You can clearly see In the posts whose been successfully involved in small business, knows how it works and those who haven't got a clue yet think they do. The following statement is a prime example.

“The bottom line is some arbitrary definition of fairness, be it yours or anybody elses, has no place in business. Business isn't about being fair. It is about putting systems in place that make you money.”

Small business is all about fairness, as well as making a living on your own terms. But those terms must show fairness to yourself, your family, employee's, customers and suppliers. Small business relies upon providing a fair deal, big business relies upon systems and profit growth, going to any lengths to achieve it and all unfairly for everyone else. Bureaucracy and politics rely upon bullying and pandering to vested interests, so they have to disadvantage small business which doesn't fit in their agenda, other than as a milking cow.

Competition in small business, is all about service and satisfaction, getting a fair deal for your money. It's community orientated, people work for you because they want to and you are fair in your dealings with them and the community.

Twenty years ago, it would take you about an hour a week to get your books together for a small business. Now it takes about a day added up over the week and is getting longer as red tape requirements increase

The bottom line is business is about making money. You seem to think the chief impediment to making money is paying the employees.

Absolutely not. My posts are about fairness for all involved. At no point have I compared a baker to a salesman. I don't have a problem paying wages. It's having to give an employee complete freedom to do as they please, when they please, while I can't, that is what concerns me. This is what I mean when I say 'fairness'.

I recon if they can leave at any time, then we should be able to replace them at any time. Now that's fair.

Then
What do you think the worries the alcoholic drink manufactures more: wages or the alcoho-pops tax?
I am sorry but I see no connection between this and the post.

I can't say I agree with your motivation for business. I employ family people and I get to know thier families, take them out for Xmas dinner etc. My workplace is a happy environment.

Pelican
For a start if an employer was just able to get rid of an employee anytime a better candidate walked through the door the economic system would collapse.

This thread is about unfair dismissal.

Why is it that employers don't have the same rights as employees.

If you recall, my recent post was in response to anothers post about fairness.

It is simply unfair to protect employees rights (unfair dismissal) without giving protection to the employers. They should have the freedom to choose who they want just as employees choose where and when to work. Now that's fair!

stormbay: "Small business is all about fairness, as well as making a living on your own terms."

That's new. I'll add "bringing fairness to the world" to my list of why people start businesses.

Regardless, I doubt your behaviour is very different to mine. Things flow easier when people trust each other. I felt I had to earn that trust by being fair and honest, and also by giving the benefit of the doubt to show people I trusted them. It seemed to me most people operate on the same basis. Maybe that is why it worked out most of the time.

Regarding your assurances of treating everyone fairly - I guess before accepting them it would be prudent to check your definition of fairness matches mine. I am sure you, like me, have been surprised by the behaviour of someone who earlier claimed to be fair and honest in their dealings. Fortunately I don't have to as there is legal definition when it comes to employees, and if your standards are as high as you say they are you won't have any problem meeting them. If you go to the additional effort putting any issues you do have with an employee in writing, and writing down steps will be taken to overcome those problems, and revisiting that list noting broken promises and new resolutions if things go wrong again it is very unlikely the unfair dismissal laws will cause you a problem. They are, after all, designed to catch people who don't treat their employees fairly - and you say you aren't one of them.

recthub: "Why is it that employers don't have the same rights as employees."

If life is so good for an employee, you can always become one. Don't worry about all employers taking that option. When enough of the competition chuck in the towel, the remaining ones will be making so much money I doubt any amount of unfair dismissal laws would make then quit.

rehctub is absolutely correct. Employers should have every right to dimiss employees unfairly.

In fact, they should also be able to pay them in tobacco and sugar, and whip them if they don't work hard enough.

Those Xmas dinners must be jolly affairs.

rehctub is absolutely correct. Employers should have every right to dimiss employees unfairly.

CJ, not unfairly, but surely employers must be given the same freedom to choose staff as employees have to choosing who they work for.

I had a guy just the other day who was late by three hours due to attending to his horses.

Now if I were attending to mine and was three hours late opening the shop, then I would be out of pocket for three hours pay as it waould have been 'my problem'.

Please tell me why this is fair?

Also, please understand that I have no problems with my staff, in fact, they all like working for me.

My problem is still the fact that you can't give allowances to one side (employees) but not give the same allowances to the other (employers).

Everyone deserves a fair go. What's good for the goose should also be good for the ganda!

As for the comment about there being no fairness in business as it's all about making money, well, I employ people with names, not just numbers.

Now if you are one to employ only numbers,not people, then that's your choice, but please don't brand me with this style of doing business.

rehctub: "I had a guy just the other day who was late by three hours due to attending to his horses ... tell me why this is fair?"

I imagine you are uninterested in the answer, as you seem to be entertaining yourself by whining about how hard business owners have it.

As I said, it doesn't particularly matter whether it is fair or not. What matters is you don't have to put up with employees that do it on a regular basis. If you do, be assured that if you are up against a competitor like me, they won't be putting up with it and they will either be undercutting you or making more money.

What you have to do is pretty straight forward. You write a simple letter saying the behaviour is unacceptable. You then sit down with the employee, present the letter and discuss it, and ask him what he is going to do the fix the problem. He will of course swear back and blue he won't do it again, or perhaps he will have a sob story that you accept if he gave you advance notice - or whatever compromise is acceptable to you both. You minute the meeting as it happens, and get him to sign the minutes, and file them away. Its all over in a few minutes.

If he does it again go through the same process a second time, but this time hauling out the previous warning, point out during the chat he did didn't keep his promises, ask whether he will be able to in the future, yada yada yada. You also point out if he does it a third time you will fire him.

But it almost certainly won't get to that point. Typically employees who can't turn up on time can't do a lot of other things either. They get a stream of warnings. Remarkably most will adapt, but those that don't can't stand the pressure and resign.

You end up better employees and less staff turnover. And less reason to whinge, which probably kills it for you.