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The Forum > Article Comments > Right to withdraw labour is a human right > Comments

Right to withdraw labour is a human right : Comments

By Tristan Ewins, published 24/4/2007

Rudd’s position on WorkChoices is likely to prevail with barely a whimper, with a pre-conference stitch-up reducing ALP democracy to a media stunt.

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You miss my point belly. I'm suggesting corporations need not be hamstrung by hostage taking and hijacking methods used by unionist to strong arm high hourly wages while offering to do less actual work. Yes it is the bad unionist that promote this behavior in their negotiating but, they have set the example and even the most docile union is held to account. China and India and other countries with lower cost of living will be the new beneficiaries of what could have been Australian jobs. If you don't understand this, that foreign direction of manufacturing exist and that these countries are creating the environment to anticipate new and old companies alike, you will miss a hell of a lot more tomorrow when you wake up and find your company that you have relied on for and to maintain your high standard of living has moved offshore. Blame me, blame John Howard, bay at the moon. Gone is gone. Employment is not a right. It's a privilege. As for the Liberals, what can they do any more than the Howard government. Zero. Howard's standing there with his finger in the dike. And the next guy up, regardless of political bent will have to take his place, and if it is a left left of centre government he or she will probably need to use more than one finger to stem the flow which is a trickle to becoming a torrent.

Why would any corporation want to pay you 28.00/hr plus a full benefit package when they can relocate to India or China and pay 5/hr.
Globalisation baby. The world is wide open and your not competing with just Australians. You must consider cost of living. Why open a business in a country that requires the minimum of 10/hr just to get by -not considering the social benefit package. When there are countries begging for the jobs and that have cost of living standards that make 5/hr seem like hitting the lottery. Maybe it's something to think about?
Posted by aqvarivs, Saturday, 28 April 2007 8:50:41 AM
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Dear aquarivs,

What you say re: globalisation is important. India and China are providing a pool of cheap labour the likes of which we haven't seen before. But we should not be engaging in a 'race to the bottom in wages and conditions' in order to compete:

a) There is room to retain what's left of protective mechanisms - this can be justified by the trade deficit.

b) We need to build movements of international solidarity to work for better wages and conditions in China, India and elsewhere (including Australia). More solidarity, not less, is the answer for a fairer world economy.

c) With a proactive industry policy, and a first class education system, we can attract investment regardless of wages and conditions in China and India. The Nordics, in particular, have first class communications, automotive, defence industries - they sustain this with interventionist industry policies, targeted subsidies, highly skilled workforces, 'niche' marketing at the high end of the market...

Most importantly - as I said - we need more solidarity, not less: only with less solidarity can a 'race to the bottom' succeed.

Tristan
Posted by Tristan Ewins, Saturday, 28 April 2007 12:33:38 PM
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Tristan: Many of your points in response to me or aqvarivs may indeed be right, and in some ways I agree with you (in many I don't).

However, a large part of the problem is that middle Australia is not actually with either you or Howard. They want to have their cake and eat it too. Yes, in a sense, the average Australian is opposed to the economic agenda of Howard or multi-nationals. On the other hand, the average Australian also wants to be able to go down to Bunnings or JB and pick up a cheap Chinese imported drill for that home renovation, and a cheap Chinese imported DVD player for when the renovation is finished. Likewise, Australians all seem to want incredible social services AND want to pay little to no tax. I lean to the right in economics, but I'd be at least somewhat happy if people could sort themselves out one way or another and stop making a lot of noise about this when their spending habits are in direct opposition to their supposed values or where they'd like to see Australia in the future. We're a really muddled lot.
Posted by shorbe, Saturday, 28 April 2007 5:02:12 PM
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I wonder if we shall ever get the balance right. We need some extra reward for those who work hard, work smart, take risks. These behaviours are essential to overall wealth and prosperity. But how much differential is enough to motivate people to do their best? I don't think that everyone has a right to a job, or has a right to be able to make a living. These things need a degree of striving and luck. I have striven, and had my share of luck and so I survive. But why should workers have a right to collectively withdraw their labour and assume that paid jobs be available when they choose to resume? Withdraw your labour at any time that is your right. But withdraw it and expect that your entitlements be continued without interruption seems unnatural. Self interest is the key. How to maximise self interest for all parties is the task. Crippling strikes are a lose/lose formula. Collaboration and cooperation are more likely a win/win. But international solidarity would mean a big lose for the workers of developed countries and a big win for those of undeveloped lands. We need to recognise the primacy of selfishness and to realise that victories are only temporary pertubrations of economic things that find their own level eventually. Less dogma, more realistic attention to selfishness as the prime motivator.
Posted by Fencepost, Saturday, 28 April 2007 7:37:01 PM
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I note one poster has an understanding of the differences in unions and how some act.
That difference is every thing, but remember its some not all unions
Monday last week, by invitation, a firm I had never heard of asked me to come and talk to its workers.
Faced with 21 non unionists who never wanted to meet me, the whole thing was looking like unwanted trouble.
It turned out they each worker had been harassed to join a union.
Fear and threats had been used, and not one of them had ever been a union fan.
So why me? why had the boss asked us to get involved?
12 months ago he had just been a worker and a member of my union.
He had as a last resort withdrawn his labour and got in a day every cent he was owed.
He now wanted to formalize what he paid his workers.
We commenced talking about an agreement that mirrors what the best in his industry are paying.
How do union haters handle that? not a boss held at bay by useless idiotic unions but looking for fairness from one.
Those workers? half for the first time ever joined a union.
The other half may never do so but not all unions are mugs or thugs.
Pride in a movement that is not one bit different than the dozen bosses unions in existence.
Would never let my union be anything else than fair handed
Our right to strike is needed because just as not all unions are saints nor are all bosses.
Posted by Belly, Sunday, 29 April 2007 7:58:26 AM
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so much hot air, so little light,

tapp, if you wish to lead the people to new grasslands, you need new ideas, or at least some understanding of old ones.

do us all a favor, go to wikipedia and read what they have to say about 'democracy'- especially 'direct democracy' and 'democracy in switzerland'. even if you don't agree, you will at least have a base to argue from.(a good idea for every ozzie- don't say you have democracy until you know what it can be)

further, unlike nearly every australian i have met, i believe in the collective wisdom of the electorate. i am certain they will be on the right side of any question much more often than any political gang.

further, i believe in their sense of justice and common sense. so i espouse democracy in australia, over any other kind of government. in particular, my contempt for party rule is even handed, alp and the liberal party are very slightly different, but neither gives a fig for the welfare of the nation if some personal or party advantage interferes.

finally, i'm sorry my sarcasm to 'billie' went over your head. over everyone else's head too, if that helps. but i was accurate as well as cruel: you, billie, and every australian are political cattle, unable to participate in directing your society. not at local level, not at state, not at national. i wish you would change this situation, but first you must realize it exists before you can stand up and take responsibility for your life and welfare.
Posted by DEMOS, Sunday, 29 April 2007 10:21:36 AM
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