If one is somehow aligned with "the truth" it is more likely that ethical behaviour will ensue, or at least be more likely understood if not enacted. So up to now I am on board with Peter. But I would object if Peter is suggesting that an experience of life in God is the best or only way. So far as I've been able to grasp in my struggles to understand ethics, the best glimpse of truth about the Universe is offered by efforts at the laws of physics. These apparently amoral laws of the universe have somehow led to the emergence of life as we experience it, and as we identify ourselves with this process we are more likely to respect life, all life. Reverence for life, truth, or God if you care for that term is the basis of ethics. The virtues and the moral precepts that have been distilled from the stuff of successful communities and cultures through the ages seem to me to be about respect of life and life together. There may well be something prior to the Big Bang that could be called God but knowledge of this is folorn. If God be the Truth, or respect for life, an epiphenomenon of physical laws on this side of the Big Bang, and exemplified by Christ and the spirit he inspires in believers, then maybe I am not so far from Peter's way at all.

Where does Thomas Aquinas come in all this,Terra?

Remember he was also a philosopher who tempered his faith with Socratic Reasoning through word from the French monk Peter Abelard, who had mixed with Muslim scholars.

Aquinas also became a Saint, as did other Christian leaders who accepted Hellenistic Reasoning.

It is also said that Mahomet may have accpted such reasoning also, which helped him convert practically all the Middle intelligentsia of the time.

It is so sad, Terra, that Christian leaders of today discount much of the above history mainly for political reasons, especially in America.

Best Regards, BB, WA.

Crasby,
I do not know why you need myths but I do not need them. I need evidence to support an opinion as I search for real truth. I prefer Terry Lane's view that all theology is made up by men as they go along. Maybe GyM-Fish's reaction to a load of bad baloney is appropriate.
Annina please learn to look for real evidence. I can think of several ways in which religions act in an unjust manner; or evil if that is a word you prefer. Destruction of a child's ability to think clearly is probably one of the worst and is achieved by indoctrination. The Jesuit claim of, "Give me a child until the age of seven and we will give you the man," is a boast of achieving an aim using an diabolically destructive and evil method.

Which Christ are we supposed to be imitating, then? The one who drove the moneylenders from the temple, or the one who said 'suffer the little children to come unto me'? The Christ who gave the Sermon on the Mount, or the one who cried out in despair on the Cross? Or whichever of the above happens to suit your mood at the time?

Unfortunately religious 'morality' is so flexible that it only gives carte blanche for anyone to do whatever they think happens to be right without the need to try and justify it in terms of reason or evidence. Would Jesus burn down an abortion clinic or beat up gays? There are plenty of people who think he would, and I don't know any way to prove them wrong.

Genuine morality consists in doing things because they are likely to produce good results, not because some guy did them in a 2nd-Century storybook.

No, John J, going by the Sermon on the Mount, coupled with the actions of the younger Christ, or rather the Nazarene Jesus, though he would discount abortion, the anger he displayed against the moneylenders in the temple, one feels would not be evident.

Also reckon one does not need to be religous to appreciate the difference.

JonJ.

"Suffer" in the old meaning of the word meant "to allow".

"13. a. To allow (a thing) to be done, exist, or take place; to allow to go on without interference or objection, put up with, tolerate. arch. or dial."...

"c1290 Beket 1601 in S. Eng. Leg. 152 I-nelle none costomes soffri..at aein sothnesse beoth. c1350 Will. Palerne 3337 Men, for youre manchipe na more at suffre. 1377 LANGL. P. Pl. B. II. 174 Erchdekenes and officiales..Lat sadel hem with siluer owre synne to suffre. c1385 CHAUCER L.G.W. 1846 Lucrece, That nolde she suffre by no wey. c1400 Destr. Troy 5081 It falles to a fole his foly to shew, And a wise man witterly his wordes to suffer. c1430 LYDG. Min. Poems (Percy Soc.) 67 Suffre at thy table no distractioun. 1523 FITZHERB. Husb. §20 The sede [sc. of Cockole] is rounde and blacke, and maye well be suffred in a breade-corne. 1584 LODGE Alarm agst. Usurers 15 Our lawes..although they suffer a commoditie, yet confirme not they taking. 1592 SHAKES. 3 Hen. VI, VI. viii. 8 A little fire is quickly trodden out, Which being suffer'd, Riuers cannot quench. 1604 E. G[RIMSTONE] tr. D'Acosta's Hist. Indies III. iv. 128 The Easterly winds raine continually, not suffering their contraries. 1660 JER. TAYLOR Worthy Commun. ii. §2. 124 We suffer religion, and endure the laws of God but we love them not. 1716 LADY M. W. MONTAGU Lett. I. vi. 19, I have..here..had the permission of touching the relics, which was never suffered in places where I was not known. 1806 GOUV. MORRIS in Sparks Life & Writ. (1832) III. 229 France will no longer suffer the existing government. 1894 HALL CAINE Manxman VI. xiii. 405 They wouldn't have me tell thee before because of thy body's weakness, but now they suffer it." - OED - Unabridged

I am not religionist, but a seeker of the truth, via scientific and histographic knowledge discovery.

Regards,