The National Forum   Donate   Your Account   On Line Opinion   Forum   Blogs   Polling   About   
The Forum - On Line Opinion's article discussion area



Syndicate
RSS/XML


RSS 2.0

Main Articles General

Sign In      Register

The Forum > Article Comments > Is the Catholic Church losing its grip? > Comments

Is the Catholic Church losing its grip? : Comments

By Brian Holden, published 28/7/2008

The Catholic Churches' cathedrals are among the West’s most magnificent artistic achievements - and they will remain to be its headstone.

  1. Pages:
  2. Page 1
  3. 2
  4. 3
  5. 4
  6. ...
  7. 34
  8. 35
  9. 36
  10. All
I have to agree with nearly everything you have said, except like most people you are incorrect on the concept of immaculate conception. Jesus was born of "Virgin Conception" according to Catholic Dogma, in that Mary never had sex (apparently). Mary was born of immaculate conception, that is she was born without sin, whereas us mere mortals are born with original sin already staining our soul. Mary had no such original sin and was kept free from sin throughout her life. (One does have to wonder, do this mean Mary could cast the first stone?).

Other than that, spot on, the Catholic church has created its own monster in denying priests most of their natural urges. I would be interested to know if the Anglican church has any such shortage of priests or trust in its church.
Posted by Patrick, Monday, 28 July 2008 9:28:38 AM
Find out more about this user Visit this user's webpage Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Spot on.
A few years ago Andrew Denton wrote a 'Diary" article in the SM Herald and quoted an extract from Robert Ardrey's writing where Ardrey stated we are risen apes not fallen angels. Ardrey's arguments for that view were well documented in 'African Genesis'.
In the 1960's the evidence for evolution finally caused the then Pope to accept evolution except for claiming that we were differnt from the animals and had a God given soul.
In his 1966 book 'The Territorial Imperative' Ardrey gave the lie to that claim of difference when he wrote,
"And finally we must know that the territorial imperative - just one it is true of the evolutionary forces playing upon our lives – is the biological law on which we have founded our edifices of human morality. Our capacities for sacrifice, for altruism, for sympathy, for trust, for responsibilities to other than self-interest, for honesty, for charity, for friendship and love, for social amity and mutual interdependence have evolved just as surely as the flatness of our feet, the muscularity of our buttocks, and the enlargement of our brain; out of the encounter on ancient African savannahs between the primate potential and the hominid circumstance."
Robert Ardrey, The Territorial Imperative,1966, chpt9, p.377-8.
Fortune paperback edn.
Posted by Foyle, Monday, 28 July 2008 11:19:19 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
A good article, but as a catholic turned agnostic turned atheist (last conversion about 45 years ago) you are merely preaching to the converted here. Fascinating comment about whether Mary was in a position to cast the stone, and interesting that Benedict's number is written as XV1 instead of XVI ... is there a name for that number (and I don't mean "16th")?

Brian says: "The church’s teaching is that faith and the scientific evidence supporting evolution are not in conflict. The theologians who went through the intellectual gymnastics required to come to that conclusion, can only be pitied."

How reasonably intelligent people can perform these gymnastics has always been beyond my understanding, and I would welcome comments which might help me understand. I presume it is just part of that "give me a child for 7 years and I will etc etc", but today's press advises that the man who has walked on the moon longer than any other man undertakes similar gymnastics (cured of kidney disease or something from afar). Why would he believe that? Is he a Galileo or a Copernicus ahead of his time, or has he some physical neurological problem which makes him think this way; or maybe he was influenced by a dotty parent or two. Or does he just have a wicked sense of humour?

As a determinist, I find this all fairly easy to answer to a degree, but I don't want to give up on free will!
Posted by HarryG, Monday, 28 July 2008 12:04:36 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Whilst the author has identified a number of valid discussion points, the reasoning behind his view is not as well argued as one might expect from a serious journal, but, as the notes about the author make no such claim to serious intellectual standing (or anything much else?!?) then this opinion piece is no more substantial than a letter to the SMH/Age.

Sexual deviancy or other moral and legal failure is no more related to one being a priest as is it to one being a doctor, school teacher or drug running ABC foreign correspondent. However, reporting about the later groups is not quite so hysterical, nor, are the oversight authorities perceived as an easy payout option for lawyers (oh, and their clients too!). If you want to be critical (and correct) celibacy has more to do with retaining Church property.

The Church will continue to survive and grow despite numerous failed administrative and pastoral outcomes. That's why you needn't worry.

As for the tax dollars, just like any major event, the State gets a lot of it back. If you want to hold a referendum to prevent this kind of spending (on sports, cultural as well as religious events) then good luck.
Posted by Reality Check, Monday, 28 July 2008 12:07:41 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
What a mean spirited article. It is true that many have thrown away any morality in life and then turned to earth worshiping in order to cover guilt and put on a facade for others. Many shamelessly murder their children and then want to preach values (or lack of) to others. Many refuse to keep their marriage vowels and then despise everyone else who do.The moral high ground taken by Brian is typical of many who think 'science' justifies their rants and denial of their Creator.

Their is nothing surer that every person will face judgement. Every person's knee will bow to the Lord Jesus Christ. I just hope the likes of Brian and others will realize their futility before that time comes. I don't know about the Catholic church but their are certainly millions coming to Christ through out the world
I would be more concerned about money wasted by a truckload of Labour pollies heading off to the Bali recently in the pretense that somehow Australia is going to save our planet from destruction.

We have already had about a dozen blogs on homosexual paedophile priests. Why don't we have a few on paedophile doctors or earth worshippers or sports coaches or Labour Ministers? I wonder?

If Brian wants to wear condoms let him but stop imposing your own narrow worldview on everyone else.
Posted by runner, Monday, 28 July 2008 12:43:24 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
"Is the Catholic Church losing its grip?" On what? A controlling interest in its ability to have detrimental consequences for millions of people due to 'messages from God' through His servant on Earth? I'm not a christian. I have no religion. I'm certainly not an atheist either (why try to disprove the existence of something you believe doesn't exist?) Yet I love my neighbour (more or less) and don't kill people (definitely). I believe that no religion has a monopoly on being a good person and the very notion that one "ism" or group can say it has is so laughably illogical that it makes my eyes water. So, is the Catholic Church losing its grip? I sincerely hope so, along with just about every other so called religion on this poor little planet of ours!
Posted by bj1950, Monday, 28 July 2008 1:52:15 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
  1. Pages:
  2. Page 1
  3. 2
  4. 3
  5. 4
  6. ...
  7. 34
  8. 35
  9. 36
  10. All

About Us :: Search :: Discuss :: Feedback :: Legals :: Privacy