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The Forum > Article Comments > Fact rather than fable in the Iraq debate > Comments

Fact rather than fable in the Iraq debate : Comments

By Ted Lapkin, published 31/10/2006

The study that claims there have been 655,000 civilian Iraqi deaths is the deployment of pseudo-science in a bald-faced campaign to sway America’s choice of leadership.

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Is "GZ Tan" a pseudonym for Pauline Hansen? Soon, my friend, it will be just you and John Howard supporting the continuing, disastrous occupation of Iraq.
Posted by Youngsteve, Sunday, 12 November 2006 10:30:10 AM
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Youngsteve,

perhaps you're very young indeed...

fyi, it is not me to respond to somone with an utter lack of intelligence.

I notice that most writers do not respond to comments on their articles, but Ted Lapkin actually took the troubles to explain things, to even a fool like yourself.

I suggest you express gratitude to Ted in your next post (even though you cannot grasp what he says). That way, at least you will have said the most intelligent thing all day.
Posted by GZ Tan, Sunday, 12 November 2006 12:24:38 PM
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According to GZ Tan, I am:

1. Probably very young

2. Utterly lacking in intelligence

3. A fool, and

4. Ungrateful to Ted Lapkin.

Sorry, mate, I have to plead Not Guilty to all of the above. What you are really saying is simply that you don't agree with me. I don't mind that at all, but your ad hominem method of argument leaves much to be desired. Ted Lapkin? In fact I am grateful to him for providing a flint upon which others can sharpen their axes.

In these times of change, we need the Lapkins, the Bolts and the Sheridans to remind us of what we're leaving behind.

I apologise to Pauline Hansen for the slur on her character.
Posted by Youngsteve, Sunday, 12 November 2006 1:20:19 PM
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I'm probably as guilty as anyone in this post of driving divisism between those who live in the same nation as me on the subject of what I believe to be a completely unjust, illegal, and improper war in Iraq and have attacked the seeming stupidity of some of those who support Bush's CHOICE. ('Action' does not have to equal WAR people).

I am however going to be the FIRST to suggest that people put their biases aside, stop attacking one another (because we ALL HERE want peace in this world - Agreed?) and discuss rationally what is best for Australia, not America, right now and for our continued and prosperous and safe future.

Any ONE of you got the intelligence to do that? or do you want to go on making war the rest of your lives and leaving Death of men in your wake ?

Once we can sort out Peace here then we can try spreading it elsewhere.

Maybe other country's could learn something from us?

Anyone else willing to give that a try?

Why do i feel another attack coming on??
Posted by BrainDrain, Sunday, 12 November 2006 3:47:32 PM
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Response to the incredible post of GZ Tan (12 Nov 2006 10:06 AM):

According to Tan, Iraq disregarding the UN demand to disclose its stockpiles of WMD's. It is notable that Tan does not mention what the US demand was, because that would immediately make clear the demand was baseless.

As I remember the Iraqi response, it said it did not have WMD's and that past stockpiles where destroyed. The US did not accept this answer, although we know this information was correct and that the US demand was impossible to comply with.

It is absolutely clear the case for war was unproven, and the was nothing in the results of UN inspections to indicate a actual or growing threat, unlike North Korea or Osama Bin Laden.

Under all circumstances, governments are accountable for their errors however baseless reasons continue to provided for the invasion and occupation of Iraq. Like most people, I believe in being accountable for my mistakes. By his actions since George Bush has shown he is not such a person.
Posted by David Latimer, Monday, 13 November 2006 12:59:48 PM
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Further response to incredible comments of GZ Tan (12 Nov 2006 10:06 AM):

The remainder of Tan's post, focuses on the importance of American life above that of Iraqi life. According to Tan, Americans value life but Muslim mothers want their sons to be suicide bombers.

This is a shocking statement and double standard, indicative of the desperate need of a small minority to divide the Australian community and have neighbour attacking neighbour. It the same approach used by Iraqi insurgents and American military interrogators and strategists alike, that incredibly has turned the heinous, repressive yet secular government of Saddam Hussein into something comprehensible by Western observers, something better than the current situation.

Astonishing!

People like Tan believe that Bush’s failure and confusion is the fault of those like Colin Powell who provided sober counsel (“one-hand tied, tied by stupid people” as Tan put it.) As far as I know Powell was the only moderating force on the Bush national security team and ultimately accepted responsibility for his failure as a member of that team.

People like Tan believe that Iraq is in the same position as Germany and Japan at the end of World War II, forgetting that the Axis nations declared war and were so ruthless in their persecution of that war that millions of civilians were killed, year after year after year.

It takes a twisted view of responsibility, truth and humanity to write a post as Tan has done.

The lesson of the Bush presidency becoming crystal. To win against repression and terrorism our greatest weapons are not smart bombs, aircraft carrier groups or interrogation black sites.

Our greatest “weapons” against terrorism are the principles of humanity, justice and democracy. Let’s start using them.
Posted by David Latimer, Monday, 13 November 2006 1:01:48 PM
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