Sells--why do you think Jesus was executed?

Because he was a threat to the worldly power on the then religious establishment.

Do you think Jesus would have been welcome or even recognised in Calvins fascist mini-state?

At the Vatican?

At the "world-youth-day" circus that was held in Sydney?

At Opus Dei?

At anything that was sponsored or endorsed by Neuhaus?

At any of the rallies or conferences put on by USA evangelicals?

At a Billy Graham crusade?

At your local church?

Plus Jesus was not in any sense a theologian.

The authenticity of ones religion is always demonstrated by what one actually does--no exceptions. By ones applied politics and the company one keeps.

"Therefore, we must judge our religion in psycho-physiological terms, in factual terms, real, actual, living, human terms. That is how you tell the difference between true teachers or prophets or practitioners and mere believers.

What is the quality of their existence? What do they do? If you see people practicing some religious path and they look happy, and they are healthy, and they are sane, and they are also intelligent, and their experience is real and also extraordinary, then naturally they are attractive and there is value in listening to them and talking to them......

....But if you see a group of crazy self-divided fanatical people, who call themselves true believers but who have no clarity, no humanity, no love, no ability to inspect and transcend themselves and their "righteous" dogmas, then you can know that they are doing nothing but mumbling the usual belief in the Myth of long-ago Jesus."

And their dark self-possession will be written all over their faces and bodies---and by extension their inevitable dreadful politics---the piety of pain dramatised on to the bodies of their inevitable scape-goat victims

When I saw Sellick's article this morning and the large number of post that came in immediately I wondered why we all give him so much time?

So I have formed a hypothesis based on his article.

Liberalism (combined with the separation of church and state) as reached the stage where I can say 'Peter, your article is total garbage' without being dragged outside to be burnt at the stake. I can say 'Christianity is a lie' and the worst thing that can happen is David Boaz will threaten me with the Victorian police and vilification laws.

Isn't the freedom lovely? I can live with my partner without being married and not live in constant fear of being sapped from above for doing naughty things with our genitals. We can watch footy on Sunday without feeling guilty about not being at some ridiculous ceremony where poor old Jesus gets his again and we eat his flesh and drink his blood. If we want to name our children with un-Christian names and wait till they are old enough to decide for themselves if that want to be Christened.

Christianity imploding? It was only the fear that kept it going for so long. I have no idea why the earliest Christians started it in the first place, but whatever their reasons it was soon replaced by the Jewish fear based teaching of Paul the Pharisee.

Years ago there was a religion called Wicca that had central to its core beliefs 'If it harms none, do as you will.' Now Sells is lamenting that the idea of 'harming none' has arisen again in the form of liberalism.

Maybe Sells you have been born several hundred years too late. I can imagine you riding along side Guzman the Butcher killing Cathars in their thousands. Or sticking a torch under some poor person tied to a stake on a bonfire.

That world has gone, and I hope it will never to return.

So my theory is that we write and tell Sells that his articles are garbage for no other reason than we can.

Peter, Your post rings absolutely true. Disregard the anti-Christian abuse from humanists, relativists, nihilists, those who deny the actual or even desirable existence of anything outside themselves. Your posts are welcome fresh air.

I agree absolutely with the main proposition advanced by John Carroll (La Trobe University) in his 2004 book The Wreck of Western Culture - Humanism Revisited. His thesis, as you summarized in your book review at the time, was that humanistic rationalism has robbed Western culture of the deep insights about humanity provided by faith. "How can a culture survive when its guts have been torn out?"

Western civilization is in decline because of its denial and now ignorance of its own roots. Political correctness and 'tolerance' are no defence against militant Islam, for example. Thomas Mann is right in saying "Tolerance becomes a crime when applied to evil."

The bloggers who abuse you, and Christianity, have no idea of the difference between good and evil, of what is really important.

I'm with Ivan (The Brothers Karamazov) when he tells his brother "If God doesn't exist, then everything is permitted." That's where 'liberal' present culture has brought us.

Kant (Critique of Pure Reason) says wisely "There can be no proof of the existence of God, but it is all our interests to behave as if he exists."

You are right in criticising liberalism's deification of radical individual freedom. Theodore Dalrymple (excellent UK writer) says in his essay "The Frivolity of Evil" (in 'Our Culture, what’s left of it') that the apologists for 'harm minimization' believe "not only that it is economically feasible to behave in an irresponsible and egotistical fashion, but also that it is morally permissible to do so. ... There has been a long march [of this idea] not only through the institutions but through the minds of the young. When young people want to praise themselves, they describe themselves as “nonjudgmental”. For them, the highest form of morality is amorality." Lamentable, dead-end copout!

I loved your article on "The problem with modern art" (August 2008) at http://www.onlineopinion.com.au/view.asp?article=7702&page=1 . Said it all!

Glorfindel wrote: "Disregard the anti-Christian abuse from humanists, relativists, nihilists, those who deny the actual or even desirable existence of anything outside themselves."

Dear Glorfindel,

Nobody in this string has denied the actual or even desirable existence of anything outside themselves. You exist. Sellick exists. However, Sellick wants us to accept the existence of entities on the basis of belief when there is no proof of the existence of such entities. Socrates was executed in part for denying the existence of the Gods. To believe in their existence was the fashion in ancient Greece. Now Sellick is in fashion in maintaining the existence of the Christian God. There is no more reason to believe in such a god than there is to believe in the Greek pantheon which is no longer fashionable.

You and Sellick are actually accusing some of the posters on this thread of being out of fashion. However, fashion is ephemeral. Someday, the Christian God and his humanoid representation will be regarded in the same way as we regard the Greek pantheon. Both are merely legend.

If anyone has been abusive it has been Sellick. Nobody else has told those who disagree to be silent.

Daviy,

It is obvious you get your religions mixed up. You write 'I can say 'Christianity is a lie' and the worst thing that can happen is David Boaz will threaten me with the Victorian police and vilification laws'

I think you mean that the worst thing that can happen to a Christian in Victoria is those who worship self will threaten Christians with vilification because they expose the lies of the secularist. Your god denying philosopher might allow you to live enslaved to your lusts and guilt free for the time being but the end fruit of this belief is obvious to anyone with a brain.

Daviy's reference to "the Jewish fear based teaching of Paul the Pharisee" perplexes me.

What is it in the following from Paul that you see as fear-based?

* Do not conform any longer to the pattern of this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind.

*Do not repay anyone evil for evil ... Overcome evil with good.

*If I speak in the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal...

*But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control ...

*Do not let the sun go down while you are still angry...

*Whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable - if anything is excellent or praiseworthy - think about such things.

*Clothe yourselves with compassion, kindness, humility, gentleness and patience.

Paul also says “The man without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned.”

And he says that in the last days “People will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boastful, proud, abusive, disobedient to their parents, ungrateful, unholy, without love, unforgiving, slanderous, without self-control, brutal, not lovers of the good…”

Don’t you think he was spot on in relation to our own times?