I cannot bring myself to disagree with a grieving mother. To do so would be an insult to the sacred bond of motherhood that God created.

I guess all I can say is that there are many Christian and Muslim Palestinian mothers who are also grieving for their dead children. I just hope that leaders on both sides can take actions and make decisions that can stop more mothers from shedding tears.

I sympathise with Ms Roth's loss of her daughter and I sympathise with those affected by the loss of lives throughout the world which result from wars and conflicts.

The comparison of the Israeli/Palestinian conflict with the Irish/British conflict however is neither new nor useful.

Resulting from a dmocratic process the 26 Counties of Ireland chose to secede from the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland, and the 6 Counties that now make up Northern Ireland chose to retain the status quo with their connection to Great Britain.

As we know the situation in what was Palestine could not be any more different - with the State of Israel constantly expanding its borders and denying the Palestinians the hope of a viable Palestinian State.

I can see no hope for Israel, the Middle East, or the world, so long as Israel remains intransigent and with the huge financial and moral support of the USA continues to disadvantage the Palestinian people and to vilify Moslems and Arabs.

Stan Potter

The article writer makes some fair points. Other people, and not she, propose to justify the release of prisoners from Israel's jails. She correctly points out that the comparison is misleading for the reasons she suggests.

Regarding Stan Potter's point, it's far from clear that the Arab/Israel conflict will end when Israel stops "constantly expanding its borders", as he puts it.

The facts, to those who pay attention to them, are quite different.

The UN partition resolution of 1947 determined Israel's first borders. Israel captured additional territory in a series of defensive wars and has withdrawn from these areas time after time for peace.

As part of the 1974 disengagement agreement, Israel returned territories captured in the 1967 and 1973 wars to Syria. In the 1979 Israeli-Egyptian peace treaty, Israel withdrew from the Sinai for the third time.

In September 1983, Israel withdrew from large areas of Lebanon to positions south of the Awali River. In 1985, it completed its withdrawal from Lebanon, except for a tiny security belt immediately north of the Israeli border. This too was abandoned, unilaterally, in 2000.

In the 1994 Oslo accords, Israel agreed with the Palestinians and Jordan to withdraw from most of the West Bank previously occupied by Jordan (in 1967).

Israeli PM Barak offered to withdraw from 95 percent of the West Bank and 100 percent of the Gaza Strip in a final settlement. PM Yitzhak Rabin and his successors offered to withdraw from virtually all of the Golan Heights in exchange for peace with Syria. Under the Oslo agreements, Israel withdrew from more than 40 percent of the West Bank and 80 percent of Gaza. Negotiations continue regarding the remaining 6 percent (about 1,600 square miles) of the disputed territories in Israel's possession.

Territorial concessions for security suggest Israel's goal is peace, not expansion. (For anyone interested, my historical review is based on http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/myths/mf10.html#a )

Irfan, while Palestinian mothers do mourn for their dead children, Palestinian terrorists and suicide-homicide bombers all to often have a say in when they die. Palestinian civilians, on the other hand, are never deliberately targeted by the IDF. Did Frimet Roth’s daughter get a say in whether she wanted to die, or how?

Stan, the US also contributes financial resources to the Palestinians for education and other necessities- however, it also does the right thing by revoking aid when it goes to schools named after terrorists, or is distributed to those who glorify suicide-homicide bombers and target Jews. The US does not ‘disadvantage the Palestinian people’, they often do this themselves. As for your claim Israel is expansionist, you would do good to read Brigid’s post or ask why an ‘expansionist’ Israel would forcefully pull settlers out of the occupied territories.

Hopefully Israel will reconsider its prisoner release program.

In my short contribution to the issues raised by Irfan, I wanted to draw attention to points of view rarely heard in our popular media.

Rather than giving a point by point rebuttal of some of your contributors’ offerings, I would like to make my final comment in a much more positive way.

What are the causes of Palestinian/Arab attacks on Israel? What are the causes of Islamist terrorism? What were the causes of 9/11 and the more recent attacks on London?

Brigid states that the facts (“to those who pay attention to them”) are quite different to the ones I stated. (Pity about the snide comment Brigid.) I read the Jewish Virtual Library comments with interest and learned much.

Perhaps Irfan, Brigid, and wrighta may like to consult the following references with an open mind:

The Australian Arab Councilhttp://www.aac.org.au/media.phpartID=68

Antony Loewerstein http://antonyloewerstein.blogspot.com/

for an alternative point of view.

A couple of short quotes will give an idea of the flavour:

The Australian Arabic Council issues strong condemnation of the London attacks but adds this:

"The war on terror must address the root causes of terror – injustice, poverty, disenfranchisement and genuine grievances of many about the militaristic power exerted by Western nations led by the US, Britain and Australia. Policies such as the blind support of Israel’s illegal occupation of Palestine and the invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan feed fundamentalism and have established fertile breeding grounds for extremism. It is not unreasonable to assume that Australia, as the prime mover behind the US and Britain, is next in line for an attack on our shores...
"While terrorism will never succeed, the current strategy in confronting it will also not succeed. We need to break the cycle of violence."

Loewerstein:
Israel is little more than a US client state, totally reliant on American government handouts. If this seems unnecessarily harsh, consider this. Israel is now asking for hundreds of millions of dollars to assist in August's proposed Gaza withdrawal. Israel already receives the greatest amount of US aid annually.

Israel is not an independent nation.

Stan's original comments above made me think there were some interesting issues to discuss without our necessarily reaching agreement. I misjudged.

Unfortunately, from experience, hearing rhetorical nonsense like "Israel is not an independent nation" and "Israel is little more than a US client state" changes everything. Stan's is the kind of doctrinaire factless know-nothingness that makes dialogue hopeless. The author of the piece on which we're commenting is making some points about the release of unrepentant convicted murderers that ought to have gotten people thinking even before the terror that fell on London last week. Instead of addressing her ideas in a thoughtful fashion, Stan rehashes a facile strong-versus-weak analysis that does him no credit.

I have visited Israel (where Arabic language and culture are routinely taught in secular and state-religious schools), and several Arab states and kingdoms as well (where you can be quite certain nothing positive is ever taught about the Jews). So that when I read Stan's totally unfounded comment that Israel villifies Moslems and Arabs, I know with whom I am dealing. And I know that debating issues with a card-carrying stereotyper is pointless.

The message of London is that terrorism needs to be on everyone's agenda.