Thank you for an interesting story.

I am also interested in Gender Issues and the stats you quote
' number of men and women killed... 261 to 87 ' and most of the fatalities among youngsters were males.

The 1993 ABS leading cause of death amongst men between 12 and 60 is self inflicted.

Many single-person fatal traffic accidents also hold a question mark.
Are these also suicide?

Why do young men seem to have a need to 'prove' themselves in front of their peers with high powered vehicles?

It is sad that a mates death brings out the emotions in young men, but at the same time
perhaps this can be a lasting memorial to one who 'died young'.

For a couple of years, I used to drive an hour and a half to work, at 100km/h (oh, OK, 120kmh – I can't be prosecuted now, and I'm not revealing my rego number anyway) five nights a week, leaving home at 9.30pm. Every bloody night, I'd find my attention, which really should have been on the road, distracted by the roadside memorials. I understand the animist feeling – that the memorial should be HERE, because that's the last place the person I loved WAS. But what gets me is that I've read about some of the accidents at the sites I drove past. And I'm pretty sure the survivors don't do a round trip from Queensland to the back of Canberra twice a week to provide fresh flowers. So who are the ghouls who do? What are they thinking? I think I remember a suggestion a few years back that roadside memorials would be removed after a year, because of the danger they presented to motorists. Hasn't happened, but don’tcha just LOVE the irony?

Roadside memorials are nothing more than an eyesore and should be banned. Could you imagine having one directly in front of your house? Whether the flowers are fresh or withered makes no difference.

Such very public and long lasting displays are nothing more than a symbol of a sick personality unable to come to terms with their grief. Rather than being a fitting and respectful remembrance to the deceased this practice instead focuses on the bereaved. Afterall, isn't this just a bid for attention?

It's worse in Germany where people even erect crosses etc on the roadside where their beloved dog was hit by a car. That'll be the next we see. Come on people get real. Grieve in private - we've all lost someone. Should I petition the hospital to allow a memorial over the bed where my father died? If someone drops dead in the newsagency should we erect something between the wrestling magazines and the crossword books? Why is that anymore ludicrous than beside the road?

Anomie, what an extraordinary contradiction you present:

You admit that; “For a couple of years, I used to drive an hour and a half to work, at 100km/h (oh, OK, 120kmh – I can't be prosecuted now, and I'm not revealing my rego number anyway) five nights a week, leaving home at 9.30pm.”

How on earth can you talk about distractions being a problem if you were driving long distances at high speed, well in excess of the speed limit, not in ideal conditions but late at night? Distractions are not the problem, you are. Drivers like you don’t deserve to hold a drivers licence. Drivers like you CAUSE these roadside memorials!!

“Don’tcha just LOVE the irony?”

.
I respect your opinion Lorraintag, but I totally disagree. Such very public and long lasting displays are regular and sober reminders of the dangers on our roads. For me, they serve as very real reminders that some of the drivers around me are not fit to drive, not being sufficiently aware of risk factors and safety margins. They remind me that I need to be really careful all the time, not so much of the road conditions, but of other road-users.

They are everywhere in north Queensland and have been for many years. I pass one of the biggest and most detailed ones I have ever seen every day on the way to work, where four young people lost their lives a year or so ago.

I have not seen a single situation in which they have presented a hazard (and I am very sensitive to hazards on our roads), either by way of distraction or via people stopping on the side of the road in a risky manner to closely observe or service them. By their very nature, they engender a strong need for caution in those who change the flowers or wish to take a closer look.

They have a traffic-calming effect, which must serve to reduce the accident rate.

How very po-faced you are, Ludwig. Haven't you heard of hyperbole? Listen, I actually agree about speeding drivers, particularly overtaking speeding drivers, whom the bulk of the local memorials commemorate. And speeding trucks. Many's the time I actually have been forced to drive at 120 or so because of an amphetamine-crazed outtake from Duel up my rear end. And you know, I don't reckon those roadside memorials are going to influence drivers like that.

Thanks for your comments. Yes, I find the gender differences in the road toll “statistics” extraordinary. My suspicion is that the natural energy and risk-taking behaviour of males isn’t being focussed into other areas. Trying to decrease the road toll is obviously an ongoing issue for law enforcement authorities and legislators. Interestingly, their efforts are often tainted with the accusation of “revenue raising”. However, if you look at figures from years ago, it’s clear that speed cameras and seat belt laws, among other initiatives, have had a tremendous impact on decreasing the road toll.

I can find agreement with Lorraine. Indeed, there are elements of her view that I put forth to a friend of my mine. It’s interesting that the need for roadside memorials doesn’t apply to other ways of dying. It perhaps says something deeper about our complicated relationship with the road and vehicles (modern technology in general, perhaps). Although, I think calling grieving people “sick” is harsh. I sensed Jason’s mates were very sad and confused and wanted some way of connecting with him and the place where he died. I think there are a range of factors that account for the increase in roadside memorials including the decline in religious belief and a lack of connection with traditional forms of commemoration. I can’t remember reading anything that indicates a roadside memorial has been responsible for causing a death due to distracting a driver. There was a project where flowers were planted by a roadside as a form of remembrance. A beautiful tribute and long-lasting too.

