions of bodies lie side by side
Crimes the authorities try to hide
Alexei Navalny's widow weeps
As she tries in his name justice to seek

A lady brave who had to flee
To try to fulfill her destiny
The prisons and psych wards and abominable nooks
Solzhenitsyn exposed in his famous book

The Gulag Archipelago became well known
Showing the world Russia's terror zone
Autocrats like Putin will someday depart
Hopefully, his replacement will have a heart

And, like Gorbachev, he shall try to reform
An authoritarian political system hard to transform
Russia's an enigma that will need to dig deep
To wake up from the slumber of its comatose sleep

It will need to shed chains embedded in fear
And admit state control is far too severe
Only then can Russia stand up and proclaim
That centuries of abuse were not suffered in vain

Centuries of dreams of hopes and tears
Have been hiding in Russia's soul for years
All tied and tangled in one layer
Of burning hope wrapped in a prayer

All the while that Russia's been burning
Its people for life have continued yearning.
It's a shame that my gran won't be able to see
What Russia can finally truly be.

Its people for life have continued yearning.
Foxy,
Wherever bureaucracy reigns instead of common sense Public Servants there are people like these !

Individual,

In Russia as in China and North Korea, et al, - it's more than
just "bureaucracy." It's an authoritarian political
system that controls - with severe consequences to those
who disobey.

it's more than just "bureaucracy." It's an authoritarian political
system that controls - with severe consequences to those
who disobey.
Foxy,
Sounds eerily much like a Public Service Union !

Indyvidual,

Librarians don't have unions.
So you'd know more about them than me.
I've never had a need for one. Plus I've worked
in a variety of jobs - private and public.

http://www.goodreads.com/quotes/386688-the-war-therefore-if-we-judge-it-by-the-standards

“The war, therefore if we judge it by the standards of previous wars, is merely an imposture. It is like the battles between certain ruminant animals whose horns are incapable of hurting one another. But though it is unreal it is not meaningless. It eats up the surplus of consumable goods, and it helps to preserve the special mental atmosphere that the hierarchical society needs. War, it will be seen, is now a purely internal affair. In the past, the ruling groups of all countries, although they might recognize their common interest and therefore limit the destructiveness of war, did fight against one another, and the victor always plundered the vanquished. In our own day they are not fighting against one another at all. The war is waged by each ruling group against its own subjects, and the object of the war is not to make or prevent conquests of territory, but to keep the structure of society intact. The very word "war," therefore, has become misleading. It would probably be accurate to say that by becoming continuous war has ceased to exist. The peculiar pressure that is exerted on human beings between the Neolithic Age and the early twentieth century has disappeared and has been replaced by something quite different. The effect would be much the same if the three superstates, instead of fighting one another, should agree to live in perpetual peace, each inviolate within its own boundaries. For in that case each would still be a self-contained universe, freed forever from the sobering influence of external danger. A peace that was truly permanent would be the same as a permanent war. This--although the vast majority of Party members understand it only in a shallower sense--is the inner meaning of the Party slogan: WAR IS PEACE.”
&#8213; George Orwell, 198

http://www.george-orwell.org/1984/16.html

Part 2, Chapter 9- It's a bit long but interesting.

Concepts- Hate week (Marxist Permanent Revolution), War is peace, slavery is freedom (freedom by global principles such as diversity DIE), ignorance is strength (expert power), the superstates of Oceania/ Eurasia/ Eastasia (US, China, Israel), The Theory and Practice of Oligarchical Collectivism (Marxism), permanent war (Marxist Permanent Revolution), war is waged by each ruling group (the university academy) against its own subjects, doublethink (self censorship for fear of death), Newspeak (using language to destroy communication),..

CM,

That is so interesting I can hardly wait for the next instalment! Now I think I'll go off and watch paint dry, grass grow, washing dry, other just as exciting things as your posts about Woke/Markist/Commies, none of whom you can even name!

Indyvidual- I agree that bureaucracy is a factor in the tyranny of Marxism. Soviet military commanders shoot retreaters...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_No._227
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barrier_troops#Soviet_Red_Army

The first use of the barrier troops by the Red Army occurred in the late summer and fall of 1918 in the Eastern front during the Russian Civil War, when People's Commissar of Military and Naval Affairs (War Commissar) Leon Trotsky of the Communist Bolshevik government authorized Mikhail Tukhachevsky, the commander of the 1st Army, to station blocking detachments behind unreliable Red Army infantry regiments in the 1st Red Army, with orders to shoot if front-line troops either deserted or retreated without permission.

This seems like the sort of bureaucratic regulation that can be very effective on bureaucrats to achieve a leaders goal. It can apply throughout the hierarchy at different levels to create a whole of nation effect. Leaders at any level that refuse to execute the policy will be killed, sub-commanders can use this as a way to be promoted. It creates a feedback loop

Herbert Marcuse could be considered as being one of the first Woke/ Marxist's as he was a Gay Hebrew Marxist Psychologist who is considered the Father of the New Left. It's been said by others that when the unfathomable horror of Marxism were realised, in Soviet Russia and Mao's China, many Marxist's reframed their beliefs as Social Democracy but still pointing to Marxist literature and principles. Another Woke Marxist could be considered to be the Hebrew Writer of "Rules For Radicals", Activist, Saul Alinsky apparently a mentor of Hillary Clinton.

