From July, New Zealand citizens who have lived in Australia for four years on the current temporary, special category visa provided to all New Zealanders will be able to directly apply for citizenship, without first having to become a permanent resident.

This change introduced by the Albanese Government, overturns the discriminatory rule the Howard Government introduced in 2001, that made Kiwi's living here permanently go through a long and expensive process to transition from permanent residency to citizenship. As it has been the case all along for Australians living in New Zealand, citizenship application will be much more straight forward.

My wife has said, although she sees her roots are in Aotearoa, and always will be, her "hou ora" (new life) is in Australia. For one, she will be applying for Australian citizenship at the first opportunity. After 17 years of residency the only additional benefit she will receive is the right to vote.

Dear Paul,

This is good and I don't think this move is controversial.

The question is, why must we have citizenship to begin with?

Paul,

If the only difference is that the Kiwis can vote why is this "justice"

What's the point of being an Australian these days, where every man and his dog can be handed out citizenship as though it is a complimentary ticket to a concert.

Hi Yuyutsu,

Citizenship gives one a senses of belonging and acceptance, there is a certain pride in inclusion. I know you have differing opinions on what I see as the collective well-being of people, but that's okay. Some confuse inclusion with patriotism, and its negative sidekick nationalism. Once a person has demonstrated their value to the nation, then acceptance as a citizen should be straight forward, we should not place additional obstacles in the way. Justice is what's fair and reasonable, the intangible benefits of citizenship are a good thing.

Dear Paul,

«Citizenship gives one a senses of belonging and acceptance»

I can't see how a piece of paper could give me a sense of belonging (supposing I am even interested in that), and as for acceptance, there are and will always be those who accept me and those who won't, that's human nature and is not really a problem.

If I cared to belong, then it would be in like-minded group(s) with similar interests and/or worldview - not with this meaningless cohort of everyone who happens to live in this large continent. I already have a sense of belonging in several such groups.

«Once a person has demonstrated their value to the nation, then acceptance...»

How do you personally feel when others accept you because you have a value to them? Is this true acceptance? Suppose tomorrow you can no longer work and instead become a burden - should that acceptance be withdrawn?

«the intangible benefits of citizenship are a good thing.»

And what about the tangible drawbacks, like compulsory voting, like jury duty, like the threat of conscription?

Making sacrifices for a group you voluntarily want to be part of, because you share its values and goals, is natural and beautiful, but having to make sacrifices just because otherwise you would be kicked out of the land, for a group whose values and goals you do not share, is not a beautiful thing at all!

And this didn't even go to a vote of the Australian people to have such a massive change to the citizenship rules- what democracy- Communists don't believe in ownership. Communists killed 100 million in the name of equality- walled off eastern block countries for a generation. Marie Curie at the age of 16 taught Polish in blacked out classrooms because Communist Russia wanted to destroy Polish culture and language. Communism sees culture as false consciousness- they want to destroy our past to control our future- just as Orwell predicted. "A boot on the head of everyone forever".

We should say who comes and how many but Australian's never got a vote- so the leaders don't have a mandate- democracy is government of the people, by the people, for the people- but what is a people?

These are interesting...

http://youtu.be/IwGR_ZMSuMs

http://www.spectator.com.au/2023/04/australia-has-an-immigration-problem-and-its-tearing-the-country-apart/

I see that nut job is back ranting about "communists". Oh well, it takes all kinds.

"Marie Curie at the age of 16 taught Polish in blacked out classrooms because Communist Russia wanted to destroy Polish culture and language."

Curie was born in 1867 - so she turned 16 in 1883. No Communist Russia at that time. Communist anything, let alone communist Russia was just a glint in the eye of that well-known anti-Semite Karl Marx.

This is being dressed up in highfaluting tales of grand policy and eternal brotherhood.

When in reality its just about letting some NZers gain permanent access to our more generous welfare system.

I agree with mhaze.

Sorry mhaze- it was the Russian Empire that had annexed Poland at that stage apparently.

http://daily.jstor.org/marie-curie-and-polish-resistance/

I remembered it wrongly- but my point remains. Thanks mhaze.

Neoliberalism on steroids !

This looks interesting ... by Marx...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/On_the_Jewish_Question

When mhaze mentioned hebrew Marx's anti-semitism I thought it was interesting. I probably wouldn't call it anti-semitism but perhaps reformation- maybe a false flag operation. Engels and Marx's personalities are interesting- Engels was a womaniser whereas Marx was apparently faithful to Mary.

From the Wiki article...

"Isaac Deutscher (1959)[27] compares Marx with Elisha ben Abuyah, Baruch Spinoza, Heinrich Heine, Rosa Luxemburg, Leon Trotsky, and Sigmund Freud, all of whom he thinks of as heretics who repudiate Jewry, yet still belong to a Jewish tradition. According to Deutscher, Marx's "idea of socialism and of the classless and stateless society" expressed in the essay is as universal as Spinoza's "Ethics and God"."

"Marx was apparently faithful to Mary"

Fredrick Demuth would be surprised to hear that.

Pros and Cons here.
New Zealand brain drain.
The best and brightest New Zealand have will come to Australia and become citizens here which will reduce New Zealand's ability to retain the citizens best able to make New Zealand great and take it into the future.

Interesting. Thanks for the information Mhaze.

http://hackneyhistory.wordpress.com/2018/11/18/the-sad-story-of-fred-demuth-marxs-son-in-hackney/

Hi AC,

I don't believe the changes to citizenship will greatly effective the flow of Kiwi's across the ditch. It will have no effect on employment opportunities at all, therefore NZ is not jumping up and down about the loss of skills.

One NZ relative is presently on the Gold Coast setting up a home building business there, he has run a successful such business in the Auckland area for over 15 years, and with most of the family grown up now, he thinks there are opportunities here and is giving it a go.

Also, a 'moko' 20 year old, we caught up with her in Sydney, she was holidaying down there. She works in hospitality back home, and wants a bit of adventure, thinking she might also give the Gold Coast a go for a year or so, and then off to Canada.

Neither of the above two are interested in long term Australian citizenship (as far as I know).