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The Forum > Article Comments > Indoctrination and fear > Comments

Indoctrination and fear : Comments

By Carl Mather, published 16/7/2008

History clearly shows that any society that relies on religion for moral guidance hastily plummets into barbarism.

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There is a fine line between an opposing opinion being reasonably put and simply out yelling your opponent. While the article has some truth its design, language and factual rigor are lacking. One could say it's biased, selectively chosen facts and borders sadly, on swapping one form of zealotic hyperbole for another.

The graph and the credibility of the conclusions are suspect and misleading.
To wit its graph shows:
• That scientific development as starting with the Egyptians not true. The most important scientific developments, Agriculture, Civilization, Construction and Writing, mathematics, astronomy, trade and money started in the Fertile Crescent take you pick which civilization(s).
• “The Hole Left by the Christian Dark Ages “is again wrong, wrong and wrong again. During this time the scientific advancements were being made in the Arabic world and after about 600AD under the encouragement of (perhaps one of the most prescriptive religions) ISLAM.
• Likewise no mention of anything Asian.
It is widely accepted that the enlightenment could not have taken place without their in put.

The author fails to acknowledge that much of the age of enlightenment was under the patronage of Christianity. Da Vinci, Michelangelo etc sec

Paedophilia being linked with religion is again nonsense as it is universal. The ‘morals’ that vilify these practices are cultural. But the practice isn’t. (In this culture they are abhorrent and unacceptable.)

Hitler a good (?) Christian. Relevance? Starlin was a good Atheist?
“Religions promote elitism, xenophobia, intolerance, ignorance and fascism” Doesn’t every hierarchical system? Communism.

“I'm still appalled and deeply ashamed of what was done by my forebears” Why you personally? I believe that the Country owes an apology by me personally? I didn’t do it. Howard is an ideologue and unable to see the difference between the self and the country.

The list goes on.

Atheism is based on reason unfortunately this article is little more than Christian Bashing. As an essay to prove his point was given to me by any student beyond year 9 I would mark it as an… F

BTW. I am an atheist and Secular Humanist.
Posted by examinator, Thursday, 17 July 2008 10:42:50 AM
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re: Polycarp and, "A person must not, on the ground of the religious
belief or activity of another person or class of persons, engage in conduct that incites hatred against, serious contempt for, or revulsion or severe ridicule of, that other person or class of persons."
I note that the law quoted says serious contempt and severe ridicule. In my view the adjectives, serious and severe, adequately protect the article and the author or they should. Revulsion could still be a bit of a problem. The display in Sydney of the casket reputedly containing the body of Pier Giorgio Frassati causes revulsion in me. Bury the poor guy; he's dead, like John Clease's parrot. He deserves to 'Rest in Peace'.
I am reminded of Terry Lane's comment about ridiculous beliefs deserving ridicule. In his conversation with God, (God the interview) when discussion miracles, Terry riles God to the point where God says, "Stand back, I'll make a caterpillar drive a double decker bus up a spiral staircase." to which Terry replies, "Don't be ridiculous." Which is the point, if something is ridiculous it didn't happen. No one who understands modern science can really believe the 'Water into wine' and other impossible miracles including those attributed to Lourdes and the other ridiculous claims of the modern religions.
Posted by Foyle, Thursday, 17 July 2008 10:47:29 AM
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Excellent article. Couldn't have said it better although the graph seems a little dubious.
Posted by Steel, Thursday, 17 July 2008 11:05:33 AM
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Christ
I have been told that a man whose name was Christ lived by a fundamental precept that is; ‘compassionate love towards the person, any person, one happens to be near to’.

Probably this man Christ didn’t know the word precept; probably his behavior was natural to him.

I thought his way uncomplicated and adopted it as my way of living.

This compels me to avoid anyone who has chosen the opposite precept; that of overpowering his/her neighbor.

And it is a lot of avoiding.