Oh Dear!

The Kudos Kid has finally came up with the names of a couple of so-called Woke/Marxists....Herbert Marcuse, dead for over 40 years and Saul Alinsky dead for over 50 years. Nowhere in their bio's does it mention that they were Woke/Marxists. According to the forums number one "cooker" one bloke was "apparently a mentor of Hillary Clinton", APPARENTLY! Now if you want to find a radical left wing Marxist, just point the finger at Hillary Clinton. Then its all relative, is it not, there are those who believe Adolf Hitler was a bleeding heart liberal who went soft on the Jews.

p/s Woke Marxism must be a Jewish thing, the two so-calls named were both Jews, and according to the "expert" one was gay as well, that's a big minus. Oh dear, I can see where this guy comes from.

There is no organised group of Woke/Marxists in the world, this "cooker" just believes there is.

Yes "Miss Lube Rack" Nancy Pellosi and "Miss Scorned" Hillary Clinton are probably closer to death than to birth, too, at this point, but both are extremely influential in the anecdotally Woke Marxist, Democrat Party.

And look who's influential in the Republican Party.

He's racist. He's homophobic.He's xenophobic. And he's
sexist. He's the perfect Republican candidate. And he's
chosen colleagues who don't dare not to support him.
He knows nothing and thinks he knows everything. That
clearly pointed to a political career.

I think it appropriate to end this discussion with
the poem that I began sometime ago. It's dedicated
to my grandma who was a white Russian:

Here goes:

Russia a nation soulful and deep
Writers like Dostoevsky made people weep
Tolstoy wrote about War and Peace
His Anna Karenina was hard to resist

Rudolph Nureyev's leaps were entrancing
Mikhail Barysnikov made a name dancing
Kirov and Bolshoi set ballet standards
Which Margot Fonteyn also demanded

It wasn't vodka that made Russians sing
But the rapid strumming of balalaika strings
Stirring up songs tenderly expressed
What couldn't in life be fully addressed

Cossack dancers led the way
Joyously demonstrating their ebullient display
The Volga Boatmen was a popular choice
Kalinka, Katyuska, were given a voice

And who can forget - otschi tsherniye - dark eyes
With which Ivan Rebroff melodically surprised
The Red Army was known to terrorize
As a touring world choir they harmonized

The dark side of this nation
Is its penal colony aberration
An arctic inferno frozen and brutal
With thoughts of escape being totally futile

Where millions of bodies lie side by side
Crimes the authorities try to hide
Alexei Navalny's widow weeps
As she tries in his name justice to seek

A lady brave who had to flee
To try to fulfill her destiny
The prisons and psych wards and abominable nooks
Solzenitsyn exposed in his famous book

The Gulag Archipelago became well known
Showing the world Russia's terror zone
Autocrats like Putin will someday depart
Hopefully, his replacement will have a heart

And, like Gorbachev, he shall try to reform
An authoritarian political system hard to transform
Russia's an enigma that will need to dig deep
To wake up from the slumber of its comatose sleep

It will need to shed chains embedded in fear
And admit state control is far too severe
Only then can Russia stand up and proclaim
That centuries of abuse were not suffered in vain

cont'd

cont'd :

Centuries of dreams of hopes and tears
Have been hiding in Russia's soul for years
All tied and tangled in one layer
Of burning hope wrapped in a prayer

All the while that Russia's been burning
Its people for life have continued yearning
One day soon they will stand up and see
That it's up to them to decide to be free.

Kudos Kid,

"(Pellosi, Clinton) probably closer to death than to birth" like several old fellas on here Pellosi is an octogenarian and as you say "closer to death", Clinton at 76 is a spring chicken compared to a couple of the forum Old Farts. They'll love for that one sunshine!

Friendly Fire Fiasco: Ukrainian Army Shoots Down Its Own F16 Jet, Pilot Killed
http://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/first-us-made-f16-jet-downed-ukraine-during-combat-pilot-killed
>>Update (5:15pm ET): It appears that the US-made F-16 fighter jet, which was handed over to Ukraine earlier this year, was downed by a Ukrainian Patriot air defense system in a friendly fire incident, Ukrainian lawmaker Maryana Bezuglaya said cited by TASS.
"According to my information, the F-16 of the Ukrainian pilot Alexey ‘Moonfish’ Mes was shot down by the Patriot anti-aircraft missile system due to a lack of coordination between the [military] units," she wrote on Telegram.
The lawmaker criticized the Air Force of the Ukrainian Armed Forces for falsely describing the incident as "a crash."<<

Zelensky fires Ukraine's air force commander after fatal F-16 crash
http://www.france24.com/en/europe/20240830-zelensky-fires-ukraine-s-air-force-commander-after-fatal-f-16-crash
>>Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky dismissed his air force chief after one of the country's F-16 fighter jets crashed while repelling a Russian air attack, killing the pilot, Oleksiy Mes. “We need to protect people. Protect personnel. Take care of all our soldiers,” Zelensky said in an address.<<