On and on they go, these socialists. “Based on need, not ability to pay” … “Health-care is a right” … “common good for the benefit of all Australians” … etc, etc; while all the time sweeping the gross injustice being committed against those who are compelled to pay for it under the carpet.

How do you define need? What about those who require medical treatment due to a lifetime of smoking, overeating junk food, and excessive alcohol consumption?

The fundamental problem with all this rubbish is that when you eliminate the natural feedback between benefit and cost, demand spirals out of control. The only way to maintain this state of affairs is to take more and more from those with the means to pay, and give it to those without.

That is neither just nor sustainable. It’s simply the mob attempting to rationalise away theft.

Oh for goodness sake Winston. If you're so unhappy living in a society, go and buy a small island somewhere where you can pay people to come and build a hospital for your private use, a private road to get there, a private school to educate yourself in, and a private army to defend it all.

Society has costs. And to my thinking, healthcare should be one of them. There are very few of us who could afford our own private MRI and surgical theatre, but most of us can afford one-millionth of one.

Nice cocktail of right wing libertarianism and fundamental misunderstanding of the present system Winston.

The current "health care" system isn't a health care system at all. It is primarily a rather dysfunctional disease treatment system.

The best way to minimise cost of treating diseases caused by "a lifetime of smoking, overeating junk food, and excessive alcohol consumption" is to devote more effort to reducing the number of people who do those things.

As for defining need, it may be politically courageous, but it is ethically and technically feasible. For example the NSW government has just banned vanity cosmetic surgery procedures from public hospitals, in favour of freeing beds for more serious cases. (Whether the ban lasts longer that road closures around the Cross-City Tunnel, we have yet to see.)

Less in the political limelight (apart from stunts like Abbot's RU486 one) is the Pharmaceutical Benefits Scheme administration, which is continuously making decisions on need and cost-effectiveness, about which drugs should be available to everyone on a subsidised basis.

Since a large proportion of hospital cost is funded by GST revenue, an impost on all Australians, I don't see where the accusation of theft comes from. Rather it could be argued that government subsidy of private health benefit scheme costs is giving away to the affluent middle classes money stolen from everyone else.

I agree completely that we have a system that treats illness rather than a health system. Encouraging a substantial shift of funds away from the hospital system into preventative healthcare and discouraging Federal Health Ministers from urging people to use "free" hospital facilities are both fundamental to addressing the crisis in healthcare in Australia. I look at current Australian hospital waiting times and wonder just where we would be right now had Medicare Gold eventuated. Telling people over the age of 70 that they could have anything they wanted, no matter how trivial, bsolutely free of charge, was insane in terms of health economics and demand management and wards full of pensioners taking the government at its word would be the last straw in this and other States.

Regards

Kevin

Quote“ It is difficult to achieve a sustained focus on the source of our problems in health and the reforms needed to address them. The issues are complex and inter-related and there will be no quick fix or simple solutions. A co-ordinated and concerted effort is required from state and federal governments, “consumers” of health services, private health service providers, and a myriad of other key stakeholders, if we are to implement sustainable solutions.”unquote

Some health problems are self inflicted such as drug & alcohol abuse, eating disorders to cite a few.

However, the largest single contributor to health problems is industry.
In acknowledgement of this, governments have enacted legislation requiring PAYE employees to be insured against injury and one would assume that is the end of the problem…. Not So….Although the Insurance Industry makes provision for injury incurred but not reported (IBNR) just try making a claim without irrefutable evidence in cases of slow onset.. You have more chances of winning Lotto.
Once ceasing employment, Industry is off the hook despite the work environment being the primary cause of an Illness or injury which cannot be easily verified without a class action and probing investigation….I am mindful of a major blowout of Workers Compensation costs in NSW in the ‘80’s following such an action in a poultry factory where many migrant workers sustained RSI from a particular repetitive task and were unable to continue work. The cause was discovered by a Workers Health Centre in Lidcombe which has records of migrant women who had developed Tendonitis. Inhalation of substances cause many illnesses which do not become apparent until years after exposure ceases…e.g. Asbestosis and Silicosis
Instead of premium payments to insurance companies who profit from any surplus, Industry should contribute to their workers general health wellbeing with direct payments to Medicare which provides lifetime treatment.

We need a system of universal health care. We don't want to return to the "user pays" systems of the past or follow the United States for profit health system.

My ex-neighbour gave birth to a son with brittle bone disease in 1935. She did not smoke, drink or gamble. The family was responsible for rearing him, they had to move from the city to a country town which would allow him to attend school, they spent 20% of their [modest] income on his surgical boots every time he grew. Mrs S. used to tell me details of how she would tightly budget.

When loved ones have been at death's door we are confident that we have access to the best care available in Australia, we don't have to worry about the $2000 cost per dose of chemotherapy.

Most of the health care costs are clocked up in the last 2 years of life so why should some one who has worked for 40 years and paid their taxes be denied access to health care or be forced to spend a day per week filling in forms for rebates.

We don't want a US style health system because the most common reason for bankruptcy is unpaid medical debts. The cost of health insurance is so high that its usually part of your salary. In the US all employees who work more that 30 hours per week have to have employer paid medical insurance. Hence the large number of part time employees. 75% of Walmart employees work less than 28 hours per week.

In Victoria the government has renovated public hospital wards then sold them [cheaply] to private operators. One private hospital is currently under contract of sale to another but the sale has drawn out so long cynics wonder if this isn't a ploy to wipe out the competition and gain themselves a maternity ward - a cash cow. Private hospitals chronically understaff and are dependent on agency nurses employed on a daily basis. This is unfair employment practice.