Ludwig I agree that nothing will come of the efforts to reduce CO2, even if it were to blame for increased warming.

The world is warming naturally as the sea level rises as we come out of the last Ice Age, the scientific community has hijacked that for their own selfish reasons, the usual one, money. That's unraveling, we'll see how fast, but I suspect the scientific community has done itself considerable damage as far as fundamental research funding goes.

There's no grand conspiracy, just little "cartels" that naturally see the competitiveness and rewards of the research world life gone large.

I have no doubt that all the money from our ETS or UN taxes, call them what you will are anything more than redistribution of money through society. It won't work, socialism does not work regardless of intent, greed will overcome. The people in countries that are backward, will not be suddenly bootstrapped to 1st world level, it takes hundreds of years, not decades, for cultures to change and evolve, without even a mention of the primitive tribal based cultures who reject first world values anyway.

However, if we follow your line, that there needs to be a cataclysmic event before the 1st world really does something, you're probably right, I admit it. If, and only if, the world is really heating up due to additional effects from humans, then no one alive today in power is going to give it up for some abstract future benefit.

PM Rudd is not a generous man, he is pursuing this end for his own greedy benefit and ego, not some love of mankind principle.

He talks a good fight, but is he a man of principle or ambition?

This is a folly, our generation will be laughed at for centuries. All the hand-wringing and doom-saying will not produce anything towards what the eco warriors want, the money will end up back where it began or in Swiss bank accounts.

There will be much disappointment, but it does give the children something to do, to rage at the machine.

I agree with examinator (I never thought I would say that!) :)

"Business always works on the cash cow mentality and only resorts to drastic change when their is no option."

I would go further and say the majority works on that mentality.

I support action on climate change. I don't want it to cost me $3000 per year.

Whether there is or isn't climate change, I support the aim of living sustainably and using renewable resources. I'm no greenie, I also support using up the mininng resources, oil, gas etc while we have the means and the processes to do this efficently. But in the end we need to find better alternatives.

One of the problems with bull-tish is the taste.

No matter how sincere, emotional or contrived the presenters of GW theories are when they feed the public bull-tish the public still taste the same thing every time.

Nowadays we, the real people of the planet, have been force fed so much bull-tish by the “green-enviro-GW” zealots that we can taste the bull-tish even before they open their mouths

It is no different to the previous manna-for-the-proletariat, communism, a central authority telling everyone they needed to do something for the common good

The whole things is simply “Socialism by Stealth”

A ruse, designed to increase taxes and reduce the discretionary power / disposable incomes of the individuals who actually create the wealth on which the state gorges itself.

No wonder Krudd and Co are hell bent on signing everyone in Australia up to the programme ( they are probably on some MLM commission scheme run by UN/Gore).

How can ya read socialism into that is beyond me.
This world would be far better off with a good clean up.
Oil and gas will come to an end one day, so any change now will be a head start. There seems to be a lot of people fearing what it will cost them. I suggest they take stock now to see what they can do to alleviate this.
Even diesel cars are carbon producers, so put them on gas.
Use some imagination instead of whingeing.

Amicus, I don’t buy this scientific conspiracy or ‘cartel’ theory.

I believe that just the opposite is happening. That is; effectively an enormous conspiracy from big business, governments and people afraid of us possibly steering away from business as usual. In other words, there is a huge push to continue with the same old methodology of economic growth, human expansion, overconsumption, etc….and scant little regard for any need to err on the side of caution.

We can see that something is definitely happening out there and that it is huge and global, with the melting of glaciers, ice-shelfs, more severe and frequent cyclones, increasing CO2 content in the atmosphere, etc.

But rather than try to unite in a cautious approach, a very large section of humanity, largely including those in the big business sector and others with power and influence, are willing to do whatever it takes to poo-poo it and continue with business as usual!

But even worse than this, the whole climate change debate has effectively hijacked the debate about sustainability. Rather than act as a step towards a broader debate on sustainability, as I would have expected, it seems to have diverted attention away from continuous population growth, the development of steady-state economies and the imperative for humanity to come into balance with its resource base, in a holistic manner and not just regarding energy.

We so desperately need to tackle the sustainability imperative and not just one section of it as we virtually are with climate change / fossil fuels / energy supplies.

Now the climate change debate has become terribly muddled. We’re not going to get anywhere with it for years, so it seems.

And the sustainability debate continues to be subdued and largely out of the media and decision-makers’ minds.

Bring on the apocalypse.

Examinator & all other greenies take note, having your elite left wing leadership leap into bed with right wing elites, to promote wall street's change from credit trading to carbon trading did not help us to believe all the bull dust, the mass media has been feeding us.

The ETS Economic Treason Scheme & CPRS Create Poverty Ruthlessly System are about exporting jobs, stealing from all of you and giving the money to Goldman Sachs, Macquarie Bank, etc. Wake up to yourselves, its yet another, steal from 99% of the people and give it to 1% of the filthy rich. (they have not stolen all of your money yet and they will not stop until they have impoverished all of you)

Reducing Electricity usage in oz does not need carbon trading.

Reducing fossil fuel burning may actually contribute to GW, because it would also reduce smog production. If smog in the atmosphere clears up or reduces faster than the excess co2 does, it could trigger increases in temperature more catastrophic than even the worst doomsdayer's have been predicting.

Have all of you forgotten about GD or Global Dimming or the "Shade Cloth Effect" or have all of you stopped talking about it, deliberately. It was on 4corners a few years ago.