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The Forum > Article Comments > The baby Jesus and the business of welfare > Comments

The baby Jesus and the business of welfare : Comments

By Kate Mannix, published 20/12/2006

Catholics should recommit to the genuinely Catholic idea of universality.

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LOL Good one Renee! It has often been speculated that Westy had a problem in his childhood in a Christian organisation. He basically hates anything to do with Christianity to the point that his comments sometimes are so over the top as to become comical. You also can't help wondering if his obsession is the expression of some internal struggle whereby he is trying to rationalise the difficult struggle he may be having fighting a strong urge to convert.

Kate,

I'd like to see a response to the comment about the common sense approach of Catholic schools (to an extent reiterated by Westy in his inimicable style). You seem to be arguing that basic common sense is some type of elitism. That doesn't seem to make sense. Jesus didn't choose Pharisees who didn't agree with His teaching to become the 12 Apostles. Instead the 12 He chose were disciples. As Pauline would say "please explain".

Michael.
Posted by mjpb, Tuesday, 2 January 2007 9:21:57 AM
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mjpb I think you speak out of prejudice of me. I am addressing externalities of a political cult which claims a god exists on the premise that members say so. Those members see fit to rule other peoples lives based on claims of superstition. Such a cult requires deceit to operate. It claims moral superiority but holds no good values. Such a cult claims historical justification but denies true history. Such cult claims magical justification but has no proof of god.

Basically Christianity is a group of people with a very bad attitude with no respect for other people. The result is when they are given responsibility over a weaker they abuse that power. It is why all theocracies are despots.

To articulate what I am talking about so you may next time launch an informed attack I recomend you browse the experience of young people caught in the net of Christians in power on http://www.nospank.net/floggers.htm#bujak
Posted by West, Tuesday, 2 January 2007 9:45:10 AM
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Westy,

Sorry if I wielded too blunt an instrument but you do make 'over the top comments'. Look at your current post. Nevertheless I wouldn't rush off and claim minority status just yet if I were you. I don't believe my views could fit within the term prejudice.

Westy you are discussing something relating to one of the major world religions of which your society is a product not a mere cult. Neopaganism to any significant prevalence is a relatively recent feature of the society.

Faith is a factor in any religion but it completely understates the issue to say that God exists solely because people say so. You claim that Christianity has no good values. Clearly the main rule about loving God you would reject. However wouldn't the second main rule relating to loving your neighbour be considered to have some merit even in a secular mindset?

"Basically Christianity is a group of people with a very bad attitude with no respect for other people."

I know you don't listen to responses and prefer to formulate your posts based on what you think Christianity is not what it really is but I'll respond anyway. The Christian belief is that humans are made in the image of God and are to be respected as such. When societies stray from Christianity they typically become violent and disrespectful to people. Look at increasing acceptance of pornography, abortion and euthanasia in secularising societies.

"The result is when they are given responsibility over a weaker they abuse that power."

Not so. They tend to do well in that domain.

I'll read your article.

Sorry again. I haven't seen your sensitive side before. Given your incessant and brutal attacks on Christians it might be worthwhile taking counsel from the saying "he who lives by the sword will die by the sword".
Posted by mjpb, Tuesday, 2 January 2007 10:51:42 AM
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mjpb rather than throw stones at the ogre who you are claiming is wrong not for the reasons he provides but because he is heathen perhaps you could humour me and show that moral authority which Christianity is the claim to be. As the one who speaks as god surely you could excercise a little more wisdom in your attacks. As you speak as god take care to give the claim of god justice. Anyway God is irrelevant, the issue is about people, human agendas and politics.

This is not about wether god or any mythical supernatural beast exists. It is about the Christian claim that they hold the self claimed god given authority over everybody else and the outcomes of that attitude. Christianity and Christians are moral only because they say so. If we include the harm of others or ask why Christianity is moral there is no evidence to support that claim. Everything is based on the self importance that Christians award themselves. Of course there are good people who are Christian but they would be good people even as devil worshippers.

As a Christian you have self gratification and superstitious decadence to gain if Christianity subjugated humanity. This is made very clear by the teaching of religion in schools. Non-christians have a lot to lose - freedom, liberty, moral evolution, the right to peace, the right to inclusion, the right to truth and so informed choice. Christians are demanding a lot from non-Christians just so Christianity can maintain the fantasy that god exists and loves them - themselves.
Posted by West, Tuesday, 2 January 2007 11:47:31 AM
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Hmm, I grew up within the Catholic system and I can tell you that when it comes to having to do some real work instead of just talking about their values of being nice, loving and kind, they run and hide and opt to abuse people instead.

This is not just beholden to Catholics but the Christian insitutions overall. After all, why should we be leaving such responsbilities to those who have abused people and still cover up their cronies to this day?

The government and the people should stop throwing away their responsibilities. We nolonger live as a community. We despise it and that is why society has gone to the dogs.
Posted by Spider, Saturday, 6 January 2007 5:15:04 PM
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Oh wow!! I can express what I have wanted to for so long,!! I am actaully a Christian employed by Job Network, and no way is it Christian , or do we favour christians. Daily I am appalled at what we are as consultants meant to 'get our umemployed clients' to do in relation to them being able to continue to receive their benefits they obtain from the government ( what a guilt trip) in relation to job searching, I say it is a load of b....%^#@ and I, like the previous commenter a few back....(sorry, didnt read who). am horrified at what might come once the next elections happens and Little Johnny Howard remains, and we go further along the American Welfare System Path. I would also like Centrelink and Jobnetwork to be no more, and let the people who cant or dont want to work receive their paltry amount and others that want to - they certainly can work and do what is needed for the country and themselves. ! The money saved by not having these agencies to 'fix' the unemployed would be of huge proportions. and one can only imagine the great and wonderful things that could be done to help this country, eg water, etc to be very basic.
The Jesus I know does not burden people. He is full of love and mercy and kindness and goodness......so, God help some of us!!
Posted by trishy, Friday, 26 January 2007 7:05:03 PM
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