Hey, how about a bit of substance to your arguments and a bit less abuse to those with whom you find disagreement.

David

Leigh wrote: "Howard’s attitude to education and the development of Australia as a knowledge nation not reliant on immigration is plain to see in Peter Wilkinson’s “The Howard Legacy”."

A book which should be read by anyone concerned about the future of this country, or more precisely, the future makeup of the cognitive elite which will shape this country's future. (For those who haven't read it, you can read an extract here: http://independentaustralian.com.au/node/10)

Wilkinson explores in great detail how Australia's unhealthy over-reliance on immigration to meet "skills shortages" is having a profound effect on the makeup of our cognitive elite, the professional and management classes.

He writes:

"Under John Howard, Australia has become the first ethnic European nation to openly invite in distinct ethnic groups to provide the skills required in today’s knowledge economy. The need arises because governments have not been prepared to provide the necessary finance and motivation to sufficiently educate our own children. They have allowed ideologues in the education system to persuade parents and children that achieving certain skill levels does not matter. Recent arrivals are not fooled, they exploit existing Australian human and physical capital at the expense of the long standing Australian families in our schools and universities. The intergenerational transfer which has been an integral part of our society has been denied to many long established families without them realising it."

In other words, the birthright of long-standing Australians is being handed to foreigners on a platter. Rather than invest in our own people, the Federal Government is selling them out and outsourcing the running of our "knowledge econony" to a new, foreign-born elite.

It is not difficult to parade the arguments for a lower level of population.

In fact, it is by far the simplest position to adopt.

Look around you, we are told, self-righteously and occasionally pompously, there are finite resources. We are consuming more and more of them every day. Every new arrival adds to the "ecological footprint". Growth is not sustainable, mathematically and logically. And so on and so on.

It's is an easy stance to adopt, and a simple one to defend.

Where it gets difficult, is proposing a solution. So far, I haven't seen anything remotely practical being put forward. Or, come to that, remotely humanitarian.

"Stop immigration". Ok. What happens to the people we turn away. Are we happy to condemn them to an early grave, so long as they go and die where we can't see them? I guess that's all right then.

"Limit population growth". Ok. Who stops, and who is allowed, and who decides?

How about a voucher system. If you have one you can't or don't use, sell it to someone who wants it. Put your baby-voucher up on eBay. Kids as commodities. Nice. And what would be the punishment for unauthorised pregnancy? I know, we could deport them, so that they can seek asylum in a less enlightened political system.

So here's a little challenge for those who simply call us "overpopulation deniers" (thanks Rick S).

Stop shilly-shallying around with slogans, and come up with a plan.

If you believe that our "ideal" population is fifteen million, or ten million, or two million, show us how to get there.

Do the maths, work through the demographic implications - ageing population, urban migration etc. and describe a little of the reality of anti-growth.

It would certainly be more useful and illuminating that sloganry, mil-observer.

>>And should the degenerates ever seem to have succeeded in the short term, then we merely adjust our aims to resistance, then restoration of civilization, then back to progressive advancement.<<

If you can't come up with anything, we'll just have to call you "solution deniers".

I see that the usual growth zealots are still trying to foist their pyramid schemes upon the rest of us.

Here's a little dose of demographic reality: immigration is no solution to an aging population because, surprise surprise, immigrants grow old too. In fact, by importing so many immigrants, we are simply augmenting the dependent elderly population of the future, which will make it necessary to bring in even more immigrants further down the track to support them.

As one parliamentary research paper concluded:

"... immigration cannot 'solve our ageing problem'. Substantial ageing of the Australian population over the coming decades is absolutely inevitable. To illustrate the lack of power that immigration has in relation to our age structure, we investigate the levels of immigration that would be required to maintain the proportion of the population aged 65 and over at its present level of 12.2 per cent. In doing this, we maintain the fertility and mortality assumptions of the standard but allow annual net migration to change.

To achieve our aim, enormous numbers of immigrants would be required, starting in 1998 at 200 000 per annum, rising to 4 million per annum by 2048 and to 30 million per annum by 2098. By the end of next century with these levels of immigration, our population would have reached almost one billion. ... it is important that the message is heard that our population cannot be kept young through immigration. The problem is that immigrants, like the rest of the population, get older and as they do, to keep the population young, we would need an increasingly higher number of immigrants."

http://wopared.parl.net/library/pubs/RP/1999-2000/2000rp05.htm

I cant believe this forum , how did you lot become so anti Human ?
Are you all living in cardboard boxes hiding behind the Vic Market ?

Apparently you see yourselves as Titled Beneficiaries of the Estate of Moses !

You are Defeatists you have no Vision or Imagination . You are Philosophically Dead .

You are Morally and Ethically Broken !

Every time you pass a Primary School you Lust for Revenge , "The Final Solution".

As an example Japan and the UK tiny Countries , where do they fit into your scenario , how come they missed out on being Junked as in your Theories .

We all need to Wake Up We need to Reproduce ourselves a few times and we need to get off our Bums and Produce Products to Market OS .

We need to Grow up and stop Voting for funny blokes who stroke us from the Box , what is the Debt now , it's very dynamic , probably 315 Billion , thats everybody over 40's super vanished ?.............Thats our finance pool demoralized our future an up hill journey . The lesson not yet complete The Ersatz Man has passage yet .

Cont'd

Cont'd

Finally we need to do something about Water !

We 'Have to' generate water on a Grand Scale .

The answer will be found by examining nature and duplicating and Containing that process .

This is our Future : Desalination of Sea Water by the combination of Contained Solar Sea Water Evaporation and Contained Chilled Water Condensation producing totally salt free water .

The Evaporators can be built by Journey Men assisted by Green House Tomato Growers . Inside the Greenhouse are racks for Shade cloth drapes over which sea water is pumped Solar energy evaporates the water the product is a Cloud of fresh water or a parcel of air at 100% Humidity .

One end of the Greenhouse is open the air is drawn into the greenhouse by Huge Centrifugal Fans contained in the exit end of the Chilled Water Condenser House
Condensers contain Chilled Water ; the cloud from the Evaporation Plant is drawn through the Cold Condenser the product is Rain .NB Other tricks happen here , Saturated adiabatic Lapse Rate and Dust Introduction etc.