Suzionline “I am quite happy to leave it to the police and courts, rather than to aggressive vigilantes”

Please quote where in my post did I suggest any “vigilante” action.

I did mention in my first post on this thread, a swell of opinion that “public humiliation punishment” was a view which held popular support among members of the police force

Re “The reason we have given up all the humiliating punishments that people like you want to see returned is that law abiding citizens no longer want to stoop as low as the behaviours displayed by drunks!”

Speak for yourself, whilst I do not advocate losing a hand for theft etc, I do believe we do need to consider the lenient way we treat the perpetrators of sometimes violent and always anti-social behavior.

Pillorying a drunk is not the same as violently assaulting other members of the public or police and it can be avoided by the drunk simply not behaving in an anti-social manner

(re “I know one idea popular among law enforcement is a return to public humiliation penalties – maybe public stocks or pillory, since so many whoosies seems to think birching is inhuman.”)

So I am happy for police to charge them and then stand them before a magistrate to receive what the magistrate considers “the judgment of their fellow citizens” which should include a defined number of hours locked in a public pillory or stocks, to receive the acclaim or otherwise of law abiding citizens.

Anyway back to the real issue

It is up to the drunks and drug abusers to stop committing criminal offenses, including assaults on police, hospital staff and private citizens.

It is not up to the police hospital staff or private citizens to make excuses or exceptions for the lack of responsibility and consideration exercised by those who cannot deal effectively with their substance of choice.

Drunks and drug abusers simply need to shoulder their share of “obligation”, to behave civilly , which is required of anyone who feels “entitled” to enjoy public places

Col Rouge,

It was you who argued
'they do not deserve access to the resources of public medical facilities, designed and funded by the taxes I pay for real emergencies rather than self-inflicted ones'.

My point is that the entitlement to medical care does not depend on desert.

As for your assertion that drunks are sub-human, It is false. They still have the capacities to reason, to choose values and act on them, to feel pain--even if some of those are temporarily blunted by the alchohol.

In any case, we have obligations in respect of animals too.

I don't argue that people are entitled to behave badly while drunk, or that they should be free from punishment.

I'd be interested to know what theory of punishment you adopt. It is hard to discern through your posts how you justify one kind of penalty rather than another.

Ozbiz “They still have the capacities to reason, to choose values and act on them, to feel pain--even if some of those are temporarily blunted by the alchohol”

Obviously you have not tried to “Reason” with a drunk or someone high on methamphetamines.

I repeat, having spurned their obligation to behave civilly they do not deserve any entitlement to public medical facilities to apply remedy to their self-inflicted injuries or medical risks

“In any case, we have obligations in respect of animals too”

that is why we shoot race horse when they are injured.

Are you suggesting we shoot drunks and drug abusers too?

“I'd be interested to know what theory of punishment you adopt. It is hard to discern through your posts how you justify one kind of penalty rather than another.”

I doubt anyone could objectify punishment however, since we are all equal under the law, I would assume a listed punishment would be objectively applied and a pillory / humiliation punishment being objectively applied would see lots of unruly drunks and drug abusers locked in a position of public prominence for a number of hours – available for the law abiding public to demonstrate their distain for the miscreants.

Nothing you have said is in the least convincing.. .

try again if you wish.