Hyperbole?? Come on Anomie, you were expressing yourself in a very straightforward take-it-at-face-value manner. Or at least that was the unambiguous impression you gave.

For a couple of years, five nights a week, you used to drive an hour and a half to work, at 120kmh in a 100k zone. And how much of that time did you have a truck up your bazooka, forcing you to go at 120? About 0.01% of that time at best.

You are a really good contributor to OLO, on all manner of subjects. I have not found disagreement with you before. But this time we seem to have critical disagreement. I really do take the greatest of exception to people who just speed, innately, completely regardless of the law, especially when they are prone to distraction!!

“Every bloody night” you were distracted by roadside memorials. By the same memorials, on the same route! What?

“I actually agree about speeding drivers, particularly overtaking speeding drivers…”

Thank goodness you do have some concern about speeding, although dare I say it, it seems like a case of ‘the law only applies to other people’. I wouldn’t worry about speeding while overtaking. I think that it is perfectly fair and reasonable to considerably exceed the speed limit while overtaking, in order to make the manoeuvre as quick and as safe as possible.

Perhaps you might want to look up ‘po-faced’. You seemed to have used it in a totally inappropriate manner here.

Please, Ludwig, please. My speed alarm's set to 110, and it doesn't go off very often, and most of the time when it does, it's because some idiot is tailgating me. As was the case on all those night drives. You're wrong about the trucks, by the way. At that time of night, on that road, it was basically milk tankers, log trucks, and me. Lots of log trucks. Lots. And I was starting off about 20km from where Peter Spencer can't clear his land. Odd. The memorials did irritate me every night – you know how when you're on a long, boring, lonely drive, you mark off landmarks on the way …

We're going to have to disagree on speeding while overtaking, though, possibly because of a location-specific problem. The Monaro Highway has annual serial kamikazes (a.k.a. skiers), tired after a day's work followed by a long drive, in a hurry to get to their accommodation, largely unused to country driving, largely in overpowered 4WDs, and very, very annoyed by a 60km stretch with no overtaking lanes. Every Thursday and Friday night, they'd be going in the opposite direction from me, staying on the wrong side of the road while they overtook three, four, five cars at a time. Cars which were travelling at what looked to be pretty close to the speed limit. They used to scare the bejasus out of me. Winter Thursday and Friday nights, I drove well under the speed limit.

I breed dogs, and these drivers' behaviour struck me as being just like that of several stud males I've had – they couldn't bear it if another dog was walking slightly in front of them, and simply HAD to get in front. We don't expect dogs to understand how pointless this is, and I fear some people won't understand either.

22 years working for the NSW RTA all of them on the Nabiac death stip I have seen more death and roadside trauma than you would beleave.
And fathers and mothers brothers and sisters even in old age return to refresh flowers, even from hundreds of klms away.
Some self asured posters make light of others loss, and no real harm is in these sites unless it is in reminding us constantly that we have a duty to drive safely.
No halo in my glove box I drive fast but with respect for others always.
The road kills no one people do that.

Anomie, this business of speeding up when you get a truck or tailgater behind you is a bit of a concern. I don’t think many people do that, at least not to the point of exceeding the speed limit by more than 10kmh and hence placing themselves at risk of getting booked.

I consider that to be a terrible practice. It just serves to encourage tailgaters. While it may alleviate the risk sometimes, many of the mongrels will continue tailgating even when you are sitting on or above the maximum speed that you can get away with.

You could argue that you have the right to act in a way that will alleviate or lessen a risk that you have been placed under. But if you get booked for speeding under these circumstances, you won’t get off, or at least not before going to a great deal of trouble to fight your case I court.

I have received totally conflicting advice from police over this matter. I was told that it is ok to speed up beyond the speed limit in these circumstances. A second officer confirmed this. But I was later told by different police officers that this is complete rubbish.

Belly, as an ex RTA person, can you tell me your thoughts on how well the RTA officers and police in general know the road rules that they are supposed to police. My experience, based on a number of instances in different states, is that it is very poor indeed. Can you also give me some idea as to why such a small number of infringements are actually policed, while the majority go effectively unpoliced…. especially tailgating! Thankyou.

NT has the oft referred to as "deadly" unrestricted speed zones. Once you get clear of Darwin, Katherine, Tennant Creek and major centres of population. The main reason speeding kills is that people drive:

1) Vehicles at a speed without consideration of its limitations i.e unroadworthy condition or 4wd's driven at the speed of a sports car, etc.

2)In a manner that disregards the conditions of the road/weather, sun in their eyes, fatigue, etc.

3)Thinking they are on a European Autobahn and forgetting about the local wildlife.

