Boxgum, nice synopsis of Peter's argument but you do little (if anything) to address the criticisms of the argument presented by myself and others.

This forum finally allows people to debate religion. Everyone has a religion. For some its football or cricket, and for some its anti god. The anti-gods are the atheists. They don’t have a set of solid rules, so they obey none. For that reason a Muslim is better than an atheist. 13.5 million Australians claim Christianity.

If Jews have the Kol Nidre prayer, that lets them disregard their oaths, and undermine Christianity. They are worse than the Muslims. This debate is stuck in the Old Testament for some, and outside Christianity altogether for others. What is the difference, Christianity works. Thousands of ordinary people have miracles happen. In World War II Dunkirk was a miracle. They continued throughout. Look up the casualties from World War II on Google. The Protestant British Commander, had a combined civilian and military casualty list, a butchers bill, as the Navy calls it, of 512,000. ( 100,000 Australians included) The Axis power, Japan and Russia, had Sixty million. The Yanks lost about 270,000.

I have seen miracles, unexplainable healings, in fact two in my close family. Explanation, Doctors misdiagnosed the cancer. I have had people hounded and harassed by the State Church, seek help. What really annoys me is Labor abolished this atheist church, between 1993 and 1995, but the atheist priests won’t leave or accept federal (Christian) authority. There is much talk about VCAT. It should be a dead cat, shot by a vigilant Commonwealth. It has never been constitutional to create un-Australian Courts, like VCAT. With no effective High Court, State Judges give the Commonwealth the finger.

Christianity and justice have always traveled as partners just like love and marriage. Every right we treasure, is founded in Christianity. Our freeholds, marriages, inheritances, freedom of travel, all Christian. Even your life belongs to the State in the eyes of atheists. Under Christianity, the ONLY time the State owns everything, is wartime. Otherwise the Christian way is to provide just terms. The State is muzzled by Christianity, atheists have let the mongrel pit bull out. It is ravenous for revenue, nasty and vindictive

David BOAZ (yep, still off topic, but the original post stinks anyway)

Let's just assume that I precis every sentence with "I believe", because then I can apparently say what I like...

Oh, except to say, if those passages from the Quran are so bad, what of Deuteronomy 13:

"6 If thy brother, the son of thy mother, or thy son, or thy daughter, or the wife of thy bosom, or thy friend, which is as thine own soul, entice thee secretly, saying, Let us go and serve other gods, which thou hast not known, thou, nor thy fathers;

7 Namely, of the gods of the people which are round about you, nigh unto thee, or far off from thee, from the one end of the earth even unto the other end of the earth;

8 Thou shalt not consent unto him, nor hearken unto him; neither shall thine eye pity him, neither shalt thou spare, neither shalt thou conceal him:

9 But thou shalt surely kill him; thine hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hand of all the people."

Along with Commandment #1 - You shall have no other gods before me - seems like that's a pretty clear incitement to violence on religious grounds...

Still, they're both works of fiction, so I guess they're exempt from the vilification laws because they're works of art... :-)

Peter the Believer,
'Christianity and justice have always traveled as partners just like love and marriage.'
Tell that to the Cathars (If there where any left after their genecide by the Christian Church. What was the religion of Wicca really like? Nobody knows because it was wiped out by Christianity and all that is left is rubbish propaganda about witches spread by the Christains. There are too many expamples of Christion 'justice' to mention.
The history of the Christian church is one of crimes against humanity that are beyond conprehension. A small reminder of live under the Christians was the last eight years when the Christian right got a foothold in the Oval office.
All I can say is God help us all if the Christians regain their past power. Thankfully I can say that without being taken to court and then being drag outside to be burnt at the stake.

Daviy,

I like Peter the Believer... he makes me feel saner and smarter than I really am.

Dear George,

Sorry for taking so long to respond to your question.
I had used up all of my posts so I couldn't respond
until now.

You asked me to explain to you about the personal attacks on
atheists.

I wasn't referring to any one person. I was speaking generally
because that was my reaction after reading the second page of
Sellick's article where he was out of line in my opinion in
the way he talked about the "darkness" etcetera of atheists.

Re-read the second page of his article and you'll see what I mean.

I'm not an atheist, but I do object to an author expressing his
opinion using such unnecessary language knowing full well that it
will offend people.

I realize that I may have overstepped the line with my attempt at
humour by quoting George Cargill to try to cheer Pelly up.
If I caused any offense to anybody - I apologise. I was merely
attempting to "lighten things up." But in retrospect - perhaps
I shouldn't have done it.