Politicians; Bureaucrats; Diplomats; Judges; Journalists; Academics; Industrialists; Financiers; Merchants; Accountants; Estate agents; Sports Executives, Do-gooders Prelates, Policemen of all kinds and unthought-of…fanatics writing on OLO.

Did I say uncomplicated?

Poor Christ! Were he to be here now, they would have him stitched in no time.

Albert Trianni
Posted by Alcap, Thursday, 17 July 2008 11:42:31 AM
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The pope mentioned global/warming[speach today]

He is part of the plan to gets rudds new_WORLD_order tax installed

Its built on a lie!
The con-cept is rebutted on alex jones show

he revealed the blair rabbit theory[good cop bad cop]that set up the play gwbusche is hated so he [like howard before him CLAIMS to hate the carbon excuse of global_warming

[thus we think it good[knowing them to not be good]

So in comes the 'new' GOOD guy
and the pope
and next thing we have a new NEW tax

not set at any rate!
BUT LEFT TO GLOIBAL MARKET FORCES

we think a twenty dollar carbon-tax
but market forces WILL set this new global tax!

at ANY RATE the MARKET decides!
[remenmber how the market forces built up the price of the phone spectrums?]
allowing markets forces to set the price is treasonous
[no matter who is selling this cow]
THE good guy as usual fixes the rule

then the markets rule over it FOREVER,see you not the price of petrol[and everything else the MARKET_forces us_to pay?

YOUR FALLING FOR THE DOUBLE[XX] play yet again

this one costs us gods creation

IPCC overstated CO2’s effect on temperature by as much as 2000 per cent!

The Institute of Oceanology of the Russian Academy of Sciences have released a study that they claim completely contradicts the link between CO2 and global temperature increases.

Computations based on the adiabatic theory of greenhouse effect show that increasing CO2 concentration in the atmosphere results in cooling rather than warming of the Earth’s atmosphere,”
see

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/

Temperatures have gradually declined and studies indicate that there will be no further warming for the next 10 years.

Mars, Jupiter, Neptune’s largest moon, and Pluto have warmed at the same time as Earth warmed, a factor attributed to the Sun having been more active than at almost any other time in the past 11,400 years.

“CO2 enrichment will add little more than 1 °F (0.6 °C)
to global mean surface temperature by 2100.”

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http://morgana.forumco.com

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http://swedenborg.newearth.org/hh/hh00toc.html
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http://www.angelfire.com/ne/newviews/facts.html
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http://www.angelfire.com/ne/newviews/morelight.html
Posted by one under god, Thursday, 17 July 2008 11:43:49 AM
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This is my first attempt and I appreciate your responses and criticisms of my writing. I'll use this to improve next time. Where I don't know the source I haven't attributed.
My point of view may be harsh but I'm writing from an emotional point of view.

Mac – the graph may overstate but I think the point is about the effect of religion.
Ponder – I'm aware that buddhism lacks a god, in theory, but every follower I've spoken to refers to Siddhattha Gautama as a god.
Martin – OLO is about opinions, this is mine.
Phil – I think paedophilia is entirely relevant and also that 'those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.' (George Santayana).
JPW – How about, for example, the Spanish Inquisition, Salem witch hunts, various pogroms throughout Europe? Are they not barbarism? I think the logic is that the moral vacuum of religion leads to barbarism.
GP – I used the word must as a figure of speech. But you're right I have no place to tell anyone what they must do. I didn't think my sentiments were noble, just obvious. I guess that's rather arrogant.
Pericles – We can't all be Shakespeare. And Epicurus (circa 33AD) was clearly atheistic. I find it difficult to believe that doubters haven't existed for as long as believers.
Polycarp – Christian moral law is that atheists should be killed. I think any law the stifles freedom of speech deserves to be ignored.
Stuart – I'm not advocating outlawing religion, just to see it in its proper light.

Carl.
Posted by Ozymandias, Thursday, 17 July 2008 1:48:24 PM
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