The National Forum   Donate   Your Account   On Line Opinion   Forum   Blogs   Polling   About   
The Forum - On Line Opinion's article discussion area



Syndicate
RSS/XML


RSS 2.0

Main Articles General

Sign In      Register

The Forum > Article Comments > Teacher-proofing our education system, New York style > Comments

Teacher-proofing our education system, New York style : Comments

By Mike Williss, published 3/9/2008

What is it about the New York education system that has so infatuated Kevin Rudd and Julia Gillard?

  1. Pages:
  2. Page 1
  3. 2
  4. 3
  5. All
American teachers earn between $28,000 and $40,000 a year. Australian teachers earn from $42,000 TAFE, $50,000 primary to $76,000. There are probably 350,000 teachers in Australia so you can understand the appeal of the American system to Rudd and Gillard.

What other university trained professionals earn such money? Nurses.

Although its fashionable to decry our literacy standards they are still higher than they were a generation ago but if we keep chiselling away at our education budget (of which salaries forms a major part) then our literacy standards will fall.
Posted by billie, Wednesday, 3 September 2008 9:13:35 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
There is a maxim: "You cannot control what you do not measure".

All the information on school performance is either generalised or anecdotal.

One thing is clear is that the independent schools publish their results, compete for students, and out perform the state schools. While some may claim that the funding model is unfair, the state gets an excellent return on its investment in results.

The problem is with public education. No one knows where the failings are, and without this knowledge there can be no action or improvement, and the acceptance of mediocrity will continue.

The steps taken in NYC are drastic, but there are many other less draconian steps that can be taken with great effect.
Posted by Shadow Minister, Wednesday, 3 September 2008 10:43:38 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Nothing new here folks - and it just doesn't seem to be working for a lot of parents does it - or there would be no attraction to it or even the semblence of a debate about it.

I know you have to try to defend the status quo, and admirably done by the way - but we need to try something new, something different to the socialist management and employment system currently running, where good and bad teachers get treated exactly the same and go up the food chain at the same rate regardless of performance.
(Sorry, almost out of breath there.) Talk about stifling creativity and enthusiasm, that will sure do it - the rest of the community works on a reward for effort and performance system - come join us.

Your arguments though of playing the man (or woman) and not playing the ball are typical of this sort of fight against progress. it may be Labor, Coalition, NY government employees, whoever - yet everyone seems to be wrong except you guys, seriously.

The current system isn't working for us .. the taxpayers, and we want a change.
Posted by rpg, Wednesday, 3 September 2008 10:46:54 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
I too wonder why our politicians are facinated by the failing USA education system.
Good education is about teaching children to think clearly for themselves. Sure they need to learn to read and write but if youngsters learn to think (to analyse information and ideas) the basics tend to come more easily and more naturally.
I have pointed out to this and the former federal government that education aimed at specific employment opportunities is largely a waste of effort as who knows which employment in the future will go the way of harness making and buggy building.
The Scandinavian countries are leading the world in primary and secondary education with Finland to the fore.
Some of our politicians should have spent their winter overseas holidays studying the systems in use there. My reading indicates that early year exams are rare and teachers tend to be given their head. If teacher changes were fewer with each teacher following their class through the first few primary years then picking up a new beginners class as they lose their earlier class to the next three year group we would soon lose incompetent teachers from the system.
Maybe if we aimed to emulate the best we could really achieve something for the coming generations of Australian students. The last thing we need to do is to follow the Americans.
Posted by Foyle, Wednesday, 3 September 2008 10:56:46 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
No, the rest of society does not operate some "reward for merit" system. Generally quite the opposite. That's why the various bubbles - property, shares (especially energy), and credit derivatives - all re-create, perpetuate and entrench feudalism. It's about "who's your daddy" inheritance and opportunism - forget proper notions of "ability".

My kids' school is actually a very "private enterprise" system, though nominally "state-run". From my observation, the more intelligent and conscientious teachers (like the students) get more harassment and expectation to do more work, but with generally less reward unless, of course, they are rich. The rich factor is important, because many education apparatchiks suck up to the rich, often in the hope of direct payoff via Blairite "public-private" scams that are so fashionable now.

Publicized ranking of schools will merely further entrench feudalism in the education system; brilliant kids in poor schools will have next to no chance, unless they beg and gamble for scholarships.
Posted by mil-observer, Wednesday, 3 September 2008 11:03:31 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Despite the narrowly-focused headlines (“State to pay $10m for jaded teachers to leave schools”, The Australian, 3/9 and “Fast-food giants may be welcomed in schools”, The Age, 3/9), the Victorian Government’s new Blueprint is one of the three most significant reports on education in the last thirty years, the others being the Blackburn Report, which brought us the low-standard VCE, and the IPA’s Schooling Victoria, which set the damaging agenda for the previous government.

The true significance of the new Blueprint is that it signals the long-awaited reversal of the market-based approach to education that has failed so badly since 1992. The government is once again accepting responsibility for the education of all children and not leaving some to languish in failing schools while the market slowly closes them.

It is a pity that the Commonwealth Government seems to be jumping on the creaky market-based bandwagon just as Victoria accepts that it has led us into the mire.

The actual report can be found at:
http://www.education.vic.gov.au/about/directions/blueprint2008/default.htm
Posted by Chris C, Wednesday, 3 September 2008 11:19:20 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
  1. Pages:
  2. Page 1
  3. 2
  4. 3
  5. All

About Us :: Search :: Discuss :: Feedback :: Legals :: Privacy