Predominantly in the Top End, single vehicle roll-over accidents with fatalities are a combination of these factors. Multi-vehicle accidents are the previous but with some other poor bugger in the wrong place at the wrong time.

As an ex Sydney taxi owner/operator in 2.5 years driving 6 days a week, and 10 - 12 & up to 16 hour shifts, I saw and experienced some horrendous sights on the roads of the Sydney metro area. On longer shifts I always had somewhere I could go to get a half hour break and 'freshen up'.

Alcohol, drugs, bad attitudes, fatigue, plain bad driving and lack of common courtesy (let alone road-craft) all contribute to the growing crop of white crosses around the nation. The respective governments have not even begun to get the message yet.

It is up to driver education in the first instance and ridding our collective psyches that driving is a privelege and not some "God given right upon attaining the relevant age..."

I have a child who will shortly be of that age. He will be given the best driving school training and follow up advanced driver courses at my expense before he drives on public roads.

The national road system is a disgrace in itself.

As one poster wrote ; the chances of losing a child to vehicle accident/road trauma are significantly higher than any other cause of death for the age demographic.

If the continuing carnage were caused by another agent, then there would be people taking to the streets. Why is this any different?

Lorrainetag

In Queanbeyan, some time in the last week, someone has erected a roadside memorial to their dog. I nearly choked when I saw it. Did you expect your prediction to come true so soon?

Hoons - society's biggest pest!

Children are unsafe going to school and responsible motorists risk their lives sharing the same road as these idiots. They are also a noisy nuisance because they blast their stupid stereos at a zillion decibels – you can hear the thumping, headache-inducing poor excuse for music from miles away. The sound also limits their concentration while they should be focusing on driving.

Typical of the kind of mentality that says:

‘I will do whatever I want, regardless of how it may affect other people’. Very un-Australian.

I see it daily on mass and I've reached a point where I can accurately analyze hooning behaviour – not difficult given the simplicity of their intellect. The black V8 Holden is notorious because it’s somehow meant to represent masculine ‘power’.

They carouse around the streets with crew cuts and baseball caps. Their thick forearms resting on the door window while the other arm fully extended to control the steering wheel – no doubt a reflection of their illusion of life-control. Their bodies are pressed back hard into their Holden Racing Team seat covers as if to gain a superior view of the road, which in their mind represents the world.

And they’re gutless cowards. Often I’ve been terrorized by these imbeciles as a pedestrian or while riding my pushbike. They love to yell at you to give you a fright and I’ve also been swerved at and spat at.

I usually swear back, or get off my bike and tell them to come back and face me. This is usually met with something dismissive like, 'Bring it on fagot', because they’re also homophobic.

They're full of themselves while in their cars – easy to drive off but they never come back, especially when their mates aren’t with them.

Obviously each and every one of these morons believes wholeheartedly in their ‘superior’ driving ability and that nothing bad could ever happen at their expense. Typical losers. I say harsher fines and fewer warnings before confiscation. Make the world more pleasant by getting these clowns off the roads.

Anyway, as for the topic - I find roadside memorials a whole lot less distracting than the bloody big in-your-face MacDonalds advertisements that, unlike roadside memorials, actually have the sole purpose of steeling your attention from anything happening on the road.

As with motorcycles, the power of a vehicle should be limited for new drivers.

My first motorbike was only 250 CC Kwaka, my last bike a 750 CC Honda, apart from still being alive to tell the tale (at age 52), I believe starting on a motorbike gave me additional skills as a car driver. Its pretty basic; I assume everyone on the road to be capable of doing anything at anytime for no logical reason. As a result I am rarely surprised. Must confess, when young did love speed, however I was both lucky and had a talent.

I concur with Tubley that road side memorials are not a distraction - roadside advertising most definitely is.

PS

If someone wants to memorialise their dog - so what? I buried my dog in the back yard under a tree as way to remember her. Most animals I have known have been very good people. Which is more than I can say for rude drivers.

Yeah Tubley, hoons are the bottom dwellers of the road-safety scum-bucket.

I also agree with Scout.

But there is also plenty of well-deserved criticism for various other groups – ‘normal’ drivers, police, Main Roads Departments, local councils, state and federal governments, magistrates, driver-trainers….. in fact just about everyone involved with road safety.

I have commented on lots of these: Please see ‘Ludwig’s Really Loony Roadshow’ – 53 postings so far - under “Putting the brakes on the road toll” (http://www.onlineopinion.com.au/view.asp?article=2877).

.
Helloooow Belly….. are you out there? Could you please give us your thoughts as per the request in my last post. Thanks

I am doing an article on roadside memorials for an assignment in my journalist course. I was hoping that I could have an email interview with someone who disagrees with roadside memorials. Some of the comments in this forum would make great quotes, but I would need permission from the writers. My email address is: ugatha@yahoo.com.au. My assignment is due 1st May so I need to make contact quickly. Thanks in anticipation.
Ugatha.