Irfan wrote “His rejection of his parents' mainstream Islam was caused less by any rebellious streak than his own naïvety and inability to recognise the fringe nature of Islamist ideology.”

The tatics used by Muslim apologists these days is to point the finger at Saudi Arabia and blame them for teaching extremists Islam. But the Koran actually teaches that lying and deception to further the cause of Islam is a required duty of all Muslims, this is called the "Taqyaa", or "Holy Deception."

Irfan is getting better at ‘holy lying’ as the days go by. As an ethnic Pakistani, Irfan should know that Pakistan was founded on Islamic ideology and laws derived from the Shariat. Its chief proponent was Sir Muhammed Iqbal, the brilliant Muslim philosopher recognized that Islam is not compatible with other religions and secular democracy.

“The religious ideal is organically related to the social order which it [Islam] has created. The rejection of the one will eventually involve the rejection of the other. Therefore, the construction of a polity on national lines if it means the displacement of the Islamic principles of solidarity is simply unthinkable to a Muslim. This is a matter which at the present moment directly concerns the Muslims of India.”

http://www.columbia.edu/itc/mealac/pritchett/00islamlinks/txt_iqbal_1930.html#01
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muhammad_Iqbal

Tawfik Hamid, the secular Egyptian Arab, put it in simpler terms.

“It is vital to grasp that traditional and even mainstream Islamic teaching accepts and promotes violence. Shariah, for example, allows apostates to be killed, permits beating women to discipline them, seeks to subjugate non-Muslims to Islam as dhimmis and justifies declaring war to do so. It exhorts good Muslims to exterminate the Jews before the "end of days." The near deafening silence of the Muslim majority against these barbaric practices is evidence enough that there is something fundamentally wrong.”
http://www.opinionjournal.com/editorial/feature.html?id=110009890

TR, check this out ...

http://www.newmatilda.com/home/articledetail.asp?ArticleID=2047

I call a spade a spade. But I refuse to call it a hand grenade.

Yes, Philip, the voices in your head are telling you the right stuff. I am part of a huge international conspiracy of 'holy lying'. It is a huge conspiracy and we are all wired up and connected to the giant Islamist intergalactic intranet in which we receive instructions from Usama bin Ladin and Popeye the Sailer Man. We call ourselves the "Spinach Sleeper Cell".

And just between you nd me, Phil, we hold our secret meetings at a pub in Western Sydney. But please, Phil. Don't tell anyone. It's our little secret.

Irfan I do not think you lie but forgive those of us who believe far too many do.
I know and understand it will be people like you who one day stop the insanity and evil murder.
But this mornings news for me highlights a very real danger in ALL religions.
By this I speak of those who never get a full and rounded education, just one about belief.
Libya it is said wants the Arab world to bar all contact with Bulgaria?!
Middle ages blind bigotry.
However we only have to continue to read our own papers to find a victim of lies and made up evidence here , the poor bloke in Brisbane this morning.
I think education to hate in the name of any God, or the thought some humans are lessor beings is going to see our differences settled in a war.

IRF's article is VERY important. I feel this kind of analysis can help all of us untangle the mess which is 'mainstream' Islam today..ie. there are many aspects and dimensions to it.

Irf has information there which we all should take to heart.

A thought which crossed my mind, is that when 'xyz' Islam (as in the British Mosques, which is JI type) becomes 'mainstream' to young Muslims, and JI types run most of the mosques... is it not actually fair to say this IS "mainstream" ? It cannot be defined outside its actual real world occurrence right?

MORE CONCERNS, I looked up the Muslim Village link provided by TR and I found the comment below:

[mods(Moderators) are cracking down on cyber scholars, so if u post an opinion u need to include a link to a fatwa/scholarly opinion.
we've been warned that anyone posting their own opinion on religious matters will get banned.]

Do we notice this ? PERSONAL opinions.. you get BANNED!

If that is how Muslim village moderators treat "Muslims" how much more will they treat "outsiders" who are non Muslims? (As I experienced)

Look by contrast at OLO.. we have diverse opinions, often polarized, at odds on many subjects including religion..NO-ONE gets banned, unless they attack personally and use profanity.

I have more concerns about TR's 'solution'. He feels 'make them all atheists' will work. My solution is introduce them to the One True God as revealed in Christ Jesus, and bring them into relationship with God through Christ.
TR..your solution cannot offer this "By this shall all men know that you are my disciples, that you have love, one for another"... instead, your solution gives us moral vacuums....nihilists... MIUAUG

'TR..your solution cannot offer this "By this shall all men know that you are my disciples, that you have love, one for another"... instead, your solution gives us moral vacuums....nihilists... MIUAUG'

No Boaz, this lie by monotheists that atheism is equal to immorality and nihilism needs to be exposed then demolished.

Indeed, I would say thay atheists are MORE moral than Christians or Muslims because they have a vested interest in society succeeding, and succeeding well.

Christians and Muslims merely loath this present life and long for the second coming of Jesus Christ. At this point Christians and Muslims bugger off into heaven bidding the Earth good riddance.

Therefore, atheists are the ones who really care about the planet and the people on it. Christians and Muslims are the uncaring fly-by-nights. And the Islamists and other assorted religious fundamentalists are the worst by degree.