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The Forum > Article Comments > Bridging the gap with Indonesia > Comments

Bridging the gap with Indonesia : Comments

By Chris Devir, published 4/8/2005

Chris Devir argues Australia risks more attacks from terrorist groups if it fails to address its bad image in Indonesia.

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Few would disagree with Chris Davir's call for better relations with Indonesia. But many would disagree with his dredging up of the old apologist theme of beating terrorism by asking why terrorists attack us in the first place, as though it is not really their fault, but something we have done. The only reason for the current brand of terrorism is the criminal lunacy of individuals with a warped sense of Islam. Mr. Devir suggests as much when he tells us that the mere resentment of Westerners by the Indonesians is enough to make us a target for terrorists.
And, yes: "Australians have to relate to Indonesia as they would any mature and developed country". It's a pity that Mr. Davir didn't think to mention Indonesia's responsiblities to the relationship.
Posted by Leigh, Thursday, 4 August 2005 2:36:43 PM
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Good on ya Leigh,well said,you saved me the effort.
Posted by Arjay, Thursday, 4 August 2005 10:45:27 PM
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The relationship with Indonesia is the cornerstone of Australia’s foreign policy, and as such, this case for building bridges with our nearest neighbour is well grounded. Therefore the valuable contribution of the Australia-Indonesia Partnership for Reconstruction and Development following the tsunami should be acknowledged. Similarly, the study of Bahasa Indonesia at the school and college level has provided a good framework for an appreciation Indonesian culture, though more needs to be done in this area.
Posted by David Mason, Sunday, 7 August 2005 4:45:42 AM
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To Leigh,

You have failed to understand my point completely. Interpreting the article as an apology for terrorism is completely misguided. Ignorance is bliss but it can be dangerous. I am unaware to your answer to terrorism as you failed declare any solution. The current approach to fighting terrorism, the pre-emptive "big stick" is failing alarmingly. Leigh, I suggest you read the article again and refute the argument with alternative, not hostile rhetoric. If you still have the same opinion then I suggest you forget about this site (Online Opinion) and move directly to foxnews.com, you will feel a lot safer.
Posted by Chris Devir, Sunday, 7 August 2005 7:09:22 AM
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Chris Devir,

Sorry, Chris. I won't be leaving this site because you don't like what I say. If you believe that I indulged in 'hostile rhetoric' and you cannot accept that your opinions are are not superior to everyone else's and that they should not be criticised, you are very fragile and, perhaps, you are the one who should not be posting those opinions. Your advice to me:- "If you still have the same opion (mine-after re-educating myslelf with your opinion)then I suggest you forget about this site (Online Opinion)and move directly to foxnews com, you will feel a lot safer", is extremely arrogant and rude. You even took the trouble to ensure that I knew the name of the site and suggested that opinions not in line with my own make me feel "unsafe". Not so, Chris. Your petulant reaction to my criticism shows you are the one with that feeling, and your advice to me is the patronising "weapon" of a very young and immature man who thinks that he can squash opposing views by attempting to put others down.

Incidentally, your opinion of the failure of using a big stick against terrorists is just that - an opinion, as is your claim that finding out why terrorists are terrorists is the answer. You are entitled to those opinions, but don't expect everybody else to agree with them. Surely, that is what "Online Opinion" is all about.
Posted by Leigh, Sunday, 7 August 2005 12:24:49 PM
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It will be interesting to see what sentence the Bali Nine get.I think they may well get a far lesser sentence than Schapelle Corby.They were after all,exporting drugs to the infidels and possibly bringing money to Indonesia.It will be an opportunity for the Indonesians to do an "In your face verdict."

They have virtually freed Abu Bakar Bashir and condoned the murdering of 80 Australians.

Schapelle is now a political prisoner and they will use her to assert their authority.

If Schapelle was a real drug dealer,she would have had the money to buy herself out of trouble by bribing the customs officers.Once this story reached the media,Schapelle had lost the battle.

It all should have been done behind closed doors.
Posted by Arjay, Wednesday, 17 August 2005 11:20:42 PM
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I agree with Mr Devir that some of you have missed the point of his article. However I still feel that his argument is flawed in a number of respects.

Up until Australia's involvement in East Timor the Jakarta Elite considered Australia as a laughing stock. Fuelled by Keating's policy of appeasement the Suharto regime perceived Canberra as 'wishy washy'. In other words the ALP sacrificed principles and didn't mind what Jakarta did with human rights, military attrocities, and systemic corruption at all levels of trade. Canberra under the ALP desperately wanted to be Asian.

Of course many would argue that Howard involved us in Timor because of oil, and that the Libs are pursuing trade with China whilst sacrificing principles (especially in relation to Taiwan). However what Howard has done is engaged Asia in trade relationships of mutual benefit that only were possible after we gained respect through military engagement in Timor (as well as the Pacific). Boundaries have been set this time around. Afterall appeasement only works if respect is there to begin with!

Finally any ideas that Indonesia has nothing to thank Australia for (and vice versa) are nonsense. Australian unions actively campaigned against Dutch colonialism prior to Indonesian independence. Additionally Australia's involvement in Borneo in effect thwarted communism under Sukarno.
Posted by wre, Wednesday, 24 August 2005 12:50:20 PM
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Chris Devir..my ami.

History,should be the criteria you uphold.Most of the juicy bits regarding Australia have been flagrantly omitted. My trips to Bali have been marred by our Ockerism, profanity, nudity, and booze-junkets ..and lately drug offences.

Some of the 88 revellers who unfortunately perished in the Nighclub scene were there as part of an end of season Footy year. The red light district of Bali were bursting at the seams, and in between the Sari and that other dens of inequity, the 'flesh' trade really took some beating. The drunken hedonism that particular night, like every other night was enjoyed by all, mostly Ozzie . Of course, we vehemently deny it.
Our denial begins with Gough Whitlam, who cosily instructed Indonesia's PM, we would take no exception to their invasion of East Timor, as part of the US's Arms trade deal which was going on at the time. The US were equipping the Indo's with all their obsolete software which after the chastening over the Iran-Contra affair, had to be diverted else where for mere profit. After a change of Government, JH decided the Timor Sea was a hot bed of Oil Exploration, and that vast amounts was there for the taking, soo we conviently step ped in, and under the guise of a UN Sanction, we usurped East Timor's soverignty, plundered their Oil and left them one of the poorest Nations on the Planet. So much for the Good Guys.

The dreadful saga regarding relationship between our two Nations is so deplorable, not even the eloquence of silver tounged JH will heal the rift. Of course, we then trumpeted $ 1B to the Tsumnami appeal to bribe them.We then wanted some back after Shapelle Corby took the 20 strikes for the fall. Now, we have a full house in Kerobokan Jail,with Miss Beautiful overtaken SC as the queen of the catwalk, the 9 mules,one SA kindy teacher, and other lesser known druggies. Bali as our favourite playground, we have colonised their goal.
C'est la Guerre !
Posted by dalma, Sunday, 28 August 2005 4:19:26 PM
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